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Let's just put it this way DBS, employers are not going to hire new employees if they foresee the cost of maintaining employees is going to double or even triple in 2014.
And forgive me for the attitude, DBS and Sallow, someone definitely pissed in my Corn Flakes this morning. I'm pissed at the entire world.
Immie
I'd like one of the Barking Moonbats to explain this:
For months and months, we've been hearing that the original Stimulus failed because $800B was not enough to Stimulate The Economy.
Now Obama is proposing basically the same set of programs for about half the amount.
If $800B wasn't enough, how is $450B now going to make any difference?
Pass the bill we have to pass the bill .... 17 times
code word for I watch FOX news, an entertainment channel. saw this coming a mile away, next!
Let's just put it this way DBS, employers are not going to hire new employees if they foresee the cost of maintaining employees is going to double or even triple in 2014.
True. I know I wouldn't hire in that situation. But we aren't in that situation. There is nothing on the books that will cause the cost of maintaining employees to jump by that much in that short amount of time. If there is, no one on these boards or on Fox News has ever shown it. They just claim it will happen and then leave it at that. Sorry, but I need proof.
You made the distinction between "Political" and "Solutions", casting Political as a negative. I think it was both. A Political speech and a Solutions speech.
Personally, I like when a person likes their job. They do it better. Because they are doing something they enjoy. I don't like it when a politician casts government as evil or politicians as "self serving". Those people really should find another line of work.
Well in the context of a joint session of congress he should have had a specific plan laid out instead of more rhetoric. That is what my comments were based on.
I have no more of an idea today as to what Obama's actual plan is then I did yesterday morning when I woke up. He didn't tell me anything new in the speech, it was more of the same stuff we have been hearing for years (from both sides).
I was just hoping he would say "I'm going to make this tax this percent, i'm going to get the reneue by increasing this specific tax and cutting this specific program, these are the numbers from doing so and the full plan will be available at whitehouse.gov for the american people to read over themselves"
All I got was "agree with me or you dont want to create jobs and you want to fire teachers" ok ok i oversimplified it but that was the general tone as I watched it.
This wasn't that type of speech..you are right.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLrrBs8JBQo]Braveheart In Defiance Of The English Tyranny! BRAVO - YouTube[/ame]
It was that type of speech.
It was saying we have a huge problem..and we have to come together to solve it.
We cannot keep going on with all of these entitlement programs, especially giving it to people who never paid into them, it's not sustainable, we have to reel in this reckless spending, and it's simply not being done, as is proof of the presidents request to spend another half trillion dollars.
look bucko, I just left Iraq and we have spent far more there and listen to you, like its the end of the world to help or own peoples. Shame on you man. You should have gone ape shit years ago, you did not so its sort of hard to not take you as political type. I just laugh at the people who want to point at the poor in this nation, well guess what dude im over here protecting their freedom, you should be doing the same and stop acting like a fool.
god belss America.
Sorry, it was a bit hyperbolic. I have to chalk it up to complete and utter frustration on the job front.
But, the fact is, that people are not hiring and one reason is that they don't know what the ACA is going to cost them. There is also a general attitude in Washington to screw small business employers and the middle class. My entire career has been in small business accounting. I send dozens of resumes out every week and if I get lucky and hear from an employer, I get told that they received over 500 resumes for one fuc... um, every job.
Employers are not hiring and things are not going to change because of President Obama's American Jobs Act which is in his head alone; not even down on paper yet. There were some ideas even some good ideas, but nothing that is going to work.
I'm frustrated. I don't think Obama can do the job. And even more frustrating is that there isn't a Republican in the mix that will do any better than President Obama.
And again... someone pissed in my Corn Flakes this morning.
Immie
But thats just it, he was being divisive by his "agree to my plan if you want to keep teachers working" and by inserting rhetoric about taxes going up on people. Both of those things put the other side of the political spectrum in a bad spot and are not how you behave if your truly looking for cooperation.
