Roman Catholicism: The One True Church?

[Book of Jeremiah]

King James ordered the interpreters to alter Biblical passages so that it would be more in line with Protestant doctrine.

Actually that is not true, Blackrook. It is the Roman Catholic bible that is corrupt (and has been from the beginning) - please listen to this video for the history on why there is a concerted effort to lie about the purity of the King James Bible and the many strategies and schemes of the devil to replace it with these other versions. After listening to Gail Riplinger please share your thoughts with me. I'd be interested to know what you think.

 

[Meriweather]

By Stephen Meehan

If grace is unmerited favor and is freely given by God, how can one then co-operate or work alongside with it to receive it? Co-operating with grace would nullify grace; it wouldn’t be freely received.

Their works for attaining salvation include: Going to weekly Mass; partaking of the sacraments; paying a penalty or penance for one’s sins (which denies the sufficiency of Christ’s death on the cross to cover all sins); and then finally spending time in a fictitious place called Purgatory, to purge away any leftover sins that Christ’s blood couldn’t cover, or not enough penance was performed.

Purgatory is just another means of denying the sufficiency of Christ’s atonement for our sins; it is the ultimate declaration that His agonizing crucifixion on a wooden cross—the plan of salvation that was established before the foundation of the world was laid, was not enough to pay the cost of all of our sins.

In other words, when Christ uttered those final words, “It is finished” signifying that He had satisfied the wrath of God against us for the sins we have committed and that all our sins were “paid in full.” Rome declares that no, it is not finished and the paying of penances and time spent in Purgatory is required. It is a rejection of what Christ accomplished.


great article.. please read the full one.

An article that from the start begins with wrong premises cannot qualify as great.

Some believe being "saved" means that one possess the guarantee of a heavenly afterlife.

Catholics do not teach this definition of salvation. Salvation is a way of life--it's not something we will receive later--it is something we are living today, right now. God's grace is freely given and greatly accepted to help, strengthen, and guide us as we live The Way.

Do non-Catholics really eschew prayer? Non-Catholics really believe that prayers are considered works which nullify grace? Really? Non-Catholics are insisting no one pray?

Mass is a prayer. Sacraments are prayers. If prayer is not frowned upon, then why frown when Catholics pray? How does prayer become a work when it is done by Catholics?

Do non-Catholics dismiss Jesus' teaching that before any gift is offered, one should make sure all is right between oneself and one's fellowman? Is there a belief there is no need for apologies or to make reparations? There is no need to replace acts that are sinful with acts of goodness so that evil won't find an empty place to take up residence and make things worse than before?

Catholics do not believe in the penal substitution that some non-Catholic denominations teach. Rather, our belief is in repentance for remission of sins. The God of Wrath seems to the description of the Almighty by those who profess penal substitution by Christ. Catholics are more closely focused on the qualities of God's love and goodness who calls for us to simply turn from sin to Him; from disobedience to obedience.

 

[Meriweather]

The Catholic church is the first so they say all others are posers.

A slight correction here: The Catholic Church teaches that people of other Christian denominations are our brothers and sisters in Christ. The Catholic Church does not say they are posers, but rather that they simply aren't in full communion with the Catholic faith. Non-Catholics will be the first to agree they are not in full agreement with Catholicism, so no argument there. However, not all Christian denominations accept other denominations as their brothers and sisters in Christ.

 

[Meriweather]

They believe having sexual relations in marriage need to be open to procreation, but still allow the rhythm method, but times are changing and everyone uses the pill and they know that.

The Catholic Church, in sexual matters (as in everything), teaches the ideal. It teaches natural child planning, but could not give a stamp of approval on artificial birth control because it did not measure up the ideal.

Many Catholics thought Pope Paul VI would approve Catholic use of the birth control pill, and I guess he came pretty close to doing so. However, after a lot of prayer and soul searching he couldn't close his mind to the inevitable question: What will people do when artificial means fail? He predicted abortion. Where would indiscriminate use of the pill take us? He saw it taking society well beyond family planning for married couples, but for recreational sex between people who are not married.

The Theology of the Body by Pope John Paul II may interest Catholics who struggle with sexuality in today's society. It makes the case for the ideal, but yes, the Church is well aware many will settle for less than the ideal. Still no reason not to point to the ideal.

 

[ninja007]

The Catholic church is the first so they say all others are posers.

