We Need Socialism.

[initforme]

We do not need socialism. What we need are for wages of average working americans to rise across the board. Thats what is needed.

 

[Ringo]

“Capitalism is not held together by capitalists, but by idiots who dream of becoming capitalists.” (с)

 

[Leo123]

socialism is supposed to have the workers owning the workplace, collectively. If you dont have that, then its not socialism. When workers own the workplace, it makes labor unions redundant and obsolete.

Nazis pretended to be socialist in the 1920's in order to gain popularity, but after they gained power in the 1930's they threw out the strassers and put the socialists in concentration camps. The german economy during the nazis was certainly capitalist.

If workers own the workplace, decisions must be made with a vote. There would be no executives or owners. So, where does the money come from to start and fund a business? Also, if workers are all equal, what is the incentive to be the best?

 

[dblack]

What is the bug up your ass about having a social safety net.

I like the idea of a social safety net. I just don't think it should be run by government.

 

[Highlight]

My bugs are largely Consequences and Self-Reliance, two things I was taught were main characteristics of a proper individual. I don’t worry about the billionaires… I worry about ME. The amount of my tax money going places it shouldn’t. The services and products paid for by MY taxes for people unworthy of the assistance.

I’ve never seen a bum employ anyone. But I see folks in government aid with 72” TVs, iPhones, new cars, etc… Things my family couldn’t afford growing up even with a proper nuclear family (single income, stay at home mother).

Before you ask… I’m just as against corporate welfare, foreign aid, FRMA, etc…

Oh gee, aren't you all fucking "superior" and stuff. Blow it out your ass. You leech off the poor just as much as the wealthy do. Or maybe you do it through the wealthy who themselves leech off the poor. Which makes you guilty of the same thing. You wouldn't be able to exist without the poor. So now that I know where you are coming from, do me the favor of not replying to me again.

 

[Highlight]

“Capitalism is not held together by capitalists, but by idiots who dream of becoming capitalists.” (с)

Nice quote. But those who dream of becoming capitalists are capitalists. Also, feel free to use the truthful memes I have in post #85 anywhere you wish.

 

[Highlight]

I like the idea of a social safety net. I just don't think it should be run by government.

Nothing, not a god damned thing, should be run by private companies. For those in government, they are held accountable by voters. But for those in the private sector, they basically aren't accountable to anything. Have you never seen the documentary "The Corporation?" Corporations often break the law. And if they're caught, they have little to fear. That's why they keep doing it. Because even if they are caught, it's still more profitable for them to keep trying to break the law.

 

[Oddball]

 

[Highlight]

Hitler didn't turn the German economy into the greatest in the world. The German economy was a shambles; he propped it up by confiscation of wealth and deficit spending. He was rapidly running out of hard cash and had to turn conquistador to prop up the economy. Germany fought WWII by confiscating the wealth of the nations it conquered.

You are totally clueless. Please try to refrain from speaking to me.

 

[Anathema]

Oh gee, aren't you all fucking "superior" and stuff. Blow it out your ass. You leech off the poor just as much as the wealthy do. Or maybe you do it through the wealthy who themselves leech off the poor. Which makes you guilty of the same thing. You wouldn't be able to exist without the poor. So now that I know where you are coming from, do me the favor of not replying to me again.

No. Not superior. I just accept my place in the food chain. I understand that the poor don’t hand out jobs or benefits. They take. Those of us in the middle get taken from by both ends. If we’re smart we get something back from the elites.

Sorry but I don’t do requests.

 

[Highlight]

We do not need socialism. What we need are for wages of average working americans to rise across the board. Thats what is needed.

It's nice to find an intelligent person around here. At one time, a person here in the U.S. could work a job, have a house, a car, and pay to put their children through college. You know, the middle class lifestyle. From the last I heard, to do that in California, you would need to make around $50.00 dollars an hour. But few make that kind of money. Though at one time, Bill Gates was estimated to have made around $353,750. per hour. Also, as I said before, the bottom 50% in this country have around 4 trillion in wealth. While the top 50% have around 156 trillion in wealth. Therein lies the problem. How about, for instance, if the bottom 50% had around 40 trillion in wealth. Leaving the top 50% to "scrape by" on just 116 trillion in wealth.

