Zone1 Grace and Works

[onefour1]

Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

God requires that we do his will before he grants the grace to enter his kingdom.

James 2:20
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Par of having a true faith is having good works which is the will of God.

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

The faith and works do not save us. It is the grace of God that is the saving power behind salvation. However, God has required that we we walk in faith and has let us know that faith without works is dead. God is telling us that we are created in Christ Jesus unto good works and that we should walk in them but they are not the saving force. They are required before God will grant his grace but they are not the part of the equation that saves. It is the grace of God that does the saving. Does this mean that we should forsake good works? NO!!! We should walk in them and we are created unto good works. God requires that we do good works even though they are not the saving power. Only after we walk in good works will the Lord grant his saving grace which alone has the power to grant us salvation in his kingdom.

Again read Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

 

[onefour1]

1 Corinthians 15:58
58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye steadfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

 

[Mashmont]

Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

God requires that we do his will before he grants the grace to enter his kingdom.

James 2:20
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Par of having a true faith is having good works which is the will of God.

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

The faith and works do not save us. It is the grace of God that is the saving power behind salvation. However, God has required that we we walk in faith and has let us know that faith without works is dead. God is telling us that we are created in Christ Jesus unto good works and that we should walk in them but they are not the saving force. They are required before God will grant his grace but they are not the part of the equation that saves. It is the grace of God that does the saving. Does this mean that we should forsake good works? NO!!! We should walk in them and we are created unto good works. God requires that we do good works even though they are not the saving power. Only after we walk in good works will the Lord grant his saving grace which alone has the power to grant us salvation in his kingdom.

Again read Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

I have never understood the Protestant claim that works are unnecessary to reach Heaven.

 

[GMCGeneral]

I have never understood the Protestant claim that works are unnecessary to reach Heaven.

Because works cannot save whatsoever. What of the Thief on the Cross? did he have to perform for G-d to earn his salvation? No. The PROPER interpretation here is G-d die everything to secure salvation for all who ask. The works we do come as a result of being saved, not as a condition, and the purpose is to put the Gospel on display and lead others to the Cross. That G-d's grace is more than enough for eternal life.

 

[Meriweather]

I have never understood the Protestant claim that works are unnecessary to reach Heaven.

Jesus' life, death, and resurrection brought redemption to the entire world, re-establishing the relationship between mankind and God (salvation) that was broken when the first sin entered the world. Grace.

Those who joyfully embrace a relationship with God become His servants, worthless servants, Jesus assured us, and doing only what is already expected of us. Works.

Works stamps those who have accepted redemption and have a relationship with God. Salvation. These are His children and His servants.

 

[BULLDOG]

Jesus' life, death, and resurrection brought redemption to the entire world, re-establishing the relationship between mankind and God (salvation) that was broken when the first sin entered the world. Grace.

Those who joyfully embrace a relationship with God become His servants, worthless servants, Jesus assured us, and doing only what is already expected of us. Works.

Works stamps those who have accepted redemption and have a relationship with God. Salvation. These are His children and His servants.

So everyone who died between the first sin and the resurection went to hell?

 

[Meriweather]

So everyone who died between the first sin and the resurection went to hell?

Christianity teaches that Christ descended to the dead and opened the way of salvation to all who came before.

 

[BULLDOG]

Christianity teaches that Christ descended to the dead and opened the way of salvation to all who came before.

So salvation after death is possible? How does that work?

 

[onefour1]

Because works cannot save whatsoever. What of the Thief on the Cross? did he have to perform for G-d to earn his salvation? No. The PROPER interpretation here is G-d die everything to secure salvation for all who ask. The works we do come as a result of being saved, not as a condition, and the purpose is to put the Gospel on display and lead others to the Cross. That G-d's grace is more than enough for eternal life.

Many seem to assume that the thief on the cross was granted entrance into the kingdom of heaven. I don't think the verse ever claims that he went to heaven.

Luke 23:
39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

In these verses the thief on the cross was promised that he would be with him in paradise on that very day. The problem is that Jesus would not ascend into heaven until 3 days later and not on that same day. So the question is, "Is paradise the same as the kingdom of heaven?".