A slight correction here: The Catholic Church teaches that people of other Christian denominations are our brothers and sisters in Christ. The Catholic Church does not say they are posers, but rather that they simply aren't in full communion with the Catholic faith. Non-Catholics will be the first to agree they are not in full agreement with Catholicism, so no argument there. However, not all Christian denominations accept other denominations as their brothers and sisters in Christ.

..as they shouldn't.

 

[ninja007]

By Stephen Meehan

If grace is unmerited favor and is freely given by God, how can one then co-operate or work alongside with it to receive it? Co-operating with grace would nullify grace; it wouldn’t be freely received.

Their works for attaining salvation include: Going to weekly Mass; partaking of the sacraments; paying a penalty or penance for one’s sins (which denies the sufficiency of Christ’s death on the cross to cover all sins); and then finally spending time in a fictitious place called Purgatory, to purge away any leftover sins that Christ’s blood couldn’t cover, or not enough penance was performed.

Purgatory is just another means of denying the sufficiency of Christ’s atonement for our sins; it is the ultimate declaration that His agonizing crucifixion on a wooden cross—the plan of salvation that was established before the foundation of the world was laid, was not enough to pay the cost of all of our sins.

In other words, when Christ uttered those final words, “It is finished” signifying that He had satisfied the wrath of God against us for the sins we have committed and that all our sins were “paid in full.” Rome declares that no, it is not finished and the paying of penances and time spent in Purgatory is required. It is a rejection of what Christ accomplished.


great article.. please read the full one.

An article that from the start begins with wrong premises cannot qualify as great.

Some believe being "saved" means that one possess the guarantee of a heavenly afterlife.

Catholics do not teach this definition of salvation. Salvation is a way of life--it's not something we will receive later--it is something we are living today, right now. God's grace is freely given and greatly accepted to help, strengthen, and guide us as we live The Way.

Do non-Catholics really eschew prayer? Non-Catholics really believe that prayers are considered works which nullify grace? Really? Non-Catholics are insisting no one pray?

Mass is a prayer. Sacraments are prayers. If prayer is not frowned upon, then why frown when Catholics pray? How does prayer become a work when it is done by Catholics?

Do non-Catholics dismiss Jesus' teaching that before any gift is offered, one should make sure all is right between oneself and one's fellowman? Is there a belief there is no need for apologies or to make reparations? There is no need to replace acts that are sinful with acts of goodness so that evil won't find an empty place to take up residence and make things worse than before?

Catholics do not believe in the penal substitution that some non-Catholic denominations teach. Rather, our belief is in repentance for remission of sins. The God of Wrath seems to the description of the Almighty by those who profess penal substitution by Christ. Catholics are more closely focused on the qualities of God's love and goodness who calls for us to simply turn from sin to Him; from disobedience to obedience.

you can focus on whatever aspects you want; doesn't make it true. Do you love only half of God? God is judge just as much as Savior. Catholics like yourself want the feely good cotton candy milktoast religion...which sends people to hell.

 

[Meriweather]

you can focus on whatever aspects you want; doesn't make it true. Do you love only half of God? God is judge just as much as Savior. Catholics like yourself want the feely good cotton candy milktoast religion...which sends people to hell.

Two wrong premises followed by a threat... Plus the interesting detail that you apparently don't think love and goodness are aspects of God.

Wouldn't you be a lot more interesting if you spoke out about your own faith? As far as I can tell your faith is based, not on God, but on misunderstanding and bashing the Catholic faith. Personally, I'd choose to be an atheist before I'd choose as my faith the misunderstanding and bashing another faith.

 

[sealybobo]

The Catholic church is the first so they say all others are posers.

A slight correction here: The Catholic Church teaches that people of other Christian denominations are our brothers and sisters in Christ. The Catholic Church does not say they are posers, but rather that they simply aren't in full communion with the Catholic faith. Non-Catholics will be the first to agree they are not in full agreement with Catholicism, so no argument there. However, not all Christian denominations accept other denominations as their brothers and sisters in Christ.

In other words at least you're all worshipping the same guy. What he said that's a different story.

So you don't have to be a Catholic? It isn't the only way?

 

[ninja007]

Meri is blinded by the rcc who teaches many false doctrines. The rcc has led more people astray than any other.

 

[Meriweather]

So you don't have to be a Catholic? It isn't the only way?

Christ commissioned his followers to proclaim the good news, not to threaten the world with damnation. The Catholic Church considers it spreading Christ's teachings a serious responsibility/commission that is expected of the Church and its members.

