Dems 0 for 3 today.

[task0778]

If they ever pass the HR1 or some variation of the same, the trust in elections will be at an end. The choice then will be to simply accept the single-party rule that the Dems want so badly OR to push for a secessionist movement to separate the states OR, to have individuals simply refuse to obey laws coming out of DC. The last one may seem impossible but in our modern age of communication, very large groups could simply refuse to obey and governments would have no real way to punish or sanction them effectively.

Well, I'd like to think that even if they passed their voting laws they would get voted out of office anyway, cuz I am confident that they will always overreach and go too far and pay for it in the next elections. Like I think they will in 2022 and 2024.

First of all, it is possible if not likely that some or maybe most of the crap that they want to change will be struck down by the Supreme Court, and what's left can be changed back to what it was or better. I would expect a litany of lawsuits filed by red states charging violations of the 10th Amendment and other laws.

What I was so worried about was the filibuster, I really do not want to see that disappear.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Bring back the rule that they had to speak at the podium for the length or their filibuster. Make the monkeys dance for their employers again. I'd support this under republican governance as well.

That's just a waste of time. The bill is going to get 60 votes for cloture or it will not pass.

 

[OKTexas]

This means that despite the need to pander to their base, they were unwilling to lead this nation into conflict from which we might lose the country. This is NOT hyperbole. If either side changed the rules on a single vote and that led to the widespread loss of trust in the vote, it would signal the beginning of the end. That's why the rhetoric coming from Schumer and his minions is effing EVIL.

I agree completely.

.

 

[task0778]

That's just a waste of time. The bill is going to get 60 votes for cloture or it will not pass.

Not sure you understand that the democrats' proposed rule change would give opposing senators 2 times to speak for as long as they want but when they're done it would only take a simple majority to end debate (cloture), NOT 60. And it only takes a simple majority to pass the bill once the debate is over. From the OP's link:

The tweak would have required a so-called talking filibuster only for the voting rights bills, forcing GOP senators to actively speak on the Senate floor to block the legislation rather than withhold their support in a vote. If all senators used up their speeches – each would be allowed up to two speeches, with no time limit – the chamber could pass the proposals with a simple majority.

Added: I see that the democrats made their proposal only for their voting rights bill, as if once it's done they or the GOP could do the same thing for any bill they want to pass.

 

[Augustine_]

That's just a waste of time. The bill is going to get 60 votes for cloture or it will not pass.

A waste of time? These people are off 200 days a year and have wealth beyond most Americans wildest dreams. Few people have more time.

 

[San Souci]

Right now, I'd say the Biddum Administration, the DNC and the whole democrat party are essentially bankrupt, demoralized, completely failed, out of answers, and nearly belly up.

If they have any dignity left at all, they will take their lives and end the humiliation.



View attachment 590288

Or they could all move to Cuba.

 

[Esdraelon]

Mitch: this is the most important day in the history of the Senate. this is a plot to break the Senate!

He's a partisan hack like most of the rest of them there BUT he's telling the essential truth about that institution. IF America is to survive much longer, people like Manchin and Sinema will need to be elected on a larger scale. I don't think of them as perfect or selfless but in this instance, they literally SAVED this nation for a little while longer.

 

[toobfreak]

Or they could all move to Cuba.

Cuba won't have them either.

 

[FA_Q2]

I actually think we avoided a fate much worse. If only that can be sustained.

.

A fate much worse how?

 

[Esdraelon]

Maybe it is inevitable that one day the filibuster will be destroyed and whichever party is in the majority will do everything they can to keep it that way.

Since we know these people aren't actually ignorant of the cost of what they do and that changing these rules would only benefit them for a short while, one has to believe that either they are simply incapable of compromise and are stupid enough to knowingly burn down their own party OR they actually believe the people are so stupid or apathetic that they'd just cower when the Left used a strategy that would guarantee the power would never again shift due to the built-in ability to cheat elections. The Dems realize they cannot win with their policies so they want to steal the power and never return it.

 

[OKTexas]

Well, I'd like to think that even if they passed their voting laws they would get voted out of office anyway, cuz I am confident that they will always overreach and go too far and pay for it in the next elections. Like I think they will in 2022 and 2024.

First of all, it is possible if not likely that some or maybe most of the crap that they want to change will be struck down by the Supreme Court, and what's left can be changed back to what it was or better. I would expect a litany of lawsuits filed by red states charging violations of the 10th Amendment and other laws.

What I was so worried about was the filibuster, I really do not want to see that disappear.

It would take years to get challenges before the supremes. That would allow their scams to effect the next two elections.

.

 

[task0778]

The Dems realize they cannot win with their policies so they want to steal the power and never return it.

My thinking is that they actually do believe they can win with their policies if they can implement them unimpeded by the GOP. After what happened in the Virgina election, they doubled down. They didn't backtrack at all, it looks like they think they should keep moving further Left. Which is kinda scary, are they that out of touch with the American people? I saw a recent Gallup poll within the last couple of days that showed the democrats losing ground in 2021:

A new Gallup poll shows that Democrats went from having a 9-point advantage in the first quarter of 2021 to Republicans having a 5-point advantage in the fourth quarter. That’s a 14-point swing!
.
.
Gallup’s latest polling data show a party preference advantage for Republicans over Democrats in Q4 2021, but the bigger finding from Gallup is that 42% of Americans now identify as independent, while neither the Democratic Party nor the Republican Party reaches 30% support.

