Who Started The Civil War?

[Winston]

The Yankees did with their tariffs. They gonna tax people in country to buy a product that they need.

That's really the main reason.

Pay no attention to the secession documents of most of the Southern states, which specifically stated they were seceding over slavery.

Yes, there was an economic issue, concerning an economy based on slavery. It always comes back to the slavery, no matter how you try to get away from it.

Only in indoctrinated leftist minds.

I've read a book that's 6" thick on The Civil War. I have pictures taken by Matthew Brady.

What do you have? "LeftistTalkingpoints.com"? Bite me.

I may even have some Confederate cash around, somewhere.

And yet almost every single State that left the Union did in fact state they did so over the issue of Slavery. I don't know what you have been reading but I suggest you try real info.

Yeah, and if you didn't have your good shirt on you would whoop my ass. What a joke. How about you just provide a rebuttal to Charles Dickens.

The Northern onslaught upon slavery is no more than a piece of specious humbug disguised to conceal its desire for economic control of the United States.

And honestly, it takes a damn fool to make the argument that the Republican Party of the middle 19th Century is the same as the Republican Party today. What about tariffs? Who is for free trade now. is it the democrats? The Republican platform of 1860 said nothing about banning slavery, only about containing it. However it did provide strong support for the Transcontinental Railroad--so is the Republican Party supporting bullet trains today? NO. That same 1860 Republican platform also strongly advocated a Homestead Act giving FREE LAND to settlers. Today's Republican party believes in taking land from settlers and giving it to industry.

You want more?

"And honestly, it takes a damn fool to make the argument that the Republican Party of the middle 19th Century is the same as the Republican Party today."

The issue under discussion is slavery, and so the two parties are the very same as they were in 1860.

You want more?

Wow, the modern Republican Party opposes slavery. Guess that is somehow distinguished from the modern Democratic Party being opposed to slavery. But, the modern Republican Party does support wage slavery, a concept that I am quite sure is beyond your comprehension. Then there is the Republican support of private prisons and penal labor. You know what they call that, penal slavery.

Your argument is lame, totally, and is reflective of Tomi Lahren--another idiot split-tail, whose argument is basically destroyed here,

It’s actually the modern Republican Party that’s the spiritual successor of the pre-1964 Democratic Party.

Yes, Democrats Supported Slavery, But That Misses the Point

The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists.

While talking a great game, it is well known by all except liberals in general, and the Black community specifically, that the Democrat Party claims to be concerned with support of blacks, their record with respect to black politicians tells a different story…

1. In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean.


2. “Gov. David A. Paterson defiantly vowed to run for election next year despite the White House‘s urging that he withdraw from the New York governor’s race.” Obama Asks Paterson to Quit New York Governor’s Race

3. President Barack Obama has kept mum on the fate of Rep. Charles Rangel (D-NY) for days -- but he tells CBS News that it's time for the embattled 80-year-old former Ways and Means Chairman to end his career "with dignity."

"I think Charlie Rangel served a very long time and served-- his constituents very well. But these-- allegations are very troubling," Obama told Harry Smith in an interview to be aired on the "Early Show." and first broadcast on the CBS Evening News with Katie Couric. Obama: Time for Rangel to end career "with dignity"

4 Harold Ford told not to run for Senator from New York:

“From the start, Mr. Ford’s potential candidacy angered national Democratic Party leaders by disrupting plans for what was planned as a seamless Gillibrand nomination. Harry Reid of Nevada, the Senate majority leader, called Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg to discourage him from supporting Mr. Ford, and Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York met personally with Mr. Ford to argue against his candidacy.” http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/02/nyregion/02ford.html


5. “As state comptroller, [Carl] McCall earned the distinction of being the first African American ever elected to a statewide office in New York. Four years later voters overwhelmingly supported McCall over Republican Bruce Blakeman 64.75 to 32.1%. McCall's reelection in 1998 may have given him the confidence he needed in order to pursue the governor's mansion….The McCall campaign had the support of the Democratic Party; whether or not McCall had the party's full support has been the subject of much debate….Still one wonders just how committed the party was to McCall's campaign….shunned by some of the state's most respected Democrats…McCall blamed his money woes on the national Democratic Party, claiming that the party had abandoned his campaign….” H. Carl McCall for Governor: a lesson to all black high-profile statewide office seekers. - Free Online Library


6. And, most telling, Bill Clinton’s remarks about the black candidate for the presidency:

“[A]s Hillary bungled Caroline, Bill’s handling of Ted was even worse. The day after Iowa, he phoned Kennedy and pressed for an endorsement, making the case for his wife. But Bill then went on, belittling Obama in a manner that deeply offended Kennedy. Recounting the conversation later to a friend, Teddy fumed that Clinton had said, A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee.”

Teddy's anger


7. Three staffers working for embattled Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) were asked by security officers to leave an event in downtown Washington on Thursday after they tried to display large campaign signs just as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was about to speak. .. Waters told The Hill afterward that the staffers had been displaying the signs at the annual legislative conference for the Congressional Black Caucus Foundation, which was held at the Washington convention center a few blocks away. “It ain’t about Nancy. It’s about black people,” Waters said. Waters aides expelled from Pelosi event


8. And what Governor of Arkansas made the Saturday before Easter "Confederate Flag Day"?
The Arkansas Code, Section 1-5-107. Confederate Flag Day.
(a) The Saturday immediately preceding Easter Sunday of each year is designated as "Confederate Flag Day" in this state.
No person, firm, or corporation shall display any Confederate flag or replica thereof in connection with any advertisement of any commercial enterprise, or in any manner for any purpose except to honor the Confederate States of America.
Any person, firm, or corporation violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction shall be fined not less than one hundred dollars ($100) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000).

"In April 1985, Governor Bill Clinton signed Act 985 into law...'
Mark R. Levin on Trent Lott & Moral Outrage on National Review Online


9. Do Democrats in Congress support blacks by practicing affirmative action in their hiring…and of course this would be our of moral convictions, as they are legally exempt from affirmative action requirements. More than passing interesting, the ‘National Journal,’ a survey of congressional staffers revealed that Democrats hired black employees at the same rate as Republicans: 2 percent. “The Racial Breakdown of Congressional Staffs,” National Journal, June 21, 2005

a. Schweitzer, “Do As I Say,” p. 9


10. Clinton pushed black candidate to drop out of Florida race:

“Bill Clinton sought to persuade Rep. Kendrick Meek to drop out of the race for Senate during a trip to Florida last week — and nearly succeeded…Clinton did not dangle a job in front of Meek, who gave up a safe House seat to run for the Senate, but instead made the case that the move would advance the congressman’s future prospects, said a third Democrat familiar with the conversations. Clinton campaigned with Meek in Florida on Oct. 19 and 20, and thought he had won Meek over. But as the week wore on, Meek lost his enthusiasm for the arrangement, spurred in part, a third Democratic source said, by his wife’s belief that he could still win the race. Clinton spoke with Meek again at week’s end, three Democrats said, and again Meek said he would drop out.”

