That’s really a great point. The argument from the Christian religious perspective is that life can’t come from non-life and that inevitably rolls into the question of abiogenesis. We know with absolute certaintyIf you presuppose the existence of a Divine Being in control of the universe, of course it follows that everything that happens is the result of Its actions. But if you make no such supposition, then everything that has happened is the result of chance, and/or is simply the way of the universe. The proof is that THIS is the universe which exists. That explanation makes just as much sense as yours, and it doesn't require the intervention of a supernatural being.See the article I linked to.I don’t understand what you are trying to get at. What are you trying to say?No. It is inevitable that intelligence will arise. Since the very beginning energy has complexified and has not ceased. In fact, SETI searches for intelligent life for this very reason. They literally expect to find it because the nature of the universe is to create beings that know and create.No, it wasn't inevitable. It was chance. If the dinosaurs hadn't been wiped out by a meteor 65 million years ago, we wouldn't exist. But we DO exist. And that's a good thing, right?It was an inevitability that we exist. No luck about it.That we're able to exist even now, at this instant that I type this.
Based on the belief of atheists, this earth, has been in existence for millions, and millions of years now, starting w/of course, the Big Bang.
That there's all types of gargantuan stars, suns, meteors, planets etc, all around the universe swirling around and that could ultimately, at one point smash in to us.
Remember, that's what they claimed happened to make the dinosaurs go extinct and caused the Ice Age. A giant meteor that all but destroyed all life on earth...in an instant.
So that was millions of years ago, aren't we due for another one right about now?
What's stopping us from being destroyed by a super meteor at any point? And how do you feel w/the knowledge that this can happen at any instant?
I'd like to hear from our resident atheists on this.
What are your thoughts?
Informational molecules do not arise by chance - only statistical molecules arise by chance - and even they are due to the fine tuning of our universe.
Bottom line - the fine tuning of our universe, star, magnetic field, ozone layer, and earth as a whole is due to God's love - not luck.
Would you like me to list in detail some of these examples of fine tuning?
Or were you referring to my reference to informational vs. statistical molecules?
That would be a chemistry tangent - for starters DNA would be useless for life if it was not precisely coded in a chemical language (cp. a book). Not to mention the need for a messenger molecule (RNA) to read this information and use it in one of the many processes required for life.
And that is just one of the many informational molecules required for life.
It boils down to the difference between life and death. One cause for death is the second law of thermodynamics and specifically the principle of entropy which causes informational molecules to decay to their most stable state - which is non-living matter. It doesn't go the other way - from death to life - without informational molecules in living things. See the many aspects of the origin of life by chemistry directed by information/intelligence vs. statistical molecules.
A simple example - in origin of life experiments many amino acids are produced by chance + an environment produced by intelligent creators (humans). But the primary product is formic acid - this fact is usually omitted by chemical evolutionists. And besides that many amino acids useless for life are produced - another fact covered over by chemical evolutionists (and popular media programs).
And, of course, chirality - but that is just left or right hand polarization of molecules.
Also usually ignored is the precise 3-d shape of molecules required for life - such as enzymes and receptor molecules.
Would you like me to post more detail on this?
I'm not ignoring scientific evidence, I'm requiring you to substantiate your claims that anything you supplied from the JW website requires supernatural intervention from a unique set of gods as opposed to natural mechanisms. When you write "we only worship one god", you are only one subset of one religion "worshipping" one version of the gods. I see your gods as no more demonstrated than the earlier gods your gods derived from.I’m not ignoring the “scientific evidence” you’re posting. I’m challenging you to identify how any of it supports your claims to partisan gods.
The majority of your “scientific evidence” is boilerplate from any of the fundamentalist Christian ministries. Creationists like to use to "support" their claims. Aren't selective quoting and argumentum ad verecundiam fun?
The existence of various parameters in nature being in such a state to produce life is well known among the physics community, but surely you realize (although refuse to accept), that there is a world of difference between natural forces and "intelligent design", and that the latter does not logically follow from the former?
The intelligent design / creationist argument simply states that “if things were different, things would be different”. Well, yeah. If today was Tuesday, it wouldn’t be Monday.
Even if we acknowledge that parameters are godly “fine-tuned”, why should anyone accept that it is your gods are the fine tuners? Your gods are only three assertions of the gods so you might want to present evidence for your gods before insisting that your gods are the only fine tuning gods.
The universe could fine-tune itself. Self-organizing critical systems (Ecosystem as self-organizing critical systems) are capable of fine-tuning all by themselves, following only a simple set of physical laws -- thus making it likely that the parameters are "fine-tuned" the way we see them by purely natural mechanisms.
Yes, you are ignoring the scientific evidence and you also have not explained what you believe caused all this 'fine tuning.'
On your off topic tangent - we only worship one God: Jehovah. That name means "He causes to be." So, how do you explain how all of these examples of fine tuning came to be?
I don't explain your claims to "fine tuning" of anything because your insistence that "fine tuning" is the product of your gods is absent any measurable standard which applies to your gods, also. Nothing about the workings of the universe or the laws of nature require your gods or anyone else's gods.
Fine tuning is not dependent on the cause. You are simply using an excuse to ignore the scientific evidence of fine tuning and you also fail to post any cause you think more likely.
For me, I believe in cause and effect (as in the primary definition of the Divine Name Jehovah) and the law of conservation of matter and energy.
What was the cause of fine tuning, and where did the energy come from that caused the energy first and then later the matter in our universe?
Or do you have the blind faith of some that claim the origin of our universe had no cause and was produced from nothing?
I will be offline until tomorrow probably - so you will once again have time to examine the evidence I have posted.
Or, you can continue to make excuses to ignore the scientific evidence.
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