CDZ I want to present this in this forum hopefully to get some real dialogue

[Correll]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

One in a million chance.

So, you would just assume a connection and record it as a COVID-19 death, right?

 

[Crepitus]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

 

[Correll]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

 

[Faun]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

 

[Correll]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

I didn't claim to have such evidence.


BUt I did just get two libs to demonstrate that they would inflate the numbers if given the opportunity.

 

[Gdjjr]

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

Rolling Stone magazine said Joe Diffie died of Covid19 *related* issues- that means what it says- related is not direct- if others aren't saying that just means others aren't being called related because it doesn't help the narrative- and if you, or anyone else, doesn't see that all I can say is, being willfully blind helps many through life, but it doesn't stop them from taking wrong turns following the crowd.

 

[Faun]

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

Rolling Stone magazine said Joe Diffie died of Covid19 *related* issues- that means what it says- related is not direct- if others aren't saying that just means others aren't being called related because it doesn't help the narrative- and if you, or anyone else, doesn't see that all I can say is, being willfully blind helps many through life, but it doesn't stop them from taking wrong turns following the crowd.

Great, let's see your evidence Diffie would have died last month had he not contracted COVID-19....

 

[Faun]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

I didn't claim to have such evidence.


BUt I did just get two libs to demonstrate that they would inflate the numbers if given the opportunity.

Thanks for admitting you're making shit up.

Be sure to let the forum know when you can actually prove this thread with actual evidence supporting your claims.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

I've asked the mods to clean up this thread.

do you have any specific violators in mind that you wish to silence?

please be specific.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

#130 reply to Post #55

What was the daily flu death rate last year? Since you are claiming this is so different.

I’m not claiming anything unsupported by hard cold facts.

You want to compare the abnormal month of March 2020 to previous normal years to determine I assume because you believe the deaths in ICU!s this year is consistent with the number of deaths on ICU’s in previous years.

I have provided this and you ignore it. WHY?

Italy’s Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported “Many are dying uncounted as nation’s stretched health-care system struggles to save the living and accurately gauge human cost”

Italy’s Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported

Italy is undercounting thousands of deaths caused by the virus in the areas worst hit by the pandemic, a WSJ analysis shows, indicating the human toll may end up being much greater than official data indicate.

www.google.com

In the areas worst hit by the pandemic, I

We will see numbers like this coming out of New York when APRIL is over I’m sure.

Do you have a plan or conspiracy theory in mind to Knock these numbers down?

 

[Porter Rockwell]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Okay, I'm late to the party, but I read the article and the posts on this thread. Bear with me.

There seems to be this debate about how bad this really is and then the numbers. Two things stuck with me:

In reading this thread the point was made that some hospitals only have a few cars in the parking lot. That is supposed to be proof that this problem isn't bad. Sensible people aren't hanging out at the hospital when they could end up dead waiting to find out how a relative is doing. Secondly, some places don't want you in the facility if you're not being treated. That brings me to another point. A poster here said that this was just the "simple flu." Let's put the facts on the table here:

In 1918 - 1919, the H1N1 virus, which is not nearly as deadly as this strain of Corona virus took the lives of some 50 MILLION people world wide and that includes approximately 675,000 Americans.

1918 Pandemic (H1N1 virus) | Pandemic Influenza (Flu) | CDC

Everything you need to know about the flu illness, including symptoms, treatment and prevention.

www.cdc.gov

In 1918, the U.S. population was about 103 million. Today our population is about 327 million. For those of you who want to do what was done in 1918, that means we could see in excess of 2 million lost lives at a minimum. The reality is, we have better technology and we have a better understanding of viruses than we did in 1918. The reality is that, as a society, we wanted our politicians to focus on building a wall around America, give reparations to Black people, execute people who oppose the LGBTQP community, try to wage a war against the Second and Fourth Amendments to the Constitution. Notice that I indicted both the left and the right; conservative and liberal; Democrat and Republican. The basic reason we have this problem today is that we failed to learn the lessons of history and now we want to play the blame game. What Washington does depends on how we react as a nation. The politicians first goal is to get reelected. Saving lives is secondary (except their own families and most politicians are well to do so they can afford the best care.)

Well, it's now up to us to decide what may be acceptable losses. Then we have to balance the value of those lives with the infringements on our Liberties. While I truly, with every fiber of my being believe that if you give up essential Liberty for the promise of temporary Safety, you deserve neither Liberty nor Safety (to paraphrase Benjamin Franklin), I do believe that this is not cut and dried as my Libertarian view on the subject might normally be. But, the real question is, if my Liberty is costing the lives of another human, another principle comes into play: Your Rights end where my nose begins. None of you can control what happens to others should you contract this virus unless you quarantine yourself. I won't go too in depth so as not to lose you in one post, but just want you to think about this. The fault for this pandemic is that we, the people don't demand the government be good preppers with a plan to handle disaster. We are too involved in special interests. So, the fault is ours, not theirs. Politicians react to what we demand of them. From here, forward, if I make any more replies here, it will be to try and figure out what we should do. Should we accept the potential losses OR do we mobilize and stop this from spreading?

