Orthodox Jews and Zionism

[irosie91]

I do not consider the Nazis of Germany all that UNIQUE ----now--for the record---most
germans never killed anyone and would not have supported that which went on
in Auschwitz -------does that help? MOST GERMANS as for turks ---
ask Ellia Kazan (spelling?) or Daniel Pipes

You don't think so?

They supported the underlying rhetoric of racial inferiority of some and of eugenics enough to look the other way at evidence of the mass dissaperance of people. Enough to support the rounding up and labeling of Jews. Not all supported it, that's for sure - but without some degree of popular support and peer pressure from those supporters, Hitler could not have done what he did.

right ----not ALL supported and MOST---would not have taken part in the
actual enactment so? how does that differ from popular participation
in throat slitting parties in Islamic lands? How does it differ from the starvation
siege of Biafrans and more than a million babies dead in the dust? ----with lots
of popular support...........

labeling? interesting allusion-----shariah law mandates the COLOR CODE
labeling of non muslims red for Zoroastrians, blue for Christians,
yellow for jews ----and saffron orange for hindus. It is not ancient stuff----
hubby has still living relatives who can remember and discuss it ----at least as
it was applied to jews------there were no other non muslims left in that
particular shariah cesspit Do you imagine that people OBJECTED?

"oh gee achmed----it ain't nice what we do to jews"

stay awake-----its coming back to Iraq

 

[aris2chat]

That's kind of like saying Israeli parents teach their children to join the IDF in order to kill Pali's.

In order to kill those who are trying to kill them.

You know who, Coyote.

They're your Pali's.

Did you bring your Goebells 101 check off list to check one side and pretend there's only one side?

The Jews hide their children away in times of war. In order to try and protect them.

Your "Pali's"

You know. The ones who are not on Billo's Goebbels 101 list.

Hamas uses photo of dead child from Syria to wage Twitter propaganda war against Israel; Update: More bogus injuries

Hamas uses photo of dead child from Syria to wage Twitter propaganda war against Israel; Update: More bogus injuries | Twitchy

Depends Ropey, on what a person is taught.

If a person is taught that it's a duty and postive moral obligation to take up arms in defense of their country or in legitimate resistance, that can produce one outcome.

If a person is taught that the opponent is "less than", a barbaric subhuman animal, that needs to be pushed out or wiped out, it produces another outcome.

There is, of course, a lot of propaganda.

T-shirts were five years ago, the t-shirts were not approved by the IDF, they were pulled within days.

 

[Coyote]

I do not consider the Nazis of Germany all that UNIQUE ----now--for the record---most
germans never killed anyone and would not have supported that which went on
in Auschwitz -------does that help? MOST GERMANS as for turks ---
ask Ellia Kazan (spelling?) or Daniel Pipes

You don't think so?

They supported the underlying rhetoric of racial inferiority of some and of eugenics enough to look the other way at evidence of the mass dissaperance of people. Enough to support the rounding up and labeling of Jews. Not all supported it, that's for sure - but without some degree of popular support and peer pressure from those supporters, Hitler could not have done what he did.

right ----not ALL supported and MOST---would not have taken part in the
actual enactment so? how does that differ from popular participation
in throat slitting parties in Islamic lands? How does it differ from the starvation
siege of Biafrans and more than a million babies dead in the dust? ----with lots
of popular support...........

labeling? interesting allusion-----shariah law mandates the COLOR CODE
labeling of non muslims red for Zoroastrians, blue for Christians,
yellow for jews ----and saffron orange for hindus. It is not ancient stuff----
hubby has still living relatives who can remember and discuss it ----at least as
it was applied to jews------there were no other non muslims left in that
particular shariah cesspit Do you imagine that people OBJECTED?

"oh gee achmed----it ain't nice what we do to jews"

stay awake-----its coming back to Iraq

I'll tell you how it differs.

Not all Germans were Nazi's.

Not all Muslims are extremists.

Sharia law - much of which is not even applied - is based on ancient times (ie the color coding) and is not even practiced. It's no different than a host of other religiously based barbaric laws that still exist in the culture but are seldom applied, around the world, like suti.

