The definition of insanity

[freethought]

is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.

A brief history of the chats I've had with my conservative friends since Bush was elected.

- If you thought the economy was good under Clinton, wait until you see it under a republican

- Bush is gonna save Social security

- Bush is gonna save education with no child left behind

9/11

- Bush is a great man. He's our leader and he's gonna get Osama Dead or Alive.

- Iraq has WMDs and if we don't go in now, the next thing will be a mushroom cloud.

- Iraq is the closest member of the Axis of Evil to having nucs, and that's why we've got to go into Iraq first.

- We will be greeted as liberators.

2004 election

- Kerry will ruin the economy.

- Kerry will make terrorism go up

Post 2004

- Bush is the best president ever

- (they were strangely silent on Katrina and Bush for some reason)

- Our economy is sound

And now, despite these issues and MANY, MANY others, they want to elect a man who voted with Bush over 90% of the time, and return a party to power that has overseen the destruction of our liberties, our economy, and our constitution (among many other things).

INSANE

 

[midcan5]

Amazing but true, I was baffled over Bush Jr, McCain / Palin are potentially worse, that America has to live through and survive these fools and their stupidity challenges the foundations of credibility.

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter." Winston Churchill

>

 

[rayboyusmc]

They are good at this spin crap.

What would be happening right now if we were at the end of 8 years of Dem rule and the economy was in the crap pile?

They would have impeached the Dem president. But no, today they are blaming the dems for this mess.

6 years the lemmings crawled up Bush'sButt and approved everything. Now since 2006, they have used more filibusters in less than two years than the Dems did for six.

I have met and worked for the Sarah's of this world. Bully, dictator, not that well read, but loves to be seen and heard. If McCain were to die or become unable to fill the office, she would be a disaster that would come close to destroying this country.

Ora pro Obama.

 

[N4mddissent]

Hell, they tried to impeach the president for getting a bj, they may have sanctioned assassination if a (D) president manipulated intelligence to promote a war agenda and sent this country into the greatest economic disaster since the depression.

Hopefully that group of conservatives is moving into its final years. I don't mind reasonable conservatives, with which I can agree to disagree, but this latest breed over the past few years makes me have flashes of something sinister happening. Consider this quote:

But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

This was stated by Hermann Göring., one of the leaders of the Nazi party. Twisted though they were, they seemed to understand something about the masses. And it is almost as if these techniques became like "The Art of War" for political strategists in the new right.

 

[dilloduck]

But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

Isn't that pretty much what the liberals are telling us today? We are being attacked ?

 

[Valerie]

Isn't that pretty much what the liberals are telling us today? We are being attacked ?

What do you mean?

 

[dilloduck]

What do you mean?

Bush is going to declare martial law--etc etc

 

[editec]

The definition of insanity

Posting lamed assed cliches and thinking them profound, would be most guess.

 

[freethought]

Posting lamed assed cliches and thinking them profound, would be most guess.

I suppose screwing up a one line post is also a good sign.

Though not quite as telling as ignoring the content of an entire post...

the 'lamed assed' cliche is an Einstein quote, btw.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

You could argue the insanity thing for electing both Democrats and Republicans since 1860, especially now considering that there's very little difference between the two.

 

[Truthmatters]

to pretend that there is no differance is foolish.

If there were no differances we would have been in this mess under Clinton.

If you cant figure out who to vote for dont blame us for being able to figure it out.

 

[N4mddissent]

Bush is going to declare martial law--etc etc

I think I saw where someone had mentioned this somewhere on these boards, but didn't even bother to read it. I don't pay that much attention to wingnuts on either side. But I consider myself pretty well informed getting information from lots of places and I have heard this nowhere else. I think saying liberals are saying we're going to be attacked is misleading. I'm not claiming conservatives are saying there will mushroom clouds if Obama is elected, but one here did say that.

After 9-11 these republican neocons followed that quoted formula to the letter. Specifically by blowing the threat of terrorism out of proportion and pointedly they would, "denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger.

 

[Stoner]

Hell, they tried to impeach the president for getting a bj

Actually they didn't "try". He was impeached. Second POTUS in US history. Shameful. At least he represented the libs in their true tradition.

And he wasn't impeached for a blowjob. Libbies love to use that line because it makes his impeachment seem less severe. Bubba was impeached for perjury and obstruction of justice.

I can see how a methane-breathing, mindless, clone can confuse perjury to a federal grand jury and obstruction of justice with a hummer.

 

[SwingVoter]

Liberals should remember we got here because Bush had a socialist spending plan that included Medicare Drug and No Child Left Behind. Under Bush, gov spending is up over 60% compared to just 30% under Clinton. So Bush has proven that fiscal liberalism really doesn't work, and Clinton proved that fiscal conservatism does.

 

[Truthmatters]

The last six months have made it abundantly clear that voluntary regulation does not work. When Congress passed the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act, it created a significant regulatory gap by failing to give to the SEC or any agency the authority to regulate large investment bank holding companies, like Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, Merrill Lynch, Lehman Brothers, and Bear Stearns.

Because of the lack of explicit statutory authority for the Commission to require these investment bank holding companies to report their capital, maintain liquidity, or submit to leverage requirements, the Commission in 2004 created a voluntary program, the Consolidated Supervised Entities program, in an effort to fill this regulatory gap.

As I have reported to the Congress multiple times in recent months, the CSE program was fundamentally flawed from the beginning, because investment banks could opt in or out of supervision voluntarily. The fact that investment bank holding companies could withdraw from this voluntary supervision at their discretion diminished the perceived mandate of the CSE program, and weakened its effectiveness.

I think the SEC knows what got us here.


one word: DEREGULATION

 

[SwingVoter]

And it is almost as if these techniques became like "The Art of War" for political strategists in the new right.