Like O'reilly said in this clip I was just watching
Bill O'Reilly vs. White House Spox Jay Carney over '' The American Jobs Act'' - YouTube
I watched the speech in its entirety. Let me preface this by saying that from the beginning I wanted President Obama (just for you Sallow) to succeed. If he had succeeded, we would all succeed. A rising tide lifts ALL boats, not just some. He did not succeed because he is more concerned with an ideology than with common sense business approaches. I agree that the tax incentives for small businesses will HELP, but it will not fix the situation. If you hire someone at minimum wage, it costs you $30,000 a year. How is a $4,000 tax break going to compensate when we haven't even addressed the penalties coming for Obamacare?
Small businesses are being drowned in red tape. I truly agree that it would not be helpful to completely do away with some regulations, such as levels of mercury that President Obama highlighted, but it would be helpful to eradicate those regulations that are strangling small businesses. I got out because I spent more money complying with federal regulations than in just doing my business. I saw nothing last night that makes me believe that it will change. At coffee this morning, none of my acquaintences who own businesses saw anything that makes them believe otherwise either. Those that can hire will not. Still the "wait and see" attitude.
I have to ask my friends on the left, which government agency is it that creates those jobs we need? The answer my friends is NONE. Government does NOT create jobs and I really get the impression that the left does not understand that simple fact. You have to REMOVE roadblocks. You have to REMOVE the belief, whether deserved or not, that President Obama and his administration wants to punish small business owners. I am here to tell you that in "fly over" country the belief still exists this morning that the only solution will be a change in leadership. He (President Obama) has spent his political capital on previous ideas that will and have hurt small businesses and he is not willing to change or even discuss those issues.
I am glad that those of you on the left were so impressed. But naturally, YOU don't run a small business. We do and we do not see a change in attitude nor a change in direction. Enact the jobs bill and I can guarantee that nothing will change. Sad, but true...
I do, and growing to boot. I can honestly say that regulation is not the problem, and I'm in one of the most heavily regulated industries you can fathom. The problem is a shitty economy in general; Not only are sales slow, but you have to work extra hard to get them, and everybody wants a deal. This stems from the consumer level. The retail store slashes prices to encourage broke-ass people to buy their products, then pass along the price cut to the wholesaler who passes it on the the manufacturer/distributor (ME.)
A tax incentive would more than likely spark me to hire another person here, but really only because I'm on the fence about doing it anyway. (FYI a minimum wage employee working 40 hours a week would make only about half of what you say; Not that you can get anyone decent to work for minimum wage anyway).
The bigger picture here is that when people get back to work, everyone benefits - Consumers have more money to spend, businesses have more demand, and the government gets more revenues, even at the same tax rate. I think that multiplier is the ultimate hope for a proposal such as this one.
A minimum wage employee only MAKES half of what I said, but when you take into account the taxes you pay for them working for you, insurance, facilities, HR costs, etc., if you figure it out completely, it comes to around $30,000 a year. YOU pay for far more than just salary my friend. And do you know how Obamacare will affect that bottom line? No, I don't either. I know that my taxes and insurance is going to go up, but no one can tell me how much or anything else about it.
If you feel that this program proposed by the President is going to benefit you, then I think you should hire some more employees. My business involved IT. A lot of my friends are in manufacturing and service industries such as cleaning, etc. They are not convinced. I can't say as I blame them. I actually hope you are right. But I doubt it.
I do, and growing to boot. I can honestly say that regulation is not the problem, and I'm in one of the most heavily regulated industries you can fathom. The problem is a shitty economy in general; Not only are sales slow, but you have to work extra hard to get them, and everybody wants a deal. This stems from the consumer level. The retail store slashes prices to encourage broke-ass people to buy their products, then pass along the price cut to the wholesaler who passes it on the the manufacturer/distributor (ME.)
A tax incentive would more than likely spark me to hire another person here, but really only because I'm on the fence about doing it anyway. (FYI a minimum wage employee working 40 hours a week would make only about half of what you say; Not that you can get anyone decent to work for minimum wage anyway).
The bigger picture here is that when people get back to work, everyone benefits - Consumers have more money to spend, businesses have more demand, and the government gets more revenues, even at the same tax rate. I think that multiplier is the ultimate hope for a proposal such as this one.
