Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

GreatestIam

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
 

Vastator

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
He was an important character in the story either way. He even gets two separate death accounts in the gospels. He got to die twice for Jesus... Lol!
 

Likkmee

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Regardless of Judas choice,Yeshua had the final call. He could have shut the whole thing down, come off the cross(stick) and there would have been no way for anyone to escape."no man is worthy, not one". Yeshua paid the fine. He,for some reason,liked humanity enough to die for us.
I look at it in redneck terminology.
" Dad, these sunzabitches are all screwed up,but I like'm; despite all their faults, and want to hang with them forever"
 

Aletheia4u

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Genesis 50:20 You intended to harm me, but God intended it for good to accomplish what is now being done, the saving of many lives.

Matthew 1:21 She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins.”
 

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
Judas is only for NWO, presstitutes, politicians & Co a hero, for true Christians he is a traitor
 

ding

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?
Neither. He used what Judas intended as evil for good. Same as he is using you.

600 To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy. When therefore he establishes his eternal plan of "predestination", he includes in it each person's free response to his grace: "In this city, in fact, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place."395 For the sake of accomplishing his plan of salvation, God permitted the acts that flowed from their blindness.396
 
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GreatestIam

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
He was an important character in the story either way. He even gets two separate death accounts in the gospels. He got to die twice for Jesus... Lol!
Indeed.

Judas is the best friend archetype who will do all that a friend bids you do. Jesus chose well.

The scribes, whoever Rome chose, wrote a good yarn.

Thanks for that bit of data.

Regards
DL
 
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GreatestIam

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there would have been no way for anyone to escape.
One escapes an unjust judgement by denouncing Yahweh, as not living by the Jewish law.

That laws says that the sin will not be passed to the next generation. All are responsible for their own sins.

To abdicates ones own responsibility is not living by the Golden Rule.

That's gospel.

Regards
DL
 
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GreatestIam

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
Judas is only for NWO, presstitutes, politicians & Co a hero, for true Christians he is a traitor
To esoteric reading, Judas is what helps the enlightened kill their ego so as to reach no thought.

Jesus was an esoteric character, in this myth, who wanted to test the savior prophesy. All man. Not a god.

More like the Chrestian Jesus the good.

If a traitor, why would the 11 apostles just sit there and watch Judas go do Jesus' bidding?

Jesus had laid the whole plan out to them and they knew and accepted the fact that Jesus trusted and loved Judas more than the rest.

Without Judas, there is no sacrifice.

Regards
DL
 
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GreatestIam

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?
Neither. He used what Judas intended as evil for good. Same as he is using you.

600 To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy. When therefore he establishes his eternal plan of "predestination", he includes in it each person's free response to his grace: "In this city, in fact, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place."395 For the sake of accomplishing his plan of salvation, God permitted the acts that flowed from their blindness.396
Thanks for the compliment.

You have forgotten that. in the myth, Satan enters Judas only after Jesus chose him.

That is when god permitted Satan access to Judas.

That asside.

I already have an anal orifice, so why are you following me around?

Regards
DL
 

luchitociencia

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
Hero?

Lol.

I don't think so, the more you can say is that Jesus & Co. made Judas to be the idiot.
 
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GreatestIam

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Piece of shit Judas was. No need to say anything more.
How could Jesus get to his destiny without a betrayer?

In Jewish tradition, the sop is offered to the most honored guest.

Jesus incorporated the mission into that honor.

I can understand your position my friend, but remember that Satan was not allowed to enter Judas till after Jesus and god allowed it.

It was not Judas' fault. Right?

Regards
DL
 

norwegen

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If the gospel story is a myth, then the Gospel of Judas is no less a fairy tale than the Three Little Pigs.

Who in their right minds would base their tenets on fairy tales?
 
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GreatestIam

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?

Most people see Judas as a traitor in the myth of the crucifixion. Few recognize that Jesus was asking his most trusted disciple, Judas, to turn him over to the Jews and Pilate.

Most are unaware of the meaning of the sop that Jesus gave to Judas at the last supper. Without knowing the definition and meaning of that word, it is not surprising that most think of Judas as they do. The completely wrong way.

A sop is basically a gift or conciliatory bribe, something that seals a deal. That is what Jesus gave Judas, his most trusted disciple. We know he was Jesus’ favorite because he was Jesus’ banker.

Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.

Without the betrayal, Jesus would not have died for us, as Yahweh had planned, and scriptures say that Judas also had no choice as that would have derailed god’s plan.

If any blame for Jesus’ death is to be given, it must be to Yahweh, whose plan, scriptures say must come to pass. Meaning that Yahweh would have to control all the players including Judas.

