That was the point....no? YOU "NEVER SAID", Peter was speaking of TRIBULATION but you attempted to use Peter's quote as confirmation that John when drafting the Book of Revelation (who was speaking of the coming tribulations of the infant church) was speaking about some imagined future events 1800 years in the future that included the second coming of Christ.....when John made it clear.........THE TIME IS NEAR, THINGS SHORTLY TO COME TO PASS. John was not speaking of Christ's 2nd return.....he was addressing the coming tribulations.Jesus also taughtWhy would anyone attempt to understand the "mind of God" when its stated clearly, "For My thoughts are not your thought, nor are your ways My ways, 'Says the Lord'. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than yours, and My thoughts than yours." -- Isaiah 55:8-92 Peter 3:8
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
To the Lord, the term "shortly" could be several thousand years. There are many things in the Book of Revelation that didn't occur within 40 years or even 1000 years. The Book takes us through the second coming of the Lord in the clouds of heaven, the millennial era and the end of the mortal earth. To say it all occurred within 40 years after the prophesy is absurd.
John 17:3
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
So that they might know him.
Matthew 5:48
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
So that they might become perfect like him.
1 John 5:20
20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
So that they might understand him and become like him and be one with him.
I never said Peter was speaking of tribulation. I simply pointed out to you that one day to the Lord is as a thousand years to us. Thus, what is shortly to come to pass with the Lord may not be what is shortly or near to us.I like the way you "cherry picked" a single sentence away from the contextual integrity of the entire passage. The entire passage includes 2 Peter 3:3-9. Peter is not speaking of any tribulations facing the infant church, he's addressing the 2nd coming of the Lord. On the other hand John is indeed addressing the coming tribulations that will face the infant church.........that will Shortly come to pass. John is speaking to the churches of his day (why would they fear any tribulation or have concern about a future event that would not take place for 1800 years?)
My point exactly. So when the Lord says something is to come shortly. It could be a few thousand years or even more.Peter was warning people there were some claiming that sense the Lord had not returned by now.......was He ever going to return? He told them they were willingly forgetting that the Lord did previously bring judgement upon man (Noah). If God was willing to destroy the earth once before He would do it again (at a time of His choosing)........because God is longsuffering toward us and does not want any to perish and wants ALL to come to repentance before the final judgement.
What was Peter's point in mentioning a day in comparison to a thousand years? God does not hold time to the same significance or standard as man, to an eternal being that has always been and will always be.... thousands of years pass like days to us..........
Right, so you don't know if he is referring to 40 years or 2000 years.What part of THE TIME IS NEAR found in revelation do you fail to comprehend? "The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants -- THINGS WHICH MUST SHORTLY COME TO PASS -- (there's no mention of a day or years etc.).
Because I never said that all his prophesies were to occur in these last days but some would occur starting from the time he gave the prophesy. Go back and read my posts. I disagreed with surada about the Abomination of Desolation being prophesied by Jesus in Matthew 24 as being that of Antiochus IV since that occurred in the past and Jesus was prophesying of the future. I have stated that the Abomination of Desolation was the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD. But I also pointed out that Jesus prophesied that His second coming would also occur before the current generation should pass away showing her the doctrine of translation and blessing of John the Apostle and how Jesus taught that some of those standing before him would live to see his second coming.And He sent and signified (presented in symbolism) it by His angel to His servant John, who bore witness to the Word of God, and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, to all things he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of prophecy; and keep those things which are written in it; FOR THE TIME IS NEAR." -- Rev. 1:1-3
This book of symbolic prophecy was addressed to, "John, to the seven churches which are in Asia; Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits who are before His throne." -- Rev. 1:4
Again........why would the members of these 7 churches be concerned about TRIBULATIONS that were to happen to a generation of people thousands of years in the future?
Matthew 16:28
28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
Read all of post #112 above for my explanation. I don't believe that Jesus has come again in his kingdom nor do I believe that the following prophecies were fulfilled yet that are to occur before that generation should pass away.
Matthew 24:27, 30
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
...
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
So I ask you if you believe that these verses have come to pass? If you do not believe that these verses have yet come to pass, then all that is in Revelation did not come to pass within the 40 years spoken of by surada. Also the generation which Jesus spoke of would not yet have passed away according to Matthew 24.
The people of that day would be concerned because it is not told when the coming of the Lord would be without further revelation regarding the prophesies of the Book of Revelation and the tribulation and destruction of their temple, aka The Abomination of Desolation, which was upon them.
I agree but Matthew 24 does prophesy of the second coming of the Lord and it has not yet occurred. The generation has not yet passed away based on my discussion found in post #18 and #112. There is no confusion that the Revelation of John speaks of the second coming of Jesus Christ, the millennium, and the end of this mortal world. My point is that these things did not occur with the 40 year period that surada speaks of and that there is no reference in scripture to "40 years" in relation to Matthew 24 or the Book of Revelation.God is not the author of confusion.
While the text of 2 Peter, when taken in context with the subject matter was simply declaring that man and God look at eternity with different visions........a man's physical eternity is limited to 50-100 years while God is an eternal being with no beginning and no ending. Peter is telling the people to have patience as God is longsuffering even if man is impatient, what man might declare a long period of time, its nothing to an eternal God that might compare one human day to a thousand years...... 2nd Peter has nothing to do with revelation which is by majority speaking of comforting the young church even though they were facing great periods of tribulation in the NEAR FUTURE. The majority of the book of revelation is speaking of the church OVERCOMING those coming tribulations.
No where is the RAPTURE or a physical thousand year reign by the Christ at His 2nd coming is mentioned in the book of revelation. When the Christ comes back it will be the final judgement not the beginning of some imagined physical kingdom on earth.........the Christ is never to set foot on earth again, He will meet His church in the Air with the sound that all all mankind will hear at one time.
Since you are quoting Peter why not quote his take on the day of Judgement at the Christ's 2nd coming? 2 Peter 3:10 within the same chapter that you quoted from, "But the day of the Lord will come like a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will be melt with fervent heat, both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up."
Kind'a sounds like the SUN might go supernova when the Lord decides His longsuffering is over................
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