Why Would Anyone Wish Christianity to Not Be True?

[Anathema]

Do you believe God targeted your father for cancer? Or do you believe God failed to save your father from cancer? Do you believe this would be the role of God if one existed?

I believe that the purpose of “God” is to put us in unpleasant situations to see how we respond.

I’ve changed my belief now, but at the time I felt “God” should have saved him. I no longer believe that’s the role “God” plays in the Universe.

I now believe “God” simply exists to judge our ability to deal with the horrible situations we are put in during the course of our lives.

 

[ding]

Is that why you are here discussing things you don't believe?

Shouldn't everyone search for the truth and not just assume they already know everything?

Absolutely. That's why it is odd that you dismiss the possibility that spirit created the material world.

 

[alang1216]

Your life is good, your family wonderful. It doesn't sound like you are missing anything. Do you feel as if you are missing something? If so, what do you think that might be?

An understanding of those who actually have faith.

 

[ding]

If I don't go to heaven what are my other options? I know of hell but I thought that is a place of punishment.

Well, just think of a place in history where no morals or ethics were present.

That’s what hell is, because there is no presence of God there.

I can't think of a time or place when man had no morals or ethics. Can you?

We are hardwired for it. That ought to raise your suspicion.

 

[Weatherman2020]

If I don't go to heaven what are my other options? I know of hell but I thought that is a place of punishment.

Well, just think of a place in history where no morals or ethics were present.

That’s what hell is, because there is no presence of God there.

I can't think of a time or place when man had no morals or ethics. Can you?

Cambodia Killing Fields.
German extermination camps.
German and Japanese human experimentation camps
Soviet Gulags

 

[ding]

If I don't go to heaven what are my other options? I know of hell but I thought that is a place of punishment.

Well, just think of a place in history where no morals or ethics were present.

That’s what hell is, because there is no presence of God there.

I can't think of a time or place when man had no morals or ethics. Can you?

Cambodia Killing Fields.
German extermination camps.
German and Japanese human experimentation camps
Soviet Gulags

What is it that you believe that proves exactly?

 

[Anathema]

I don't know how you ended up attributing that quote to me. I suspect you edited my quote because I never wrote what you are attributing to me.

I'd appreciate it if you would either correct it or have it deleted.

My apologies. Unfortunately we are past the point where the post can be edited or deleted.

 

[ding]

I don't know how you ended up attributing that quote to me. I suspect you edited my quote because I never wrote what you are attributing to me.

I'd appreciate it if you would either correct it or have it deleted.

My apologies. Unfortunately we are past the point where the post can be edited or deleted.

All you have to do is press the report button and ask the moderator to delete it.

 

[Meriweather]

I’ve changed my belief now, but at the time I felt “God” should have saved him. I no longer believe that’s the role “God” plays in the Universe.

Me either. As a child it wasn't difficult to figure out that God did not fix colds and flu. Reached my teens and realized He didn't fix acne, either.

 

[ding]

Your life is good, your family wonderful. It doesn't sound like you are missing anything. Do you feel as if you are missing something? If so, what do you think that might be?

An understanding of those who actually have faith.

It's not that hard to understand. The Hindu's believe in reincarnation and that through man's multiple lives he will pursue pleasure, fame, fortune and power but none of that will satisfy him because he was made for more. The reality is that the data overwhelmingly shows that man is a spiritual being. It is for good reason that David Foster Wallace said that we all worship something and the only choice in the matter is what we choose to worship. We are literally hardwired for it. Throughout history every society has overwhelmingly held the belief that man is more than just matter and that there is a higher power than man. When we look at the data today we see that more and more people are rejecting organized religion but have not abandoned their belief that they are more than just matter or that there is a force which connects or binds us all. From the atheist's vantage point these beliefs exist because of evolutionary forces. But the reality is that even that argument confirms that spirituality offers a functional advantage over materialism. According to natural selection there are two main components; functional advantage and transfer of functional advantage to the next generation. So even natural selection confirms that spirituality is a behavior which leads to success. Otherwise, according to natural selection, it would have been abandoned long ago. As mankind has gained more and more knowledge of his natural surroundings his desire for spirituality has not diminished. In fact, the more materialistic we became the less satisfied we became.