Scriptures show Jesus persuading Judas to do what he would not ordinarily have thought of doing.

Judas believed that Jesus was the messiah who was to rise again to lead the Jews. This lie imposed by Yahweh.

Was Judas a good man doing Jesus’ will or was he a traitor?

Regards
DL
Hero?

Lol.

I don't think so, the more you can say is that Jesus & Co. made Judas to be the idiot.
Correct. He was set up.

He had no choice or free will.

He was a puppet on a string and would fail mens rai because he did not have an evil intent.

Not having an evil intent would make Judas innocent of any wrong doing.

Regards
DL
 
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GreatestIam

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If the gospel story is a myth, then the Gospel of Judas is no less a fairy tale than the Three Little Pigs.

Who in their right minds would base their tenets on fairy tales?
That would depend on how you read the numbers.

If push came to shove, I think the majority would disavow any real hard belief in anything supernatural.

In Northern Europe, 95 % are Christians, but only about 5% go into a church even once a year.

Politics has a real politique and religions have a real religiontique.

As sub cultures, religionists are not as foolish as their myths make them out to be.

Regards
DL
 

norwegen

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If the gospel story is a myth, then the Gospel of Judas is no less a fairy tale than the Three Little Pigs.

Who in their right minds would base their tenets on fairy tales?
That would depend on how you read the numbers.

If push came to shove, I think the majority would disavow any real hard belief in anything supernatural.

In Northern Europe, 95 % are Christians, but only about 5% go into a church even once a year.

Politics has a real politique and religions have a real religiontique.

As sub cultures, religionists are not as foolish as their myths make them out to be.

Regards
DL
I think the only myth here is the Gospel of Judas.

P52 can be dated to as early as AD 100, and that fragment is only a copy. The original Gospel of John was almost certainly written in the first century.

None of the Gnostics involved in the production of the Gospel of Judas - a second-century production - remembered the crucifixion story in real time or even heard it second-hand.
 
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GreatestIam

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If the gospel story is a myth, then the Gospel of Judas is no less a fairy tale than the Three Little Pigs.

Who in their right minds would base their tenets on fairy tales?
That would depend on how you read the numbers.

If push came to shove, I think the majority would disavow any real hard belief in anything supernatural.

In Northern Europe, 95 % are Christians, but only about 5% go into a church even once a year.

Politics has a real politique and religions have a real religiontique.

As sub cultures, religionists are not as foolish as their myths make them out to be.

Regards
DL
I think the only myth here is the Gospel of Judas.

P52 can be dated to as early as AD 100, and that fragment is only a copy. The original Gospel of John was almost certainly written in the first century.

None of the Gnostics involved in the production of the Gospel of Judas - a second-century production - remembered the crucifixion story in real time or even heard it second-hand.
All holly books are myths.

Does it really matter when or where worthy words are written?

I hope you can see how intelligent the ancients were as compared to the mental efforts that modern preachers and theists are using with the literal reading of myths.

What is God?

Further.
Bill Moyers Journal . Watch & Listen | PBS

Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."

Please listen as to what is said about the literal reading of myths.

"Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."

Matt 7;12 So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

This is how early Gnostic Christians view the transition from reading myths properly to destructive literal reading and idol worship.


Regards
DL
 

my2¢

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Dictionary reference for sop.
Something that is done or given to someone in order to prevent trouble, gain support, etc.
A conciliatory gift or bribe.
Through the prayer at Gethsemane afterwards we hear of Jesus asking for the cup to be lifted if there was any other way. So a conciliatory gift or bribe to a betrayer seems a sensible act to me.
 

ding

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Was Judas a hero and most trusted disciple, or a traitor?
Neither. He used what Judas intended as evil for good. Same as he is using you.

600 To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy. When therefore he establishes his eternal plan of "predestination", he includes in it each person's free response to his grace: "In this city, in fact, both Herod and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles and the peoples of Israel, gathered together against your holy servant Jesus, whom you anointed, to do whatever your hand and your plan had predestined to take place."395 For the sake of accomplishing his plan of salvation, God permitted the acts that flowed from their blindness.396
Thanks for the compliment.

You have forgotten that. in the myth, Satan enters Judas only after Jesus chose him.

That is when god permitted Satan access to Judas.

That asside.

I already have an anal orifice, so why are you following me around?

Regards
DL
You have forgotten that since you believe it is a myth you don't believe satan entered Judas. :lol:

Jesus chose Judas with full knowledge that he would betray him, but Judas still had to make that choice.
 

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