Why is this Race Even Close?

[BlackAsCoal]

Thatta boy Ray.

The GOP worked their magic on BAC when they created the FISA issue.

No brother .. the system worked it's magic on you. Obama did not have to agree with Bush on this issue to get elected.

Same when they tried to create that controvery in Georgia/Russia.

BINGO .. they got you again.

Who do you think proposed a ONE BILLION DOLLAR payoff to the president of Georgia for his treachery in STARTING a conflict with Russia he knew he would lose in about 5 minutes and would cost the lives of many of his own people?

Biden calls for $1 billion in emergency aid to Georgia
The Crypt: Biden calls for $1 billion in emergency aid to Georgia - Politico.com

Bush is following the OBAMA/BIDEN PLAN

.. and guess what, the day after Biden proposed it, Obama picked his as VP.

Here's the clue you should be paying attention to .. As Rove was Bush's brain, Zbigniew Brzezinski is Obama's brain on foreign policy. Now put this together .. Zbigniew Brzezinski + Russia + Georgia + Afghanistan + Pakistan .. putting that together would tell you a far different story than the one you're hearing.

Or when Bush came up with the bailout, 75% of the GOP voted against it and somehow the Dems look like it was their puppy.

That doesn't help your case

Sorry BAC, but you've been played by the right.

As I've just demonstrated my brother .. one of us has indeed been played.

But as long as he isn't voting for McCain, that's cool with me. I just hope he isn't in a swing state.

BAC, where are you from?

I'm from Detroit, but I live in Atlanta

 

[Jon]

Calling Obama a Marxist is no further a stretch than calling McCain Bush-lite.

 

[sealybobo]

There's the answer. The gullible really believe this shit. The propagandists know it's crap but they're hoping people believe it and believe it they do. Even though it's clear that Obama is a right wing capitalist, albeit with a conscience, he is apparently a Marxist. I saw vox pop by our national tv broadcaster in Pennsylvania, people were banging on about Obama being a Marxist, a Muslim and how he was going to take away the guns that were needed to defeat an invasion of the US. Those were real people who firmly believed what they were saying.

This is why it's close and this is why Obama can lose.

And I didn't say Obama's perfect. He's as close as you are going to get though.

And fuck the morons who voted for Bush because they could drink a beer with him. Ultimately, that's how they made their decision. Now they want to get all phylisophical about socialism and marxism?

 

[sealybobo]

Calling Obama a Marxist is no further a stretch than calling McCain Bush-lite.

No, because McCain voted with Bush 92% of the time. The times he voted against Bush:

DeLay allowed centrist or moderately conservative Republicans to take turns voting against controversial bills. If a representative said that a bill was unpopular in his district, then DeLay would ask him to vote for it only if his vote were necessary for passage; if his vote were not needed, then the representative would be able to vote against the party without reprisal.[citation needed]

Tom DeLay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

OR, McCain has flipped on a lot of issues. One being torture. He fought Bush on torture but ultimately caved in.

 

[Diuretic]

Ya, I don't want to vote for someone who has socialistic or Marxist ideas. Hell, I don't even want to vote for someone who might have the knowledge to know the true meaning of what it means. Cause I mean, if they know what it really means, then they know how to make it happen!

I'm going to stick to my faith and principles Thank You Very Much. I don't care if Obama policies are better for me economically.

Then you can vote for Obama if you wish. He is a Christian, he is a capitalist. He is not even midly Left, let alone Marxist. You won't get realo socialism, you'll keep corporate socialism though, whichever candidate you vote for.

 

[Jon]

He is not even midly Left.

 

[sealybobo]

No brother .. the system worked it's magic on you. Obama did not have to agree with Bush on this issue to get elected.

BINGO .. they got you again.

Who do you think proposed a ONE BILLION DOLLAR payoff to the president of Georgia for his treachery in STARTING a conflict with Russia he knew he would lose in about 5 minutes and would cost the lives of many of his own people?

Biden calls for $1 billion in emergency aid to Georgia
The Crypt: Biden calls for $1 billion in emergency aid to Georgia - Politico.com

Bush is following the OBAMA/BIDEN PLAN

.. and guess what, the day after Biden proposed it, Obama picked his as VP.