The Nazi's were united in their belief that there was a superior race, eugenics were a valid means of obtaining racial purity and disposing of inferiors - even children - was acceptable. There isn't even remotely such a uniting in the Muslim world.

 

[Coyote]

In order to kill those who are trying to kill them.

You know who, Coyote.

They're your Pali's.

Did you bring your Goebells 101 check off list to check one side and pretend there's only one side?

The Jews hide their children away in times of war. In order to try and protect them.

Your "Pali's"

You know. The ones who are not on Billo's Goebbels 101 list.



Hamas uses photo of dead child from Syria to wage Twitter propaganda war against Israel; Update: More bogus injuries | Twitchy

Depends Ropey, on what a person is taught.

If a person is taught that it's a duty and postive moral obligation to take up arms in defense of their country or in legitimate resistance, that can produce one outcome.

If a person is taught that the opponent is "less than", a barbaric subhuman animal, that needs to be pushed out or wiped out, it produces another outcome.

There is, of course, a lot of propaganda.

T-shirts were five years ago, the t-shirts were not approved by the IDF, they were pulled within days.

They reflected an underlying sentiment that exists in portions of Israeli society.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/wor...nant-woman-rifle-cross-hairs-article-1.361380

 

[Lipush]

Palestinians ARE raising their children to be doctors etc etc - the point is made by reading the post he is responding to

That'd be on me.

And well, yeah, on the one hand they teach their kids to become doctors, and on the other hand they teach them to become suicide bombers.

So what gives

That's kind of like saying Israeli parents teach their children to join the IDF in order to kill Pali's.

No, it's not.

First, because parents don't teach their kids to join the IDF. They join the IDF mostly nowdays because the law says so and they feel the need to do it.

Second, we don't poison the minds of kids like you see the Palestinians do

Comparison is misplaced.

 

[Coyote]

That'd be on me.

And well, yeah, on the one hand they teach their kids to become doctors, and on the other hand they teach them to become suicide bombers.

So what gives

That's kind of like saying Israeli parents teach their children to join the IDF in order to kill Pali's.

No, it's not.

First, because parents don't teach their kids to join the IDF. They join the IDF mostly nowdays because the law says so and they feel the need to do it.

Second, we don't poison the minds of kids like you see the Palestinians do

Comparison is misplaced.

Really? How do they get poisoned then?

Attacks on Arabs in Israel prompt soul-searching - CNN.com

Wharton, of the left-wing Meretz party, told CNN Wednesday the statements from Netanyahu and others condemning the violence are welcome -- but the government seems unlikely to take on the deep-rooted issues behind the attacks.

She believes the incidents are a symptom of three highly concerning trends.

"One is a question of racism, which is definitely on the rise in Israel and is very worrisome to, I think, just about everyone except for a worrisome combination of extreme right and extreme religious groups," she said.

A second is the issue of rising violence in Israel, particularly among the younger generation, she said, in contrast to a tradition of low levels of violent crime despite the threat of terrorism.

The third has to do with a growing number of ultra-orthodox youth who drop out of school but whose highly religious education and upbringing have left them unable to adjust to regular society, Wharton said.

"Those kids, they leave these schools and they are suddenly exposed to a whole world they haven't seen before. They don't know how to behave, they get involved in drugs or crime," she said.

At the same time, racism is also increasing in mainstream schools, she said, in part as a by-product of Israel's long history of conflict and the distrust built up following scores of attacks by Palestinian militants.

She believes more must be done in schools to emphasize the need for peaceful coexistence, in line with traditional Jewish values, and to warn against stereotyping and violence.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/21/w...tinians-in-jerusalem.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/173927/israeli-arrested-for-instigating-beating-of-arabs

Children learn to hate from somewhere - the aren't born that way.

 

[Ropey]

That'd be on me.

And well, yeah, on the one hand they teach their kids to become doctors, and on the other hand they teach them to become suicide bombers.

So what gives

That's kind of like saying Israeli parents teach their children to join the IDF in order to kill Pali's.

No, it's not.

First, because parents don't teach their kids to join the IDF. They join the IDF mostly nowdays because the law says so and they feel the need to do it.

Second, we don't poison the minds of kids like you see the Palestinians do

Comparison is misplaced.

