My son may have ADHD

[Samson]

the part that is made up is that it is a brain disorder..my sons so called hyperactivity..that was a problem in school is a gift in the real world..he often works 6 days a week..he comes home after a full days work at 3 has the house clean dinner ready for his girlfriend getting home ..then he ready to go out or work on a project..he will talk to anyone anywhere and always has something to say.. employers love him..all the qualities he is praised for his outgoing ways his out the box thinking, his humor.his high energy and talkativeness..his mufti-tasking..are all the traits they called his symptoms
in a school setting

You said it yourself, it was a problem in school. He's adjusted and he's living with it in the real world, that doesn't make it less of a brain disorder. He's turned it into a gift but few people can get jobs if they can't get an education and they can't get an education if they can't sit still enough to learn.

Guess what? Savant-ism is a neurological disorder too. Do you know what that is? It's what gives certain people talents like photographic memories, etc. The fact that it's a good thing doesn't make it less of a brain disorder.

Interesting that you've gone from arguing that it doesn't exist to claiming it's not a disorder.....

Both of my sister's sons have been through multiple diagnoses over the years. They went from ADHD ( their school insisted on drugs) to Tourettes ( their school insisted on drugs) to Autism ( their school insisted on drugs) to Savant ( their school insisted on drugs) to Asperger ( their school insisted on drugs).

Every step of the way she has insisted on a no-drug approach. And to this day she has prevailed. But not without a ferocious battle. My nephews have both tested at genius level intelligence. The younger is being courted by MENSA. The elder has his sights set on M.I.T. and will settle for nothing less.

Stick to your dogs, Ms. A. It is not you or your child who must bend.

YOU must fight to bend authority.

I'm curious: how did the school insist on drugs?

Was it a teacher, or the entire staff, or evey member of the school district from the school janitor to the superintendent?

I have no doubt that she may have run up against an over-zealous individual; however its difficult to believe that the entire school insisted on anything without due process (diagnosis from medical profesionals), and even then it would not be possible to insist on anything without an overwhelming body of documented evidence.

This is often the case, however: Parents believe that one person, a teacher, or councellor or even a principal, can insist anything, and they think they must do it because as a student they were compliant. The fact is, as a adult and parent, nothing could be further from the truth.

 

[Mr. H.]

It was the janitor. He needed the extra income.

 

[Samson]

It was the janitor. He needed the extra income.

Ah, they know eots.

 

[Mr. H.]

^

 

[eots]

It was the janitor. He needed the extra income.

Ah, they know eots.

Is this your lame attempt at wit ?...how sad for you

 

[eots]

the part that is made up is that it is a brain disorder..my sons so called hyperactivity..that was a problem in school is a gift in the real world..he often works 6 days a week..he comes home after a full days work at 3 has the house clean dinner ready for his girlfriend getting home ..then he ready to go out or work on a project..he will talk to anyone anywhere and always has something to say.. employers love him..all the qualities he is praised for his outgoing ways his out the box thinking, his humor.his high energy and talkativeness..his mufti-tasking..are all the traits they called his symptoms in a school setting

Normalcy is a mental disorder. Especially in boys. Boys are not independent. They are actually dysfunctional girls and must be medicated to act more like girls.

Your experience is quite common. The ones who need to be drugged are often the most imaginative and creative. They are the hardest workers. But then being a "workaholic" is also a mental disorder that must be drugged out. Children that like to run or climb are hyperactive. Those that use creative ways of problem solving have ADD.

If you are a workaholic who likes to work. Never fear. There are drugs that can make you as lazy as the next guy.

The TRUTH About Workaholics | CareerCast.com

This is certainly true in MANY diagnosis of ADHD, but it does not mean ADHD does not exist.

and it does not mean that it does...back to the drawing board sigmund

 

[Samson]

[

For something that does not exists as a medical condition it certainly has the attention of the CDC.

