2 Grown Men and a 13 Yr Girl

[Asclepias]

I agreed that they took the time to question them. Once someone produces a document that explains whats going on with phone numbers to verify the story then the cops should have given it a rest. They didnt. They cuffed the guys and the girl. They kept the guys in custody for 11 hours and sent the girl to CPS

The document could have been fake. And how do phone numbers verify the story?

True however if your a cop and you call a number and ask questions its pretty easy to verify. There is a reason cops separate people. They are trying to see if the stories match.

Why is it easy to verify? You don't know who is on the other end of the phone.

Go talk to a cop and he will explain it to you if you dont believe the following....

You ask the two guys and the girl their stories seperately. You then make the call and ask for verification of the information they gave you by asking questions that force the person responding to fill in the story. If there are any inconsistencies you know someone is lying.

And how do you know there were no inconsistencies? Or are you just assuming again?

Because the girl wasnt a runaway and her parents talked to the cops.

 

[GWV5903]

HPD did the right thing, I cannot imagine letting my 13 year old daughter travel over 500 miles with 2 adult men, no matter what their race may be...

Her parents were asking for trouble, unless these 2 men where her step brothers nothing else makes sense...

To attempt to sue HPD for this would be nothing short of stupid...

 

[GWV5903]

I know even driving alone in the wrong part of my state is dangerous for a Black person.

This goes both ways milkweed...

 

[Asclepias]

HPD did the right thing, I cannot imagine letting my 13 year old daughter travel over 500 miles with 2 adult men, no matter what their race may be...

Her parents were asking for trouble, unless these 2 men where her step brothers nothing else makes sense...

To attempt to sue HPD for this would be nothing short of stupid...

I disagree. They stepped over the line when they didnt let them go after talking to the parents.

Why do you think the parents were asking for trouble? Gymnasts actually live with their male coaches when training for the Olympics.

 

[Asclepias]

I know even driving alone in the wrong part of my state is dangerous for a Black person.

This goes both ways milkweed...

What do you mean? Are you claiming there is a place where whites are racially profiled by Black cops? Where is this mythical place?

 

[GWV5903]

I know even driving alone in the wrong part of my state is dangerous for a Black person.

This goes both ways milkweed...

What do you mean? Are you claiming there is a place where whites are racially profiled by Black cops? Where is this mythical place?

You didn't reference police officers...

 

[Asclepias]

Seems you're doing a lot of "assuming". Suppose the cops had been afraid of being labeled racist and let the three of them go, then later the girl was found dead? Would that have been a better outcome? Looks like the cops did the right thing.

Dead of what? If a cow had nuts it would be a bull. She still left with the guys and survived. What makes you think they would kill her?

I thought you said they were detained. And I didn't say they would kill her, I said what if she had turned up dead.

They were detained but they waited for her and took her home.

What if fairies were evil?

 

[GWV5903]

I disagree. They stepped over the line when they didnt let them go after talking to the parents.

In today's world nothing is clear enough, imagine what would be said if something had gone wrong, which coarse would you take? It's always better to be safe than sorry...

Why do you think the parents were asking for trouble?

I was pretty clear, I have 2 adult daughters and when they were that age I wouldn't let them travel that far without a parent I knew and trusted...

Gymnasts actually live with their male coaches when training for the Olympics.

True, I agree, but they are well identified and they are not sleeping in the parking lot of a gas station, it looks pretty suspicious...

 

[RodISHI]

Depending on the jurisdiction, in most of them, sleeping in your car is against the law.

The local motel and hotel industry, along with the trade groups have passed ordinances making that a crime.

Fair enough. However, they had a note from her parents with phone numbers. It seems a bit much to haul them all in with handcuffs. While it may be against the law to sleep in your car, it's very seldom something you get arrested for. The officers should have had dispatch call and confirm things, then sent them on their way.

I think this is a clear case of racial profiling. I am not someone who is opposed to any and all racial profiling, I believe there are times when it's appropriate, this just isn't one of them.