Here is where the line is drawn: God is not bound by human failure. Anyone the Church fails to reach or convert is entrusted to God's love and mercy. It is a situation of, "Here is what we were able to do, and we trust you, God, with our failures." The Catholic Church teaches that those of other faiths--or no faith--are not just in God's hands, but the loving hands of God.

 

[Penelope]

Meri is blinded by the rcc who teaches many false doctrines. The rcc has led more people astray than any other.

How is that? also what sect of Christianity do you belong to?

 

[zaangalewa]

Oh by the way: Did you know that our Pope Francis is seen in Saudi Arabia as holy as the Prophet Mohammed? They did not even allow "National Geographic" to show our holy Father from the back. The Islam is indeed a fascinating religion. This religious ceremony is called "censorship" - censorship means: "There is no truth as long as no one knows the truth."

 

[zaangalewa]

The Catholic church is the first so they say all others are posers.

A slight correction here: The Catholic Church teaches that people of other Christian denominations are our brothers and sisters in Christ. The Catholic Church does not say they are posers, but rather that they simply aren't in full communion with the Catholic faith. Non-Catholics will be the first to agree they are not in full agreement with Catholicism, so no argument there. However, not all Christian denominations accept other denominations as their brothers and sisters in Christ.

Yea - but even birds are our sisters and brothers, and oxes, and donkeys ... ask Saint Francis ... and from time to time someone on a Harley ... or even someone who looks not only like a pirate of the Caribbean ... and some are even on their way in his name ... everywhere ...

 

[sealybobo]

So you don't have to be a Catholic? It isn't the only way?

Christ commissioned his followers to proclaim the good news, not to threaten the world with damnation. The Catholic Church considers it spreading Christ's teachings a serious responsibility/commission that is expected of the Church and its members.

Here is where the line is drawn: God is not bound by human failure. Anyone the Church fails to reach or convert is entrusted to God's love and mercy. It is a situation of, "Here is what we were able to do, and we trust you, God, with our failures." The Catholic Church teaches that those of other faiths--or no faith--are not just in God's hands, but the loving hands of God.

How do you know God is real?

 

[zaangalewa]

King James ordered the interpreters to alter Biblical passages so that it would be more in line with Protestant doctrine.

Actually that is not true, Blackrook. It is the Roman Catholic bible that is corrupt (and has been from the beginning) - please listen to this video for the history on why there is a concerted effort to lie about the purity of the King James Bible and the many strategies and schemes of the devil to replace it with these other versions. After listening to Gail Riplinger please share your thoughts with me. I'd be interested to know what you think.

We made the bible like others make a barn for example. A barn is not bad if it rains. But how is a barn able to be true or wrong? The bible is a summary of books - on a kind of dry place - that's all. The bible is not a god - not even if it is the bible from Wulfila - the most worthful book the world ever had seen.

 

[Meriweather]

Yea - but even birds are our sisters and brothers, and oxes, and donkeys ... ask Saint Francis ... and from time to time someone on a Harley ... or even someone who looks not only like a pirate of the Caribbean ... and some are even on their way in his name ... everywhere ...

I understand. However, brothers and sisters in Christ, is seen as a closer relationship than one we have with birds, oxen, and donkeys. Believing we were made from the clay of the earth has us calling earth, "Mother Earth..." but the relationship we have with our parents is of a different quality.

 

[Meriweather]

How do you know God is real?

I see goodness and love as real, two subjective facts that cannot be proven, that cannot be proven by the scientific method, yet are still qualities of earth and life on earth. Just as darkness cannot exist in light, evil and hate cannot exist within goodness and love. Goodness and love appear to be qualities of creation. Does the subjective indicate a Creator?

If all of creation is centered around the scientific method, wouldn't if logically follow that creation could only think it terms of scientific method? Yet so much of our time and our thinking is spent in the subjective, suggesting an inner core of what people reference as soul or spirit.

I also look at why people do not believe in God. The answer seems to be that God cannot be found in what is mighty and powerful--or by the scientific method. Worse, they see God in the destructiveness of the Great Flood and Sodom and Gomorrah, simply because these are powerful events. The hypothesis seems to be, God is powerful, these were powerful events, therefore God. Elijah would be the first to remind us that God was not in the great storm or the great fire. He was the tiny whispering sound for all who were listening.

Knock, seek, ask, listen. In the right place, for the right thing--the tiny whispering sound. Observe how evil and hate cannot exist in goodness and love. Don't dismiss out of hand experiences people have had that cannot be proven by the scientific method. Be open to the possibility that the subjective has as many doors for us to walk through as does the scientific method.