As you have no credentials to know anymore about the subject than the ballon of hot air that is your credablity, whether or not You believe it is a medical condition is irrelevant.

and 40 years a go they all knowingly drove ice picks in peoples brains ,listed homosexuality as a neurological disorder and appeal to authority types like yourself chimed very much the same responses to he critics as you do now

Scarecrow much?

Try to focus on the subject......interesting this seems to be your issue in a thread about ADHD.

 

[barry1960]

Normalcy is a mental disorder. Especially in boys. Boys are not independent. They are actually dysfunctional girls and must be medicated to act more like girls.

Your experience is quite common. The ones who need to be drugged are often the most imaginative and creative. They are the hardest workers. But then being a "workaholic" is also a mental disorder that must be drugged out. Children that like to run or climb are hyperactive. Those that use creative ways of problem solving have ADD.

If you are a workaholic who likes to work. Never fear. There are drugs that can make you as lazy as the next guy.

The TRUTH About Workaholics | CareerCast.com

This is certainly true in MANY diagnosis of ADHD, but it does not mean ADHD does not exist.

and it does not mean that it does...back to the drawing board sigmund

I do agree that ADHD is over diagnosed (your position would be by 100% since in your opinion the condition does not exist). I also agree that there should be concern over providing medication to children.

I was curious what your thoughts are on the diagnosis of autism. The rate of autism has increased dramatically. Do your feel that the condition is over diagnosed or that perhaps it does not exist at all. Although there are symptoms related to autism, there is no definitive test to confirm a diagnosis. The diagnosis is usually made by ruling out other disorders and by the obervations of multiple symptoms.

I am asking since your position on ADHD would appear extreme and I was wondering if you held a similiar position in regards to autism.

 

[eots]

[

For something that does not exists as a medical condition it certainly has the attention of the CDC.

As you have no credentials to know anymore about the subject than the ballon of hot air that is your credablity, whether or not You believe it is a medical condition is irrelevant.

and 40 years a go they all knowingly drove ice picks in peoples brains ,listed homosexuality as a neurological disorder and appeal to authority types like yourself chimed very much the same responses to he critics as you do now

Scarecrow much?

Try to focus on the subject......interesting this seems to be your issue in a thread about ADHD.

what kind of loser repeatedly re-post his old post from the Beginning of the thread minus my reply ??

 

[eots]

This is certainly true in MANY diagnosis of ADHD, but it does not mean ADHD does not exist.

and it does not mean that it does...back to the drawing board sigmund

I do agree that ADHD is over diagnosed (your position would be by 100% since in your opinion the condition does not exist). I also agree that there should be concern over providing medication to children.

I was curious what your thoughts are on the diagnosis of autism. The rate of autism has increased dramtically. Do your feel that the condition is over diagnosed or that perhaps it does not diagnosed at all. Although there are symptoms related to autism, there is no definitive test to confirm a diagnosis. The diagnosis is usually made by ruling out other disorders and by the obervations of multiple symptoms.

I am asking since your position on ADHD would appear extreme and I was wondering if you held a similiar position in regards to autism.

lets ask Dr Francis chairman of the dsm V

In support of the criticisms Dr Frances wrote: ‘We are already in the midst of a false epidemic of ADD. Rates in kids that were 3-5% when DSM IV was published in 1994 have now jumped to 10%. In part this came from changes in DSM IV, but most of the inflation was caused by a marketing blitz to practitioners that accompanied new on-patent drugs amplified by new regulations that also allowed direct to consumer advertising to parents and teachers. In a sensible world, DSM 5 would now offer much tighter criteria for ADD and much clearer advice on the steps needed in its differential diagnosis……. The DSM 5 child and adolescent work group has perversely gone just the other way. It proposes to make an already far too easy diagnosis much looser. How puzzling and troubling.’ (Full blog by Dr Frances available at DSM 5 Will Further Inflate The ADD Bubble | Psychology Today )