Read more: Clinton pushed Meek to quit Fla. race


By some strange coincidence, the Democrats, again, force a black to the back:

11. “Under an arrangement reached two days ago, Steny Hoyer of Maryland, the current majority leader, would get the No. 2 job of minority whip come January. Clyburn, now majority whip, would hold the post of assistant leader, newly created for the purpose of heading off a contest for the whip position.” http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...dership-as-clyburn-settles-for-no-3-post.html


Democrats to blacks: get to the back of the bus.



Need more?

Damn girl, you got some serious problems. This is like your KKK claim. You said, "The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists" and then you list a few cases of a party opposition to black people running for office as proof. Not a single case of segregation proposals, not a single documented case of racism. Hell, here is a thought--how many black people were at the most recent Democratic candidates school? How many showed up for the Republican candidate's school last election?

But better, here is how it is done. The Republican party of today SUPPORTS SEGREGATION.

Goal of Kentucky Republicans: School Re-Segregation

The Republican Party of today SUPPORTS RACISM

Immigrant advocates lambaste ‘racist and bigoted’ proposals in Legislature | Miami Herald

Besides, it is pretty comical to call the Democratic party a racist party when the Republican president has a past of refusing to lease to blacks, proposed an obviously racist and unconstitutional immigration policy that was struck down by the courts, appointed an AG that actively attempted to suppress black votes in his home state, has an adviser that is a well known white supremacist, and only has one black member in his administration that I know of. Nope, pretty comical and pretty stupid. But at least you wear it proudly.

I didn't claim it, you dunce....I proved it.

Nearly a dozen examples of the 'modern' Democrat Party shunting blacks to the back of the bus.

You must have recognized it, as you removed it from the post you quoted.

This:

You did not prove shit. Again, you claim the modern Democratic party is still populated by racist and segregationists. But your "proof" does not even come close to supporting those allegations. I eliminated them from the quote because they are little more than SPAM. Seriously, look at your last number one.

In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean
'
The fact that you want to claim that as "proof" the Democratic Party is full of racists and segregationist is a clear indication of your total ignorance. And I do mean ignorance. Let me tell you why.

1. In 2005 Donna Brazile was not even running for head of the DNC. She was a wee bit busy helping New Orleans recover after Katrina as an active board member of the Louisiana Recovery Authority.

2. In 2016 Howard Dean WAS under consideration for chair of the DNC, he withdrew his name. You know who that racist segregationist Democratic Party elected as chair, why DAMN it was Donna Brazille

3. The only thing your post suggests is that the Democratic Party thought Howard Dean would make a better chair than Donna Brazile. Well holy shit, Dean lead them to a VICTORY and Brazile's leadership ended in DEFEAT.

I mean the only thing more ignorant than your position is someone who willing swallows the stupidity. Do I even need to go to your number two, David Paterson? The fact that Obama and the Democratic party preferred a very popular AG running for governor than a scandal riddled governor with the lowest approval rating of ANY GOVERNOR IN NEW YORK HISTORY hardly proves racism and segregation. Hell, it only proves Obama and the Democratic Party had some COMMON DAMN SENSE.

I got to admit, you sure are a hoot.

 

[PoliticalChic]

The Yankees did with their tariffs. They gonna tax people in country to buy a product that they need.

That's really the main reason.

Pay no attention to the secession documents of most of the Southern states, which specifically stated they were seceding over slavery.

Yes, there was an economic issue, concerning an economy based on slavery. It always comes back to the slavery, no matter how you try to get away from it.

Only in indoctrinated leftist minds.

I've read a book that's 6" thick on The Civil War. I have pictures taken by Matthew Brady.

What do you have? "LeftistTalkingpoints.com"? Bite me.

I may even have some Confederate cash around, somewhere.

And yet almost every single State that left the Union did in fact state they did so over the issue of Slavery. I don't know what you have been reading but I suggest you try real info.

"And honestly, it takes a damn fool to make the argument that the Republican Party of the middle 19th Century is the same as the Republican Party today."

The issue under discussion is slavery, and so the two parties are the very same as they were in 1860.

You want more?

Wow, the modern Republican Party opposes slavery. Guess that is somehow distinguished from the modern Democratic Party being opposed to slavery. But, the modern Republican Party does support wage slavery, a concept that I am quite sure is beyond your comprehension. Then there is the Republican support of private prisons and penal labor. You know what they call that, penal slavery.

Your argument is lame, totally, and is reflective of Tomi Lahren--another idiot split-tail, whose argument is basically destroyed here,

It’s actually the modern Republican Party that’s the spiritual successor of the pre-1964 Democratic Party.

Yes, Democrats Supported Slavery, But That Misses the Point

The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists.

While talking a great game, it is well known by all except liberals in general, and the Black community specifically, that the Democrat Party claims to be concerned with support of blacks, their record with respect to black politicians tells a different story…

1. In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean.


2. “Gov. David A. Paterson defiantly vowed to run for election next year despite the White House‘s urging that he withdraw from the New York governor’s race.” Obama Asks Paterson to Quit New York Governor’s Race

3. President Barack Obama has kept mum on the fate of Rep. Charles Rangel (D-NY) for days -- but he tells CBS News that it's time for the embattled 80-year-old former Ways and Means Chairman to end his career "with dignity."

