Sport and Education

[BuckToothMoron]

Why should jocks be given a free ride through college while the handful of academic achievers, many of who studied the sciences and mathematics, be given little to no help with their college bills?

If the United States wants to invest in it's future it should be giving the academic achievers in science and mathematics a free ride through college.

The jocks get enough glory with their stadiums, awards, and news headlines.

*****SMILE*****

Most high academic achievers do get free or nearly free college. Happy now?

View attachment 100147

No they don't.

******SMILE*****

Yes they do.

 

[Damaged Eagle]

Why should jocks be given a free ride through college while the handful of academic achievers, many of who studied the sciences and mathematics, be given little to no help with their college bills?

If the United States wants to invest in it's future it should be giving the academic achievers in science and mathematics a free ride through college.

The jocks get enough glory with their stadiums, awards, and news headlines.

*****SMILE*****

Most high academic achievers do get free or nearly free college. Happy now?

View attachment 100147

No they don't.

******SMILE*****

Yes they do.

Then my children need to be reimbursed.

*****SMILE*****

 

[Unkotare]

....... Sports are sports. They can be respected on their own merits rather than trying to tie them to something like school....

Then you don't understand it.

Then I don't understand what?

Sport

 

[Unkotare]

... If someone already knows how to play a sport, they don't have to stop doing it, it just may not involve any sort of education any longer....

Wrong.

Are you trying to say that every time a person plays a sport they must learn something?....

They sure do.

 

[Unkotare]

...

Why should jocks be given a free ride through college while the handful of academic achievers, many of who studied the sciences and mathematics, be given little to no help with their college bills?

If the United States wants to invest in it's future it should be giving the academic achievers in science and mathematics a free ride through college.

The jocks get enough glory with their stadiums, awards, and news headlines.

.......

Let go of that bitterness before it consumes you.


Why should those high-achievers in Science get high-paying jobs after college? Why should the best musicians have successful careers in the music industry? Why should the most beautiful girls have careers in film or modeling, etc.? Because those people have unique skills in a given area. If you don't, try to gain those skills or get the fuck over it. Meanwhile, those trying to gain such skills will also gain much more - and you will just sit there munching on your sour grapes.

That's fine. Then let's do away with all scholarships and free rides through college. Most especially those dealing with sports where a exceptional player can always join the pro's and make millions.

*****SMILE*****

Get rid of sports scholarships? I'm in

Sorry Poindexter, not happening.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Why should jocks be given a free ride through college while the handful of academic achievers, many of who studied the sciences and mathematics, be given little to no help with their college bills?

If the United States wants to invest in it's future it should be giving the academic achievers in science and mathematics a free ride through college.

The jocks get enough glory with their stadiums, awards, and news headlines.

*****SMILE*****

I agree, Bernie has the right idea. But, don't forget Football and Basketball bring in revenue, and more than compensate the U. when tickets are sold, concessions purchased and parking fees charged.

Only at the highest level do sports pay for themselves. Most colleges lose money on sports.

Half-true. As posted, football and basketball are revenue producers, and title 9 states:

“No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any educational program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.”
​

Title 9 has leveled the playing field for those engaged in sport, but that was not the point of the OP, nor your concerns.

Okay, what is the net profit for a Div I school like University of Houston in football?

I have no idea, I stated Football and Basketball generate revenue, of course so do other sporting events but the two I highlighted can sell ten's of thousands of tickets fro each game.

 

[Montrovant]

... If someone already knows how to play a sport, they don't have to stop doing it, it just may not involve any sort of education any longer....

Wrong.

Are you trying to say that every time a person plays a sport they must learn something?....

They sure do.

Now you're just being ridiculous. Is this some sort of 'every time a person does something, they learn from it' philosophical opinion?

 

[Unkotare]

... If someone already knows how to play a sport, they don't have to stop doing it, it just may not involve any sort of education any longer....

Wrong.

Are you trying to say that every time a person plays a sport they must learn something?....

They sure do.

Now you're just being ridiculous. Is this some sort of 'every time a person does something, they learn from it' philosophical opinion?

You have no experience with sport beyond the age of ten, right?

 

[candycorn]

Why should jocks be given a free ride through college while the handful of academic achievers, many of who studied the sciences and mathematics, be given little to no help with their college bills?

If the United States wants to invest in it's future it should be giving the academic achievers in science and mathematics a free ride through college.

The jocks get enough glory with their stadiums, awards, and news headlines.

*****SMILE*****

I agree, Bernie has the right idea. But, don’t forget Football and Basketball bring in revenue, and more than compensate the U. when tickets are sold, concessions purchased and parking fees

charged.

Only at the highest level do sports pay for themselves. Most colleges lose money on sports.