 

[Anathema]

Me either. As a child it wasn't difficult to figure out that God did not fix colds and flu. Reached my teens and realized He didn't fix acne, either.

The issues I’ve been concerned with are somewhat less trivial.

 

[Meriweather]

An understanding of those who actually have faith.

Oh, good! For a moment I thought you might want an understanding of spouse and children!

Everyone is different, unique--and even within a single one of us, there are a variety of reasons. I, myself, have always had this rule of thumb that generally, we all have three good reasons in coming to a decision. For me, these three reasons played a part. Belief in God gave me a new perspective on my own life, comparing God's ways to my ways--what as important to Him versus what was important to me. Second, belief in religion took my mind off myself and broadened my thinking. Third, following the teachings of Jesus, while difficult and even bewildering, worked. They changed my life and how I viewed life and others. Faith in Jesus was making a huge difference.

In the interest of full disclosure, I did have a couple of experience of God along the way, so I never had to work on faith alone. I know God is. That is a huge motivator for choosing to follow either Christianity or Judaism.

 

[Meriweather]

The issues I’ve been concerned with are somewhat less trivial.

The point is that when something less trivial occurred I was well aware God did not handle such situations with a quick physical cure. He works much more deeply than that.

 

[presonorek]

I would hope that a real god would be nicer than the one depicted in the bible.

Nicer than being born so as to take the blame for everything bad you’ve ever done?

Interesting.

Not what I said. The god of the bible starts out in chapter one by drowning nearly everyone.

I think that's Chapter 7, actually.

It also destroys cities, kills first born, boots us out of a nice place (Eden), and generally does pretty bad things throughout and threatens people with hell...

Hell really isn't a biblical concept. Or not hell as in the fiery pit of eternal torment, anyway.

Yeah. I noticed that each time I read through the Bible. There are very few references to hell in the Bible. The references that are there are vague and ambiguous. I believe the hell most commonly described in our culture is based upon Greek mythology not the Bible.

 

[presonorek]

I am not talking about the Christianity that has been hijacked by people and religion throughout the centuries to gain power and control. I am not talking about what your opinion you learned as a child in some Sunday school class. I am not talking about what you learned from some friend or website about Christianity.

I am not even talking about if you think Jesus is a myth. I am talking about wouldn't it be great if Jesus was real?

The stand up to the corrupt religious leaders of the time Jesus. The I'm going to take in all of the outcasts you so called religious people refuse to be around Jesus. The God so loved the world that he came to save us Jesus. The I am here to make you new Jesus.

What is the objection to walking with Jesus?

Do you know somebody that doesn't want it to be true? It is the greatest story ever told. Everybody loves it. It is just that it is so outrageous that we know it isn't true. That doesn't make atheist relieved. It makes them angry.

People who believe in Christ are happier than those who don't. I have personally been on both sides. There were times when I knew for a fact that God was real and working in my life. Most of my adult life I have lived in disappointment knowing that the Jesus fairy tale makes zero sense.

Those times when I believed I was way happier.

 

[Anathema]

[QUOTE="Meriweather, post: 21554146, member: 51965@]The point is that when something less trivial occurred I was well aware God did not handle such situations with a quick physical cure. He works much more deeply than that.[/QUOTE]

No. He doesn’t work at all. He simply sits there and laughs at our misery and the whole idea that he would be interested in helping any of us.

 

[presonorek]

Doesn't seem fair. If I died and then was given a chance to accept Jesus, I'm sure I would. There are no atheists in heaven (or hell).

If this was God's system for Him to judge people for thousands of years, why the change? What did Jesus bring to the table?

