Would You Vote for a Mormon?

[Disir]

We can name call right out here in the open too. Can't refer to relatives though. I guess my cat is safe for the moment. lol

I gathered from your prior post you considered Mormonism a cult. I would agree.

Kitties have to be kept from all of that. I wholly support that.

I do consider it a cult, but I have to acknowledge that it is recognized as a religion.

 

[earlycuyler]

Any group can be defined as a cult. The republican and democratic party's can be considered cults. And the way political partisans act since 2000 can be considered proof. In the end it does not matter if they worship gravity, or the gum on the bottom of there shoe, as long as there religion does not become policy then all is well. As for the "insider/outsider" thing, post up the examples of it, who did it and where it happened.

 

[Disir]

This is from 1970:
Religion: Mormons and the Mark of Cain - TIME

Mormon Exclusion | Utah Non-Mormons Stung by Exclusion - Los Angeles Times

EdCC instructor, Mormon faces exclusion over articles

Other important stuff that shows the direction:
The Spirit of America | The Moral Liberal

But, if you really want to read up on it, then you will find the ex-mormon forums particularly helpful.

 

[earlycuyler]

This is from 1970:
Religion: Mormons and the Mark of Cain - TIME

Mormon Exclusion | Utah Non-Mormons Stung by Exclusion - Los Angeles Times

EdCC instructor, Mormon faces exclusion over articles

Other important stuff that shows the direction:
The Spirit of America | The Moral Liberal

But, if you really want to read up on it, then you will find the ex-mormon forums particularly helpful.

I will check It out. Ex-anything forums I try to stay away from. They tend to be understandably biased.

 

[JoeB131]

Christianity is a cult.

Doesn't mean it's not a religion.

And doesn't mean it's not true.

My opinion is that the distinction between a cult and a religion is the amount of control they exert on the members lives. Cults want to control every aspect of their members lives because they don't want contrary opinions.

Looking at Mormonism, you have requirements to wear spiritual undergarments (which I laughingly deride as "Magic Underpants"), tithing, requirements to go on missionary work, (parents frequently bankrupt themselves paying for this), requirement to blurt out your testimony at any time, secret temple oaths. When people leave the church, their relatives are instructed to shun them.

In short- Cult.

I don't think religions are true. Any of them. But most of them have the good sense to stay out of politics and not try to run every aspect of their members lives.

 

[Amelia]

Christianity is a cult.

Doesn't mean it's not a religion.

And doesn't mean it's not true.

My opinion is that the distinction between a cult and a religion is the amount of control they exert on the members lives. Cults want to control every aspect of their members lives because they don't want contrary opinions.

Looking at Mormonism, you have requirements to wear spiritual undergarments (which I laughingly deride as "Magic Underpants"), tithing, requirements to go on missionary work, (parents frequently bankrupt themselves paying for this), requirement to blurt out your testimony at any time, secret temple oaths. When people leave the church, their relatives are instructed to shun them.

In short- Cult.

I don't think religions are true. Any of them. But most of them have the good sense to stay out of politics and not try to run every aspect of their members lives.

Too many things wrong with your claims to respond.

It's been fun trying to yank your ignorant chain, but I realize that's the reason you're doing it - you like the attention you get for being such a hatemonger - so I'm moving on.

Have a lovely day.

 

[JoeB131]

Hey, Amelia, I take your claims of bigot about as seriously as I take claims of racism from liberals when Obama is criticized.

Usually when someone screams something like that, they are pretty much admitting they don't really have a counter argument.

 

[earlycuyler]

So watch out, or it will come for you too.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The only fraud is that of atheists who insist that religious belief is fraudulent when they cannot even mount a good philosophical rejection for deity much less a scientific explanation for there not being a god.

JoeB is the classic example that it takes more faith to be an atheists than a believer in deity.

If atheism is a religion, then not collecting stamps is a hobby. I don't think most religions are frauds. Just Mormonism. And Scientology. And a few others. Most are just ignorance and superstition, which is not quite as bad.

JoeB, you are in denial, as almost all atheists. Romney, apparently now that Perry is imploding, is moving forward in the polls. He will do well in NH, not so well in IA and SC, and should easily win FL because of the senior citizen vote. He will be in position to sweep aside the poor representation of the Tea Party. Romney's biggest strength is that folks know him while they are getting to, disgustedly, getting to know the far right candidates.

