Zone1 What are Your Deepest Confusions About God?

Well, your argument was that he tweaks things. Now it's just that he gets angry about things. But didn't get angry about Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot or any of the other nasty dictators in the 20th century, not Putin, Assad or the current crop.
Why not?
Surely an entity that is smart enough to create a universe could be smart enough to be consistent.
I never said he gets angry about things. From his perspective he is occasionally tweaking and he is consistent.
As I said before he generally lets things play out without intervention.
Would he save Earth from a climate disaster or WW3? Stay tuned.
 
I'm sure it doesn't. I'm sure you get whatever you want out of it. When you see "stone adulterers to death", I'm sure you see "vote adulterers to be President".
What I want from the Bible is to understand the lesson the original author was presenting to his original audience. What say you: Do you believe the author was advocating for his audience to take on your opinion of God?

When I see the punishment assigned to adulterers, I also recall the Jewish position that if their court punished a second person by death within a seventy year period, it was known as a bloody court.

No, because of the New Testament, I do not see, "Vote adulterers to be President." I see, "Let those without sin cast the first vote against that candidate."
 
I never said he gets angry about things. From his perspective he is occasionally tweaking and he is consistent.
As I said before he generally lets things play out without intervention.
Would he save Earth from a climate disaster or WW3? Stay tuned.

How is he consistent?

Back thousands of years ago when the human population wasn't large, people killed. They killed because... we're omnivores, we kill animals and eat them?

God created lions, tigers and all manner of CARNIVORES, and suddenly he's angry at killing.

And to show how much he hate KILLING, he.... KILLS PEOPLE and all manner of "innocent" creatures.

That's not consistency. That's the exact opposite.

Why would he save the world from WW3 when he supposedly didn't do it for WW1 or WW2? Why would he stop humans killing when he likes to kill himself?
 
What I want from the Bible is to understand the lesson the original author was presenting to his original audience. What say you: Do you believe the author was advocating for his audience to take on your opinion of God?

When I see the punishment assigned to adulterers, I also recall the Jewish position that if their court punished a second person by death within a seventy year period, it was known as a bloody court.

No, because of the New Testament, I do not see, "Vote adulterers to be President." I see, "Let those without sin cast the first vote against that candidate."

So, you're willing to ignore whole swathes of the Bible in order to get a lesson from it that is totally convenient for what you want? Seems like it.

You see what you want to see, and ignore everything else. It's how Trump is going to be President again.
 
So, you're willing to ignore whole swathes of the Bible in order to get a lesson from it that is totally convenient for what you want? Seems like it.

You see what you want to see, and ignore everything else. It's how Trump is going to be President again.
Grin. No. In your post I saw an example of proof-texting one point while ignoring a later point. It wasn't a matter of "seeing what I want to see", it was, I can tease a little here and perhaps lighten the exchange. ;)

Seriously, I take the Bible in its totality, which is why I rejected discussing your position that God's intention was to kill all the animals.

I do not understand the hatred and vitriol towards President Trump by some. My mother died of Alzheimer's...dementia. For me, these signs of dementia were readily apparent in President Biden when he was running in 2020. I was immediately angry at Jill Biden for not taking care of her husband, and letting the Democrat Machine know (if they didn't already) that President Biden's mental abilities were in decline due to his age. When she didn't, I expected President Obama to put a halt to it...he resisted recommending President Biden for awhile, but then succumbed to the Powers that Be behind the Democratic machine.

The nation elected President Biden. Could they not see his condition of dementia? Or did it not matter to them? I don't know. What I do know, I was sick at heart from day one at the Democrats and much of the news media covering up. But what really hurt was when the rest of the news media poked fun at the President for his lapses. It was like they were poking fun at my mother who had been in a similar position--and neither my mom nor the President nor anyone deserves that.

During the past four years, I could not get Sirach out of my mind:

Sirach 3:10: "My son, take care of your father when he is old; grieve him not as long as he lives. Even if his mind fail, be considerate with him; revile him not in the fullness of your strength".

No matter that running Joe Biden for President and electing him never should have happened, it did. And since it did, we, as citizens, should have taken close note of what Sirach had said.

I understand you are mad at President Trump because he committed adultery. Let's move on and give him a chance for a better legacy than "adulterer". I think the country itself may benefit from his leadership.
 
Grin. No. In your post I saw an example of proof-texting one point while ignoring a later point. It wasn't a matter of "seeing what I want to see", it was, I can tease a little here and perhaps lighten the exchange. ;)

Seriously, I take the Bible in its totality, which is why I rejected discussing your position that God's intention was to kill all the animals.

I do not understand the hatred and vitriol towards President Trump by some. My mother died of Alzheimer's...dementia. For me, these signs of dementia were readily apparent in President Biden when he was running in 2020. I was immediately angry at Jill Biden for not taking care of her husband, and letting the Democrat Machine know (if they didn't already) that President Biden's mental abilities were in decline due to his age. When she didn't, I expected President Obama to put a halt to it...he resisted recommending President Biden for awhile, but then succumbed to the Powers that Be behind the Democratic machine.