Regardless of which party has an advantage in party affiliation, over the past three decades, presidential elections have generally been competitive, and party control of the U.S. House of Representatives and Senate has changed hands numerous times. This is partly because neither party can claim a very high share of core supporters -- those who identify with the party -- as the largest proportion of Americans identify initially as political independents.

Overall in 2021, an average of 29% of Americans identified as Democrats, 27% as Republicans and 42% as independents. Roughly equal proportions of independents leaned to the Democratic Party (17%) and to the Republican Party (16%).

U.S. Political Party Preferences Shifted Greatly During 2021

Although the U.S. political party affiliation average for 2021 was similar to prior years, the country shifted from a nine-point Democratic preference early in the year to a five-point Republican advantage near the end.

news.gallup.com

It doesn't look to me like the democrats' agenda is winning hearts and minds.

 

[Esdraelon]

A fate much worse how?

By refusing to ram through legislation that would forever change this nation and ruin trust in elections, all on a tiebreaker vote. If you think my words are hyperbole, stop just a moment and look at this situation from the mirror image. If the Republicans were attempting to ram through a law that would give them the unfair advantage of always being able to win every election, how would YOU react? Imagine that this kind of law was passed in this way and you were thoroughly convinced that it diluted or nullified your vote at the whim of the opposition party. Would you be willing to sit for that? Would you obey laws that were passed by representatives that you felt were unfairly elected or signed by a president that you considered illegitimate?

That last condition we already have the answer for. The Left refused to accept the election result of 2016 and they used all means, legal or illegal to deny the votes of half their countrymen. Several blue states simply ignored the Constitution and imposed their own rules on the national laws on immigration. So-called "sanctuary states" just ignored Trump's EOs even when it was settled law that the POTUS' power to protect against illegal immigration was absolute. How will you react if the Right were to do the same with abortion rights or welfare reform?

 

[task0778]

It would take years to get challenges before the supremes. That would allow their scams to effect the next two elections.

.

I'd bet money the Courts would put a hold on those laws and I think the courts would expedite the challenges to those laws. I highly doubt the democrats are going to win anyway in 2022.

 

[Esdraelon]

After what happened in the Virgina election, they doubled down. They didn't backtrack at all, it looks like they think they should keep moving further Left.

This is another strong indication that they believe they will not pay a consequence of losing power. If they thought they'd be drummed out in 2 years and then those rules they put in place were going to potentially keep THEM out of power indefinitely, there's no way they'd be pushing for this.
The rhetoric coming from the Left is preparing their voters to think in terms of having to "fight like hell" ( gee, sounds familiar) or they will lose their "democracy". The Dems are nearly in lockstep in creating the perception that the nation is being destroyed by Republicans being Fascists. There's no way this is organic or well-intentioned. Someone is trying to set this nation on fire.

 

[Esdraelon]

I'd bet money the Courts would put a hold on those laws and I think the courts would expedite the challenges to those laws. I highly doubt the democrats are going to win anyway in 2022.

Their "election reform" would make it quite easy for them to leave the impression that they'd won. Since the media back everything they've said about 2020, why WOULDN'T they do it again?

 

[OKTexas]

A fate much worse how?

The possibility of civil war. People are getting tired of the commies trying to run roughshod over the country with an evenly divided senate. Had they succeeded on this you can bet they would be back for another bite at the marxist BBB using the same crap.

.

 

[MarathonMike]

No fed take over of elections and no change to fillibuster.

Senate Republicans block voting rights bills, join with two Democrats to prevent filibuster change

Senate Republicans blocked two voting rights bills, while Democrats Sinema and Manchin joined the GOP in opposing filibuster rule changes.

www.cnbc.com

.

The Democrats just love wasting our time and tax money on their stupid shit. They care about NOTHING except that which helps them achieve perpetual One Party Rule. They are truly disgusting creatures.

 

[task0778]

The possibility of civil war. People are getting tired of the commies trying to run roughshod over the country with an evenly divided senate. Had they succeeded on this you can bet they would be back for another bite at the marxist BBB using the same crap.

.

I believe Biden and the Dems will reach some agreement with Manchin and Sinema and pass a watered-down version of the BBB in the next few months. My only question is whether the Far Left will accept whatever it is, or will they revolt and not support it. And thereby kill the damn thing. I tell ya what, the democrats would get absolutely killed in November if that happens. OTOH, I think they're going to get killed anyway even if they do pass something.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Not sure you understand that the democrats' proposed rule change would give opposing senators 2 times to speak for as long as they want but when they're done it would only take a simple majority to end debate (cloture), NOT 60. And it only takes a simple majority to pass the bill once the debate is over. From the OP's link:

The tweak would have required a so-called talking filibuster only for the voting rights bills, forcing GOP senators to actively speak on the Senate floor to block the legislation rather than withhold their support in a vote. If all senators used up their speeches – each would be allowed up to two speeches, with no time limit – the chamber could pass the proposals with a simple majority.

Added: I see that the democrats made their proposal only for their voting rights bill, as if once it's done they or the GOP could do the same thing for any bill they want to pass.

You apparently didn't read my post, or the one I quoted. I was responding about the "speaking until you fell down" filibuster.

I knew all of those details weeks ago,