He had previously (February 2010) raised concerns about the DSM5 proposal for ADHD along with 18 other DSM5 proposals including; Psychosis Risk Syndrome, Mixed Anxiety Depressive Disorder, Minor Neurocognitive Disorder, Binge Eating Disorder, Temper Dysfunctional Disorder, Paraphilic Coercive Disorder, Hypersexuality Disorder, Behavioral Addiction Conditions, Addiction Disorder, Autism Spectrum Disorder, Pedohebephilia and medicalising normal grief. (see Opening Pandora?s Box: The 19 Worst Suggestions For DSM5 - Psychiatric Times )

5, Dr Frances has identified that the DSMIV process he lead inadvertently helped ‘trigger three false epidemics. One for Autistic Disorder… another for the childhood diagnosis of Bi-Polar Disorder and the third for the wild over-diagnosis of Attention Deficit Disorder.’1

‘The putative diagnoses presented in DSM-V are clearly based largely on social norms, with ‘symptoms’ that all rely on subjective judgements, with little confirmatory physical ‘signs’ or evidence of biological causation. The criteria are not value-free, but rather reflect current normative social expectations. Many researchers have pointed out that psychiatric diagnoses are plagued by problems of reliability, validity, prognostic value, and co-morbidity.’

Dr Allen Frances, the lead author of DSMIV, and the British Psychological Association, lead the chorus of opposition to disease mongering proposals in DSM5 | Speed Up & Sit Still

 

[Samson]

ADHD Is Over-Diagnosed, Experts Say

Mar. 30, 2012 — What experts and the public have already long suspected is now supported by representative data collected by researchers at Ruhr-Universität Bochum (RUB) and University of Basel: ADHD, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, is over-diagnosed. The study showed that child and adolescent psychotherapists and psychiatrists tend to give a diagnosis based on heuristics, unclear rules of thumb, rather than adhering to recognized diagnostic criteria. Boys in particular are substantially more often misdiagnosed compared to girls.

....​

Science Daily

No one ever disputed that it was over diagnosed.

What was in dispute was the moronic position that it simply did not exist.

it does not exists as a medical condition..it is a non-existent brain disorder
and i have not said otherwise..there a personality we describe with words like hyper..of course all kinds of complex personalities exists..but they are not medical conditions

 

[eots]

ADHD Is Over-Diagnosed, Experts Say

Mar. 30, 2012 — What experts and the public have already long suspected is now supported by representative data collected by researchers at Ruhr-Universität Bochum (RUB) and University of Basel: ADHD, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder, is over-diagnosed. The study showed that child and adolescent psychotherapists and psychiatrists tend to give a diagnosis based on heuristics, unclear rules of thumb, rather than adhering to recognized diagnostic criteria. Boys in particular are substantially more often misdiagnosed compared to girls.

....​

Science Daily

No one ever disputed that it was over diagnosed.

What was in dispute was the moronic position that it simply did not exist.

it does not exists as a medical condition..it is a non-existent brain disorder
and i have not said otherwise..there a personality we describe with words like hyper..of course all kinds of complex personalities exists..but they are not medical conditions

That is absolutely correct there is no evidence that ADHD exists as a brain disorder..

‘The putative diagnoses presented in DSM-V are clearly based n social norms, with ‘symptoms’ that all rely on subjective judgements, with little confirmatory physical ‘signs’ or evidence of biological causation. The criteria are not value-free, but rather reflect current normative social expectations. Many researchers have pointed out that psychiatric diagnoses are plagued by problems of reliability, validity, prognostic value, and co-morbidity.’

Dr Alan Francis chairman dsm 4

 

[Samson]

I had a meeting with my son's teacher's and school psychologist, and they recommended I take him to a pediatrician that specializes in ADHD etc to be tested for ADHD. Many of you have might already know I have had my son in special programs since before he was two, and that they had diagnosed him with a sensory perception disorder when all this first started.

II have read some on it, but not a lot. The whole thing is scary at this point, for one I have no clue how I feel about medication, how to treat it, and even the diagnoses of ADHD. Feedback, recommendations, stories would be great. Thanks.

