Zone1 Allegory man, this thread is for you!!

[hobelim]

the religion they made was not entirely INNOVATIVE to the greek and roman mind ----it was an easy transition. An interesting reality is the PANTHEON of angels and saints that characterized the
"christian innovation" Another one that I find fascinating is the "VIRGIN" concept to replace the
vestal sluts. Then----hard on came the rules that morphed into the Inquisition with the Public
Auto de Fe to replace the Gladiator games-------see? no actual change

I agree.

They just made the existing secret Babylonian MYSTERY RELIGION of the Roman government and military public, a universal compulsory religion, and put the name of Jesus in the place of Mithras when Caesar conferred power and authority to the Papacy who then set out to conquer the world under the sign of the Mithran cross.

Nothing changed at all.

 

[irosie91]

you've not answered why the romans did not rearrest the itinerant as the authorities and the jews would have demanded or mentions by the jewish community such an occurrence and their regrets being who had them executed and surly would be forgiven ... the latter being the proof they indeed died on the cross.

what are you trying to say, breezie? As to Jesus "immediately" becoming gawd at the time of
the putative resurrection---the only "proof" for that seems to be the writings in the NT

 

[hobelim]

There is no evidence its a metaphor. Christians didnt want enlightened people they want obedient people. They created a devil which isnt in the OT hell which isnt in the OT and used it as threat.

From what I understand Christianity got the idea of the devil from the talking serpent, the nachash, which Jesus taught was a human archetype whose direct descendants actually still exist out there and are as real as Trump.

What is nefarious is that Christians indoctrinate children by filling their heads with irrational superstitious tripe. They teach that Satan is an invisible disembodied entity that is in peoples heads trying to get them to do naughty things, lol, also teaching that any rational objection that arises in their own mind about the crap they are being "taught" is a satanic attack on their 'faith' which sets the mind against itself between knowing what is true and pretending to believe in what they know isn't true, a state of cognitive dissonance which resembles a deep sleep making "believers" unaware, oblivious, easy prey for every sort of foul and loathsome beast and bird on earth.

And if anyone tries to wake them up to the trap they are caught up in they accuse them of being a devil.

 

[BreezeWood]

You are talking nonsense.

- had it occurred and not as gossip or figments of imagination.

you can run and hide (or) give it a shot - zing ... remember not everyone lives in texas.

 

[BreezeWood]

As to Jesus "immediately" becoming gawd

all in the heavens are equal - all became gods ... is monotheism.

the triumph over evil ... is purity and is an achievement all the same for everyone.

 

[irosie91]

all in the heavens are equal - all became gods ... is monotheism.

the triumph over evil ... is purity and is an achievement all the same for everyone.

ding dong dell----***** in the well

 

[Hafar1014]

From what I understand Christianity got the idea of the devil from the talking serpent, the nachash, which Jesus taught was a human archetype whose direct descendants actually still exist out there and are as real as Trump.

What is nefarious is that Christians indoctrinate children by filling their heads with irrational superstitious tripe. They teach that Satan is an invisible disembodied entity that is in peoples heads trying to get them to do naughty things, lol, also teaching that any rational objection that arises in their own mind about the crap they are being "taught" is a satanic attack on their 'faith' which sets the mind against itself between knowing what is true and pretending to believe in what they know isn't true, a state of cognitive dissonance which resembles a deep sleep making "believers" unaware, oblivious, easy prey for every sort of foul and loathsome beast and bird on earth.

And if anyone tries to wake them up to the trap they are caught up in they accuse them of being a devil.

The devil comes from Dualism like Zoroastrianism. The serpent is a metaphor for guile from Hebrew folklore. Satan is liar noy devil.

 

[hobelim]

hell which isnt in the OT and used it as threat

The long list of maledictions Moses promised if the people did not follow Divine Law sure sounds like hell to me.

 

[irosie91]

The long list of maledictions Moses promised if the people did not follow Divine Law sure sounds like hell to me.

you are not accustomed to hebrew rhetoric----or the sort of rants in which jewish mothers
engage

 

[hobelim]

Satan is liar

Every creature described in scripture from angels to devils and every one in between, dogs, swine that DO NOT RUMINATE, teeming vermin that go down on all fours, cattle, wolves, sheep, goats, serpents, bottom feeders, creepy things that creep, etc., are metaphors for human archetypes that are used in every language to this day.,

 

[hobelim]

you are not accustomed to hebrew rhetoric----or the sort of rants in which jewish mothers
engage

You are assuming that I am not accustomed to Hebrew rhetoric and that I didn't have a ranting Jewish mother?

Shame on you. lol

 

[irosie91]

So you are assuming that I didn't have a Jewish mother?

Shame on you. lol

OH !!!!! well if you do----then the hysterical complaints issued forth by Moses would
seem familiar to you-----he is a classical KVETCH

 

[hobelim]

OH !!!!! well if you do----then the hysterical complaints issued forth by Moses would
seem familiar to you-----he is a classical KVETCH

Hysterical complaints? Wow. Sure, Moses was a kvetch whose "hysterical" kvetching came true.