"I think Charlie Rangel served a very long time and served-- his constituents very well. But these-- allegations are very troubling," Obama told Harry Smith in an interview to be aired on the "Early Show." and first broadcast on the CBS Evening News with Katie Couric. Obama: Time for Rangel to end career "with dignity"

4 Harold Ford told not to run for Senator from New York:

“From the start, Mr. Ford’s potential candidacy angered national Democratic Party leaders by disrupting plans for what was planned as a seamless Gillibrand nomination. Harry Reid of Nevada, the Senate majority leader, called Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg to discourage him from supporting Mr. Ford, and Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York met personally with Mr. Ford to argue against his candidacy.” http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/02/nyregion/02ford.html


5. “As state comptroller, [Carl] McCall earned the distinction of being the first African American ever elected to a statewide office in New York. Four years later voters overwhelmingly supported McCall over Republican Bruce Blakeman 64.75 to 32.1%. McCall's reelection in 1998 may have given him the confidence he needed in order to pursue the governor's mansion….The McCall campaign had the support of the Democratic Party; whether or not McCall had the party's full support has been the subject of much debate….Still one wonders just how committed the party was to McCall's campaign….shunned by some of the state's most respected Democrats…McCall blamed his money woes on the national Democratic Party, claiming that the party had abandoned his campaign….” H. Carl McCall for Governor: a lesson to all black high-profile statewide office seekers. - Free Online Library


6. And, most telling, Bill Clinton’s remarks about the black candidate for the presidency:

“[A]s Hillary bungled Caroline, Bill’s handling of Ted was even worse. The day after Iowa, he phoned Kennedy and pressed for an endorsement, making the case for his wife. But Bill then went on, belittling Obama in a manner that deeply offended Kennedy. Recounting the conversation later to a friend, Teddy fumed that Clinton had said, A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee.”

Teddy's anger


7. Three staffers working for embattled Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) were asked by security officers to leave an event in downtown Washington on Thursday after they tried to display large campaign signs just as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was about to speak. .. Waters told The Hill afterward that the staffers had been displaying the signs at the annual legislative conference for the Congressional Black Caucus Foundation, which was held at the Washington convention center a few blocks away. “It ain’t about Nancy. It’s about black people,” Waters said. Waters aides expelled from Pelosi event


8. And what Governor of Arkansas made the Saturday before Easter "Confederate Flag Day"?
The Arkansas Code, Section 1-5-107. Confederate Flag Day.
(a) The Saturday immediately preceding Easter Sunday of each year is designated as "Confederate Flag Day" in this state.
No person, firm, or corporation shall display any Confederate flag or replica thereof in connection with any advertisement of any commercial enterprise, or in any manner for any purpose except to honor the Confederate States of America.
Any person, firm, or corporation violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction shall be fined not less than one hundred dollars ($100) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000).

"In April 1985, Governor Bill Clinton signed Act 985 into law...'
Mark R. Levin on Trent Lott & Moral Outrage on National Review Online


9. Do Democrats in Congress support blacks by practicing affirmative action in their hiring…and of course this would be our of moral convictions, as they are legally exempt from affirmative action requirements. More than passing interesting, the ‘National Journal,’ a survey of congressional staffers revealed that Democrats hired black employees at the same rate as Republicans: 2 percent. “The Racial Breakdown of Congressional Staffs,” National Journal, June 21, 2005

a. Schweitzer, “Do As I Say,” p. 9


10. Clinton pushed black candidate to drop out of Florida race:

“Bill Clinton sought to persuade Rep. Kendrick Meek to drop out of the race for Senate during a trip to Florida last week — and nearly succeeded…Clinton did not dangle a job in front of Meek, who gave up a safe House seat to run for the Senate, but instead made the case that the move would advance the congressman’s future prospects, said a third Democrat familiar with the conversations. Clinton campaigned with Meek in Florida on Oct. 19 and 20, and thought he had won Meek over. But as the week wore on, Meek lost his enthusiasm for the arrangement, spurred in part, a third Democratic source said, by his wife’s belief that he could still win the race. Clinton spoke with Meek again at week’s end, three Democrats said, and again Meek said he would drop out.”

Read more: Clinton pushed Meek to quit Fla. race


By some strange coincidence, the Democrats, again, force a black to the back:

11. “Under an arrangement reached two days ago, Steny Hoyer of Maryland, the current majority leader, would get the No. 2 job of minority whip come January. Clyburn, now majority whip, would hold the post of assistant leader, newly created for the purpose of heading off a contest for the whip position.” http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...dership-as-clyburn-settles-for-no-3-post.html


Democrats to blacks: get to the back of the bus.



Need more?

Damn girl, you got some serious problems. This is like your KKK claim. You said, "The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists" and then you list a few cases of a party opposition to black people running for office as proof. Not a single case of segregation proposals, not a single documented case of racism. Hell, here is a thought--how many black people were at the most recent Democratic candidates school? How many showed up for the Republican candidate's school last election?

But better, here is how it is done. The Republican party of today SUPPORTS SEGREGATION.

Goal of Kentucky Republicans: School Re-Segregation

The Republican Party of today SUPPORTS RACISM

Immigrant advocates lambaste ‘racist and bigoted’ proposals in Legislature | Miami Herald

Besides, it is pretty comical to call the Democratic party a racist party when the Republican president has a past of refusing to lease to blacks, proposed an obviously racist and unconstitutional immigration policy that was struck down by the courts, appointed an AG that actively attempted to suppress black votes in his home state, has an adviser that is a well known white supremacist, and only has one black member in his administration that I know of. Nope, pretty comical and pretty stupid. But at least you wear it proudly.

I didn't claim it, you dunce....I proved it.

Nearly a dozen examples of the 'modern' Democrat Party shunting blacks to the back of the bus.

You must have recognized it, as you removed it from the post you quoted.

This:

You did not prove shit. Again, you claim the modern Democratic party is still populated by racist and segregationists. But your "proof" does not even come close to supporting those allegations. I eliminated them from the quote because they are little more than SPAM. Seriously, look at your last number one.

In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean
'
The fact that you want to claim that as "proof" the Democratic Party is full of racists and segregationist is a clear indication of your total ignorance. And I do mean ignorance. Let me tell you why.

1. In 2005 Donna Brazile was not even running for head of the DNC. She was a wee bit busy helping New Orleans recover after Katrina as an active board member of the Louisiana Recovery Authority.

2. In 2016 Howard Dean WAS under consideration for chair of the DNC, he withdrew his name. You know who that racist segregationist Democratic Party elected as chair, why DAMN it was Donna Brazille

3. The only thing your post suggests is that the Democratic Party thought Howard Dean would make a better chair than Donna Brazile. Well holy shit, Dean lead them to a VICTORY and Brazile's leadership ended in DEFEAT.