Here's the clue you should be paying attention to .. As Rove was Bush's brain, Zbigniew Brzezinski is Obama's brain on foreign policy. Now put this together .. Zbigniew Brzezinski + Russia + Georgia + Afghanistan + Pakistan .. putting that together would tell you a far different story than the one you're hearing.

That doesn't help your case

As I've just demonstrated my brother .. one of us has indeed been played.

I'm from Detroit, but I live in Atlanta

I heard Atlanta may possibly go Blue?

And I'm confused about Georgia. I thought Bush/Rove/McCain encouraged Georgia to do what they did because McCain wanted to talk about foreign policies, not the economy.

The way it seemed, Karl Rove went to Georgia a month before the conflict and the rest is history.

And what about this?

John McCain's top foreign-policy adviser, Randy Scheunemann, is a leading expert on U.S.-allied Georgia -- and was a paid lobbyist for the former Soviet republic until March, in the run-up to what has become a major battle between Georgia and Russia.

McCain Adviser Was Lobbyist for Georgia - WSJ.com

Are you telling me that Obama already runs the show?

What was a top national security aide to Vice President Dick Cheney doing in Georgia shortly before Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili's troops engaged in what became a disastrous fight with South Ossetian rebels -- and then Russian troops?

Why was Cheney's guy in Georgia before the war? | Countdown to Crawford | Los Angeles Times

And why did Rove go to Georgia before the conflict?

The White House has started to panic over a July 9 meeting between Condi Rice and Mikheil Saakashvili, desperate to suggest they didn't encourage Georgia's crack-down in South Ossetia. Given that panic, I wonder whether Karl Rove had any similar chats with Saakashvili when they were in Yalta together just days later?

Emptywheel Did Karl Rove Chat to Saakashvili about South Ossetia Too?

 

[WillowTree]

No, because McCain voted with Bush 92% of the time. The times he voted against Bush:

DeLay allowed centrist or moderately conservative Republicans to take turns voting against controversial bills. If a representative said that a bill was unpopular in his district, then DeLay would ask him to vote for it only if his vote were necessary for passage; if his vote were not needed, then the representative would be able to vote against the party without reprisal.[citation needed]

Tom DeLay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

OR, McCain has flipped on a lot of issues. One being torture. He fought Bush on torture but ultimately caved in.

those talking points are so tiresome! but if you are going to quote figures how about this one Obama voted 94 times to either raise taxes or to oppose tax decreases. so that tells me he lies when he says he is going to cut taxes for 95% of us.

 

[GigiBowman]

If Obama loses brother, it won't be because of his race.

A few things you forgot to point out.

Obama is flip-flopper supreme and has abandoned, altered, and ignored almost every position he took in winning the nomination .. and he's abandoned the forces that drove him to the nomination.

Obama has become a warmonger and is following Bush's foreign policy to the letter.

Americans should be able to clearly see that Obama is Wall Street's brightest star and he's abandoned all illusions of being a populist. The notion that he's raised the most money in American history through small donations is preposterous. A very large chunk of that money is coming from Wall Street .. and the piper will have to be paid. This is significant because it's not some arab guy thousands of miles away that's destroying the American way of life .. it's the lock corporations/Wall Street has on our government.

In his quest to become king, Obama has shown that he will say anything to win. That ain't leadership my brother

Thank the lord there are still some of us left who have not been taken over by the Pod People......way to go BAC!

 

[WillowTree]

Boy if this isn't the pot calling the kettle black.

It'll be a long time before I trust a republican or believe they really love America.

Why? Because I know what they did to this country.

No, I don't love the people who emptied the treasury and lied us to war.

I think they should be imprisoned, hung or shot like Saddam and his sons were. Or at least impeached.

Like I said, you won't be asking us to all come together anymore, now that your cat is outta his bag! Nope, no Obama for me. Not now, not ever, I won't support Marxxism.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

I'd really appreciate you, my brother, providing evidence of Obama's change in position on health care, taxes, the war in Iraq, abortion and other issues since this election began. Don't dig back 10+ years or anything... where has his message changed since he began campaigning?

