Let's Drop the Partisan Knee-Jerk Reactions and Look at the Ukraine Negotiations Realistically and Fairly

Oh brother. Joe you’re a statist. You support this shit show that is our government.

There is no dispute by most experts that the US has committed numerous coups, including Iran. The Iranians know it.

You can't have a coup unless someone local is on your side.

That you want to lump in there the fall of the Iron Curtain as coups, just shows how weak your argument is.

So, yes, we pick sides in internal conflicts, and sometimes we pick the wrong side.

So let's look at Iran.

On one side, you had the Shah, who was our ally during the war and willing to work with the west.

On the other side, you had Mossedeqii who was willing to use the Communist Tudeh party as enforcers

So who's side do we take?

The idealistic position is you don't take a side, of course,

The pragmatic one is you pick a side and hope for the best.
 
On another side, we have many liberals accusing Trump of siding with Putin and selling out Ukraine
Do you remember how Ronald Reagan took down the Bolshevik empire – without firing a shot? His key weapon? Oil. As Michael Reagan put it, "He did it without firing a shot, as we know, but he had a super weapon -- oil.

Now, President Trump aims to cut global oil prices, specifically targeting putin's Urals 🇷🇺crude, potentially driving it below $30. The implications are clear: the Moscow empire might not survive his term.

Back in the 1980s, a similar strategy played out. Saudi Arabia ramped up oil production from 2 million to 10 million barrels per day. This flooded the market, causing prices to plummet from $32 to $10 a barrel. For Bolshevik empire , heavily reliant on high oil revenues, this was a devastating blow. In 1986 alone, they lost over $20 billion – about 7.5% of their annual income – and their budget was already in deficit.
While this hurt Saudi Arabia's economy in the short term, it appears the US provided financial backing. As one source suggests, then-CIA Director Casey offered financial reparations to the Saudis. This is supported by the fact that in 1986, 80% of Saudi oil was sold through American companies like Exxon, Mobil, Texaco, and Chevron.
The result was that the Bolshevik empire was plunged into a deep recession. The already fragile, centrally planned Bolshevik empire´s economy couldn't handle the shock. The USSR's foreign debt soared from $30 billion in 1986 to $50 billion by 1989.
Eventually, oil prices recovered, reaching profitability for Saudi Arabia in the early 2000s. But by then, they had likely amassed substantial sovereign wealth funds from the high-price 1970s. The US, meanwhile, profited handsomely. In 1986, gas stations in America were practically giving away gasoline as a promotion.
This oil price collapse was a major factor in the US victory in the Cold War. The resulting economic hardship forced Bolshevik mafia boss Mikhail Gorbachev to make unpopular political concessions. His attempts at reform (his empire ) were doomed by a lack of funds. Gorbachev's rhetoric fell flat with an increasingly impoverished population, who demanded accountability. This paved the way for anti-colonial harsh criticism of the entire Bolshevik imperial system. By the late 1980s, the collapse of the Bolshevik empire was inevitable.

Many people don't grasp the strategic game that Trump, like Reagan, is playing against putin´s Moscow empire. Today, Brent crude is around $62 a barrel, while Urals is much cheaper. And as reported before, "Saudi Arabia is ready to reduce oil prices to $50." AND always Remember, the USSR's imperial economy collapsed when oil prices fell to $15-23 a barrel, and the Moscow 🇷🇺 empire's budget is unsustainable below $42.4.

This is essentially Trump's peace plan. :thup:
Without 🇷🇺 Moscow support, Iran would be neutered, which, in turn, pulls the rug out from under Hezbollah, Houthis, and Hamas. All roads lead to Moscow🇷🇺 empire decolonization ...




 
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You can't have a coup unless someone local is on your side.

That you want to lump in there the fall of the Iron Curtain as coups, just shows how weak your argument is.

So, yes, we pick sides in internal conflicts, and sometimes we pick the wrong side.

So let's look at Iran.

On one side, you had the Shah, who was our ally during the war and willing to work with the west.

On the other side, you had Mossedeqii who was willing to use the Communist Tudeh party as enforcers

So who's side do we take?

The idealistic position is you don't take a side, of course,

The pragmatic one is you pick a side and hope for the best.
So you support the USG overthrowing democratically elected governments if it benefits big oil companies. Got it. :uhoh3: :spinner::fu:
 
So you support the USG overthrowing democratically elected governments if it benefits big oil companies. Got it.

Mossedequi wasn't "Democratically elected", he was appointed by a parliament that he dissolved.

And the big oil companies hardly "Benefited", as the first thing the Shah did was break BP's monopoly and negotiate a new deal that gave Iran a larger share of the profits. (Which the Shah used to fund his modernization programs that upset the Ayatollahs so much.)

That said, no, we shouldn't have gotten involved, but hindsight is always 20/20.
 