When are you liberals going to give up the conspiracy theories???

Bush has been one of the worst presidents in history, no conspiracy theory is needed to prove this!

The GOP is not clever enough to manipulate people like this, they're just a bunch of numb nut socialists who just want to pay for their big gov't programs using money from Chinese central bankers, instead of U.S. taxpayers.

 

[N4mddissent]

Libbies love to use that line because it makes his impeachment seem less severe. Bubba was impeached for perjury and obstruction of justice.

Ironic that a Libby was indicted for the exact same thing. I do understand the difference, but I am also part of the reality-based community. How did he commit the perjury? Because he was being investigated over a blowjob. We've got manipulation of evidence, partisan firings in the justice department, subverting constitutional principles, compromising undercover agents, refusal to answer congressional subpoenas, and illegal violations of the right to privacy in the last 8 years. But during Clinton, they spent millions on investigation, published ridiculous reports that were basically softcore porn, and made the U.S. a laughing stock to the rest of the world, while they bathed in hypocritical sefl-righteousness. So yeah, Clinton got laid, and they wanted to find something to tarnish him so badly, especially in light of the great shape our country was in, so they latched on and dug into it as hard as they could. Regardless of its effect on the country, they just wanted a partisan advantage. And in the end, Clinton slipped into their little trap and in the midst of all these investigations and claims and the firestorm of controversy what did they get? That he wasn't completely honest about his sex life when testifying. And they cheered.

 

[N4mddissent]

When are you liberals going to give up the conspiracy theories???

It's not a conspiracy theory. I said it seemed that way. It could just be a coincidence.

The GOP is not clever enough to manipulate people like this, they're just a bunch of numb nut socialists who just want to pay for their big gov't programs using money from Chinese central bankers, instead of U.S. taxpayers.

Talk about conspiracy theories... Look, I don't think Bush could intentionally be this crafty. But if you don't believe there are those on right who with a great deal of skill, concentrate on techniques manipulation and propaganda to achieve their goals, you are living in a dream world. I'm not suggesting new world order type stuff or the illuminati whack-job stuff, but more along the same lines as marketing. Terrorist threat levels being raised at convenient times for the GOP. It was obvious to anyone paying attention. Read the PNAC. It's not about manipulating the American public per se, it's more about subtle establishing an American empire through military presence. But even it stated that one of its goals (removing Hussein) would probably only gain the support of the American people if there was an attack on American similar in effect to Pearl Harbor. This doesn't meant that the administration knew about the attacks of 9-11, nor as the fringe claim that he orchestrated the attacks. But there are those, like the authors of that document, who are crafty enough, and ethically challenged enough to take advantage of that event to further their agenda.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

I think the SEC knows what got us here.


one word: DEREGULATION

Wrong, it's too much government regulation that caused the problem.

 

[Truthmatters]

The securities and exchange commission tells what went wrong

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Press Release: Chairman Cox Announces End of Consolidated Supervised Entities Program; 2008-230; Sept. 26, 2008


Chairman Cox made the following statement:

The last six months have made it abundantly clear that voluntary regulation does not work. When Congress passed the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act, it created a significant regulatory gap by failing to give to the SEC or any agency the authority to regulate large investment bank holding companies, like Goldman Sachs, Morgan Stanley, Merrill Lynch, Lehman Brothers, and Bear Stearns.

Because of the lack of explicit statutory authority for the Commission to require these investment bank holding companies to report their capital, maintain liquidity, or submit to leverage requirements, the Commission in 2004 created a voluntary program, the Consolidated Supervised Entities program, in an effort to fill this regulatory gap.

As I have reported to the Congress multiple times in recent months, the CSE program was fundamentally flawed from the beginning, because investment banks could opt in or out of supervision voluntarily. The fact that investment bank holding companies could withdraw from this voluntary supervision at their discretion diminished the perceived mandate of the CSE program, and weakened its effectiveness.

The Inspector General of the SEC today released a report on the CSE program's supervision of Bear Stearns, and that report validates and echoes the concerns I have expressed to Congress. The report's major findings are ultimately derivative of the lack of specific legal authority for the SEC or any other agency to act as the regulator of these large investment bank holding companies.

With each of the major investment banks that had been part of the CSE program being reconstituted within a bank holding company, they will all be subject to statutory supervision by the Federal Reserve. Under the Bank Holding Company Act, the Federal Reserve has robust statutory authority to impose and enforce supervisory requirements on those entities. Thus, there is not currently a regulatory gap in this area.

The CSE program within the Division of Trading and Markets will now be ending.

Under the Memorandum of Understanding between the SEC and the Federal Reserve that was executed in July of this year, we will continue to work closely with the Fed, but focused even more clearly on our statutory obligation to regulate the broker-dealer subsidiaries of the banking conglomerates. The information from the bank holding company level that the SEC will continue to receive under the MOU will strengthen our ability to protect the customers of the broker-dealers and the integrity of the broker-dealer firms.

The Inspector General's office also made 26 specific recommendations to improve the CSE program, which are comprehensive and worthy of support. Although the CSE program is ending, we will look closely at the applicability of those recommendations to other areas of the Commission's work and move to aggressively implement them.

As we learned from the CSE experience, it is critical that Congress ensure there are no similar major gaps in our regulatory framework. Unfortunately, as I reported to Congress this week, a massive hole remains: the approximately $60 trillion credit default swap (CDS) market, which is regulated by no agency of government. Neither the SEC nor any regulator has authority even to require minimum disclosure. I urge Congress to take swift action to address this.

Finally, I would like to commend the extraordinary efforts of the SEC's diligent staff, who for so many months have been working around the clock in the current market turmoil. Their dedication and commitment in behalf of investors and the American people are unequaled.