I am not one who believes that acceptance (or non-acceptance) of Jesus determines our fate. I believe it is our own hearts and choosing good (better the ideal) over evil that is the greatest factor.

The Catholic Church assures people it knows the ways of Christ and can guarantee that if one follows the Catholic faith, one is following Jesus and the Way of eternal life. The Church does NOT teach there is no other way into heaven and does NOT claim one must be a Catholic, or a Christian, or else! It merely points to the fact that it cannot make the same assurances to non-Catholics. It has no authority to do so, and little or no knowledge of how God may be working in non-believers' (and others) lives. The Catholic Church simply concentrates on what it was given through Apostolic teachings that came directly from Christ.

In Romans, the Apostle Paul writes that people who have no belief in God will face what I think may be a tougher judgement--they will face the judgement of their own hearts.

We all need to remember Dante's Inferno was a work of fiction as well as satire and parody. (I was taught this early on in Catholic School.) We were taught that people choose heaven (an eternity of service with God) or hell (an eternity apart from God).

Note that Jesus compares anger with one's brother to the fires of Gehenna (the city dump). The flame never goes out, yet the worm never dies. That is a good comparison for anger/hatred in our own hearts, but it is not a reference to hell.

Jesus also talks of a purifying fire. In other words, we are gold, but with some impurities that need to be burned away. (Catholics see that as an example not only of our struggles here as we strive for self-improvement, but also of purgatory after our death.)

Third, Jesus speaks of an unquenchable fire intended for devils and demons--those who know God and totally reject him. Some think that will also be the fate of humans who know God and then choose to reject Him.

There seems no indication that the same fate is in store for those who simply cannot believe. Scripture states that faith is a gift. Don't stop seeking that gift too easily, but also remember there are Bible passages where it appears that those without the gift of faith, who did try, and who did follow the law written in their hearts, are not automatically destined for hell. The Catholic Church teaches they are entrusted to a merciful God.

Thanks. You are a fine spokesman for your religion and faith. I just wish I could believe your beliefs describe reality. Maybe someday.

Religious usually think atheists are mean spirited. Atheist are usually extremely jealous of strong believers. Being a person of great faith is the most wonderful thing a person can have in this life.

The apostle Paul got it right when he said that thing. Something about us having hope only in this life alone then we would be most miserable. I don't remember it exactly. Atheists are a miserable lot. They would trade all their material possessions to have faith like Meriweather. Unfortunately, it can't be bought.

 

[Meriweather]

No. He doesn’t work at all. He simply sits there and laughs at our misery and the whole idea that he would be interested in helping any of us.

My experience was much different. I believe He cares greatly. I am so sorry, though, for your hard times. Impossible to explain, I know.

 

[BreezeWood]

I am not talking about the Christianity that has been hijacked by people and religion throughout the centuries to gain power and control. I am not talking about what your opinion you learned as a child in some Sunday school class. I am not talking about what you learned from some friend or website about Christianity.

I am not even talking about if you think Jesus is a myth. I am talking about wouldn't it be great if Jesus was real?

The stand up to the corrupt religious leaders of the time Jesus. The I'm going to take in all of the outcasts you so called religious people refuse to be around Jesus. The God so loved the world that he came to save us Jesus. The I am here to make you new Jesus.

What is the objection to walking with Jesus?

Do you know somebody that doesn't want it to be true? It is the greatest story ever told. Everybody loves it. It is just that it is so outrageous that we know it isn't true. That doesn't make atheist relieved. It makes them angry.

People who believe in Christ are happier than those who don't. I have personally been on both sides. There were times when I knew for a fact that God was real and working in my life. Most of my adult life I have lived in disappointment knowing that the Jesus fairy tale makes zero sense.

Those times when I believed I was way happier.

.

Those times when I believed I was way happier.

finding the truth does not at least make you more comfortable ... why not happy.

 

[Slyhunter]

I would hope that a real god would be nicer than the one depicted in the bible.

The one in the bible is a totalitarian, narcissistic maniac.