I think you are confusing McCain with Obama when you make the claim that in his question to be "king" he'll say anything. It is McCain who has changed his position more than he's changed his suit. There seems to be no low that he won't stoop to to scare the American public into believe that Obama is dangerous.

We agree about McCain .. but then again, we can say the same thing about most American politicians. Being able to lie fluently is an asset in American politics .. which is why so many of our politicians are lawyers. They're trained liars.

We make excuses for our lying politicians .. "he's only saying what he has to say to win."

I'm not on the right .. nowhere near it, but I believe Obama is dangerous .. two words .. Zbigniew Brzezinski. What they're planning in Pakistan is mindlessly dangerous and Obama and Brzezinski will have no opposition to war. The democrats will fall in line and do whatever they're told. Obama is too weak to take a strong stand against more corporate wars.

He flipped on taxes when he announced that as president he would delay rescinding the Bush tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, suggesting such an increase would further hurt the economy. .. Not what he said during the primaries and if he had taken this position during the primaries, he would not be the nominee.

Had he said he wanted to leave 80,000 troops in Iraq, he would not be the nominee.

His flip flops are too numerous to post but go to google put in "obama flip flops on XXXX" .. you fill in the blank with an issue.

 

[editec]

Thank the lord there are still some of us left who have not been taken over by the Pod People......way to go BAC!

The Pod people are back?

Oh goodie! An excuse to do diet pills.

Rx: Take five, PRN

 

[BlackAsCoal]

I heard Atlanta may possibly go Blue?

I believe that it will go blue. The turnout here is massive.

And I'm confused about Georgia. I thought Bush/Rove/McCain encouraged Georgia to do what they did because McCain wanted to talk about foreign policies, not the economy.

The way it seemed, Karl Rove went to Georgia a month before the conflict and the rest is history.

Don't feel bad about being confused on this. A lot of people thought it was the "October surprise" and Bush and McCain planned it to create more tension on security and foreign affairs as you suggested. Rove did go to Georgia .. but so did Biden. The one billion dollars, which we can't afford, was a payoff to the Georgian president who got his people killed in a mission that was bound to fail. Obama WILL follow Bush on trying to put AMB's next door to Russia and Obama WILL follow Bush on Georgian policy .. because of PIPELINES/Wall Street.

The piper must be paid.

And what about this?

John McCain's top foreign-policy adviser, Randy Scheunemann, is a leading expert on U.S.-allied Georgia -- and was a paid lobbyist for the former Soviet republic until March, in the run-up to what has become a major battle between Georgia and Russia.

McCain Adviser Was Lobbyist for Georgia - WSJ.com

Are you telling me that Obama already runs the show?

No, I'm telling you Wall Street runs the show .. the same ones who ran the show when Bush was in office. It's a truth that continues to escape most Americans. We live in a plutocracy my brother and all this rancor about this politician and that politician doesn't mean shit to the puppetm,asters who run the show. They've simply figured out how to control both mainstream political parties.

What was a top national security aide to Vice President Dick Cheney doing in Georgia shortly before Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili's troops engaged in what became a disastrous fight with South Ossetian rebels -- and then Russian troops?

Why was Cheney's guy in Georgia before the war? | Countdown to Crawford | Los Angeles Times

Clearly, he was doing the bidding of the puppetmasters.

And why did Rove go to Georgia before the conflict?

Most likely to set the stage for the conflict. .. BUT, guess who else was in Georgia BEFORE the conflict .. Brzezinski, 3 weeks before the conflict .. you need to read this ... take some time to fully digest what it's saying.

Georgia-Russia: It's a Classic Brzezinski Project!
excerpts --

It is further worthwhile asking why would the Americans deliberately antagonize the Russians by ferrying Georgian soldiers from Iraq back to the Georgian frontlines so that they can contribute to Russian and Ossetian casualties?