 

[Correll]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

I didn't claim to have such evidence.


BUt I did just get two libs to demonstrate that they would inflate the numbers if given the opportunity.

Thanks for admitting you're making shit up.

Be sure to let the forum know when you can actually prove this thread with actual evidence supporting your claims.

I pointed out that the motive for people like you to hype the numbers was real.


And you helped me validate that.

 

[NotfooledbyW]

#133 reply to Post #131 Your Rights end where my nose begins.

While I truly, with every fiber of my being believe that if you give up essential Liberty for the promise of temporary Safety, you deserve neither Liberty nor Safety (to paraphrase Benjamin Franklin), I do believe that this is not cut and dried as my Libertarian view on the subject might normally be. But, the real question is, if my Liberty is costing the lives of another human, another principle comes into play: Your Rights end where my nose begins.

I agree 100%. And if COVID-19 were most deadly to children, Infants and teens, while adults were the super spreaders, I doubt all the libertarian and right wing panic about rights freedom and the financial repercussions would be spreading out of control as bad as the virus.

 

[Faun]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

I didn't claim to have such evidence.


BUt I did just get two libs to demonstrate that they would inflate the numbers if given the opportunity.

Thanks for admitting you're making shit up.

Be sure to let the forum know when you can actually prove this thread with actual evidence supporting your claims.

I pointed out that the motive for people like you to hype the numbers was real.


And you helped me validate that.

No, you made up a fake case and I pointed out your fake case was baseless.

 

[Porter Rockwell]

#133 reply to Post #131 Your Rights end where my nose begins.

While I truly, with every fiber of my being believe that if you give up essential Liberty for the promise of temporary Safety, you deserve neither Liberty nor Safety (to paraphrase Benjamin Franklin), I do believe that this is not cut and dried as my Libertarian view on the subject might normally be. But, the real question is, if my Liberty is costing the lives of another human, another principle comes into play: Your Rights end where my nose begins.

I agree 100%. And if COVID-19 were most deadly to children, Infants and teens, while adults were the super spreaders, I doubt all the libertarian and right wing panic about rights freedom and the financial repercussions would be spreading out of control as bad as the virus.

This is a time when we should all accept our ownership in the status quo. Instead of playing the blame game, I'm trying to find out from both sides where do they want to go? I lean more toward Libertarian ideology, but we have to assemble a lot of our ideas to formulate a solution, not more blame game. I'd like to cite some of an article about Georgia here:

"According to the Georgia Department of Public Health, as of April 5, there were 688 COVID-19 cases in Dougherty County and 31 deaths. That is the second-highest number of cases in Georgia, behind only Fulton County, which is 10 times more populous. Fulton had 970 cases and 28 deaths. The number of confirmed cases of COVID-19 in the state is 6,742."

https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/news/2020/04/06/ga-funeral-homes-face-more-deaths-fewer-services.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/a-funeral-sparked-a-covid-19-outbreak--and-led-to-many-more-funerals/2020/04/03/546fa0cc-74e6-11ea-87da-77a8136c1a6d_story.html

There are just over 95,000 people in that county and it is predominantly Black. It was once a cotton producing stronghold in the past. Blacks, by culture, are a touchy - feely kind of people, so many of the Covid-19 cases were traced back to funeral attendees. IF someone knew they were sick, or had reason to believe it, their Rights ended the moment they made physical contact with another person. We're talking about a virus that can spread and kill.

Now, despite my Libertarian leanings and my objection to the illegally ratified 14th Amendment, state leaders can order a quarantine (and we're under one now.) They can also appeal to all those places that do drug test places employers use to vet new employees to use their resources to do Corona virus tests with the primary objective to identify those who have the virus. Once identified, we should figure out what we're going to do with them. So, let me start by asking you - and anyone else that cares to offer a response:

Does a person with the Corona virus have the Right to go into public and endanger us with a condition they cannot control?

To draw an analogy here, a gun owner has the Right to keep and bear Arms. Here, you can go into stores, walk down the street, etc. with your firearm. Wave it around or start pointing it a others, you end up in jail. The gun owner can maintain control of their weapon. In this case, a person has a deadly weapon, a virus, that they cannot control and it poses a threat to his fellow man. So, what are the extent of their God given Liberties now?