 

[hobelim]

The devil comes from Dualism like Zoroastrianism. The serpent is a metaphor for guile from Hebrew folklore. Satan is liar noy devil.

"Now the serpent was more crafty (subtle, skilled in deceit) than any living creature of the field which the LORD God had made." Genesis 3:1

You do know that pharaoh wore a serpent on his head and was an expert in the magical arts, sorcery, what is now well known as hypnosis, brainwashing, or mind control, the stars, feared and revered, in the ancient world.

A subtle crafty creature, (skilled in deceit), that God had also made is a metaphor for guile? I don't think so,.

 

[irosie91]

I once had a bracelet that was made to look like a snake----hubby HATED
it------I thought it was cute------I don't know what happened to it.

 

[hobelim]

I once had a bracelet that was made to look like a snake----hubby HATED
it------I thought it was cute------I don't know what happened to it.

Ask hubby.

 

[BreezeWood]

"Now the serpent was more crafty (subtle, skilled in deceit) ...

they new at the time - moses

and gave the criminal the horns they deserved. the true events of the 1st century and matters not for a conclave that may have written for him, judaism.

 

[hobelim]

they new at the time - moses

View attachment 1161409

and gave the criminal the horns they deserved. the true events of the 1st century and matters not for a conclave that may have written for him, judaism.

"The original Hebrew text describes Moses' face as being "radiant" after his encounter with God, but the word for "ray" (keren) was mistakenly translated as "horn".

Apparently your dedication to self determination, lol, has had the same exact effect that it had on Adam. In spite of your tireless labor the sweat of your brow, thinking, has only produced thorns and thistles. Absolutely nothing.

Congratulations!

 

[Hafar1014]

"Now the serpent was more crafty (subtle, skilled in deceit) than any living creature of the field which the LORD God had made." Genesis 3:1

You do know that pharaoh wore a serpent on his head and was an expert in the magical arts, sorcery, what is now well known as hypnosis, brainwashing, or mind control, the stars, feared and revered, in the ancient world.

View attachment 1161245View attachment 1161246View attachment 1161244

A subtle crafty creature, (skilled in deceit), that God had also made is a metaphor for guile? I don't think so,.

There are multiple interpretations of the serpent in Genesis 3, and whether it is a metaphor for guile is one of the central questions explored by biblical scholars and theologians.
The serpent as a symbol of guile
The strongest argument for the serpent as a symbol of guile (cunning, deceit) comes from Genesis 3:1, which describes the serpent as "more crafty" (Hebrew: arum) than any of the wild animals.

• Craftiness in action: The serpent's guile is on display throughout the dialogue with Eve. It subtly questions God's command, and when Eve repeats it, the serpent lies outright, promising that eating the fruit will not bring death but rather divine-like wisdom.
• A play on words: A Hebrew wordplay in the text connects the serpent's "craftiness" (arum) with Adam and Eve's subsequent "nakedness" (arummim), emphasizing that their attempt to gain worldly shrewdness only resulted in shame.

 

[Seymour Flops]

Let me put it this way. One must decipher the allegories, metaphors, homonyms, hyperbole, etc. to know what actually happened which has been lost to time ever since the truth was buried and hidden in figurative language.

Until now.

What is the truth that was buried and hidden, and how do we all of a sudden know it now?

The miracles are impossible to be literally true.

Yes, of course. That is what a miracle is, when the impossible happens.

If its not factual then it's the greatest story that never happened. The kingdom of heaven is like hidden treasure buried in a field. The man who found it (Jesus) BURIED IT AGAIN.

After all the crazy talk about giving sight to the blind, healing the paralyzed, raising the dead, etc, Jesus said;

"Till now I have been using figures of speech."

The only question is, can you dig it?

Of course Jesus used figurative language. The wise and foolish virgins, the Good Samaritan, etc. were fictional characters and the mustard seed was an allogory. But that has nothing to do with the miracles describe in the Bible, starting with the very first line of Genesis, and going all the way through Revelations.

I'm not claiming that all of these miracles actually happened. I understand they could be fictionalized versions of real events such as the revolt of the Hebrew slaves of Egypt, turned into a series of miracles in the retelling. I like theories of naturalistic explanations of biblical events, such as the resurrection of Jesus.

But that does not change the fact that the Bible purports to be true. My faith teaches that it is true, and that the miracles happened exactly as described.. If my belief wavers from time to time, doubt is natural for humans. But what I don't do is try to convince others that I do believe in the Bible, but in an interpretation that renders it fictional, when it clearly is intended to be factual.

That makes no sense to me, and seems only an attempt to compromise with "the world."

If I not believe in the Bible, I would certainly not try to convince those who do to accept my interpretation of it. That seems like sour grapes, which is a phrase from a fictional story that teaches a truth.