Not only is the comparison misplaced but also Billo uses Joseph Goebbels (who was the creator of the propaganda and disinformation tactics of the Nazi's) when comparing Israel and the Territories to prewar Germany.

So, he's just doing what the Palestinians do when they say that the Jews are attacking themselves to make it appear that the Palestinians are involved.

I know one thing. These Palestinians who are Israeli citizens don't want to leave Israel even if/when there are land swaps.

I also know that to equate Nazi Germany pre-wwII and Israel/Gaza is disinformation.

The disinformation Goebbels used was that the Jews were going to take over Germany. The Palestinians attack Israel and say that Israel wants to take them over.

While they could have had their own state and partition in 1948.

Now they have a dream and a fight.

A fight. Not a slaughter. Goebbels 101

A fight in which both Egypt and Jordan have made peace but the rest of the Arab states have not and remain fighting and as Syria is still in a state of war with Israel (just re-declared a while ago) it's important to maintain a security with Lebanon, Syria and Both the outlying areas of Egypt and Jordan where the Palestinian's various militias have their military organizations also spread out.

It's a fight from declared war and the disinformation is that it's not a fight, it's a holocaust.

Hmmm... reversal of the Billo statement of Israel using Goebbell's strategy on the Palestinians.

But that's ok. Billo isn't as bad as Goebells just as Israel isn't as bad as the Nazis.

/sarcasm off

 

[Ropey]

Then why do you never tell that to Billo, who constantly compares Israelis to Nazis.

I said there are similarities.

The scapegoating
The propaganda
The acceptance of violence
Treating them like they're sub-human
Laws that make them 2nd class citizens
Ethnically cleansing them from the area​

That shit is all Goebbels's 101.

It's not the Holocaust, it's the years leading up to it.

But if it will make you feel better, no, the Israeli's are not as bad as the Nazis.

Happy now?

^ Gobels 101

Joseph Goebbels - Propaganda Principles

For context.

 

[Picaro]

What's on the shelves in supermarkets in Arab countries, circa 2008:

Found this Arab translation of Hitler's infamous autobiography at the local Safeway. It's really interesting to see the different kinds of political books that the Arabs here are interested in. Most of them (like this one) would be considered WAY extreme back in the states.

ONELOWERLIGHT'S DAILY PHOTO SAFARI

... and some more pics below this one. Jordan is supposedly one of those 'moderate Arab countries' we're always hearing exist, but never see any evidence of this ' the overwhelming majority of Muslims are moderates' meme that always get floated in these threads.

Childrens' books:

ONELOWERLIGHT'S DAILY PHOTO SAFARI

My Heroes: Churchill, Martin Luther King, and...Hitler What do Winston Churchill, Martin Luther King, and Adolf Hitler all have in common? Apparently, some Arab children's book company has made picture book biographies of all three of them. At the book fair, I must have seen a dozen different editions of 'Mein Kempf.' CRAZY.

 

[freedombecki]

Yes. that is right. baptist but not a southern Baptist.
This stupid software insists on capitalizing baptist. That is WRONG. Drives me bananas.

Are Calvinists Baptists? I have a friend born in upstate New York with whom I used to work years ago. She always was a Baptist, and is now attending a Baptist church in Virginian who is all for Israel. She is a good woman belonging to many groups who try to help people such as Pilots for Christ who do good work in Mexico. She would be aghast at someone like you who apparently hates Israel.

Calvin succeeded Martin Luther as leader of Protestantism. His followers developed Protestant religions in several nations as well as Scottish Presbyterianism and English Puritanism.

 

[Vigilante]

 

[aris2chat]

What's on the shelves in supermarkets in Arab countries, circa 2008:

Found this Arab translation of Hitler's infamous autobiography at the local Safeway. It's really interesting to see the different kinds of political books that the Arabs here are interested in. Most of them (like this one) would be considered WAY extreme back in the states.

ONELOWERLIGHT'S DAILY PHOTO SAFARI

... and some more pics below this one. Jordan is supposedly one of those 'moderate Arab countries' we're always hearing exist, but never see any evidence of this ' the overwhelming majority of Muslims are moderates' meme that always get floated in these threads.