John 20:1, 14-17
1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

14 And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
15 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
16 Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master.
17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Here we read that on the first day of the week which was Sunday which was 3 days after his crucifixion Jesus appears unto Mary and tells her that she should touch him not because he had not yet ascended up to heaven where his Father in heaven resides. So, Jesus had not yet ascended to heaven. Therefore the thief on the cross could not have been in the kingdom of heaven if Jesus himself had not yet gone there. So the question is, "where is paradise?" and "where was Jesus after his death to the end of that day that he promised the thief he would be with him on that day in paradise?". It turns out that Jesus, before his resurrection, went among those who were the spirits of the dead who had not yet been resurrected and who were awaiting their judgement and preached the gospel unto them.

1 Peter 3:18-20
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

1 Peter 4:5-6
5 Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

Apparently Jesus, before being resurrected, went among those who were dead to preach the gospel. I tend to believe that Jesus, upon preaching to the dead, had those who believed and those who may not have. I believe that those who believed were in a state of paradise where those who may not have believed were still in a type of spirit prison. The thief seems to have accepted Jesus while on the cross and was probably numbered among those who accepted him in the world of spirits who were dead. The thief seem to be worried about his own salvation and reprimanded the other person being crucified and believed in the Lord Jesus. Eventually he may very well have been accepted into God's kingdom but I believe that paradise was not referring to his kingdom since he had not yet ascended to heaven until after his resurrection which was at least 3 days later. But the thief did exercise faith in the Christ and may have been forgiven of his theft. We don't know what else the thief did in his life and it is possible that he may have done many good works even though he was considered a thief.

There are many who go through life without hearing the gospel of Jesus Christ and many have likely died without this knowledge. I believe they still have a chance after death to hear the gospel and either accept it or reject. In this way all will have the opportunity to accept or reject the gospel and be judged accordingly. A Prophet in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints received a revelation about the preaching of the gospel to the dead. If you are interested, it can be found at the following link:

Doctrine and Covenants 138

It may be that the thief, while in the world of spirits, took part in also preaching the gospel to the dead and repented in his heart and exercised faith unto receiving the grace necessary to enter the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Meriweather]

So salvation after death is possible? How does that work?

I imagine the same way it works before death. One shows up wanting to work in the Lord's vineyard. Jesus told a parable that teaches that no matter how many or how few hours a person works, with God the outcome is the same.

 

[Woodznutz]

So everyone who died between the first sin and the resurection went to hell?

They will be resurrected to life and the opportunity for salvation under better conditions.

 

[BULLDOG]

Many seem to assume that the thief on the cross was granted entrance into the kingdom of heaven. I don't think the verse ever claims that he went to heaven.

Luke 23:
39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

In these verses the thief on the cross was promised that he would be with him in paradise on that very day. The problem is that Jesus would not ascend into heaven until 3 days later and not on that same day. So the question is, "Is paradise the same as the kingdom of heaven?".

John 20:1, 14-17
1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

14 And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
15 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
16 Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master.
17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Here we read that on the first day of the week which was Sunday which was 3 days after his crucifixion Jesus appears unto Mary and tells her that she should touch him not because he had not yet ascended up to heaven where his Father in heaven resides. So, Jesus had not yet ascended to heaven. Therefore the thief on the cross could not have been in the kingdom of heaven if Jesus himself had not yet gone there. So the question is, "where is paradise?" and "where was Jesus after his death to the end of that day that he promised the thief he would be with him on that day in paradise?". It turns out that Jesus, before his resurrection, went among those who were the spirits of the dead who had not yet been resurrected and who were awaiting their judgement and preached the gospel unto them.

1 Peter 3:18-20
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

1 Peter 4:5-6
5 Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

Apparently Jesus, before being resurrected, went among those who were dead to preach the gospel. I tend to believe that Jesus, upon preaching to the dead, had those who believed and those who may not have. I believe that those who believed were in a state of paradise where those who may not have believed were still in a type of spirit prison. The thief seems to have accepted Jesus while on the cross and was probably numbered among those who accepted him in the world of spirits who were dead. The thief seem to be worried about his own salvation and reprimanded the other person being crucified and believed in the Lord Jesus. Eventually he may very well have been accepted into God's kingdom but I believe that paradise was not referring to his kingdom since he had not yet ascended to heaven until after his resurrection which was at least 3 days later. But the thief did exercise faith in the Christ and may have been forgiven of his theft. We don't know what else the thief did in his life and it is possible that he may have done many good works even though he was considered a thief.