I mean the only thing more ignorant than your position is someone who willing swallows the stupidity. Do I even need to go to your number two, David Paterson? The fact that Obama and the Democratic party preferred a very popular AG running for governor than a scandal riddled governor with the lowest approval rating of ANY GOVERNOR IN NEW YORK HISTORY hardly proves racism and segregation. Hell, it only proves Obama and the Democratic Party had some COMMON DAMN SENSE.

I got to admit, you sure are a hoot.

The Democrat are and have always been the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.

No matter the embarrassment of Dumb and Dumber above, everyone who has studied America history recognizes the facts.


Facts....such as this: Democrats blocked every anti-lynching bill that came to Congress.

"The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill, introduced by Representative Leonidas C. Dyer, a Republican from St. Louis, Missouri, in the United States House of Representatives in 1918, was directed at punishinglynchings and mob violence. The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill was passed by the U.S. House of Representatives on January 26, 1922 but its passage was halted by a Southern Democratic filibuster in the U.S. Senate.

Attempts to propose similar legislation took a halt until the 1930s with the Costigan-Wagner Bill.[1]Subsequent bills followed but the United States Congress never outlawed lynching due to Southern Democratic opposition..... The lynchings were Southern whites' extrajudicial efforts to maintain social control, white supremacy, and Democratic Party rule, .....

From 1882 to 1968, "...nearly 200 anti-lynching bills were introduced in Congress, and three passed the House. Seven presidents between 1890 and 1952 petitioned Congress to pass a federal law."[10] Not one bill was approved by the Senate because of the powerful opposition of the Southern Democratic voting block."
Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill - Wikipedia



Democrats have always been, and continue to be, the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.




I'm never wrong, and I appreciate you and your buddy helping prove it.

 

[Winston]

Pay no attention to the secession documents of most of the Southern states, which specifically stated they were seceding over slavery.

Yes, there was an economic issue, concerning an economy based on slavery. It always comes back to the slavery, no matter how you try to get away from it.

Only in indoctrinated leftist minds.

I've read a book that's 6" thick on The Civil War. I have pictures taken by Matthew Brady.

What do you have? "LeftistTalkingpoints.com"? Bite me.

I may even have some Confederate cash around, somewhere.

And yet almost every single State that left the Union did in fact state they did so over the issue of Slavery. I don't know what you have been reading but I suggest you try real info.

Wow, the modern Republican Party opposes slavery. Guess that is somehow distinguished from the modern Democratic Party being opposed to slavery. But, the modern Republican Party does support wage slavery, a concept that I am quite sure is beyond your comprehension. Then there is the Republican support of private prisons and penal labor. You know what they call that, penal slavery.

Your argument is lame, totally, and is reflective of Tomi Lahren--another idiot split-tail, whose argument is basically destroyed here,

The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists.

While talking a great game, it is well known by all except liberals in general, and the Black community specifically, that the Democrat Party claims to be concerned with support of blacks, their record with respect to black politicians tells a different story…

1. In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean.


2. “Gov. David A. Paterson defiantly vowed to run for election next year despite the White House‘s urging that he withdraw from the New York governor’s race.” Obama Asks Paterson to Quit New York Governor’s Race

3. President Barack Obama has kept mum on the fate of Rep. Charles Rangel (D-NY) for days -- but he tells CBS News that it's time for the embattled 80-year-old former Ways and Means Chairman to end his career "with dignity."

"I think Charlie Rangel served a very long time and served-- his constituents very well. But these-- allegations are very troubling," Obama told Harry Smith in an interview to be aired on the "Early Show." and first broadcast on the CBS Evening News with Katie Couric. Obama: Time for Rangel to end career "with dignity"

4 Harold Ford told not to run for Senator from New York:

“From the start, Mr. Ford’s potential candidacy angered national Democratic Party leaders by disrupting plans for what was planned as a seamless Gillibrand nomination. Harry Reid of Nevada, the Senate majority leader, called Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg to discourage him from supporting Mr. Ford, and Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York met personally with Mr. Ford to argue against his candidacy.” http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/02/nyregion/02ford.html


5. “As state comptroller, [Carl] McCall earned the distinction of being the first African American ever elected to a statewide office in New York. Four years later voters overwhelmingly supported McCall over Republican Bruce Blakeman 64.75 to 32.1%. McCall's reelection in 1998 may have given him the confidence he needed in order to pursue the governor's mansion….The McCall campaign had the support of the Democratic Party; whether or not McCall had the party's full support has been the subject of much debate….Still one wonders just how committed the party was to McCall's campaign….shunned by some of the state's most respected Democrats…McCall blamed his money woes on the national Democratic Party, claiming that the party had abandoned his campaign….” H. Carl McCall for Governor: a lesson to all black high-profile statewide office seekers. - Free Online Library


6. And, most telling, Bill Clinton’s remarks about the black candidate for the presidency:

“[A]s Hillary bungled Caroline, Bill’s handling of Ted was even worse. The day after Iowa, he phoned Kennedy and pressed for an endorsement, making the case for his wife. But Bill then went on, belittling Obama in a manner that deeply offended Kennedy. Recounting the conversation later to a friend, Teddy fumed that Clinton had said, A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee.”

Teddy's anger


7. Three staffers working for embattled Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) were asked by security officers to leave an event in downtown Washington on Thursday after they tried to display large campaign signs just as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was about to speak. .. Waters told The Hill afterward that the staffers had been displaying the signs at the annual legislative conference for the Congressional Black Caucus Foundation, which was held at the Washington convention center a few blocks away. “It ain’t about Nancy. It’s about black people,” Waters said. Waters aides expelled from Pelosi event


8. And what Governor of Arkansas made the Saturday before Easter "Confederate Flag Day"?
The Arkansas Code, Section 1-5-107. Confederate Flag Day.
(a) The Saturday immediately preceding Easter Sunday of each year is designated as "Confederate Flag Day" in this state.
No person, firm, or corporation shall display any Confederate flag or replica thereof in connection with any advertisement of any commercial enterprise, or in any manner for any purpose except to honor the Confederate States of America.
Any person, firm, or corporation violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction shall be fined not less than one hundred dollars ($100) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000).

