CDZ POLL: An Abortion Kills a Child

[JoeMoma]

I believe an abortion ends a life. I don’t have any scientific mumbo jumbo to trot out or any great theological or philosophical manual to shake in people’s faces.

I just feel that it is a life.

If you followed Peter Norths shake in the face lead, we'd have a non-issue

Wow! I would BET most that post (Hey, nice little rhyme!) on here have NO idea who Peter North is. I've seen quite a few videos of the man "in action". Definitely NOT for the feint of heart!

It might be wise to not volunteer that information (knowing who PN is).

 

[Likkmee]

I believe an abortion ends a life. I don’t have any scientific mumbo jumbo to trot out or any great theological or philosophical manual to shake in people’s faces.

I just feel that it is a life.

If you followed Peter Norths shake in the face lead, we'd have a non-issue

Wow! I would BET most that post (Hey, nice little rhyme!) on here have NO idea who Peter North is. I've seen quite a few videos of the man "in action". Definitely NOT for the feint of heart!

It increased Jacuzzi sales by 300%

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Reminder.

1. This thread is in the CDZ; ALL CDZ rules apply.
2. You can change your answers at any time.
3. All sides are invited to present any and all evidence to support their views.
4. Posts and responses are asked to be confined to the subject of this OP. "Does and abortion kill a child, or not?"
5. For Reference, this thread and poll is in reference to abortions and the biology of HUMAN beings, only.
6. This thread is NOT about whether or not abortions "SHOULD" be legal or illegal. It is ONLY about whether or not an abortion kills a child.

Citizens are at liberty to believe whatever they wish with regard when life begins and what constitutes life, consistent with their own good faith and good conscience.

Indeed, the right to privacy safeguards that liberty from government overreach, prohibiting the state from seeking to force a woman to give birth against her will through force of law.

The authoritarian right’s goal is to compel conformity and punish dissent – to allow government to interfere in citizens’ private lives; government has no authority whatsoever to dictate to a citizen whether she may have a child or not.

The thread premise is yet another example of the authoritarian right’s use of baseless demagoguery in an effort to inflame passions in support of violating the right to privacy and increasing the power and authority of the state at the expense of our rights and protected liberties.

 

[Anathema]

If you followed Peter Norths shake in the face lead, we'd have a non-issue

I’m aware of who Mr North is. I’m even more aware that I done believe in casual sex and never have. That’s why I can still count my sexual partners on one hand and my offspring still number zero at age 45. Without having ever had to make the decision the OP proposes.

 

[Likkmee]

If you followed Peter Norths shake in the face lead, we'd have a non-issue

I’m aware of who Mr North is. I’m even more aware that I done believe in casual sex and never have. That’s why I can still count my sexual partners on one hand and my offspring still number zero at age 45. Without having ever had to make the decision the OP proposes.

My condolences
(not on offspring)

 

[bluzman61]

I believe an abortion ends a life. I don’t have any scientific mumbo jumbo to trot out or any great theological or philosophical manual to shake in people’s faces.

I just feel that it is a life.

If you followed Peter Norths shake in the face lead, we'd have a non-issue

Wow! I would BET most that post (Hey, nice little rhyme!) on here have NO idea who Peter North is. I've seen quite a few videos of the man "in action". Definitely NOT for the feint of heart!

It increased Jacuzzi sales by 300%

Yep! A LOT of his "action" DID seem to remind one of a Jacuzzi............................AND some of his "action" DID occur IN a Jacuzzi or right after getting OUT of a Jacuzzi! What a BLAST!

 

[Likkmee]

I taught the boy well..........AHEM

 

[initforme]

Until we push for less pregnancies and births via contraception nothing will change.

 

[Nosmo King]

Should an expectant mother of triplets be allowed in the HOV lane? When an in vitro fertilization clinic empties their freezers, are they committing mass murder?

Off topic.

The op is about whether or not an abortion kills a child. It is not about the recognition or non recognition of them in other situations. That is for another debate somewhere else.

You want to expand our understanding of what we consider a child. I'm exploiting the breach you created.

 

[Chuz Life]

You want to expand our understanding of what we consider a child. I'm exploiting the breach you created.

I am doing no such thing.

This thread allows for any and all to express their views on whether an abortion kills a child OR NOT, and it also allows for participants to share the basis for their views, if they want to.

In the arena of competing ideas, we will see what the most compelling arguments are.

 

[Chuz Life]

Over the years, I have occasionally debated abortion proponents who actually AGREE with me (and the biological evidence) which proves that an abortion kills a child.

Their arguments are / were (paraphrased) "It is idiotic to deny that it is a child, when biology proves that it is. . . BUT! so what if it's a child. . . It is still the woman's right to kill it with an abortion, if she doesn't want that child in her body."