There are many who go through life without hearing the gospel of Jesus Christ and many have likely died without this knowledge. I believe they still have a chance after death to hear the gospel and either accept it or reject. In this way all will have the opportunity to accept or reject the gospel and be judged accordingly. A Prophet in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints received a revelation about the preaching of the gospel to the dead. If you are interested, it can be found at the following link:

Doctrine and Covenants 138

It may be that the thief, while in the world of spirits, took part in also preaching the gospel to the dead and repented in his heart and exercised faith unto receiving the grace necessary to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Showing up somewhere else after dying is enough proof that a god exists. Kinda shitty of him not to make it that clear before we die.

 

[BULLDOG]

They will be resurrected to life and the opportunity for salvation under better conditions.

Reincarnation?

 

[onefour1]

Jesus' life, death, and resurrection brought redemption to the entire world, re-establishing the relationship between mankind and God (salvation) that was broken when the first sin entered the world. Grace.

Those who joyfully embrace a relationship with God become His servants, worthless servants, Jesus assured us, and doing only what is already expected of us. Works.

Works stamps those who have accepted redemption and have a relationship with God. Salvation. These are His children and His servants.

I agree that redemption comes to all. But redemption is not particularly the gift of entering the kingdom of heaven. The redemption that all mankind receive is that Jesus' atonement covers original sin and we will not be punished for Adam's transgression but only for those sins which we as an individual commit if we are not forgiven of them. Because of this, no man deserves death and all mankind will receive the redemption of resurrection and live immortally for all eternity to come. But redemption into the kingdom of heaven is reserved only for the righteous in Christ. It is for those who humble themselves and follow after the Lord and his teachings. Thus not everyone that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven but he that doeth the will of our Father in heaven. I do not believe in a strict belief in "Heaven or Eternal Damnation". I believe that there are various kingdoms that man can go to but the highest kingdom is the kingdom of heaven. That is reserved for those who are the faithful in Christ. For more on those kingdoms, Joseph Smith received the following revelation regarding those kingdoms.

Doctrine and Covenants 76

Outer Darkness is where Satan, his angels and those who become a Son of Perdition will go, also known as the Lake of Fire and Brimstone. Others will go to either a Terrestrial or Telestial kingdom if they don't enter God's celestial kingdom..

 

[Woodznutz]

Reincarnation?

You could say that.

 

[Woodznutz]

Many seem to assume that the thief on the cross was granted entrance into the kingdom of heaven. I don't think the verse ever claims that he went to heaven.

Luke 23:
39 And one of the malefactors which were hanged railed on him, saying, If thou be Christ, save thyself and us.
40 But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?
41 And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.
42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

In these verses the thief on the cross was promised that he would be with him in paradise on that very day. The problem is that Jesus would not ascend into heaven until 3 days later and not on that same day. So the question is, "Is paradise the same as the kingdom of heaven?".

John 20:1, 14-17
1 The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre.

14 And when she had thus said, she turned herself back, and saw Jesus standing, and knew not that it was Jesus.
15 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, why weepest thou? whom seekest thou? She, supposing him to be the gardener, saith unto him, Sir, if thou have borne him hence, tell me where thou hast laid him, and I will take him away.
16 Jesus saith unto her, Mary. She turned herself, and saith unto him, Rabboni; which is to say, Master.
17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

Here we read that on the first day of the week which was Sunday which was 3 days after his crucifixion Jesus appears unto Mary and tells her that she should touch him not because he had not yet ascended up to heaven where his Father in heaven resides. So, Jesus had not yet ascended to heaven. Therefore the thief on the cross could not have been in the kingdom of heaven if Jesus himself had not yet gone there. So the question is, "where is paradise?" and "where was Jesus after his death to the end of that day that he promised the thief he would be with him on that day in paradise?". It turns out that Jesus, before his resurrection, went among those who were the spirits of the dead who had not yet been resurrected and who were awaiting their judgement and preached the gospel unto them.

1 Peter 3:18-20
18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

1 Peter 4:5-6
5 Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead.
6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.