"In April 1985, Governor Bill Clinton signed Act 985 into law...'
Mark R. Levin on Trent Lott & Moral Outrage on National Review Online


9. Do Democrats in Congress support blacks by practicing affirmative action in their hiring…and of course this would be our of moral convictions, as they are legally exempt from affirmative action requirements. More than passing interesting, the ‘National Journal,’ a survey of congressional staffers revealed that Democrats hired black employees at the same rate as Republicans: 2 percent. “The Racial Breakdown of Congressional Staffs,” National Journal, June 21, 2005

a. Schweitzer, “Do As I Say,” p. 9


10. Clinton pushed black candidate to drop out of Florida race:

“Bill Clinton sought to persuade Rep. Kendrick Meek to drop out of the race for Senate during a trip to Florida last week — and nearly succeeded…Clinton did not dangle a job in front of Meek, who gave up a safe House seat to run for the Senate, but instead made the case that the move would advance the congressman’s future prospects, said a third Democrat familiar with the conversations. Clinton campaigned with Meek in Florida on Oct. 19 and 20, and thought he had won Meek over. But as the week wore on, Meek lost his enthusiasm for the arrangement, spurred in part, a third Democratic source said, by his wife’s belief that he could still win the race. Clinton spoke with Meek again at week’s end, three Democrats said, and again Meek said he would drop out.”

Read more: Clinton pushed Meek to quit Fla. race


By some strange coincidence, the Democrats, again, force a black to the back:

11. “Under an arrangement reached two days ago, Steny Hoyer of Maryland, the current majority leader, would get the No. 2 job of minority whip come January. Clyburn, now majority whip, would hold the post of assistant leader, newly created for the purpose of heading off a contest for the whip position.” http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...dership-as-clyburn-settles-for-no-3-post.html


Democrats to blacks: get to the back of the bus.



Need more?

Damn girl, you got some serious problems. This is like your KKK claim. You said, "The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists" and then you list a few cases of a party opposition to black people running for office as proof. Not a single case of segregation proposals, not a single documented case of racism. Hell, here is a thought--how many black people were at the most recent Democratic candidates school? How many showed up for the Republican candidate's school last election?

But better, here is how it is done. The Republican party of today SUPPORTS SEGREGATION.

Goal of Kentucky Republicans: School Re-Segregation

The Republican Party of today SUPPORTS RACISM

Immigrant advocates lambaste ‘racist and bigoted’ proposals in Legislature | Miami Herald

Besides, it is pretty comical to call the Democratic party a racist party when the Republican president has a past of refusing to lease to blacks, proposed an obviously racist and unconstitutional immigration policy that was struck down by the courts, appointed an AG that actively attempted to suppress black votes in his home state, has an adviser that is a well known white supremacist, and only has one black member in his administration that I know of. Nope, pretty comical and pretty stupid. But at least you wear it proudly.

I didn't claim it, you dunce....I proved it.

Nearly a dozen examples of the 'modern' Democrat Party shunting blacks to the back of the bus.

You must have recognized it, as you removed it from the post you quoted.

This:

You did not prove shit. Again, you claim the modern Democratic party is still populated by racist and segregationists. But your "proof" does not even come close to supporting those allegations. I eliminated them from the quote because they are little more than SPAM. Seriously, look at your last number one.

In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean
'
The fact that you want to claim that as "proof" the Democratic Party is full of racists and segregationist is a clear indication of your total ignorance. And I do mean ignorance. Let me tell you why.

1. In 2005 Donna Brazile was not even running for head of the DNC. She was a wee bit busy helping New Orleans recover after Katrina as an active board member of the Louisiana Recovery Authority.

2. In 2016 Howard Dean WAS under consideration for chair of the DNC, he withdrew his name. You know who that racist segregationist Democratic Party elected as chair, why DAMN it was Donna Brazille

3. The only thing your post suggests is that the Democratic Party thought Howard Dean would make a better chair than Donna Brazile. Well holy shit, Dean lead them to a VICTORY and Brazile's leadership ended in DEFEAT.

I mean the only thing more ignorant than your position is someone who willing swallows the stupidity. Do I even need to go to your number two, David Paterson? The fact that Obama and the Democratic party preferred a very popular AG running for governor than a scandal riddled governor with the lowest approval rating of ANY GOVERNOR IN NEW YORK HISTORY hardly proves racism and segregation. Hell, it only proves Obama and the Democratic Party had some COMMON DAMN SENSE.

I got to admit, you sure are a hoot.

The Democrat are and have always been the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.

No matter the embarrassment of Dumb and Dumber above, everyone who has studied America history recognizes the facts.


Facts....such as this: Democrats blocked every anti-lynching bill that came to Congress.

"The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill, introduced by Representative Leonidas C. Dyer, a Republican from St. Louis, Missouri, in the United States House of Representatives in 1918, was directed at punishinglynchings and mob violence. The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill was passed by the U.S. House of Representatives on January 26, 1922 but its passage was halted by a Southern Democratic filibuster in the U.S. Senate.

Attempts to propose similar legislation took a halt until the 1930s with the Costigan-Wagner Bill.[1]Subsequent bills followed but the United States Congress never outlawed lynching due to Southern Democratic opposition..... The lynchings were Southern whites' extrajudicial efforts to maintain social control, white supremacy, and Democratic Party rule, .....

From 1882 to 1968, "...nearly 200 anti-lynching bills were introduced in Congress, and three passed the House. Seven presidents between 1890 and 1952 petitioned Congress to pass a federal law."[10] Not one bill was approved by the Senate because of the powerful opposition of the Southern Democratic voting block."
Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill - Wikipedia



Democrats have always been, and continue to be, the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.




I'm never wrong, and I appreciate you and your buddy helping prove it.

Wow, what a freakin troll. Do you realize how ignorant you look? You want to go back a hundred years and talk about anti-lynching legislation and ignore the modern RACIST Republican party. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that engages in voter suppression efforts directed at minorities. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that engages in gerrymandering, walling off black voters to dilute their voting power. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that opposes the extension of the Voting Rights Act.

But I got to admit. You would make a good first affirmative, although you wouldn't be worth shooting in the rebuttal round. You can make a claim and then post reams of evidence. Problem is your evidence sucks ass and you have no ability to construct a rebuttal. Matter of fact, you have failed to refute a single one of my arguments against your contentions. Pretty sure you didn't read a single link. You can copy and paste, you just can't THINK. Time to ignore your sorry ass. Honestly, Siri would be more fun to argue with.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Only in indoctrinated leftist minds.

I've read a book that's 6" thick on The Civil War. I have pictures taken by Matthew Brady.

What do you have? "LeftistTalkingpoints.com"? Bite me.

I may even have some Confederate cash around, somewhere.