For whatever reason, I feel I can have a more productive and meaningful with THOSE who have the above stance, because it essentially takes all the need to rehash the basic biology stuff, over and over again."

Is there anyone in this thread who has that position?

That you agree that an abortion kills a child but you think it should be legal anyway?

If so, YOU are the person I would most like to have a debate or conversation with.

 

[Anathema]

My condolences

No condolences necessary. My lifestyle has left me with... no ex-wives, no nasty breakups, no child support payments or custody fights. I’m quite pleased with where I am in life... 1 wife, no kids, and no extra “attachments”.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Should an expectant mother of triplets be allowed in the HOV lane? When an in vitro fertilization clinic empties their freezers, are they committing mass murder?

Off topic.

The op is about whether or not an abortion kills a child. It is not about the recognition or non recognition of them in other situations. That is for another debate somewhere else.

If one is of the personal, subjective opinion that an embryo/fetus is a ‘baby’ or a ‘child,’ then don’t have an abortion.

If one is of the personal, subjective opinion that a zygote is a ‘child,’ then don’t use contraceptives.

Believe whatever you wish.

Or don’t believe anything at all.

It’s up to each individual to decide for himself.

But one may not compel others to follow his personal, subjective beliefs through force of law.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

A potential child.

But a CHILD nonetheless.

Not until its' born.

Not until it's born? So ONLY a baby who is BORN is human and a living child?

So you are saying that a baby that is In Utero for 8 and a half months is NOT actually a living child UNTIL it's born?

As a matter of settled, accepted Constitutional law, yes.

As a matter of religion or philosophy or personal beliefs – that would depend on each individual.

And each individuals’ belief is equally valid.

 

[flacaltenn]

When I imagined what this CDZ thread would be like, I actually imagined a back and forth INFORMATIVE discussion. . . Where one person would post "I believe and abortion kills a child, BECAUSE. . . " Then, the other side might / would respond in kind.

I can not imagine why that is too much to ask.

Probably because it's NOT a simple YES or NO answer? It really is not.. CONSIDERED responses will draw distinctions between the gestation time being like 48 hours (as in PLAN B -- drug induced abortions) or as related to the "survivability" window, or as in pre-neural tube development.

By a rigid "moment of conception" standard, you'd be depriving woman of the blessings of In Vitro fertilization, because not all fertilized embryoes are used and "murdered"..

So I believe it is murdering a baby if the abortion is done AFTER the window of survivalibility is past.. If that's too complicated an explanation, I'm sorry...

 

[flacaltenn]

I have never understood what difference it makes between a baby 5 minutes before birth and 5 minutes after. An aborted life was snuffed out, possibilities destroyed, not even given a chance to dream and achieve.

Q: Who supports the right to kill a child 5 minutes prior to birth?
A: NOBODY

Wish that were true.. But that bridge is being crossed by zealous people.

 

[flacaltenn]

Should an expectant mother of triplets be allowed in the HOV lane? When an in vitro fertilization clinic empties their freezers, are they committing mass murder?

Off topic.

The op is about whether or not an abortion kills a child. It is not about the recognition or non recognition of them in other situations. That is for another debate somewhere else.

Has to do with the definition of a child doesn't it? Is In vitro fertilization encouraging "murdering CHILDREN"??? It's a good question.,.

 

[MAGAman]

So I take it that terminating a budding flower is not killing a life form? Can a fetus breathe on their own in the womb? Where do the fetus take a crap? It is not alive until ejected from the mothers vagina and can breathe on it's own and begins to have mental memories.

Thats a really ignorant definition of life.

1 A flower doesn't have human DNA.
2 A developed fetus breathes embryonic fluid.
3 Do you really want to use shit to define life? (BTW fetuses do shit in the womb.)
4 Adults on a ventilator can't breath on their own.
5 Adults in a coma don't form memories.


You should ask an adult for help before posting again.

 

[MAGAman]

A potential child.

But a CHILD nonetheless.

Not until its' born.

So preemie born at 6 months is a human with constitutional rights but a 9 month unborn is equal to a potato?

Brilliant.

 

[flacaltenn]

Over the years, I have occasionally debated abortion proponents who actually AGREE with me (and the biological evidence) which proves that an abortion kills a child.

If this is biology then we can technically ask -- Is a caterpillar a butterfly? How many legs does a caterpillar have? How many for a butterfly? I think folks are trying to tell you that your whole question REVOLVES the definition of a "child"...

Let me ask... Is using "morning after" abortion aids --- killing a child? Is In Vitro fertilization killing a child? Wanna express an opinion???