Half-true. As posted, football and basketball are revenue producers, and title 9 states:

“No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any educational program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.”
​

Title 9 has leveled the playing field for those engaged in sport, but that was not the point of the OP, nor your concerns.

Okay, what is the net profit for a Div I school like University of Houston in football?

I have no idea, I stated Football and Basketball generate revenue, of course so do other sporting events but the two I highlighted can sell ten's of thousands of tickets fro each game.

And after you get through paying the coaches, the travel, the lodging, the meals for 100-125 players and coaches, the band and the cheer leaders—and then ad in that the University is on the hook for paying for upkeep on the stadium, the utilities, upkeep on gymnasiums, weight rooms, medical staffs, insurance, etc (which are year round charges for 5 home games for football and maybe 16 home games for basketball), it’s doubtful that a school like UH is making money. The only reason larger schools make money is because of lucrative TV contracts for SEC, Big 10 and Big 12 conferences.

According to one website; it pretty much confirms the loss—especially if your team makes it to one of the bowl games:

From 2004 to 2011, 307 Division I Football Bowl Subdivision (FBS) football teams reported breaking even or losing money on the season, according to data provided by the schools to the federal Office of Postsecondary Education. Of those 307 teams, 98 played in bowl games after a season that was a financial break-even or loss.

Bowl Games Prosper Despite Schools Losing Money On Unsold Tickets

 

[NoNukes]

You can be educated without sports. There is nothing bad about including sports in a child's education, and I agree with having some form of PE in public schools. Sport is not education, though.

What is "education" then?

Being part of a team is valuable education.

 

[candycorn]

You can be educated without sports. There is nothing bad about including sports in a child's education, and I agree with having some form of PE in public schools. Sport is not education, though.

What is "education" then?

Being part of a team is valuable education.

I don’t think (at least I hope no one is) anyone is questioning that. What I question is that when our schools are feeling a cash pinch from college on down to Kindergarten, the wisdom of spending tax money on uniforms, fuel, stadiums etc and sending kids from one school to play kids in another school. You can learn enough about team work by playing your fellow classmates.

 

[Wry Catcher]

I agree, Bernie has the right idea. But, don’t forget Football and Basketball bring in revenue, and more than compensate the U. when tickets are sold, concessions purchased and parking fees

charged.

Only at the highest level do sports pay for themselves. Most colleges lose money on sports.

Half-true. As posted, football and basketball are revenue producers, and title 9 states:

“No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any educational program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.”
​

Title 9 has leveled the playing field for those engaged in sport, but that was not the point of the OP, nor your concerns.

Okay, what is the net profit for a Div I school like University of Houston in football?

I have no idea, I stated Football and Basketball generate revenue, of course so do other sporting events but the two I highlighted can sell ten's of thousands of tickets fro each game.

And after you get through paying the coaches, the travel, the lodging, the meals for 100-125 players and coaches, the band and the cheer leaders—and then ad in that the University is on the hook for paying for upkeep on the stadium, the utilities, upkeep on gymnasiums, weight rooms, medical staffs, insurance, etc (which are year round charges for 5 home games for football and maybe 16 home games for basketball), it’s doubtful that a school like UH is making money. The only reason larger schools make money is because of lucrative TV contracts for SEC, Big 10 and Big 12 conferences.

According to one website; it pretty much confirms the loss—especially if your team makes it to one of the bowl games:

From 2004 to 2011, 307 Division I Football Bowl Subdivision (FBS) football teams reported breaking even or losing money on the season, according to data provided by the schools to the federal Office of Postsecondary Education. Of those 307 teams, 98 played in bowl games after a season that was a financial break-even or loss.

Bowl Games Prosper Despite Schools Losing Money On Unsold Tickets

A lot of words ^^^ for a straw man. I NEVER suggested Football or Basketball was for profit, I said several times it brought in revenue. I didn't play football after high school or either basketball or football at the U. I played baseball as a walk-on, I had some offers, but always wanted to go to CAL.

 

[Montrovant]

... If someone already knows how to play a sport, they don't have to stop doing it, it just may not involve any sort of education any longer....

Wrong.

Are you trying to say that every time a person plays a sport they must learn something?....

They sure do.

Now you're just being ridiculous. Is this some sort of 'every time a person does something, they learn from it' philosophical opinion?

You have no experience with sport beyond the age of ten, right?

Wrong.

 

[WheelieAddict]

Are one and the same. In many ways, sport is an important aspect of education. It should be respected as such.

It depends on the individual. You don't have to be good at sports to be "well rounded". Sport was very good to me I got to make and blow money then finish my education later. For others it's the opposite. Being good at "sports" is not a panacea trust me, in some ways not being involved has perks.

 

[candycorn]

Only at the highest level do sports pay for themselves. Most colleges lose money on sports.