Childrens' books:

ONELOWERLIGHT'S DAILY PHOTO SAFARI

My Heroes: Churchill, Martin Luther King, and...Hitler What do Winston Churchill, Martin Luther King, and Adolf Hitler all have in common? Apparently, some Arab children's book company has made picture book biographies of all three of them. At the book fair, I must have seen a dozen different editions of 'Mein Kempf.' CRAZY.

after the quran, the best selling book in the arab speaking world.

 

[Billo_Really]

For context.

That's not "for context".

That's just a bullshit innuendo you're trying to get away with, because you're either too stupid, or too big of a pussy, to see the point I'm making.

 

[Billo_Really]

I'd rather be an anti-Semite, than an Israeli kiss-ass.

 

[Billo_Really]

Not only is the comparison misplaced but also Billo uses Joseph Goebbels (who was the creator of the propaganda and disinformation tactics of the Nazi's) when comparing Israel and the Territories to prewar Germany.

Because the comparison is valid.

So, he's just doing what the Palestinians do when they say that the Jews are attacking themselves to make it appear that the Palestinians are involved.

This statement makes no sense whatsoever!

I know one thing. These Palestinians who are Israeli citizens don't want to leave Israel even if/when there are land swaps.

That doesn't prove there are no laws that makes them 2nd class citizens. And there might be a few Palestinian's in Israel that think that, but the families who are unable to re-unite with their loved ones, because Israel won't let them back into the country, would disagree with you.

I also know that to equate Nazi Germany pre-wwII and Israel/Gaza is disinformation.

Bullshit!

Are you telling me Palestinian's are not constantly trashed 24/7?
Are you telling me they're not blamed for all the problems between them and the Israeli's?
Are you telling me they are not being cleansed from the area?
Are you telling me Israel does not want to be known as the Jewish State?​

You're full of shit, Ropey.

The disinformation Goebbels used was that the Jews were going to take over Germany. The Palestinians attack Israel and say that Israel wants to take them over.

As long as they maintain the occupation, you cannot argue Israel doesn't.

While they could have had their own state and partition in 1948.

No one in their right mind would give 10% of the population, 70% of the land.

Now they have a dream and a fight.

A fight. Not a slaughter. Goebbels 101

It's not a fight, it's not a slaughter, it's slow genocide.

A fight in which both Egypt and Jordan have made peace but the rest of the Arab states have not and remain fighting and as Syria is still in a state of war with Israel (just re-declared a while ago) it's important to maintain a security with Lebanon, Syria and Both the outlying areas of Egypt and Jordan where the Palestinian's various militias have their military organizations also spread out.

Israel doesn't occupy Egypt or Jordan.

It's a fight from declared war and the disinformation is that it's not a fight, it's a holocaust.

This statement makes no sense, either.

Hmmm... reversal of the Billo statement of Israel using Goebbell's strategy on the Palestinians.

A statement that makes no sense, is not a reversal of anything.

But that's ok. Billo isn't as bad as Goebells just as Israel isn't as bad as the Nazis.

/sarcasm off

Fuck off!

 

[Ropey]

Not only is the comparison misplaced but also Billo uses Joseph Goebbels (who was the creator of the propaganda and disinformation tactics of the Nazi's) when comparing Israel and the Territories to prewar Germany.

Because the comparison is valid.

So, he's just doing what the Palestinians do when they say that the Jews are attacking themselves to make it appear that the Palestinians are involved.

This statement makes no sense whatsoever!
That doesn't prove there are no laws that makes them 2nd class citizens. And there might be a few Palestinian's in Israel that think that, but the families who are unable to re-unite with their loved ones, because Israel won't let them back into the country, would disagree with you.
Bullshit!

Are you telling me Palestinian's are not constantly trashed 24/7?
Are you telling me they're not blamed for all the problems between them and the Israeli's?
Are you telling me they are not being cleansed from the area?
Are you telling me Israel does not want to be known as the Jewish State?​

You're full of shit, Ropey.
As long as they maintain the occupation, you cannot argue Israel doesn't.
No one in their right mind would give 10% of the population, 70% of the land.
It's not a fight, it's not a slaughter, it's slow genocide.
Israel doesn't occupy Egypt or Jordan.
This statement makes no sense, either.