 

[Correll]

#130 reply to Post #55

What was the daily flu death rate last year? Since you are claiming this is so different.

I’m not claiming anything unsupported by hard cold facts.

You want to compare the abnormal month of March 2020 to previous normal years to determine I assume because you believe the deaths in ICU!s this year is consistent with the number of deaths on ICU’s in previous years.

I have provided this and you ignore it. WHY?

Italy’s Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported “Many are dying uncounted as nation’s stretched health-care system struggles to save the living and accurately gauge human cost”

Italy’s Coronavirus Death Toll Is Far Higher Than Reported

Italy is undercounting thousands of deaths caused by the virus in the areas worst hit by the pandemic, a WSJ analysis shows, indicating the human toll may end up being much greater than official data indicate.

www.google.com

In the areas worst hit by the pandemic, I



View attachment 319816

View attachment 319817


We will see numbers like this coming out of New York when APRIL is over I’m sure.

Do you have a plan or conspiracy theory in mind to Knock these numbers down?

Interesting that I challenged you about a point you made about flu deaths here in the states, and you support it, with numbers from some city in Italy.

 

[Correll]

I don't easily abide monologues-

I want to talk about intellectual honesty. I posted this in another thread

Rush Limbaugh Floats Theory That Coronavirus Deaths Are Being Inflated to Push an Agenda

Conservative talk-radio host and recent Presidential Medal of Freedom honoree Rush Limbaugh on Thursday floated the theory that deaths from coronavirus have been inflated so that governments could further “the policies they have put in place.”Citing the latest record-breaking unemployment claims...

www.yahoo.com

I'm using that article as an example because I use the term intellectual honesty a lot- Rush, is a great example as well as our own beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic- I've said for years Rush is very intelligent, but he is hyper-partisan. I've told our very own, beloved, I'm sure, PoliticalChic, the same thing- I give them their just due for their intelligence, (and I'll add now, their tenacity as there is a lot to be said for that trait) but I can't abide their hyper-partisan intellect. Both are intelligent enough to know better and the evidence is overwhelming that there is very little difference in the Party elite outside their rhetoric, which is used as a tool to keep citizens divided. Any half wit can see there is no difference. Hitting a brick wall at 100 or at 90 still is hitting a brick wall. The only (maybe) difference is the rate of descent to the same destination- and that rate of descent is accelerating almost daily.

In the article it says what it says- I'm not going to give away the punch line- you have to read it and make your own determination.

Can you post conspiracy crap from the nation's leading dispenser of conspiracy crap in this zone?

Can you read the thread and answer the topic or go back to your hole ?

The topic is conspiracy theory nonsense. Doesn't belong in this zone.

The temptation for libs in hospitals to count deaths as Convid-19, to undermine the President is real.

Denying that, is not credible.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

Finding it suspicious when coroner's list coronavirus as the cause of death among patients with underlying health conditions is the stuff of conspiracy nuts.

You libs have shown that you invent reasons to put your partisan gain ahead of professional responsibilities at ever turn.

So, your pretense otherwise, is just you defending your side's bad behavior.

An elderly person with heart disease who contracts coronavirus and dies because their heart is too frail to fend off the virus is counted among the victims of COVID-19 and conspiracy nuts cry foul.

What about an elderly patient who has the virus and is fighting it off, and dies of an unrelated stroke?

If the stoke was brought on by them fighting the virus, COVID-19 was the cause of death.

My example. I clearly stated "unrelated" and you immediately ignore that given, and start thinking how to blame the virus so you can count it.


You just demonstrated my point. Perfectly. Thanks for playing. See the receptionist on the way out for your lovely consolation prizes.

Your point is silly. The chances of that just coincidentally happening are vanishingly small.

Actually, it's not. And you've demonstrated my point.

I've yet to see you post any evidence at all showing people are being wrongly identified as coronavirus deaths.

I didn't claim to have such evidence.


BUt I did just get two libs to demonstrate that they would inflate the numbers if given the opportunity.

Thanks for admitting you're making shit up.

Be sure to let the forum know when you can actually prove this thread with actual evidence supporting your claims.

I pointed out that the motive for people like you to hype the numbers was real.


And you helped me validate that.

No, you made up a fake case and I pointed out your fake case was baseless.

YOu response demonstrated that you would hype the numbers.


YOu know it. I know it. Everyone that read it, knows it.


Who are you trying to fool by lying?

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

1.8% seems such a small number...while some wish to ignore that that small number translates into millions of dead people. I'm willing to trade money for lives.

It is a small number, relatively speaking. You're willing for the gov't to trade OPM for lives. Gov't has no money not confiscated from voters. Forced donations is not charity nor is it being charitable. Now, if funds were redirected, from say the Education bs then there might actually be a way that would be good. Or from any of the alphabet strong arm agencies for that matter.