Lastly, in the attack by the Georgians, why would they concentrate on killing the Ossetian innocent civilians rather than take on/capture/disable things of military/civil significance if capturing the Ossetian capital and re-absorbing Ossetia into Georgia was the real goal?
Scoop: Georgia-Russia: It's a Classic Brzezinski Project!

I fact check everything brother .. this is truth.

The White House has started to panic over a July 9 meeting between Condi Rice and Mikheil Saakashvili, desperate to suggest they didn't encourage Georgia's crack-down in South Ossetia. Given that panic, I wonder whether Karl Rove had any similar chats with Saakashvili when they were in Yalta together just days later?

Emptywheel Did Karl Rove Chat to Saakashvili about South Ossetia Too?

I'm sure they did .. but ask yourself why such collusion between what are supposed to be opposite political forces.

They aren't opposite at alll.

 

[BlackAsCoal]

Thank the lord there are still some of us left who have not been taken over by the Pod People......way to go BAC!

that's funny

Thank you Gigi.

 

[sealybobo]

We agree about McCain .. but then again, we can say the same thing about most American politicians. Being able to lie fluently is an asset in American politics .. which is why so many of our politicians are lawyers. They're trained liars.

We make excuses for our lying politicians .. "he's only saying what he has to say to win."

I'm not on the right .. nowhere near it, but I believe Obama is dangerous .. two words .. Zbigniew Brzezinski. What they're planning in Pakistan is mindlessly dangerous and Obama and Brzezinski will have no opposition to war. The democrats will fall in line and do whatever they're told. Obama is too weak to take a strong stand against more corporate wars.

He flipped on taxes when he announced that as president he would delay rescinding the Bush tax cuts on wealthy Americans if he becomes the next president and the economy is in a recession, suggesting such an increase would further hurt the economy. .. Not what he said during the primaries and if he had taken this position during the primaries, he would not be the nominee.

Had he said he wanted to leave 80,000 troops in Iraq, he would not be the nominee.

His flip flops are too numerous to post but go to google put in "obama flip flops on XXXX" .. you fill in the blank with an issue.

You don't think those ppl pulling obama and mccains strings and own/control the energy, oil, media, banks, telecoms, defense, cia, fbi would do the same to nader, green party, barr or any other person?

See, I don't disagree with you that there's "the man" out there. And, I'm actually ready and willing to join you to take them out. Just as soon as you can convince even a fration of these people that its true.

I'm voting for the lesser of 2 evils in a 2 man race. And I really think obama will work for middle class people.

He just won't lead the revolution you are looking for. I think kennedy was the last to try it.

The Steelworkers said it best. At least obama knows there is a problem and wants to fix it. Until January, the gop was saying everythng was great.

And I know the difference between clinton and carter vs bush & reagan. I choose the Dems.

The gop want american workers to compete against slave labor.

Tariffs are ccoming back.

Enough of why we can't.

Yes we can!! And yes we will. Ok now i'm making myself ill.

You're just like my ron paul buddy. I know he's right, but.......

 

[sealybobo]

I imagine there isn't one man that runs everything, and I suspect they don't always get along. For example, did the US car companies like the us bringing in honda? Did they like oil fucking their business? Perhaps they do. It is helping them break the unions.

And no doubt the people that control the telecoms helped bush spy and enough dems folded to give them what they wanted. I called every day telling them not to give them immunity.

pnac is a neo con group. That's the republican agenda.

And they aren't the same. Environment, middle class, who they give money to and where it is spent.

My grandma says, their all crooks, but at least the dems give a dog a bone.

 

[Caligirl]

On TV Wednesday night, Obama will give what one aide described to me as a “meaty” discourse on his basic tax and health-care proposals. No high-flown rhetoric, but rather a briefing paper for wary undecided swing voters---most of whom, the campaign thinks, are “soft Republicans” who kind of want to vote for Obama but need reassurance.

Consumer confidence is at an all-time low. The job performance rating of the outgoing Republican president is at Nixon-Carter levels. Nine out of ten voters think the country is off on the wrong track. The Democrats lead in the generic congressional preference vote by a double-digit margin.

Obama has outspent McCain on TV advertising three or four to one

Obama has four thousand paid organizers in key states, an unheard of number.