And yet almost every single State that left the Union did in fact state they did so over the issue of Slavery. I don't know what you have been reading but I suggest you try real info.

The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists.

While talking a great game, it is well known by all except liberals in general, and the Black community specifically, that the Democrat Party claims to be concerned with support of blacks, their record with respect to black politicians tells a different story…

1. In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean.


2. “Gov. David A. Paterson defiantly vowed to run for election next year despite the White House‘s urging that he withdraw from the New York governor’s race.” Obama Asks Paterson to Quit New York Governor’s Race

3. President Barack Obama has kept mum on the fate of Rep. Charles Rangel (D-NY) for days -- but he tells CBS News that it's time for the embattled 80-year-old former Ways and Means Chairman to end his career "with dignity."

"I think Charlie Rangel served a very long time and served-- his constituents very well. But these-- allegations are very troubling," Obama told Harry Smith in an interview to be aired on the "Early Show." and first broadcast on the CBS Evening News with Katie Couric. Obama: Time for Rangel to end career "with dignity"

4 Harold Ford told not to run for Senator from New York:

“From the start, Mr. Ford’s potential candidacy angered national Democratic Party leaders by disrupting plans for what was planned as a seamless Gillibrand nomination. Harry Reid of Nevada, the Senate majority leader, called Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg to discourage him from supporting Mr. Ford, and Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York met personally with Mr. Ford to argue against his candidacy.” http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/02/nyregion/02ford.html


5. “As state comptroller, [Carl] McCall earned the distinction of being the first African American ever elected to a statewide office in New York. Four years later voters overwhelmingly supported McCall over Republican Bruce Blakeman 64.75 to 32.1%. McCall's reelection in 1998 may have given him the confidence he needed in order to pursue the governor's mansion….The McCall campaign had the support of the Democratic Party; whether or not McCall had the party's full support has been the subject of much debate….Still one wonders just how committed the party was to McCall's campaign….shunned by some of the state's most respected Democrats…McCall blamed his money woes on the national Democratic Party, claiming that the party had abandoned his campaign….” H. Carl McCall for Governor: a lesson to all black high-profile statewide office seekers. - Free Online Library


6. And, most telling, Bill Clinton’s remarks about the black candidate for the presidency:

“[A]s Hillary bungled Caroline, Bill’s handling of Ted was even worse. The day after Iowa, he phoned Kennedy and pressed for an endorsement, making the case for his wife. But Bill then went on, belittling Obama in a manner that deeply offended Kennedy. Recounting the conversation later to a friend, Teddy fumed that Clinton had said, A few years ago, this guy would have been getting us coffee.”

Teddy's anger


7. Three staffers working for embattled Rep. Maxine Waters (D-Calif.) were asked by security officers to leave an event in downtown Washington on Thursday after they tried to display large campaign signs just as House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was about to speak. .. Waters told The Hill afterward that the staffers had been displaying the signs at the annual legislative conference for the Congressional Black Caucus Foundation, which was held at the Washington convention center a few blocks away. “It ain’t about Nancy. It’s about black people,” Waters said. Waters aides expelled from Pelosi event


8. And what Governor of Arkansas made the Saturday before Easter "Confederate Flag Day"?
The Arkansas Code, Section 1-5-107. Confederate Flag Day.
(a) The Saturday immediately preceding Easter Sunday of each year is designated as "Confederate Flag Day" in this state.
No person, firm, or corporation shall display any Confederate flag or replica thereof in connection with any advertisement of any commercial enterprise, or in any manner for any purpose except to honor the Confederate States of America.
Any person, firm, or corporation violating the provisions of this section shall be guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction shall be fined not less than one hundred dollars ($100) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000).

"In April 1985, Governor Bill Clinton signed Act 985 into law...'
Mark R. Levin on Trent Lott & Moral Outrage on National Review Online


9. Do Democrats in Congress support blacks by practicing affirmative action in their hiring…and of course this would be our of moral convictions, as they are legally exempt from affirmative action requirements. More than passing interesting, the ‘National Journal,’ a survey of congressional staffers revealed that Democrats hired black employees at the same rate as Republicans: 2 percent. “The Racial Breakdown of Congressional Staffs,” National Journal, June 21, 2005

a. Schweitzer, “Do As I Say,” p. 9


10. Clinton pushed black candidate to drop out of Florida race:

“Bill Clinton sought to persuade Rep. Kendrick Meek to drop out of the race for Senate during a trip to Florida last week — and nearly succeeded…Clinton did not dangle a job in front of Meek, who gave up a safe House seat to run for the Senate, but instead made the case that the move would advance the congressman’s future prospects, said a third Democrat familiar with the conversations. Clinton campaigned with Meek in Florida on Oct. 19 and 20, and thought he had won Meek over. But as the week wore on, Meek lost his enthusiasm for the arrangement, spurred in part, a third Democratic source said, by his wife’s belief that he could still win the race. Clinton spoke with Meek again at week’s end, three Democrats said, and again Meek said he would drop out.”

Read more: Clinton pushed Meek to quit Fla. race


By some strange coincidence, the Democrats, again, force a black to the back:

11. “Under an arrangement reached two days ago, Steny Hoyer of Maryland, the current majority leader, would get the No. 2 job of minority whip come January. Clyburn, now majority whip, would hold the post of assistant leader, newly created for the purpose of heading off a contest for the whip position.” http://www.businessweek.com/news/20...dership-as-clyburn-settles-for-no-3-post.html


Democrats to blacks: get to the back of the bus.



Need more?

Damn girl, you got some serious problems. This is like your KKK claim. You said, "The modern Democratic Party is the same as the not so modern Democrat Party: racialists and segregationists" and then you list a few cases of a party opposition to black people running for office as proof. Not a single case of segregation proposals, not a single documented case of racism. Hell, here is a thought--how many black people were at the most recent Democratic candidates school? How many showed up for the Republican candidate's school last election?

But better, here is how it is done. The Republican party of today SUPPORTS SEGREGATION.

Goal of Kentucky Republicans: School Re-Segregation

The Republican Party of today SUPPORTS RACISM

Immigrant advocates lambaste ‘racist and bigoted’ proposals in Legislature | Miami Herald

Besides, it is pretty comical to call the Democratic party a racist party when the Republican president has a past of refusing to lease to blacks, proposed an obviously racist and unconstitutional immigration policy that was struck down by the courts, appointed an AG that actively attempted to suppress black votes in his home state, has an adviser that is a well known white supremacist, and only has one black member in his administration that I know of. Nope, pretty comical and pretty stupid. But at least you wear it proudly.

