Healthcare Premiums Soar

[Marener]

And the problems with Obamacare are legion. It made health insurance so expensive that even the middle class can’t afford it and needs government assistance.

Again, this was Obama’s sneaky goal.

Kicking all the sick people off insurance will make it cheaper but wind up screwing a ton of Americans who actually need medical care.

We tried it and it was unsustainable.

The ACA isn’t making costs more expensive in the way you think. It’s more expensive because people are actually getting the care they need.

 

[pknopp]

I never said go without completely. A catastrophic care plan WOULD have taken care of that - but Obamacare wiped them out.

You said costs not covered by insurance are kept low.

 

[Couchpotato]

And, you are paying a premium for coverage which make the ACA health insurance.

Insurance makes healthcare more expensive.

 

[Marener]

Insurance makes healthcare more expensive.

I guess that’s why Beveridge model health systems are so much cheaper. No insurance.

 

[Meister]

The government.

Hahahaha!!!!! Where does the government gets its revenue?
Come on, you can do it...just go ahead and say it.

 

[Hellbilly]

Hahahaha!!!!! Where does the government gets its revenue?
Come on, you can do it...just go ahead and say it.

Medicaid. Since 1965

 

[Meister]

Medicaid. Since 1965

Medicaid what? Who pays into medicaid?

 

[Hellbilly]

Medicaid what? Who pays into medicaid?

Do you have a point?

 

[Seymour Flops]

Millions had jobs that didn't offer health care. You know this but will continue to persist with the false narratives like others.

Why should the taxpayer subsidize employers who don't offer their employees healthcare policies?

Deport the illegal and "legal status" folks willing to work for minimum wage and no benefits and employers will have to pay a living wage, with sustainable benefits.

 

[Couchpotato]

I guess that’s why Beveridge model health systems are so much cheaper. No insurance.

Except for the fact that all Government run systems are more expensive that ones run privately. (Typically) There's no incentive on the provider or the consumer to save money or be more efficient. If the model is that we keep the private healthcare system and the Government just foots the bill the cost will just become 100% of what the Government is willing to pay for a service. For example if the Government is willing to reimburse 25$ for each x-ray then every provider will be charging exactly 25$ regardless of what it costs them to provide the service. They will likely take more x-rays than needed and the consumer (patient) wont care because they "aren't paying for it". The minute the Government agrees to pay 25.01$ that's what they will then charge.

If the model is that the Government takes over the healthcare system writ large then you likely wont get the best and brightest going into the medical field anymore. Like it or not part of the drive to become a doctor is the money. If I'm capped at X dollars regardless of how good I am why be anything other than just competent enough to stay employed by the system. Not to mention the insane overhead costs that will be incurred by any Government run system. BTW you would increase the number of people employed by the federal government by over 10 fold. (based on the number of people currently working for the Federal Government and in the medical field).

The question is how do you pay for all this as well as maintain the level of care we currently have?

 

[Hellbilly]

Meister Didn’t think so

 

[pknopp]

Why should the taxpayer subsidize employers who don't offer their employees healthcare policies?

Deport the illegal and "legal status" folks willing to work for minimum wage and no benefits and employers will have to pay a living wage, with sustainable benefits.

Nothing will force them to do any such thing. First off, we will never actually address the illegal work force.

 

[Marener]

Except for the fact that all Government run systems are more expensive that ones run privately. (Typically) There's no incentive on the provider or the consumer to save money or be more efficient. If the model is that we keep the private healthcare system and the Government just foots the bill the cost will just become 100% of what the Government is willing to pay for a service. For example if the Government is willing to reimburse 25$ for each x-ray then every provider will be charging exactly 25$ regardless of what it costs them to provide the service. They will likely take more x-rays than needed and the consumer (patient) wont care because they "aren't paying for it". The minute the Government agrees to pay 25.01$ that's what they will then charge.

If the model is that the Government takes over the healthcare system writ large then you likely wont get the best and brightest going into the medical field anymore. Like it or not part of the drive to become a doctor is the money. If I'm capped at X dollars regardless of how good I am why be anything other than just competent enough to stay employed by the system. Not to mention the insane overhead costs that will be incurred by any Government run system. BTW you would increase the number of people employed by the federal government by over 10 fold. (based on the number of people currently working for the Federal Government and in the medical field).

The question is how do you pay for all this as well as maintain the level of care we currently have?

My friend, the most expensive healthcare is in the US and dominated by private for profit actors.

 

[Couchpotato]

My friend, the most expensive healthcare is in the US and dominated by private for profit actors.

Sure, but we have a hybrid system. It's not just a private with insurance system is it? It's partially that, partially funded through government subsidy and partially funded in whole by the government. Then there are also people who have none of that and just go through the ER for all their health care which is then paid for by the Government sometimes and other times just written off by the health care provider. That cost is then passed on to all the other patients (customers) in the system. You'll get no argument from me that our current system is terrible and needs to be fixed, I'm just not convinced that the Government taking it over is the answer as that rarely ends up ending well for anyone.

 

[pknopp]

Sure, but we have a hybrid system. It's not just a private with insurance system is it? It's partially that, partially funded through government subsidy and partially funded in whole by the government. Then there are also people who have none of that and just go through the ER for all their health care which is then paid for by the Government sometimes and other times just written off by the health care provider. That cost is then passed on to all the other patients (customers) in the system. You'll get no argument from me that our current system is terrible and needs to be fixed, I'm just not convinced that the Government taking it over is the answer as that rarely ends up ending well for anyone.

It seems to work for most of the rest of the first world but if someone can come up with a plan that would address costs and cover everyone, I would certainly listen.

 

[Marener]

Sure, but we have a hybrid system. It's not just a private with insurance system is it? It's partially that, partially funded through government subsidy and partially funded in whole by the government. Then there are also people who have none of that and just go through the ER for all their health care which is then paid for by the Government sometimes and other times just written off by the health care provider. That cost is then passed on to all the other patients (customers) in the system. You'll get no argument from me that our current system is terrible and needs to be fixed, I'm just not convinced that the Government taking it over is the answer as that rarely ends up ending well for anyone.

Why do you assume the reason it’s expensive is because of the government? Medicare and Medicaid are highly cost effective. So is the VA. Their reimbursement rates to providers are drastically lower than private insurance.

 

[22lcidw]

Kicking all the sick people off insurance will make it cheaper but wind up screwing a ton of Americans who actually need medical care.

We tried it and it was unsustainable.

The ACA isn’t making costs more expensive in the way you think. It’s more expensive because people are actually getting the care they need.

It was not supposed to cost much at all. And from my experience I saw no on denied to the emergency room.

 

[drudge X]

The government.

Yes, through taxation from other taxpayers.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

The healthcare system in the US is for the benefit of businesses, not people.

It has taken pretty good care of me. I have no complaints. I am still here. I would be dead if I lived in the UK.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

What other scheme?

You might want to look at the part of your company’s health insurance premium you pay, and add it tothe part your employer pays.

You’ll find that it is about the same.

But you don’t write the check, so you almost certainly have no idea what. Your actual cost is.

$800 to $900 a month is very typical, BTW.

You keep singing the medical industrial complex’s song.

Every time anyone suggests anything like the single payer national health care proposal, your ilk rallies behind the insurance companies to defend your high cost health care.

And they give you the most expensive health care in the world in return.

Oh, and you ask “what other scheme?”

35 of 36 developed countries in the world pay ha;f what you pay for their scheme, universal single payer health care.

Their doctors, nurses and health care professionals also work for far less income in far worse conditions.