Most voters think that McCain’s running mate is not qualified to be president.

Many people wonder aloud if McCain is in fact too old (72) to be president.

Obama is one of the most winsome, charismatic candidates to have appeared on the scene in decades.

Still, in today’s “traditional Gallup” Daily Tracking Poll (the one that screens likely voters most rigorously, based on past votes), Obama leads McCain by only two percentage points, 49 to 47 percent.

It’s hard to make the Electoral College numbers add up for McCain. He has to win all of the current tossup states (Montana, North Dakota, Missouri, Indiana, North Carolina and Florida), plus Ohio and Virginia and one of the following three: New Hampshire, Colorado or New Mexico. That isn’t just drawing one inside straight; that’s drawing a whole casino’s worth of them.

So why hasn’t Obama run away with this?

Because the country remains culturally divided. Because the more it looks like Democrats will score huge gains in Congress, the more worried “soft Republican” voters get. Because McCain has succeeded, in the minds of some of those voters, in raising the hoary specter of “tax-and-spend” liberals.

Because Obama hails from a place (South Side Chicago)

Because of Jeremiah Wright, Ayers & Rezko

And, to a degree we cannot measure and may never fully know, because Obama is an African-American---and one with a Swahili name at that.

Race to the Finish : Why It?s Still a Race

That he does better among virtually every demographic than Kerry did, or even Gore, is good for the party. Obama is a new kind of face in the democratic part, and hurray for that. A real step up from some of the other choices.

 

[Gunny]

On TV Wednesday night, Obama will give what one aide described to me as a “meaty” discourse on his basic tax and health-care proposals. No high-flown rhetoric, but rather a briefing paper for wary undecided swing voters---most of whom, the campaign thinks, are “soft Republicans” who kind of want to vote for Obama but need reassurance.

Consumer confidence is at an all-time low. The job performance rating of the outgoing Republican president is at Nixon-Carter levels. Nine out of ten voters think the country is off on the wrong track. The Democrats lead in the generic congressional preference vote by a double-digit margin.

Obama has outspent McCain on TV advertising three or four to one

Obama has four thousand paid organizers in key states, an unheard of number.

Most voters think that McCain’s running mate is not qualified to be president.

Many people wonder aloud if McCain is in fact too old (72) to be president.

Obama is one of the most winsome, charismatic candidates to have appeared on the scene in decades.

Still, in today’s “traditional Gallup” Daily Tracking Poll (the one that screens likely voters most rigorously, based on past votes), Obama leads McCain by only two percentage points, 49 to 47 percent.

It’s hard to make the Electoral College numbers add up for McCain. He has to win all of the current tossup states (Montana, North Dakota, Missouri, Indiana, North Carolina and Florida), plus Ohio and Virginia and one of the following three: New Hampshire, Colorado or New Mexico. That isn’t just drawing one inside straight; that’s drawing a whole casino’s worth of them.

So why hasn’t Obama run away with this?

Because the country remains culturally divided. Because the more it looks like Democrats will score huge gains in Congress, the more worried “soft Republican” voters get. Because McCain has succeeded, in the minds of some of those voters, in raising the hoary specter of “tax-and-spend” liberals.

Because Obama hails from a place (South Side Chicago)

Because of Jeremiah Wright, Ayers & Rezko

And, to a degree we cannot measure and may never fully know, because Obama is an African-American---and one with a Swahili name at that.

Race to the Finish : Why It?s Still a Race

The race is close because not everyone is as gullible nor as stupid as you.

 

[Care4all]

Obama is NOT going to save any of us guys...he's just a man....

Mccain is NOT going to save any of us guys....he also, is just a man....

I see entirely too much HOPE in followers of BOTH candidates...neither will be able to pull us out of this mess all on their own....

 

[GigiBowman]

Obama is NOT going to save any of us guys...he's just a man....

Mccain is NOT going to save any of us guys....he also, is just a man....

I see entirely too much HOPE in followers of BOTH candidates...neither will be able to pull us out of this mess all on their own....

At least you see the glass half full. My glass reads "Either Way We're Screwed"