 

[JoeB131]

JoeB, you are in denial, as almost all atheists. Romney, apparently now that Perry is imploding, is moving forward in the polls. He will do well in NH, not so well in IA and SC, and should easily win FL because of the senior citizen vote. He will be in position to sweep aside the poor representation of the Tea Party. Romney's biggest strength is that folks know him while they are getting to, disgustedly, getting to know the far right candidates.

Guy, your whole argument for Romney is that the others are too right wing for you, which just indicates you are probably in the wrong party.

You have yet to give me a good reason WHY I'd want to vote for Romney, other than he's the most "electable".

Romney's been running for five years, and he's only got the support of about 25% of republicans. The fact that they are trying to recruit Chris Christie as the latest "not Romney" should indicate.

Republicans don't really want Romney.

 

[Toro]

The problem with Romney is that he can't crack the 20%-25% level. The Republican base keeps looking for someone else. That's why you see Trump then Bachmann then Perry then Cain shoot up. They may eventually pick Romney, but its pretty clear the party isn't particularly enamored with him.

 

[JakeStarkey]

JoeB, you are in denial, as almost all atheists. Romney, apparently now that Perry is imploding, is moving forward in the polls. He will do well in NH, not so well in IA and SC, and should easily win FL because of the senior citizen vote. He will be in position to sweep aside the poor representation of the Tea Party. Romney's biggest strength is that folks know him while they are getting to, disgustedly, getting to know the far right candidates.

Guy, your whole argument for Romney is that the others are too right wing for you, which just indicates you are probably in the wrong party.

You have yet to give me a good reason WHY I'd want to vote for Romney, other than he's the most "electable".

Romney's been running for five years, and he's only got the support of about 25% of republicans. The fact that they are trying to recruit Chris Christie as the latest "not Romney" should indicate.

Republicans don't really want Romney.

Republicans do want Romney more than the others, and since each of the others have less support than Romney than maybe you and the others in the wrong party. Form one to the far right please, and move on.

You won't get ours.

 

[JoeB131]

The problem with Romney is that he can't crack the 20%-25% level. The Republican base keeps looking for someone else. That's why you see Trump then Bachmann then Perry then Cain shoot up. They may eventually pick Romney, but its pretty clear the party isn't particularly enamored with him.

And that's the problem.

Elections are ultimately about enthusiasm. Whatever else is going to happen, large parts of the Democratic coalition are going to be ready to drink the koolaid for Obama. They will get out, they'll vote for him, they'll knock on doors for him, they'll get out the vote.

If Romney gets the nomination, and he might if the Establishment and Beltway types impose him on us, there's going to be no enthusiasm for him at all.

We might be able to work up enthusiasm for Christie or maybe Perry.

Romney.... meh. As Mike Huckabee said, "He looks like the guy who laid you off."

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sour grapes, JoeB. Get ready to work for Mitt. But, yes, he will lay you off after the campaign.

 

[JoeB131]

Sour grapes, JoeB. Get ready to work for Mitt. But, yes, he will lay you off after the campaign.

If Romney's the nominee, I'm voting for Obama.

We don't need two socialist parties in this country, and it'll be more honest to vote for the consistent socialists.

 

[JakeStarkey]

You really can't define socialism, can you, JoeB. By your definition, those who support the FDA or the Meat Inspection Act or the FFA are socialists. Do you know the difference between socialism and social progressivism? They are not the same thing, any more than right-wing progressivism is automatically fascisim or totalitarianism.

 

[JoeB131]

You really can't define socialism, can you, JoeB. By your definition, those who support the FDA or the Meat Inspection Act or the FFA are socialists. Do you know the difference between socialism and social progressivism? They are not the same thing, any more than right-wing progressivism is automatically fascisim or totalitarianism.

Blah, blah, blah.... Guy you are defending socialism as a concept and still claiming to be a Republican?

Okay, Here's how I'll make my choice in a Romney v. Obama Race..

"Which one of you socialists doesn't belong to a whackadoo cult started by a con man who wanted to have sex with teenagers?"

Problem solved.

 

[earlycuyler]

The problem with Romney is that he can't crack the 20%-25% level. The Republican base keeps looking for someone else. That's why you see Trump then Bachmann then Perry then Cain shoot up. They may eventually pick Romney, but its pretty clear the party isn't particularly enamored with him.