A minimum wage employee only MAKES half of what I said, but when you take into account the taxes you pay for them working for you, insurance, facilities, HR costs, etc., if you figure it out completely, it comes to around $30,000 a year. YOU pay for far more than just salary my friend. And do you know how Obamacare will affect that bottom line? No, I don't either. I know that my taxes and insurance is going to go up, but no one can tell me how much or anything else about it.
If you feel that this program proposed by the President is going to benefit you, then I think you should hire some more employees. My business involved IT. A lot of my friends are in manufacturing and service industries such as cleaning, etc. They are not convinced. I can't say as I blame them. I actually hope you are right. But I doubt it.
Economics are a funny thing. If this bill passes, and people think it will work, it will work. If they don't think it will work, they'll be right on that count as well.
...as usual! Another wasted expenditure of about a half trillion dollars that will do little if anything to boost the economy and add jobs.
It's the uninformed, uneducated Obama worshiping numbnuts that believe him when he says those "fortunate" rich people are not already paying their fair share.
It's the same uninformed, uneducated Obama worshiping numbnuts that believe him when he says corporations don't pay their fair share of taxes. Get this straight, you brain dead liberals...CORPORATIONS DO NOT PAY INCOME TAX....CUSTOMERS OF CORPORATIONS PAY HIGHER PRICES TO COVER ALL TAXES LEVIED ON THE CORPORATIONS!
My God! How damn dense can you people get?
Obama's Jumbo Jobs Plan is nothing more than a spending effort...another soon-to-be failed STIMULUS PLAN.
The economy would be far better stimulated if corporate income taxes were REDUCED!!
Business investors are waiting on some long term certainty about what the rules of the games will be. They are sitting on trillions of dollars of money that would be invested in business growth (creating jobs) if there was more certainty about the future.
As usual, Big Daddy Government wants to spend the money on what it wants rather than allow the people to spend it on what they want.
Obama's speech was nothing unexpected...pure political rhetoric, laced with lies and deceptions.
That's partly because you would not be interested in anyone that has an R next to their name. not going happen, the only democrat is going to be Obama and that's that.Sallow is not a bad guy, but he seems almost desperate in his attempt to "Keep Hope Alive" this morning.
Immie
I would do the same.
But I never believed in Obama as the man who was taking America to another level.
So I am not disappointed that he hasnt.
But so many people truly beleived in the man.....the disappointment must be devastating.
I am definitely disappointed overall in his inability to stand up and fight for what he claims to believe in/want. However I am even more disappointed that there doesn't seem to be a better candidate out there for 2012. Now THAT is disappointing.
Ame®icano;4115554 said:I thought the speech was good, but it doesn't stand a ground.
In reality he is demanding from all of us, including Congress, to band over and agree with him long before his plan is even written. Does Congress has to pas this bill in order to find out what's in it too?
And that's not what happened.
What happened was that President Obama did something that was sort of expected, but he did it well. What he did was, yet again, challenge to the Republican party to become the responsible party it once was. He challenged them to start governing in a manner that is not lunacy.
Look. President Obama won the Presidential election, and by a count greater then his predecessor. And what happened was the opposing party simply didn't accept that. They wanted to nullify the election. And by in large, they've been pretty successful. And a large part of that is because of bigotry and racism. It's not the sort of racism of 50 years ago..but it is very prevalent. Michele Bachmann is a prime example. She not a fire breathing, "let's lynch them", type. Quite the contrary. She accepts the fact that we are a multi-cultural society..just she doesn't view other cultures as "equal". She's actually said this. And this is the "soft" bigotry and racism that now is really a part of the culture of both American Conservatism and the Republican party. They have no trouble with people of other cultures and racism so long as they know their "place". And it's an abomination that a fellow who's skin is not white sits in the White House.
I'm sure President Obama is starting to get this. But he hasn't given up on the notion of working together. However, simply asking to work together is not going to work. So he challenged them. And very publicly. It was a politically masterful thing to do. But in either case, Republicans working with him or not, he will be perceived as the one who set the agenda and tried.