I didn't claim it, you dunce....I proved it.

Nearly a dozen examples of the 'modern' Democrat Party shunting blacks to the back of the bus.

You must have recognized it, as you removed it from the post you quoted.

This:

You did not prove shit. Again, you claim the modern Democratic party is still populated by racist and segregationists. But your "proof" does not even come close to supporting those allegations. I eliminated them from the quote because they are little more than SPAM. Seriously, look at your last number one.

In 2005, the Democrats did not name Donna Brazile to head the Democratic National Committee. They chose Howard Dean
'
The fact that you want to claim that as "proof" the Democratic Party is full of racists and segregationist is a clear indication of your total ignorance. And I do mean ignorance. Let me tell you why.

1. In 2005 Donna Brazile was not even running for head of the DNC. She was a wee bit busy helping New Orleans recover after Katrina as an active board member of the Louisiana Recovery Authority.

2. In 2016 Howard Dean WAS under consideration for chair of the DNC, he withdrew his name. You know who that racist segregationist Democratic Party elected as chair, why DAMN it was Donna Brazille

3. The only thing your post suggests is that the Democratic Party thought Howard Dean would make a better chair than Donna Brazile. Well holy shit, Dean lead them to a VICTORY and Brazile's leadership ended in DEFEAT.

I mean the only thing more ignorant than your position is someone who willing swallows the stupidity. Do I even need to go to your number two, David Paterson? The fact that Obama and the Democratic party preferred a very popular AG running for governor than a scandal riddled governor with the lowest approval rating of ANY GOVERNOR IN NEW YORK HISTORY hardly proves racism and segregation. Hell, it only proves Obama and the Democratic Party had some COMMON DAMN SENSE.

I got to admit, you sure are a hoot.

The Democrat are and have always been the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.

No matter the embarrassment of Dumb and Dumber above, everyone who has studied America history recognizes the facts.


Facts....such as this: Democrats blocked every anti-lynching bill that came to Congress.

"The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill, introduced by Representative Leonidas C. Dyer, a Republican from St. Louis, Missouri, in the United States House of Representatives in 1918, was directed at punishinglynchings and mob violence. The Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill was passed by the U.S. House of Representatives on January 26, 1922 but its passage was halted by a Southern Democratic filibuster in the U.S. Senate.

Attempts to propose similar legislation took a halt until the 1930s with the Costigan-Wagner Bill.[1]Subsequent bills followed but the United States Congress never outlawed lynching due to Southern Democratic opposition..... The lynchings were Southern whites' extrajudicial efforts to maintain social control, white supremacy, and Democratic Party rule, .....

From 1882 to 1968, "...nearly 200 anti-lynching bills were introduced in Congress, and three passed the House. Seven presidents between 1890 and 1952 petitioned Congress to pass a federal law."[10] Not one bill was approved by the Senate because of the powerful opposition of the Southern Democratic voting block."
Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill - Wikipedia



Democrats have always been, and continue to be, the party of slavery, segregation and second class citizenship.




I'm never wrong, and I appreciate you and your buddy helping prove it.

Wow, what a freakin troll. Do you realize how ignorant you look? You want to go back a hundred years and talk about anti-lynching legislation and ignore the modern RACIST Republican party. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that engages in voter suppression efforts directed at minorities. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that engages in gerrymandering, walling off black voters to dilute their voting power. It is the MODERN REPUBLICAN party that opposes the extension of the Voting Rights Act.

But I got to admit. You would make a good first affirmative, although you wouldn't be worth shooting in the rebuttal round. You can make a claim and then post reams of evidence. Problem is your evidence sucks ass and you have no ability to construct a rebuttal. Matter of fact, you have failed to refute a single one of my arguments against your contentions. Pretty sure you didn't read a single link. You can copy and paste, you just can't THINK. Time to ignore your sorry ass. Honestly, Siri would be more fun to argue with.

"You want to go back a hundred years and talk about anti-lynching legislation..."

Soooo...you're as poor at math as you are at history and politics?


This was part of the quote I provided:

From 1882 to 1968, "...nearly 200 anti-lynching bills were introduced in Congress, and three passed the House. Seven presidents between 1890 and 1952 petitioned Congress to pass a federal law."[10] Not one bill was approved by the Senate because of the powerful opposition of the Southern Democratic voting block."
Dyer Anti-Lynching Bill - Wikipedia



Democrats....not only have they always been the party of slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship....and LYNCHINGS.....

....but arguably the most popular elected Democrat has been a racist his entire life.

Bill Clinton....racist.


Challenge me on that, you dunce, and watch me smash another custard pie in your ugly kisser.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Gee.....I asked that dunce to challenge me to prove that Bill Clinton, Democrat, was a racist his entire life....and he ran off and hid.


I guess he knew that it was easily proven.

 

[Wolfstrike]

The South had nearly no weapons manufacturing at the beginning of the war

 

[whitehall]

An interesting historic note is that the crazy abolitionist John Brown, who raided the Union Arsenal at Harper's Ferry in 1859 with a rag tag army hoping to ignite a civil war, was captured by Union Army Lieutenant Robert E. Lee.

 

[PoliticalChic]

The South had nearly no weapons manufacturing at the beginning of the war

Soooo....why did they start a war with the North?


BTW/.....the answer is that the South deluded itself into believing that Great Britain would be forced.....FORCED.....to join them against the North.



Ask me why.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

 

[PoliticalChic]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

"Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want."


Well, then....you're in favor of 'sanctuary cities.'

How about an 'Outlaw City' or a 'Kidnapper's City' or 'Man-Boy Love Association City'?

Down with those, too?

 

[PoliticalChic]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

"...emancipation proclamation..."


It wasn't a principle....it was a tactic.

For clarity, the above only applied to those states that had seceded.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

"Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want."


Well, then....you're in favor of 'sanctuary cities.'

How about an 'Outlaw City' or a 'Kidnapper's City' or 'Man-Boy Love Association City'?

Down with those, too?

Please, surely you can see the difference between a state wanting to secede from the union and a sanctuary city within a state in the union. The sanctuary cities are breaking a law and haven't declared their desire to withdraw. Your analogy doesn't hold.

 

[Pogo]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

.
Actually the EP wasn't put forth until early 1863 by which time the War was going on two years old. And it wasn't so much about freeing the enslaved as about buttressing his manpower since it only applied to areas in the Confederacy that were under Union control.