Is the electorate really excited about any of them ? Sure for a little while, but it go's away and then the new republican messiah comes along. Its still pretty early in the game to say who is or is not going to get there let alone win. I think drawing attention to a candidates religion will be considered bad form and wont really matter. Obama got a pass for worshiping at the alter of a man who would have every white persons neck under his boot heel. And Al Sharpton got his fat jowls shaken for his comments on Romney.
I think that this election is any of the candidates to lose at this time.

 

[JoeB131]

The problem with Romney is that he can't crack the 20%-25% level. The Republican base keeps looking for someone else. That's why you see Trump then Bachmann then Perry then Cain shoot up. They may eventually pick Romney, but its pretty clear the party isn't particularly enamored with him.

Is the electorate really excited about any of them ? Sure for a little while, but it go's away and then the new republican messiah comes along. Its still pretty early in the game to say who is or is not going to get there let alone win. .

But that's not really the case.

Last time, really far right, Toon Hall Conservatives HATED McCain with a passion, even though there wasn't a clear "conservative" alternative. Guiliani was too liberal, Romney wasn't trusted because of the Mormonism and the previous liberal record, Huckabee was too liberal on immigration and spending issues for some tastes. They had hopes for Fred Thompson, but he turned out to be a dud.

McCain had to pick Palin as a sop to the Right, and it backfired when she was found to be unprepared for the big leagues.

I think drawing attention to a candidates religion will be considered bad form and wont really matter. Obama got a pass for worshiping at the alter of a man who would have every white persons neck under his boot heel. And Al Sharpton got his fat jowls shaken for his comments on Romney.
I think that this election is any of the candidates to lose at this time

Obama got a pass because the Media wasn't willing to talk about the story that much. Hillary wasn't about to exploit it because she didn't want to antagonize blacks by attacking someone who had some reverence in that community. And McCain made the tactical judgment to not talk about the issue, and after the 2008 collapse, no one would have paid attention if he had.

Not familar with what Sharpton might have said about Romney.

Obama doesn't have to say anything about Romney's religion. The MSM will do that for him, AFTER Romney secures the nomination. Then we are going to get stories about MOrmonism so negative you'd think I was writing them.

 

[earlycuyler]

The problem with Romney is that he can't crack the 20%-25% level. The Republican base keeps looking for someone else. That's why you see Trump then Bachmann then Perry then Cain shoot up. They may eventually pick Romney, but its pretty clear the party isn't particularly enamored with him.

Is the electorate really excited about any of them ? Sure for a little while, but it go's away and then the new republican messiah comes along. Its still pretty early in the game to say who is or is not going to get there let alone win. .

But that's not really the case.

Last time, really far right, Toon Hall Conservatives HATED McCain with a passion, even though there wasn't a clear "conservative" alternative. Guiliani was too liberal, Romney wasn't trusted because of the Mormonism and the previous liberal record, Huckabee was too liberal on immigration and spending issues for some tastes. They had hopes for Fred Thompson, but he turned out to be a dud.

McCain had to pick Palin as a sop to the Right, and it backfired when she was found to be unprepared for the big leagues.

I think drawing attention to a candidates religion will be considered bad form and wont really matter. Obama got a pass for worshiping at the alter of a man who would have every white persons neck under his boot heel. And Al Sharpton got his fat jowls shaken for his comments on Romney.
I think that this election is any of the candidates to lose at this time

Obama got a pass because the Media wasn't willing to talk about the story that much. Hillary wasn't about to exploit it because she didn't want to antagonize blacks by attacking someone who had some reverence in that community. And McCain made the tactical judgment to not talk about the issue, and after the 2008 collapse, no one would have paid attention if he had.

Not familar with what Sharpton might have said about Romney.

Obama doesn't have to say anything about Romney's religion. The MSM will do that for him, AFTER Romney secures the nomination. Then we are going to get stories about MOrmonism so negative you'd think I was writing them.

The media could ignore it then, but they cant ignore his piss poor performance now. Any other candidate would have to be a real numb nuts to not beat him. It will take more then religion, it will take an epic screw up. As for Sharptons comments here they are.

Al Sharpton:
“As for the one Mormon running for office, those who really believe in God will defeat him anyways, so don’t worry about that; that’s a temporary situation,” Sharpton said during a debate with Hitchens at the New York Public Library.”

After that there was no more comments on his (Romneys) religion.