The nation elected President Biden. Could they not see his condition of dementia? Or did it not matter to them? I don't know. What I do know, I was sick at heart from day one at the Democrats and much of the news media covering up. But what really hurt was when the rest of the news media poked fun at the President for his lapses. It was like they were poking fun at my mother who had been in a similar position--and neither my mom nor the President nor anyone deserves that.

During the past four years, I could not get Sirach out of my mind:

Sirach 3:10: "My son, take care of your father when he is old; grieve him not as long as he lives. Even if his mind fail, be considerate with him; revile him not in the fullness of your strength".

No matter that running Joe Biden for President and electing him never should have happened, it did. And since it did, we, as citizens, should have taken close note of what Sirach had said.

I understand you are mad at President Trump because he committed adultery. Let's move on and give him a chance for a better legacy than "adulterer". I think the country itself may benefit from his leadership.

Well, you do what you want, but it's impossible to talk to you about it, because it makes no sense
 
Clearly, the ability to create any stance via biblical reference is a religmo manifestation engineered for control here

~S~
 
Well, you do what you want, but it's impossible to talk to you about it, because it makes no sense
We definitely have two very different perspectives about the flood. The author tells us that mankind was not living up to expectations, that they were falling short of what they could be, what they were meant to be. The guiding question: What were they doing wrong?

Noah was considered righteous. What was Noah doing right?

God gave Noah instructions to build an ark. Noah asked not questions, told no one what was about to happen, loaded his family into the ark...all without saying a word.

Why did the author present Noah as a silent man, who never even spoke?

The story goes on, the flood ends, the waters recede, and Noah and his family leave the ark. Noah still hasn't spoken.

But then...Noah gets drunk, gets naked, and one of the boys in the family runs off and tattles. Finally Noah speaks...he curses a member of his family. And so the story of mankind begins again, with drunkenness, nakedness, and cursing. In those days, words were thought to be powerful--and actually words do have power.

The lesson in the story has nothing to do with animals, and God Himself plays only a small part. The author brings to the audience's attention that the goodness of mankind falls short of the goodness of God. What was bringing this about? That's revealed by the end of the story: Drunkenness, nakedness, and unkind, even nasty words/speech. It can be summed up with, Watch what goes into your mouth and watch what comes out of your mouth.

There are other insights in the story as well. It seems the dimensions of the ark match, in some way, the dimensions of the Temple.

And this is why you and I have a hard time discussing Noah's Ark. One of us is discussing how God kills animals, while the other is discussing human behavior.
 
Clearly, the ability to create any stance via biblical reference is a religmo manifestation engineered for control here
Nothing to do with control...it has to do with sharing unique perspectives. I have no fear that frigidweirdo is trying to control me, and I have not even the littlest thought--or desire--of controlling frigidweirdo. That's hilarious just imagining it, because it would be downright impossible!
 
.it has to do with sharing unique perspectives
Like insisting on death in one passage , then forbidding it in another Meri?

What Jesus said about hypocrites?


[27] Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. [28] Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.


~S~
 
We definitely have two very different perspectives about the flood. The author tells us that mankind was not living up to expectations, that they were falling short of what they could be, what they were meant to be. The guiding question: What were they doing wrong?

Noah was considered righteous. What was Noah doing right?

God gave Noah instructions to build an ark. Noah asked not questions, told no one what was about to happen, loaded his family into the ark...all without saying a word.

Why did the author present Noah as a silent man, who never even spoke?

The story goes on, the flood ends, the waters recede, and Noah and his family leave the ark. Noah still hasn't spoken.

But then...Noah gets drunk, gets naked, and one of the boys in the family runs off and tattles. Finally Noah speaks...he curses a member of his family. And so the story of mankind begins again, with drunkenness, nakedness, and cursing. In those days, words were thought to be powerful--and actually words do have power.

The lesson in the story has nothing to do with animals, and God Himself plays only a small part. The author brings to the audience's attention that the goodness of mankind falls short of the goodness of God. What was bringing this about? That's revealed by the end of the story: Drunkenness, nakedness, and unkind, even nasty words/speech. It can be summed up with, Watch what goes into your mouth and watch what comes out of your mouth.

There are other insights in the story as well. It seems the dimensions of the ark match, in some way, the dimensions of the Temple.

And this is why you and I have a hard time discussing Noah's Ark. One of us is discussing how God kills animals, while the other is discussing human behavior.

Yes. My perspective which is "this is what the Bible says, therefore this is logic" and you which is "I want to read this from this passage"

I asked if it were fiction. You said no, but act like it is.
 
Nothing to do with control...it has to do with sharing unique perspectives. I have no fear that frigidweirdo is trying to control me, and I have not even the littlest thought--or desire--of controlling frigidweirdo. That's hilarious just imagining it, because it would be downright impossible!

Sure, I'm interested in talking about these things. If people want to believe whatever, they can, I'm not going to stop them believing that.
 
Yes. My perspective which is "this is what the Bible says, therefore this is logic" and you which is "I want to read this from this passage"

I asked if it were fiction. You said no, but act like it is.
The lesson presented is not fiction. The characters are not fiction. I ask why...while you jump to a conclusion.
 
