Zone1 Another question to ponder.

[Slyhunter]

If you dont believe in yourself you believe in nothing

supposed to believe in the man not in yourself.

 

[Slyhunter]

Like a pedophile or rapist or murder?

A roman soldier fighting endless wars.

 

[BULLDOG]

Proving that Slyhunter isn't agnostic isn't a nit.

Your proof is a little nit pickey. Saying the universe allows for those things instead of that it provides those things might have been more accurate without implying any specific intention, but it's not too much of a stretch to understand his meaning.

 

[Hafar1014]

supposed to believe in the man not in yourself.

supposed to believe in the man not in yourself.

If you dpnt believe in yourself no one else will

 

[ding]

Define constant presence of mind.

Consciousness without form. Existence itself. Intelligence has always existed - just as every other extant attribute of reality has existed - as the source or matrix of the physical world. Mind, rather than emerging as a late outgrowth in the evolution of life, has existed always as the matrix, the source and condition of physical reality - that the stuff of which physical reality is composed is mind-stuff. It is the constant presence of Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.

 

[ding]

It is also possible it is aa side effect of it's purpose.

what purpose?
I don't know.

Do you disagree that the universe has produced intelligence? If you were trying to figure out what the purpose of something was wouldn't you naturally look at what it has done?

 

[ding]

I know you should be careful whom you place your faith and/or trust in.

That's what I said. I said I never place complete trust in something or someone without good reason. Do you?

 

[ding]

Go back in time and murder Hitler.

How is that making your argument that murder is good? Even if you could travel back in time - which you can't - murdering Hitler would still not make murder good. You might be able to argue it is the lesser of two evils but you are still not doing good.

How about rape? Can you make an argument that rape is good? Or slavery? Is owning people like property good?

 

[ding]

A roman soldier fighting endless wars.

Sure. That too. We are spiritual beings experiencing a material existence. At death carnal/material impulses die with the material existence.

 

[ding]

Your proof is a little nit pickey. Saying the universe allows for those things instead of that it provides those things might have been more accurate without implying any specific intention, but it's not too much of a stretch to understand his meaning.

But the universe does provide those things. Nature has a preference for life to exist, survive, reproduce and complexify. All of which have happened because matter/energy is hardwired for it. Everything which has occurred did so because of the laws of nature. Since the universe popped into existence and began to expand and cool there has never been an uncaused event. And every event had a logical cause. Your saying the universe allows for the care of living things is not saying anything different because the universe is hardwired for it by the laws of nature which existed before time itself.

 

[BULLDOG]

Consciousness without form. Existence itself. Intelligence has always existed - just as every other extant attribute of reality has existed - as the source or matrix of the physical world. Mind, rather than emerging as a late outgrowth in the evolution of life, has existed always as the matrix, the source and condition of physical reality - that the stuff of which physical reality is composed is mind-stuff. It is the constant presence of Mind that has composed a physical universe that breeds life, and so eventually evolves creatures that know and create.

So what proof do you have that is more believable than "vampires hate garlic"?

 

[Slyhunter]

How is that making your argument that murder is good? Even if you could travel back in time - which you can't - murdering Hitler would still not make murder good. You might be able to argue it is the lesser of two evils but you are still not doing good.

How about rape? Can you make an argument that rape is good? Or slavery? Is owning people like property good?

Christians in the bible supported slavery as a means to ensuring they don't starve.

 

[BULLDOG]

But the universe does provide those things. Nature has a preference for life to exist, survive, reproduce and complexify. All of which have happened because matter/energy is hardwired for it. Everything which has occurred did so because of the laws of nature. Since the universe popped into existence and began to expand and cool there has never been an uncaused event. And every event had a logical cause. Your saying the universe allows for the care of living things is not saying anything different because the universe is hardwired for it by the laws of nature which existed before time itself.

You use the word preference as if nature made a sentient choice for the things you mentioned. Sorry, but I'm not convinced of a sentient being who designed and built everything, whether you want to call it god or nature. You got something more than "this is what I believe"?

 

[ding]

You use the word preference as if nature made a sentient choice for the things you mentioned. Sorry, but I'm not convinced of a sentient being who designed and built everything, whether you want to call it god or nature. You got something more than "this is what I believe"?

I use the word preference because it's pretty obvious nature prefers life to survive and evolve towards greater complexity. What word would you like to use instead of preference to describe nature's bias for life to survive and evolve?

 

[ding]

Christians in the bible supported slavery as a means to ensuring they don't starve.

So what? How is that good? Do you think slaves thought slavery was good?

 

[ding]

So what proof do you have that is more believable than "vampires hate garlic"?

The physical world is entirely abstract and without ‘actuality’ apart from its linkage to consciousness.

 

[Slyhunter]

I use the word preference because it's pretty obvious nature prefers life to survive and evolve towards greater complexity. What word would you like to use instead of preference to describe nature's bias for life to survive and evolve?

You are using nature and universe interchangeably like they are related. I don't believe the universe has a preference hen it comes to biological life.

 

[Slyhunter]

So what? How is that good? Do you think slaves thought slavery was good?

good is related.

 

[ding]

You are using nature and universe interchangeably like they are related. I don't believe the universe has a preference hen it comes to biological life.

Yes, I also use existence interchangeably as well. Do you know how nature and existence are related?

If everyone had brown eyes would you be able to understand that nature had a preference for brown eyes? Because nature has hardwired the urge to survive and procreate into life. It's so prevalent as to be undeniable.

 

[ding]

good is related.

So you believe slavery, rape and murder can be good?