Apparently Jesus, before being resurrected, went among those who were dead to preach the gospel. I tend to believe that Jesus, upon preaching to the dead, had those who believed and those who may not have. I believe that those who believed were in a state of paradise where those who may not have believed were still in a type of spirit prison. The thief seems to have accepted Jesus while on the cross and was probably numbered among those who accepted him in the world of spirits who were dead. The thief seem to be worried about his own salvation and reprimanded the other person being crucified and believed in the Lord Jesus. Eventually he may very well have been accepted into God's kingdom but I believe that paradise was not referring to his kingdom since he had not yet ascended to heaven until after his resurrection which was at least 3 days later. But the thief did exercise faith in the Christ and may have been forgiven of his theft. We don't know what else the thief did in his life and it is possible that he may have done many good works even though he was considered a thief.

There are many who go through life without hearing the gospel of Jesus Christ and many have likely died without this knowledge. I believe they still have a chance after death to hear the gospel and either accept it or reject. In this way all will have the opportunity to accept or reject the gospel and be judged accordingly. A Prophet in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints received a revelation about the preaching of the gospel to the dead. If you are interested, it can be found at the following link:

Doctrine and Covenants 138

It may be that the thief, while in the world of spirits, took part in also preaching the gospel to the dead and repented in his heart and exercised faith unto receiving the grace necessary to enter the kingdom of heaven.

After his death on the cross the thief's next moment would be in the paradise of the restored earth (not heaven), resurrected along with the other Israelites that have passed.

 

[Clyde 154]

Because works cannot save whatsoever. What of the Thief on the Cross? did he have to perform for G-d to earn his salvation? No. The PROPER interpretation here is G-d die everything to secure salvation for all who ask. The works we do come as a result of being saved, not as a condition, and the purpose is to put the Gospel on display and lead others to the Cross. That G-d's grace is more than enough for eternal life.

The thief on the cross? God incarnate saved this man as per the Law and the Prophets..........Christianity did not take effect until Jesus Christ fulfilled the requirements of the Law and the Prophets. When He stated, "It is finished.........the Law was completed/fulfilled) What? Are you suggesting that the Christ will descend from His throne in Heaven to personally save anyone under the terms of the OLD LAW the way God saved those who ascended to heaven in the Old Testament? No one was saved under the LAW....not one human was worthy of salvation......thus, Jesus had to go IN THE SPIRIT after His death to preach salvation to those who died and are now resting in Hades awaiting the final judgment. Jesus Declared only 8 were worthy of salvation (Noah's family) -- 1 Peter 3:20

There where none other than the original disciples that were saved prior to Peter.....using the keys he had been given by the Christ (Matthew 16) to open the door to the kingdom of God...i.e, the church given to Jesus by the Father. Jesus (God incarnate had the authority while on earth to forgive sin -- Matthew 9:6), Jesus forgave His disciples while He was living....because He had the authority as God incarnate to forgive sin.

Peter preached the very first gospel message under the terms of the New Covenant (Acts 2:38)........Peter informed everyone that gathered there (Jews from all over the region...more than 3000 souls) what they must do to enter the kingdom that Jesus was both Lord and Christ over. Peter bound in heaven what was bound on earth by the use of his keys to the kingdom just as promised by the Christ in (Matthew 16:19). What did Peter bind? The conditions required for salvation under the New Testament covenant of Jesus Christ, "Repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ and you shall receive the "GIFT" of the Holy Spirit........"

These conditions are still binding today. The thief was saved because God personally saved him......not because of any work, but because God personally forgave him of his earthly sins. Thus, unless you expect Jesus (God incarnate) to personally forgive your sins......The Christ has died in vain in order to fulfill the Conditions required by the Law and the Prophets............to walk a perfect sin free life under the terms of the LAW. Jesus was the only man in history that walked from cradle to grave without sinning once under the Law. Thus He became the perfect sacrificial lamb of God......just as the prophet John the Baptist declared, (John 1:29) Jesus had to die in order for the New Covenant to come into existence.

The THIEF DIED under the terms of the Law and the Prophets........it took God incarnate to forgive his sins.

 

[GMCGeneral]

The thief on the cross? God incarnate saved this man as per the Law and the Prophets..........Christianity did not take effect until Jesus Christ fulfilled the requirements of the Law and the Prophets. When He stated, "It is finished.........the Law was completed/fulfilled) What? Are you suggesting that the Christ will descend from His throne in Heaven to personally save anyone under the terms of the OLD LAW the way God saved those who ascended to heaven in the Old Testament? No one was saved under the LAW....not one human was worthy of salvation......thus, Jesus had to go IN THE SPIRIT after His death to preach salvation to those who died and are now resting in Hades awaiting the final judgment. Jesus Declared only 8 were worthy of salvation (Noah's family) -- 1 Peter 3:20

There where none other than the original disciples that were saved prior to Peter.....using the keys he had been given by the Christ (Matthew 16) to open the door to the kingdom of God...i.e, the church given to Jesus by the Father. Jesus (God incarnate had the authority while on earth to forgive sin -- Matthew 9:6), Jesus forgave His disciples while He was living....because He had the authority as God incarnate to forgive sin.