Sure, I'm interested in talking about these things. If people want to believe whatever, they can, I'm not going to stop them believing that.
One other thing to keep in mind: The perspectives I present are never my own, original perspective, but come from years of studying what other rabbis, priests, and scholars say. I present what I have learned from those who have more expertise in the Bible than I ever will. Some of these studies focus on the perspective of the water, which saved Noah and his family--a precursor of Baptism. Some of them are focused on understanding the original Hebrew. Others follow what is known about early cultures, early geology and geography.

Tell me, have you researched and studied Noah's Ark, or did you simply read it and decide, "It's about God killing all the animals." Another poster decided, "It's about God killing all the babies--all the innocent babies."
 
If one believes in the <Christian> God, then one believes in the devil as well

If one believes in revelations (Catholicism's stick, if you will) one believe St Michael will seek incarnation

Assuming this is so , and wanting to assume power and influence over humanity , just where would you exist to do so Ding?

View attachment 1056561
View attachment 1056562
View attachment 1056563

View attachment 1056564

~S~
First of all, it's Revelation not revelations. Secondly, I don't know if I believe in a devil like you believe in a devil but if I did I would have to say you are doing his bidding. Thirdly, Revelation is about the fall of Rome, so no, I don't have to believe that St. Michael will seek incarnation. Fourthly, it's shtick, not stick.

So your assumption that I fit into the devil's plan isn't a good one. A better way of looking at it, is that we all have free will. We can choose to good or not do good. We are free to make any choice we want but we are not free from experiencing the consequences of our choices. As such we are all being pruned. We are all interconnected to some degree or another and there is a natural compensation effect that leads to good naturally and logically coming from bad. In that regard everything we do works in God's plan and the beauty and elegance of God's plan is that it naturally and logically unfolds all on its own without violating free will. You see, Sparky, it's not virtuous if we are made to be virtuous. We have to choose virtue of own accord. God doesn't want us to love him because of what he can do for us. God wants us to love him for who God is.
 
How is he consistent? Back thousands of years ago when the human population wasn't large, people killed. They killed because... we're omnivores, we kill animals and eat them?
God created lions, tigers and all manner of CARNIVORES, and suddenly he's angry at killing.
And to show how much he hate KILLING, he.... KILLS PEOPLE and all manner of "innocent" creatures.
That's not consistency. That's the exact opposite.
Why would he save the world from WW3 when he supposedly didn't do it for WW1 or WW2? Why would he stop humans killing when he likes to kill himself?
1. People have free will to do what they want.
2. I already said God doesn't get angry, he watches.
3. Things happen, like the flood, or World Wars, he doesn't cause them he sees them.
4. WW3 could end all life on earth, the other world wars were limited. Then again, read #1.
5. You haven't proven he likes to kill (read #1 again), without him we wouldn't even be here.

Not sure what point you're trying to make? That there is no God?
If you want physical proof I can give you a test of sorts.
Buy a good "Ghost Box or Spirit Box" and see what you discover.
 
Clearly, the ability to create any stance via biblical reference is a religmo manifestation engineered for control here

~S~
More conspiracy theories, Sparky? And are you using religmo as a derogatory term?

But to your point about religion controlling behaviors, religion teaches civility. Religion teaches how to live. Religion teaches how not to live. All of which are voluntary. It's effectively an honor system. If you want to see what control looks like, I suggest you take a look at how government uses laws to teach civility and how to live and how not to live. Because their system is decidedly NOT voluntary or an honor system. When you break their laws, men with guns come to take you away. That's what control looks like.

And while we are on the subject of control, aren't you trying to control me by trying to convince me to abandon my faith. So not only are your accusations vague, unsupported and incorrect, you are also a hypocrite.
 
Wer euch hört, der hört mich. Und wer euch ablehnt, der lehnt mich ab. Aber wer mich ablehnt, der lehnt damit Gott selbst ab...
Jesus
Whoever hears you hears me. And whoever rejects you rejects me. But whoever rejects me rejects God himself...

Ever tried to think about sentences like this which are written in the authentic source "bible", which is not a god on its own but only a holy book? God did not end with the bible! God is now here directly in front of your eyes - but you do not see him, you do not feel him, you ignore him, isn't it? That's why you need to live and to love.
The question at hand is whether God our Eternal Heavenly Father is the same being as our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. The sentence written above does not suggest that they are both the same being. If both the Father and Son are omniscient and able to perceive all and are one in all that they do then they would be in agreement on everything and would teach the same beliefs and teachings. So whoever hears the Father would actually hear what the Son would say to them. And if whoever rejects what the Father would teach would also reject what the Son would teach. So if anyone were to reject the Son, they would also reject God the Father. No necessity of being the same being but only being one in thought, belief and teaching. The oneness of God is a oneness not of being the same being but of principle and of unity of what is good and right and sharing in the attributes of omnipotence, omniscience, and omnibenevolence. According to John 17:20-23 it is the will of God that those who believe in him will at some point come to reach this perfection which is the same oneness that God the Father and Jesus share among themselves. It's not that we become the same being but that we become unified in goodness, knowledge, love, etc.
 
Back
Top Bottom