But it's not an easy task to lay down a pretext for a war that's already been going on for 20 months. You really do that later, with history book spin.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

.
Actually the EP wasn't put forth until early 1863 by which time the War was going on two years old. And it wasn't so much about freeing the enslaved as about buttressing his manpower since it only applied to areas in the Confederacy that were under Union control.

But it's not an easy task to lay down a pretext for a war that's already been going on for 20 months. You really do that later, with history book spin.

I agree with you. Lincoln was a master politician, and the EP was intended to reinvigorate the war effort. He intended to make it a moral war rather than a political war.

 

[Pogo]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

.
Actually the EP wasn't put forth until early 1863 by which time the War was going on two years old. And it wasn't so much about freeing the enslaved as about buttressing his manpower since it only applied to areas in the Confederacy that were under Union control.

But it's not an easy task to lay down a pretext for a war that's already been going on for 20 months. You really do that later, with history book spin.

I agree with you. Lincoln was a master politician, and the EP was intended to reinvigorate the war effort. He intended to make it a moral war rather than a political war.

You're saying two different things in two different sentences there. Pick one.

 

[PoliticalChic]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

"Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want."


Well, then....you're in favor of 'sanctuary cities.'

How about an 'Outlaw City' or a 'Kidnapper's City' or 'Man-Boy Love Association City'?

Down with those, too?

Please, surely you can see the difference between a state wanting to secede from the union and a sanctuary city within a state in the union. The sanctuary cities are breaking a law and haven't declared their desire to withdraw. Your analogy doesn't hold.

So you are opposed to states, cities, communities nullifying federal law, but not states?

"...the United States Supreme Court ruled unilateral secession unconstitutional..."
Secession in the United States - Wikipedia


"Your analogy doesn't hold."
Why not?

 

[miketx]

Politicians started it.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Politicians started it.

There is no doubt that Jefferson Davis was a politician.

But....certainly you have no doubt that he represented the views of the Southern elites, the Democrats....do you?

Democrats, North or South, have always favored slavery, segregation, and second class citizenship.....up to and including the Bill 'the racist' Clinton.


Our Democrats on the board will feel that pinch, as they know, deep down that it is true, and they've been suckered into supporting that ideology.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

.
Actually the EP wasn't put forth until early 1863 by which time the War was going on two years old. And it wasn't so much about freeing the enslaved as about buttressing his manpower since it only applied to areas in the Confederacy that were under Union control.

But it's not an easy task to lay down a pretext for a war that's already been going on for 20 months. You really do that later, with history book spin.

I agree with you. Lincoln was a master politician, and the EP was intended to reinvigorate the war effort. He intended to make it a moral war rather than a political war.

You're saying two different things in two different sentences there. Pick one.

Sorry, where is the discrepancy? I stated the war began to preserve the Union, and shifts to the moral cause of freeing the slaves after the EP.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

April 12, 1861....the bloodiest war in our history began.

1. 1861 Civil War begins as Confederates fire on Fort Sumter, Charleston, NC, capturing it on April 14. Lincoln calls for 75,000 volunteers on April 15. General P. G. T. Beauregard led the attack on Ft. Sumter. The fort’s commander was Major Robert Anderson, a former slave owner who stayed loyal to the USA. The fort fell in 34 hours.

2. The President of the Confederacy, Jefferson Davis served as a Democratic U.S. senator from Mississippi and as Secretary of War under Franklin Pierce before his election as the president of the secessionist Confederate States of America.
Although he was later indicted for treason, he was never tried.

3. As a Democrat, he represents the personification of the political views of his party up to and including today.
The Republican party was created to resist, and remove, the stain of slavery from America. While the Democrats have always supported and advanced slavery, segregation and second-class citizenship for black Americans, they have been able to convince the less astute of the very opposite.

a. The KKK was a Democrat subsidiary....FDR made a KKKer his first Supreme Court nominee

b. Bill Clinton enforced flying the Confederate Flag during his entire Arkansas governorship.....and even suggested that Barack Obama should be carrying his bags in 2008.



4. Now....how the Civil War began?
a. Major Robert Anderson and 85 men were stranded in Fort Sumter.

b. Surrounding him were hundreds of militiamen and coastal guns.

c. Lincoln refused to give the fort up, but the fort was running out of food: if he sent a supply convoy into Charleston Bay, he would be blamed for starting the war.....but how could he give in, and give up the fort?

d. William Seward tried to undermine Lincoln....telling Lincoln to give up the fort for 'goodwill.'

e. On April 5, Lincoln dispatched a fleet of supply ships with the proviso that was relayed to Jefferson Davis: the vessels would be unarmed, with the only cargo "food for hungry men."

f. Firing on the defenseless ships would have been an act of war by the Confederacy.

g. On Tuesday, April 9, Davis held a cabinet meeting, deciding on war. Three days later, and hours before the ships would arrive....the Southern forces attacked the fort.
"Double Death: The True Story of Pryce Lewis, the Civil War's Most Daring Spy,"by Gavin Mortimer, p.70-71
The First Battle of Fort Sumter opened on April 12, 1861, when Confederate artillery fired on the Union garrisonhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Sumter

And in my opinion, it was an unjust and immoral war at the beginning. Lincoln engaged in war to preserve the Union. The South had made it clear they no longer wished to be subjects of the Union. Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want. Lincoln, being the brilliant man he was, made the war Just and moral with the emancipation proclamation. Then the war was more about freeing the enslaved, a very just cause.

"Sovereign people should be allowed to select the government they want."


Well, then....you're in favor of 'sanctuary cities.'

How about an 'Outlaw City' or a 'Kidnapper's City' or 'Man-Boy Love Association City'?

Down with those, too?

Please, surely you can see the difference between a state wanting to secede from the union and a sanctuary city within a state in the union. The sanctuary cities are breaking a law and haven't declared their desire to withdraw. Your analogy doesn't hold.

So you are opposed to states, cities, communities nullifying federal law, but not states?

"...the United States Supreme Court ruled unilateral secession unconstitutional..."
Secession in the United States - Wikipedia


"Your analogy doesn't hold."
Why not?

Because sanctuary cities are breaking federal law, they are part of the Union and have not expressed a desire to withdrawal from the Union. The Southern states declared their desire to withdrawal from the Union. Why you think that is analogous to sanctuary cities or man/boy associations is unclear.