 

[Highlight]

No. Not superior. I just accept my place in the food chain. I understand that the poor don’t hand out jobs or benefits. They take. Those of us in the middle get taken from by both ends. If we’re smart we get something back from the elites.

Sorry but I don’t do requests.

Read my reply to initforme in post #91. As to you not doing requests, I bet you did a hell of a lot of them to get to the financial status you are in. (As well as some ass kissing) So honor my request.

 

[dblack]

Nothing, not a god damned thing, should be run by private companies.

Well, when you put it that way. No.

 

[Anathema]

Read my reply to initforme in post #91. As to you not doing requests, I bet you did a hell of a lot of them to get to the financial status you are in. (As well as some ass kissing) So honor my request.

I graduated from college in 1995 with an Associates of Science degree in Computer Aided Design and Drafting (CADD) and $3000 in debt which I had paid off by the end of 1997. Not because I got some great job, but because I lived at home with my parents and put every penny I made into paying off my bills AND the $300 a month rent I paid my parents.

My current financial status is pretty much: FUCKED. Why? Because my wife and I are supporting ourselves and five members of her family on my income alone.

 

[AZrailwhale]

My, you are an imbecile, aren't you. Socialism isn't as reliant on money as a capitalist country is. Now, let's take it to the extreme. Ants, bees and termites have had societies of a sort for hundreds of millions of years. How can you think that we couldn't do better than a bunch of bugs when it comes to forming a stable socialist society. You also suggest that there is something you don't know. Here is something that maybe you don't know.

View attachment 1121835

Ants, bees and termites are bred for their roles in their society. Are you willing to be the sewer cleaner, with your children and grandchildren to be sewer cleaners after you? How about being satisfied to be bred for lack of intelligence so you make a more docile low-level worker?

 

[AZrailwhale]

You are totally clueless. Please try to refrain from speaking to me.

Stick it up where the sun never shines and rotate on it. You are the clueless one, you sound like a Poli Science professor

 

[dudmuck]

If workers own the workplace, decisions must be made with a vote. There would be no executives or owners. So, where does the money come from to start and fund a business? Also, if workers are all equal, what is the incentive to be the best?

As an example, in Spain, Caja Laboral funded a worker cooperative. the company has nearly $25 billion in assets.

 

[HikerGuy83]

Not communism, but socialism. There is a difference. For instance, Hitler and the National Socialists were against the communists. (And for VERY good reasons) Under Hitler and the National Socialists, the German economy went from ruined to the greatest economy in the world! Also, the only to defeat the Chinese communists is with a socialist system. But the capitalists cringe at the thought. Why? Because there is no way a for profit company could compete with a government run company. For one reason, profit would be taken out of the equation. Also, we could make anything the Chinese make for less than they can. Because our country is rich in natural resources. As long as the government can provide the necessities that are needed to live, such as housing, food and clothing, things can be made for a very cheap price. But here is a cartoon from 1897 that shows the problem when it comes to, for example, housing. (How things haven't changed)

View attachment 1120240

Though he was an asshole, Muammar Gaddafi took a socialist approach when it came to housing. He required by law that every citizen had a place to live. He also made it illegal to own more than one house. Another point is that here in the U.S., the working poor on average spend around 55% of their income on rent. To that add the cost of food, clothing, utilities, insurance, etc., that doesn't leave people with much else. Also each year around 500,000 families go bankrupt due to medical expenses. It's all a pile of shit that only socialism can lift us out of. You should also consider what these two people had to say.

View attachment 1120243

Screw Socialism.

 

[HikerGuy83]

As an example, in Spain, Caja Laboral funded a worker cooperative. the company has nearly $25 billion in assets.

So What.

Soon it will be less.

 

[Leo123]

As an example, in Spain, Caja Laboral funded a worker cooperative. the company has nearly $25 billion in assets.

Caja Laboral was established as part of the Mondragon Corporation located in the Basque Country (Spain). The Corporation has a banking network with 370 branches and over 1800 'employees.' These people are called 'partners-owners.' As far as I can see, from reading about this cooperative, they are like a corporation with a President and the workers own a piece of the revenue.