Be very careful.....there is a reason mostly boys are on these drugs. It should be called chemical babysitter cause what it does is make you feel slow and zombie like....How do I know this? Cause some 30 years ago I had to take these drugs cause the teachers couldnt handle boys. Attention deficit disorder just mean the teacher doesn't have the attention to to give the student and the deficit causes her class to be in disorder.....

Self control. This is something the boy needs to learn. Most definitely before you put him on amphetamines that are damn dangerous to his heart. These drugs are not aspirin even if the teachers use them as such. They are controlled substances....They are illegal to posses without a prescription and now ask yourself do you really want your son to take that twice a day every day?

Very well stated;

While the ends (self control) might not justify the means (perscriptions), what other means are available?

Teachers are dealing with larger class sizes, and a wide variety of social issues (ESL, Special Education, etc.) than they had 30 years ago.

Single parent homes are more common than 30 years ago.

Electronic "Social Media" that requires not physical participation, much less exertion, is much more common than 30 years ago.

 

[Againsheila]

I had a meeting with my son's teacher's and school psychologist, and they recommended I take him to a pediatrician that specializes in ADHD etc to be tested for ADHD. Many of you have might already know I have had my son in special programs since before he was two, and that they had diagnosed him with a sensory perception disorder when all this first started.

II have read some on it, but not a lot. The whole thing is scary at this point, for one I have no clue how I feel about medication, how to treat it, and even the diagnoses of ADHD. Feedback, recommendations, stories would be great. Thanks.

Be very careful.....there is a reason mostly boys are on these drugs. It should be called chemical babysitter cause what it does is make you feel slow and zombie like....How do I know this? Cause some 30 years ago I had to take these drugs cause the teachers couldnt handle boys. Attention deficit disorder just mean the teacher doesn't have the attention to to give the student and the deficit causes her class to be in disorder.....

Self control. This is something the boy needs to learn. Most definitely before you put him on amphetamines that are damn dangerous to his heart. These drugs are not aspirin even if the teachers use them as such. They are controlled substances....They are illegal to posses without a prescription and now ask yourself do you really want your son to take that twice a day every day?

Very well stated;

While the ends (self control) might not justify the means (perscriptions), what other means are available?

Teachers are dealing with larger class sizes, and a wide variety of social issues (ESL, Special Education, etc.) than they had 30 years ago.

Single parent homes are more common than 30 years ago.

Electronic "Social Media" that requires not physical participation, much less exertion, is much more common than 30 years ago.

Yeah, right. Where do you live? Around here, when I was in highschool I tutored in a 4th grade class with 36 students. Fourth grade classes around here now don't have more than 28 students. I'll give you the rest, but not the class size.

 

[Samson]

Be very careful.....there is a reason mostly boys are on these drugs. It should be called chemical babysitter cause what it does is make you feel slow and zombie like....How do I know this? Cause some 30 years ago I had to take these drugs cause the teachers couldnt handle boys. Attention deficit disorder just mean the teacher doesn't have the attention to to give the student and the deficit causes her class to be in disorder.....

Self control. This is something the boy needs to learn. Most definitely before you put him on amphetamines that are damn dangerous to his heart. These drugs are not aspirin even if the teachers use them as such. They are controlled substances....They are illegal to posses without a prescription and now ask yourself do you really want your son to take that twice a day every day?

Very well stated;

While the ends (self control) might not justify the means (perscriptions), what other means are available?

Teachers are dealing with larger class sizes, and a wide variety of social issues (ESL, Special Education, etc.) than they had 30 years ago.

Single parent homes are more common than 30 years ago.

Electronic "Social Media" that requires not physical participation, much less exertion, is much more common than 30 years ago.

Yeah, right. Where do you live? Around here, when I was in highschool I tutored in a 4th grade class with 36 students. Fourth grade classes around here now don't have more than 28 students. I'll give you the rest, but not the class size.

You should start a tread in the Education Forum.

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y5OdQGbVNa4]The Effects of Emasculation, Part I - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Caroljo]

My youngest boy was quite hyperactive. He was 6 when we divorced and the ex promptly had him taking Ritalin. I withheld them on my weekend visits. I'd rather have had him bouncing around than staring like a zombie.