? why is it bigotry to call the American culture superior? It is superior. If I thought Russian, England or China had a better superior culture I would go there. They don't and it is not bigotry to be proud of the culture you belong to or to believe that it is superior. This is another sad attempt to paint racism when there was nothing racist in those comments. Stop, it is sad.It was saying we have a huge problem..and we have to come together to solve it.
Except there were no solutions presented. Just vague generalities and a demand that his plan be passed immediately.You made the distinction between "Political" and "Solutions", casting Political as a negative. I think it was both. A Political speech and a Solutions speech.
And now you admit the truth that all you want is a catch 22 for the republicans so that BO can get reelected, something that this is squarely meant to help with. Too bad that is not going to fly. If the republicans do not pass that bill I doubt it will be bad for them. His speech outlined old ideas that have been tried. People are tired of the same old same old bullshit and are not going to give BO a pass on pushing the same crap that is not getting results.This was the last olive branch.
It was well played. This is a marathon effort not a sprint. He's set himself up to look good regardless of what congress does.
I guess he was tone deaf to the 2010 elections, because here he goes again wanting to spend more money. You guys take it for what you want, but I can promise you this, if this bill passes there are going to be a whole lot of politicians out of work in 2012, and that's from both sides of the isle. All this bill is is a chance for politicians in need of campaign funds to line their campaigns with this money, very little will go to what it is supposed to go towards, for an example look at the 800 billion stimulus, we still have no idea where 300 billion of it went to, and now they are asking for another 400 billion in spending. I dont think so. It wont pass congress and the left will say this is the reason the economy is bad, and people like truth matters will actually believe it.
Bingo.
One thing that he is finally getting to. Ill agree on this and give him some credit for finally starting in Iraq. Afghanistan is not ready for withdrawal though and the only thing that is worse than a never ending quagmire is to leave the job unfinished.Getting back on the right track is the desire of us all. How we do it seems to be the delimma. Any useful suggestions?
Aside from what the President proposed?
I'll bite:
-Get out of Afghanistan and Iraq. We've killed enough people. I think they got the memo.
Agree completely but this is another thing that he has done nothing on at all.-Stop the ridiculous war on drugs. Legalize Marijuana. Would be a great revenue stream.
?-Encourage "work sharing" instead of layoffs.
LOL. Again, I agree completely here but did you not get the memo where he basically destroyed that idea. Never going to happen with BO in the office. I can only surmise that he hates science as there is nothing that he has done to further its pursuit but plenty to stop it...-Ramp up the space program. Heck we have a lot of out of work techies. What better way to use them then to put up a moon station.
!!!! Another thing that BO has completely missed the train on.-Build nuclear plants and get up to speed on our energy grid to incorporate new forms of energy.
Now here, we agree completely and this fuckup was started by the right. The left has only recently bought off on this idea of complete free trade and I fail to understand why? I would only add that targeting China alone is not smart. We need to address all OUR TRADING PARTNERS. Many should be completely open and free. Those nations that are free like Brittan, Germany, Italy and other major allies. Others like India, China, Indonesia and the rest of the 3rd world are a different matter. I am completely willing to give up my cheap shit for a stronger country.-Introduce tariffs to Chinese imports. They wanna play currency games? Fuck em.
That is insane. It is not going to help anything.-Encourage banks to restructure mortgages. They are under investigation right now. We could call it an "out of court" settlement. Probably a lot cheaper way to go on both sides.
They already did the last one on many levels. You're not going to get more out of that tree.-Freeze government worker salaries for a couple of years. The trade off would be no layoffs.
That's a quick and dirty.
Been shown to you a million times. The last thread I engaged you on it, you ran. I know you are more intelligent than that but please stop denying that it has not been addressed. You may disagree but I still feel the facts are not on your side. Until it is shown to those of us that believe the stimulus failed we may never agree on this but don't say they are whining about it when there has been points brought to the table.Or new ones are created. Ones that can't leave the country.2) Jobs are gone and this country cannot recover until those jobs come back.
5) I have a problem with a President who promoted a health care bill and stimulus plan that destroyed the economy
This is getting old. If you guys can't show how Obama's plans "destroyed" the economy, then quit whining about it.
September 9, 2011 3:37 pm
Wall Street down after Obama speech