So you support the USG overthrowing democratically elected governments if it benefits big oil companies. Got it. :uhoh3: :spinner::fu:
Winco asked me about how civics is taught. Not at all Winco. See ⬆️ ⬆️
 
Mossedequi wasn't "Democratically elected", he was appointed by a parliament that he dissolved.

And the big oil companies hardly "Benefited", as the first thing the Shah did was break BP's monopoly and negotiate a new deal that gave Iran a larger share of the profits. (Which the Shah used to fund his modernization programs that upset the Ayatollahs so much.)

That said, no, we shouldn't have gotten involved, but hindsight is always 20/20.
Are you lying or merely uninformed?

He was democratically elected! He had overwhelming support of the Iranian people.
Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh was nominated for the position of Prime Minister, which he won by votes of nearly 90% of the representatives present.
Meanwhile, the British continued to undermine Mossadegh’s authority by inciting division in the country, tightening the worldwide embargo on the purchase of Iranian oil and freezing Iranian assets. When all attempts failed, Britain concluded that ‘Mossadegh must go’ by any means necessary. Working jointly with the American CIA, they plotted a coup to overthrow his democratically elected government.
In 1953, he was overthrown by a British-American coup, arrested and tried as a traitor in military tribunal court. It was the CIA’s first successful dismantling of a foreign government, and Iran has not known democracy since.
Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh Biography | Prime Minister of Iran (1951-1953)


He planned to nationalize Iranian oil. For this, the UK and US worked swiftly to destroy him and succeeded. It’s an old strategy repeated many times by the CIA and other US government agencies, and all for the benefit of huge multinational corporations owned by billionaires.
 
In all 24 pages nobody has mentioned that Russia/China/the Brics has the capability to stop and turn back a US assault on Russia/China/ or Iran.

What's the point of a one-sided debate that's meant to build confidence in America's might?

For a real debate contact me for an appointment via p.m. (for time and topic)
 
In all 24 pages nobody has mentioned that Russia/China/the Brics has the capability to stop and turn back a US assault on Russia/China/ or Iran.

What's the point of a one-sided debate that's meant to build confidence in America's might?

For a real debate contact me for an appointment via p.m. (for time and topic)
Visualise Moscow, other major cities in Russia as rubble.
 
A lot like trump, Robert W just makes stuff up and thinks it's true.
That old man really confuses me, I can only imaging the whirlwind between his ears.
Yeah not much upstairs for Robbie.

He’s either 12 years old or an 86 year old virgin. ;)
 
A war criminal and a traitor.
1748451112070.webp
 
A lot like trump, Robert W just makes stuff up and thinks it's true.
That old man really confuses me, I can only imaging the whirlwind between his ears.
Winco just makes stuff up and thinks it's true. Winco is so used to being wrong he thinks what is correct is wrong.
 
In all 24 pages nobody has mentioned that Russia/China/the Brics has the capability to stop and turn back a US assault on Russia/China/ or Iran.

What's the point of a one-sided debate that's meant to build confidence in America's might?

For a real debate contact me for an appointment via p.m. (for time and topic)

No, nobody mentions that, and if that's what they are telling you on the Troll Farm, then they are lying to you.
 
Are you lying or merely uninformed?

He was democratically elected! He had overwhelming support of the Iranian people.
Dr. Mohammad Mossadegh was nominated for the position of Prime Minister, which he won by votes of nearly 90% of the representatives present.

Election by parliament isn't the same as a democratic election. The 1952 elections were kind of a farce. The Commie Tudeh party won the second highest number of votes and didn't gain a single seat. Meanwhile, the largest bloc was the British/Royalist block.

All of which was meaningless when Mossdegh disbanded parliament.

Meanwhile, the British continued to undermine Mossadegh’s authority by inciting division in the country, tightening the worldwide embargo on the purchase of Iranian oil and freezing Iranian assets. When all attempts failed, Britain concluded that ‘Mossadegh must go’ by any means necessary. Working jointly with the American CIA, they plotted a coup to overthrow his democratically elected government.
In 1953, he was overthrown by a British-American coup, arrested and tried as a traitor in military tribunal court. It was the CIA’s first successful dismantling of a foreign government, and Iran has not known democracy since.

They didn't know it before then, either.


He planned to nationalize Iranian oil. For this, the UK and US worked swiftly to destroy him and succeeded. It’s an old strategy repeated many times by the CIA and other US government agencies, and all for the benefit of huge multinational corporations owned by billionaires.

So he basically Fucked Around and Found Out.
 
Visualise Moscow, other major cities in Russia as rubble.
Moscow is expendable. Napoleon had it burned down back in 1812, but he lost the war. America, if really determined, may burn it down, too. But in this case America will lose at least 50% of population if unconditionally surrender after the first Russian counter-value strike and more than 90% if not. In practical terms Russia definitely has an upper hand in the nuclear war.
 
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