How do I know God is real? Through subjective, personal experiences with more reality than things proven by the scientific method.

 

[Avatar4321]

By Stephen Meehan



If grace is unmerited favor and is freely given by God, how can one then co-operate or work alongside with it to receive it? Co-operating with grace would nullify grace; it wouldn’t be freely received.

Their works for attaining salvation include: Going to weekly Mass; partaking of the sacraments; paying a penalty or penance for one’s sins (which denies the sufficiency of Christ’s death on the cross to cover all sins); and then finally spending time in a fictitious place called Purgatory, to purge away any leftover sins that Christ’s blood couldn’t cover, or not enough penance was performed.

Purgatory is just another means of denying the sufficiency of Christ’s atonement for our sins; it is the ultimate declaration that His agonizing crucifixion on a wooden cross—the plan of salvation that was established before the foundation of the world was laid, was not enough to pay the cost of all of our sins.

In other words, when Christ uttered those final words, “It is finished” signifying that He had satisfied the wrath of God against us for the sins we have committed and that all our sins were “paid in full.” Rome declares that no, it is not finished and the paying of penances and time spent in Purgatory is required. It is a rejection of what Christ accomplished.


great article.. please read the full one.

"Therefore I command you to repent—repent, lest I smite you by the rod of my mouth, and by my wrath, and by my anger, and your sufferings be sore—how sore you know not, how exquisite you know not, yea, how hard to bear you know not.

16 For behold, I, God, have suffered these things for all, that they might not suffer if they would repent;

17 But if they would not repent they must suffer even as I;

18 Which suffering caused myself, even God, the greatest of all, to tremble because of pain, and to bleed at every pore, and to suffer both body and spirit—and would that I might not drink the bitter cup, and shrink—

19 Nevertheless, glory be to the Father, and I partook and finished my preparations unto the children of men" (D&C 19:15-19)

The Lord has made it clear that we need to repent to accept His atonement. And that if we don't than He doesn't know us and we will have to suffer what He suffered.

The idea that our efforts in following Christ somehow makes the atonement null and void is dangerous and absurd. He has commanded us to follow Him. He wants us to follow Him. He wouldn't be continually inviting us to follow Him and Keep His commandments if doing so means we reject His atonement.

He has said "if you love me, keep my commandments". Do you honestly think that those who show their love to Him by doing what He says are rejected by Him? That makes no sense and flies in the face of so many things He clearly taught.

 

[Avatar4321]

obviously not

Judaism wasn't near the first religion therefore it's false and since christians sprang from it, it's false.

you're perfect god can't go from "an eye for an eye...." to "turn the other cheek"

It fails the common sense check


It's got some good rules to live by though, just like any other religion.

I like The Mormons spin on Christianity. Jesus really did happen 2000 years ago but since then the religion has gone corrupt and has lost its way. How do they know this? Because God told Joseph Smith in 1800 to start a new

You realize that protestants have the same viewpoint. Which is why they studied the Bible to keep reforming the church.

We just recognize that man cannot reform a corrupt church. You cannot put new wine in old bottles. If corruption exists, God has to restore it to it's pure state. This a restoration and not a reformation was needed.

God is the authority

 

[Meriweather]

We just recognize that man cannot reform a corrupt church. You cannot put new wine in old bottles. If corruption exists, God has to restore it to it's pure state. This a restoration and not a reformation was needed.

God is the authority

There are a few things to consider here. First, proof of a corrupt Church. Did Judas make Christ's community of Apostles corrupt? Did Peter's denial? One repented, the other was replaced and the group moved on. What is the proof that the Church was ever corrupt, rather than just in need of repentance and reform?

Second, where is proof that man cannot reform a corrupt church? Christ promised forgiveness, promised the help of the Holy Spirit, and he promised the gates of hell could not prevail against the church.

My points are the Church, while ever in need of reform, is not corrupt. That is like accusing Christ and the Holy Spirit of corruptness. Second, Peter denied Christ (how much worse can it get) yet ultimately he prevailed in his faith. Upon repentance, Christ forgave Peter his shortcomings, and the same repentance and power of forgiveness is there for the Church assembly.

Labeling a Church corrupt, proclaiming corruption cannot be overcome sounds more like an excuse for giving up and doing something another way that perhaps is not the way Christ established. After all, the way Christ initially established must have been "corrupt" (at least in a few eyes) as it did not or was not succeeding by their human measure of success? Just a thought.