Anhow- I'd grind up his Rit and snort it.
Pretty damn good speed.

Well I never tried my sons meds...but i know it's supposed to give you the opposite effects if you don't need them! They would help my younger son concentrate because he needed them, but my oldest son told me he tried the ritalin (knowing it could speed him up!) and he couldn't sleep for 2 days! Lol!

 

[Caroljo]

I had a meeting with my son's teacher's and school psychologist, and they recommended I take him to a pediatrician that specializes in ADHD etc to be tested for ADHD. Many of you have might already know I have had my son in special programs since before he was two, and that they had diagnosed him with a sensory perception disorder when all this first started.

II have read some on it, but not a lot. The whole thing is scary at this point, for one I have no clue how I feel about medication, how to treat it, and even the diagnoses of ADHD. Feedback, recommendations, stories would be great. Thanks.

With your son in special programs since before he was two, .....with a sensory perception disorder I would be surprised you're not already accessing all the appropriate medical and social resources available.

At any rate, it doesn't sound like the run-of-the-mill ADHD. I would contact those associated with the sensory perception disorder diagnosis, and have them refer you to a specialist if necessary. They will be able to pass on the valuable information they have regarding the disorder he already has, and how it (and any meds he may be on already) may be effecting ADHD symptoms.


Now, for the run-of-the-mill cases, I have two comments:

1. ADHD is over-diagnosed by females in an increasingly feminized society: Boys to not act like Girls, and sitting in classes for long periods of time during which they are inactive is often very difficult for boys because they are MALES. Put the kid on a treadmill.

2. Medication administered to children over a period of years must be re-evaluated, particularly as the child enters puberty. ADHD perscriptions that worked perfectly well when the child is 10, might cause some weird shit when they are 13.

I believe that....my son started Ritalin in 2nd grade, and our Dr was very good about watching him closely. My Dr's son had (has) a VERY BAD case of ADHD plus some other disorders, so he stayed up to date on all treatments and was really knowledgible about it. When my son got into 8th grade he started getting into sports, football and wrestling, and he didn't like how the ritalin made him feel and it would slow him down.

 

[Caroljo]

I've read that in some schools, 90% of the boys are on drugs for ADHD. I'll bet that the majority are being treated for behaving like normal active boys...and the mostly female staff call them ADHD so they can drug them into behaving like girls. The parents are then pressured to do something about their boys. Hence the drugs.

Yet another reason to avoid public schools.

My son had ADD, not ADHD (he was not hyperactive). His teachers never had a problem with him disrupting others or acting out....he just couldn't concentrate on things he needed to concentrate on. When i started him on ritalin, like i said in my other post, it was just what he needed! He started learning how to read and could actually do his school work without a problem. It was good for him when he was younger, and he knew when he'd had enough and wanted to do it on his own. He stopped taking it on his own and never once let his grades slip and was always eligible to play in his HS sports. Now he's training in PSY OPS which has been a real trial for him, but he made it and graduates in 2 weeks. I think ritalin helped him to "learn" how to cope with it and luckily he had the determination to not let it slow him down.

 

[Caroljo]

I've always had trouble fitting into the various expectations of others...

I was a spacy kid growing up... parents and school folks kept telling me "we know you can do better"...


here I am now at 60 years old...

been a bumpy road...


last few years, I've had folks tell me they think I may have been "ADD" all along, or "high-functioning autistic"... or sumpin' else along those same lines...

back 50 years ago, if they had a fancy name for the way I was, they'd a' prolly called it sumpin' like "lazy white boy syndrome"...

I think i understand! We're sure my husband has ADD and always has. He always struggled in school, but back then they just figured you weren't too smart! He had a lot of social issues and still today (he's also 60 yrs old) there's times i'd like to sneak him a pill! Lol! He has a very hard time concentrating and always has, I have to do most everything when it comes to paying bills, etc because he just can't do it. This is also why i believe ADD is heriditary since my son also has it, and i believe my father in law did too.