Environmental Downside of Electric Vehicles

[Cardinal Carminative]

So you would prefer "in the beauty of the winter"?

Ummm, methinks you don't quite grok my point. Sorry!

 

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Another gloom and doom anti-EV thread

Face reality….EVs are here for good

Let me know when they actually replace ICE vehicles. Because I don't see it happening ever. There's a niche for EV's; people who use it as a second vehicle (1st vehicle is an ICE) for driving around town and have a charging station at their house and rich people who want to own really fast toys, which by the way will eventually be limited by regulations when the accidents start piling up.

 

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The future of the automotive industry is in Electric Vehicles

May as well accept the fact

Just because they build them does not mean people will buy them.

 

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They see the writing on the wall

If history has taught us anything it's that governments are not very good at managing markets. It's undarwinian. You want them so bad you dismiss all of the obstacles. Absent government caveat the market would never go in this direction. It's a solution to a problem we don't have and wouldn't solve it if we did have a problem. The titanic had better odds.

 

[rightwinger]

Just because they build them does not mean people will buy them.

They said the same thing about the Horseless Carriage

 

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They said the same thing about the Horseless Carriage

Did they? Did the government ban horse and carriages? Or did ICE vehicles arise organically through market driven forces?

 

[Woodznutz]

If history has taught us anything it's that governments are not very good at managing markets. It's undarwinian. You want them so bad you dismiss all of the obstacles. Absent government caveat the market would never go in this direction. It's a solution to a problem we don't have and wouldn't solve it if we did have a problem. The titanic had better odds.

True, there are better ways to clean up the planet, but not as glitzy.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Let me know when they actually replace ICE vehicles. Because I don't see it happening ever. There's a niche for EV's; people who use it as a second vehicle (1st vehicle is an ICE) for driving around town and have a charging station at their house and rich people who want to own really fast toys, which by the way will eventually be limited by regulations when the accidents start piling up.

Actually that view of EV's is fading. They are getting some good ranges now, up to 300 miles or more on a charge. The costs are similar to an ICE vehicle (new) and with more charging stations coming on line it will ultimately be a good thing.

My neighbor put solar on his house and he has an EV which he drives something like 120 miles a day to and from his work (very far away). Sure he charges at home but I think there's a cost offset with his solar so it doesn't impact his electricity bill.

It sounds like a deal. Sure there's still a ways to go before ev's become as common as ICE vehicles but I don't think it will be too far away. Remember some of the earliest cars were actually electric. We are just coming back around to the original ideas.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Did they? Did the government ban horse and carriages?

After a while I'm sure there were some laws put up limiting where you can take your horse on a city street.

Or did ICE vehicles arise organically through market driven forces?

But ICE vehicles were not required to solve any pressing problem per se. EV's are out there in hopes of shifting how we energize these things and if we can do so with less polluting means.

And yes, oil is heavily subsidized by the government. An unfortuante fact we must face.

 

[Woodznutz]

Ummm, methinks you don't quite grok my point. Sorry!

Ditto.

 

[Woodznutz]

And yes, oil is heavily subsidized by the government. An unfortuante fact we must face.

So is food production.

 

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True, there are better ways to clean up the planet, but not as glitzy.

I don't deny the greenhouse effect of CO2. I deny the feedback that they pile on the GHG effect of CO2 which is 2 to 3 times greater than the GHG effect of CO2. What they won't be honest about is the urban heat island effect from creating a " concrete jungle" and the waste heat from using electricity. Coupled with deforestation these are the biggest culprits of man's impact on the earth's climate. They are playing games.

 

[ding]

Actually that view of EV's is fading. They are getting some good ranges now, up to 300 miles or more on a charge. The costs are similar to an ICE vehicle (new) and with more charging stations coming on line it will ultimately be a good thing.

My neighbor put solar on his house and he has an EV which he drives something like 120 miles a day to and from his work (very far away). Sure he charges at home but I think there's a cost offset with his solar so it doesn't impact his electricity bill.

It sounds like a deal. Sure there's still a ways to go before ev's become as common as ICE vehicles but I don't think it will be too far away. Remember some of the earliest cars were actually electric. We are just coming back around to the original ideas.

Have you ever calculated how much electricity is needed to replace ICE vehicles with EV's. It's about the same amount of electricity that we use today. So we would need to double the electrical generating capacity and the transmission system. I don't see that happening. I don't even see the government making those calculations. There's no transparency here. Just emotion.

 

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After a while I'm sure there were some laws put up limiting where you can take your horse on a city street.

That's not the same thing as banning horse and carriages. The auto industry arose organically through darwinian market forces. Not through government caveat.

 

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But ICE vehicles were not required to solve any pressing problem per se. EV's are out there in hopes of shifting how we energize these things and if we can do so with less polluting means.

And yes, oil is heavily subsidized by the government. An unfortuante fact we must face.

So many errors here.

1. There is no problem.
2. If there were a problem this wouldn't solve it.
3. CO2 is not pollution it is a vital component of the carbon cycle which all life on the planet depends upon.
4. You don't know what subsidized means if you believe oil companies are heavily subsidized.

subsidy: a sum of money granted by the government or a public body to assist an industry or business so that the price of a commodity or service may remain low or competitive.

 

[Woodznutz]

I don't deny the greenhouse effect of CO2. I deny the feedback that they pile on the GHG effect of CO2 which is 2 to 3 times greater than the GHG effect of CO2. What they won't be honest about is the urban heat island effect from creating a " concrete jungle" and the waste heat from using electricity. Coupled with deforestation these are the biggest culprits of man's impact on the earth's climate. They are playing games.

We fashion complex solutions to simple problems, which only create more problems.

 

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We fashion complex solutions to simple problems, which only create more problems.

"A person often meets his destiny on the road he took to avoid it." - Jean de la Fontaine.

 

[elektra]

Guess what?

ALL the Automotive manufacturers think that
They are investing all R&D in electric vehicles
New manufacturing is in EVs

They see the writing on the wall

Of course, if we look at Ford Motor Company, a politician loyal to Obama, and worked for Bill Clinton, a loyal Democrat is in the position to decide if Ford, makes electric cars.

 

[Cardinal Carminative]

Of course, if we look at Ford Motor Company, a politician loyal to Obama, and worked for Bill Clinton, a loyal Democrat is in the position to decide if Ford, makes electric cars.

OF course it won't be a political choice for Ford. It will be economic.

I guess if a major corporation does something folks on the Right hate suddenly "capitalism" is corrupt. But until that time Capitalism is god and makes only perfected solutions.

 

[rightwinger]

Of course, if we look at Ford Motor Company, a politician loyal to Obama, and worked for Bill Clinton, a loyal Democrat is in the position to decide if Ford, makes electric cars.

ALL the Automotive Companies around the world are investing in EVs

They don’t give a shit about Democrats or Bill Clinton