The irony of all of this..is that if the measures being implemented work..and the curve is flattened...most will say the whole thing was overblown---because that is what success will look like..of course, if the measures don't work..those same people will blame the Govt. for not doing enough--thus is human nature.

This depends on the definition of success and by whom. If is the biggest word in the English language and we can go down the road of if about gov't intervention any time you want. Human nature in many is lazy, take care of me, I deserve it, I demand it.

"those same people will blame the gov't for not doing enough" is assumption, presumption, speculation and/or painting with a broad brush which is not fact checking - FYI

Gov't mandates are not over blown, and rarely, if ever rescinded. They are the gov't operating outside the scope of its granted authority- nowhere in the constitution is there a caveat about the gov't being granted the authority to shut down the country- it occurs because of a lack of fact checking the presumed, assumed, ill perceived authority taken by the alleged erudite acolyte pseudo intellectual givers of facts to be checked are half-wits believing they are special- and even worse they are believed by many.

If..is indeed a big word..and I get that it is possible that there is literally no definition of success for you..at this point. If there is a real die off..it is unsuccessful..and if deaths are avoided..we will never be able to prove it...and the cost will be seen as too high..both economically..and, for those of your school of thought, philosophically.
I do not believe that the founders could predict every possible crisis in our countries history. I'm an unabashed "living document" proponent. I do not care if there is not a word-for-word recipe for every action or inaction the Govt. needs take to safeguard the both the safety and the Rights of the populace.
As for your last paragraph..maybe one or two adjectives too many for one purporting to wish reasonable debate? Perhaps those you label are not at all concerned with hewing to the Constitution..and are more concerned with preserving the life of the citizenry. BTW..our country is not "shut down"..millions go to work every day. In our rural areas large swaths of the population are ignoring lockdown...social distancing is a joke..and everyone thinks it's just the Democrats over-hyping the flu--i hope they are not awakened from their fantasy with tears and funerals.

FYI..the Govt. has taken extraordinary measures many times in our history..in response to events of the moment...and rescinded them at a later date. Everything from the internment of citizens of Japanese descent to Roosevelt's and Lincoln's actions during their times.

Tough times for a Constitutional purist...I doubt that they are going to get better soon.

 

[EvilEyeFleegle]

Reading through all these posts..it seems ridiculous that some are arguing that one must die directly of Covid-19 to be counted as one of the victims of the virus. It is like saying that those who die of Pneumonia after contracting Covid-19 were not killed by the virus. They were. A person with heart disease who contracts Covid-19 and dies of heart failure was killed by Covid-19. It was the proximate cause of death. Everyone with a brain knows that this disease afflicts those with underlying medical issues worse than those without..like most diseases. If someone would be alive today..who is not because of contracting Covid-19..then they are a victim of Covid-19.
That is not over-inflating the statistics..that is the simple truth. IMHO..of course.

 

[Leo123]

Whether deaths are being inflated is a valid question, but I find it as interesting that media (FOX included) are not reporting the number of recoveries for comparison, nor reporting the increasing success with Hydroxychloroquine.

They seem to be sticking with "If it bleeds, it leads".

Good point and, they also tend to focus on the 1.8% death rate instead of the over 98% chance you may never get this virus.

Just as many here focus on the total mortality rate..and ignore the demographic breakdown. Which is to say that if you are over 60..the mortality rate jumps significantly. More people under 60 will get the virus because, well, because there are more people under 60 in the population. If you are over 60 and in a Nursing home that is careless with hygiene--your odds of both getting the virus and dying from it are much greater.
My point? That asserting that there is a 98% chance that YOU will never get the disease is, in fact, misleading and ignores all the variables that come into play. How old you are, how healthy you are and where you live all come into play.

1.8% seems such a small number...while some wish to ignore that that small number translates into millions of dead people. I'm willing to trade money for lives.

The irony of all of this..is that if the measures being implemented work..and the curve is flattened...most will say the whole thing was overblown---because that is what success will look like..of course, if the measures don't work..those same people will blame the Govt. for not doing enough--thus is human nature.

As for the media...only shallow fools believe anything that the media says..Right or Left...without fact-checking. If you start with a desire to find a conclusion you already have..odds are good...you'll find the evidence that supports your predisposition. If you start with an open mind..and are willing to go where the evidence takes you...even if it's unpalatable to your political sensibilities..you might find an approximation of the truth.

"many people seemed surprised that two-thirds of the Americans known to be infected were under 65, according to the federal Centers for Disease Control"

Opinion | ‘Covid-19 Kills Only Old People.’ Only?

Maybe you should do some more reading.