Peter preached the very first gospel message under the terms of the New Covenant (Acts 2:38)........Peter informed everyone that gathered there (Jews from all over the region...more than 3000 souls) what they must do to enter the kingdom that Jesus was both Lord and Christ over. Peter bound in heaven what was bound on earth by the use of his keys to the kingdom just as promised by the Christ in (Matthew 16:19). What did Peter bind? The conditions required for salvation under the New Testament covenant of Jesus Christ, "Repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ and you shall receive the "GIFT" of the Holy Spirit........"

These conditions are still binding today. The thief was saved because God personally saved him......not because of any work, but because God personally forgave him of his earthly sins. Thus, unless you expect Jesus (God incarnate) to personally forgive your sins......The Christ has died in vain in order to fulfill the Conditions required by the Law and the Prophets............to walk a perfect sin free life under the terms of the LAW. Jesus was the only man in history that walked from cradle to grave without sinning once under the Law. Thus He became the perfect sacrificial lamb of God......just as the prophet John the Baptist declared, (John 1:29) Jesus had to die in order for the New Covenant to come into existence.

The THIEF DIED under the terms of the Law and the Prophets........it took God incarnate to forgive his sins.

Amen, and amen. That's the one thing Catholics and adherents to other works-based religions fail to comprehend. It is G-d Himself who saves, not us. Works-based religion teaches that we must do this, this, and this and maybe, just maybe, gain entrance into Heaven. but that flies in the face of G-d's very Holy, Just, and Righteous nature because they (religions) make G-d out to be a liar.

 

[onefour1]

Amen, and amen. That's the one thing Catholics and adherents to other works-based religions fail to comprehend. It is G-d Himself who saves, not us. Works-based religion teaches that we must do this, this, and this and maybe, just maybe, gain entrance into Heaven. but that flies in the face of G-d's very Holy, Just, and Righteous nature because they (religions) make G-d out to be a liar.

With The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints we do not preach that our works save us. However, the scriptures themselves teach that we should do good works and that you cannot have a true faith without works. They also teach that we should walk in them and that we were born to do good works. Even Jesus himself taught that unless we engage in the will of God we will not enter the kingdom of heaven. So, good works are an integral part of the faith. They are not the power to salvation but God does require them at our hands before he will grant his saving grace upon us.

Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

James 2:20
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Part of the problem with those who teach against works is that they may get some to believe that they don't need to do anything in regards to works and will still be saved. But that goes against many scriptures. We need to do the work of repentance and the work of following God's commandments and doing good works to our fellowman. These are all good works that are spoken of frequently in scripture. True, they don't do the saving but they are what God wishes us to do and Matthew 7:21 seems to indicate that if you wish to gain entrance into God's kingdom, you need to do his will. It may not be the saving power but it may be required before you are granted the saving grace that does save you.

 

[BULLDOG]

With The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints we do not preach that our works save us. However, the scriptures themselves teach that we should do good works and that you cannot have a true faith without works. They also teach that we should walk in them and that we were born to do good works. Even Jesus himself taught that unless we engage in the will of God we will not enter the kingdom of heaven. So, good works are an integral part of the faith. They are not the power to salvation but God does require them at our hands before he will grant his saving grace upon us.

Matthew 7:21
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

James 2:20
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Ephesians 2:8-10
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

Part of the problem with those who teach against works is that they may get some to believe that they don't need to do anything in regards to works and will still be saved. But that goes against many scriptures. We need to do the work of repentance and the work of following God's commandments and doing good works to our fellowman. These are all good works that are spoken of frequently in scripture. True, they don't do the saving but they are what God wishes us to do and Matthew 7:21 seems to indicate that if you wish to gain entrance into God's kingdom, you need to do his will. It may not be the saving power but it may be required before you are granted the saving grace that does save you.

So can you be saved, and not do any works at all?