Half-true. As posted, football and basketball are revenue producers, and title 9 states:

“No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any educational program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance.”
​

Title 9 has leveled the playing field for those engaged in sport, but that was not the point of the OP, nor your concerns.

Okay, what is the net profit for a Div I school like University of Houston in football?

I have no idea, I stated Football and Basketball generate revenue, of course so do other sporting events but the two I highlighted can sell ten's of thousands of tickets fro each game.

And after you get through paying the coaches, the travel, the lodging, the meals for 100-125 players and coaches, the band and the cheer leaders—and then ad in that the University is on the hook for paying for upkeep on the stadium, the utilities, upkeep on gymnasiums, weight rooms, medical staffs, insurance, etc (which are year round charges for 5 home games for football and maybe 16 home games for basketball), it’s doubtful that a school like UH is making money. The only reason larger schools make money is because of lucrative TV contracts for SEC, Big 10 and Big 12 conferences.

According to one website; it pretty much confirms the loss—especially if your team makes it to one of the bowl games:

From 2004 to 2011, 307 Division I Football Bowl Subdivision (FBS) football teams reported breaking even or losing money on the season, according to data provided by the schools to the federal Office of Postsecondary Education. Of those 307 teams, 98 played in bowl games after a season that was a financial break-even or loss.

Bowl Games Prosper Despite Schools Losing Money On Unsold Tickets

A lot of words ^^^ for a straw man. I NEVER suggested Football or Basketball was for profit, I said several times it brought in revenue. I didn't play football after high school or either basketball or football at the U. I played baseball as a walk-on, I had some offers, but always wanted to go to CAL.

ok

 

[candycorn]

Let me ask you all this:

I keep hearing about team work and the value of it in terms of education. Well, on the radio this morning, they were discussing the change in manager for the MUSNST (Mens US Soccer Team) and the hosts were asking callers what they thought made a good manager.

Over and over one of the key items was that the manager informs players of their role on the team.

My question is this; if you're talking about a kid who is 8 or 9; is it really ethical to teach the kid to continuously pass the ball down the left side of the field or shoot whenever she gets the ball or concentrate on nothing but pitching or spiking the ball? I think the schools (public schools) should teach kids every position on a volleyball team or a football team or a baseball team and let them learn the whole spectrum of what each discipline requires. Then, if they wish and the opportunity presents itself, they can enter leagues and then become specialists or whatever the coach--whose job it is to win; not develop well-rounded athletes--desires. If you don't like that your daughter is being groomed to be a setter, join another league/team or whatever.

 

[Unkotare]

... I think the schools (public schools) should teach kids every position on a volleyball team or a football team or a baseball team and let them learn the whole spectrum of what each discipline requires. ....

That's what happens.

 

[Unkotare]

Wrong.

Are you trying to say that every time a person plays a sport they must learn something?....

They sure do.

Now you're just being ridiculous. Is this some sort of 'every time a person does something, they learn from it' philosophical opinion?

You have no experience with sport beyond the age of ten, right?

Wrong.

11

 

[candycorn]

... I think the schools (public schools) should teach kids every position on a volleyball team or a football team or a baseball team and let them learn the whole spectrum of what each discipline requires. ....

That's what happens.

Not really.

Having played sports in school, I wasn't much of a scorer when it came to basketball. We had one player who was so good at scoring they literally were never taken out of a game until the last game of the season. This player played every minute of every game up until the final game. When we were going to check into the last game after those who haven't played all season were finally allowed to play, I was asked by this player "How do you check into the game?" At that time, you had to tell the scorer the jersey number of who you were replacing on the court. They didn't know how to do that.

Needless to say that when coach was crafting last play strategy, this player's number was called whenever it mattered. We didn't always get the last shot of course and sometimes we were ahead or behind by so much, it didn't matter.

Coaches in HS shouldn't be trying to win; they should be trying to develop well rounded players.

 

[Unkotare]

... I think the schools (public schools) should teach kids every position on a volleyball team or a football team or a baseball team and let them learn the whole spectrum of what each discipline requires. ....

That's what happens.

Not really.

Having played sports in school, I wasn't much of a scorer when it came to basketball. We had one player who was so good at scoring they literally were never taken out of a game until the last game of the season. This player played every minute of every game up until the final game. When we were going to check into the last game after those who haven't played all season were finally allowed to play, I was asked by this player "How do you check into the game?" At that time, you had to tell the scorer the jersey number of who you were replacing on the court. They didn't know how to do that.

Needless to say that when coach was crafting last play strategy, this player's number was called whenever it mattered. We didn't always get the last shot of course and sometimes we were ahead or behind by so much, it didn't matter.

Coaches in HS shouldn't be trying to win; they should be trying to develop well rounded players.

Your anecdote doesn't support your previous claim, and "coaches in HS shouldn't be trying to win" is just stupid.