Hmmm... reversal of the Billo statement of Israel using Goebbell's strategy on the Palestinians.

A statement that makes no sense, is not a reversal of anything.

But that's ok. Billo isn't as bad as Goebells just as Israel isn't as bad as the Nazis.

/sarcasm off

Fuck off!

Now you're not talking about Goebbels 101?

You've moved on to other things. Palestinians being trashed? These are words.

And I have no doubt you understood the reversal I showed. If you didn't, that's fine.

Ask Sunni Man or Coyote or possibly Amity.

They'll give you the audience you're looking for.



How many Islamic states are there?

57?

I'm sure you can get your support from them as well.

I prefer to fuck on. It's more enjoyable.

 

[Vigilante]

I'd rather be an anti-Semite, than an Israeli kiss-ass.

No, Billo, you're a terrorist loving muslim sympathizer, that refuses to see their inhuman acts of violence and perversion.

 

[docmauser1]

I was fairly sure that some at least were definitively anti-Zionist. So, you know me, I went to You Tube to hear it from orthodox Jews themselves. ... And it doesn't sound like they are having it any easier in Israel than the Palestinians are, actually: ... this is making me want to go watch Ushpizin one of my favorite movies!

Good, now they can move with palistanians to palistan and do their movie watching together, can't they?

 

[Lipush]

That's kind of like saying Israeli parents teach their children to join the IDF in order to kill Pali's.

No, it's not.

First, because parents don't teach their kids to join the IDF. They join the IDF mostly nowdays because the law says so and they feel the need to do it.

Second, we don't poison the minds of kids like you see the Palestinians do

Comparison is misplaced.

Really? How do they get poisoned then?

Attacks on Arabs in Israel prompt soul-searching - CNN.com

Wharton, of the left-wing Meretz party, told CNN Wednesday the statements from Netanyahu and others condemning the violence are welcome -- but the government seems unlikely to take on the deep-rooted issues behind the attacks.

She believes the incidents are a symptom of three highly concerning trends.

"One is a question of racism, which is definitely on the rise in Israel and is very worrisome to, I think, just about everyone except for a worrisome combination of extreme right and extreme religious groups," she said.

A second is the issue of rising violence in Israel, particularly among the younger generation, she said, in contrast to a tradition of low levels of violent crime despite the threat of terrorism.

The third has to do with a growing number of ultra-orthodox youth who drop out of school but whose highly religious education and upbringing have left them unable to adjust to regular society, Wharton said.

"Those kids, they leave these schools and they are suddenly exposed to a whole world they haven't seen before. They don't know how to behave, they get involved in drugs or crime," she said.

At the same time, racism is also increasing in mainstream schools, she said, in part as a by-product of Israel's long history of conflict and the distrust built up following scores of attacks by Palestinian militants.

She believes more must be done in schools to emphasize the need for peaceful coexistence, in line with traditional Jewish values, and to warn against stereotyping and violence.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/21/w...tinians-in-jerusalem.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

http://www.tabletmag.com/scroll/173927/israeli-arrested-for-instigating-beating-of-arabs

Children learn to hate from somewhere - the aren't born that way.

teenages learn to beat up people many times out of boredom. You don't hear five year olds in Israeli say "I'm going to kill Arabs". You see them playing in kindergarten.

You see Palestinian babies dressed up like suicide bombers and 4 year olds saying they want to kill Jews.

In Israel you won't find toddlers dressed up as suicide bombers and 3 years old threatening to kill anyone.

Teenagers attacking? I'm not surprised. You know that kind of crap teenagers do?

 

[Kondor3]

Israelis, disliked by Christians...

Israelis, disliked by Orthodox Jews...

Yadda, yadda, yadda... yap, yap, yap... blah, blah, blah...

How's the latest 'Divide and Conquer' effort going...

By Palestinian-Arab-Muslim operatives, sympathizers and fellow-travelers...

Trying to drive a wedge between America and Israel?

Wake me up when American Public Opinion favoring Israel drops into the cellar, from its present all-time high favoring a continued alliance between the US and Israel.

Honest to God, some of these Amateur Hour -caliber attempts at Divide-and-Conquer are the stuff of great comedy routines.