How would the cops know beyond a doubt if those papers were real or some bogus paperwork made up to facilitate a crime. I don't think they would. With all the crime committed against young people these days I would prefer that they be cautious by making sure the girl was safe. The parents may have to go to extra measures in insuring that if they allow a young daughter to go with two older guys that it can be absolutely confirmed. They could have gone to the local police station and made confirmations on their end.

 

[Asclepias]

I disagree. They stepped over the line when they didnt let them go after talking to the parents.

In today's world nothing is clear enough, imagine what would be said if something had gone wrong, which coarse would you take? It's always better to be safe than sorry...

Why do you think the parents were asking for trouble?

I was pretty clear, I have 2 adult daughters and when they were that age I wouldn't let them travel that far without a parent I knew and trusted...

Gymnasts actually live with their male coaches when training for the Olympics.

True, I agree, but they are well identified and they are not sleeping in the parking lot of a gas station, it looks pretty suspicious...

If something went wrong? Something like what?

That doesnt answer my question. I know what you would do. I asked why was it asking for trouble?

Thats why I had no problem with them being questioned. After that the cops were wrong.

 

[S.J.]

The cops handled the situation properly. This is just another of those "Poor me, I'm black and oppressed" threads by a well known racist on these forums who goes to great lengths to twist a story into White people - bad, black people - victims. Same old shit we always hear from this guy.

 

[Muhammed]

Here is the scenario. You are a cop and you see 2 grown ass men with a 13 year old girl asleep in a car parked at a gas station. You question the guys and talk to the girl. They tell you they are together and even produce a affidavit showing they have legal custody of the girl. What do you do next?

Ask them why they are sleeping at a gas station?

 

[MisterBeale]

Depending on the jurisdiction, in most of them, sleeping in your car is against the law.

The local motel and hotel industry, along with the trade groups have passed ordinances making that a crime.

Fair enough. However, they had a note from her parents with phone numbers. It seems a bit much to haul them all in with handcuffs. While it may be against the law to sleep in your car, it's very seldom something you get arrested for. The officers should have had dispatch call and confirm things, then sent them on their way.

I think this is a clear case of racial profiling. I am not someone who is opposed to any and all racial profiling, I believe there are times when it's appropriate, this just isn't one of them.

I completely agree.

OTH, I am currently raising a teenager I know how what teens are.

And black youths? Forget about it.

Also, when I was in my twenties I lived in the center of a city near the east side of an urban center and hung out with/partied with, etc. black & chicano teens/twenties regularly. I know the attitude they can take when confronted with the fuzz. It is really SO wildly and weirdly different than how I was raised to deal with the po-po.

While we both viewed them as "antagonistic," their coping mechanism with the 5-0 seemed to me idiotic, antagonistic, and down right stupid. Even if you were completely innocent of everything, they would want to MAKE the cops hassle them. I just didn't get it.

My folks raised me to understand these guys were human, carrying a gun, invested with the authority of the state to use it. As such, you just act like their bitch until you can get them to go away. Why make trouble?


OTH, I do know the type of folks that become cops, and they tend, on balance, to be racist pricks. That is the nature of the beast.

Black, Chicano's from urban areas live in code of honor society. Being anyones bitch is detrimental to your health.

lol. I'm aware.

Most of them ended up dead, in jail, or in prison.

I'm not.

They are pretty stupid. That is the point.

Great bunch of guys though, fun as hell to hang out with. They should have just left that code in the yard.

Same here. Most of my childhood friends are dead or in prison. I dont know how I got lucky enough to make it out alive. Most kids are stupid long into their 20's. Its just more dangerous for Blacks and to an extent Latinos due to racism.

It's NOT just due to racism dude. Minority cops act the same way.

That's what I'm trying to tell you.

If white teens acted the way minority teens do toward cops, they would get the same beat down.

Authority figures have a superiority complex.

 

[MisterBeale]

I would guess the excuse given would be because;

1) It is illegal behavior, even I know that.

and

2) She is a minor.

There is no way in hell I would ever sleep in a car in an urban are with my minor son. I know the consequences. It is simply bad parenting. I care too much about my kid to get into that kind of trouble.

I understand the girl going to CPS and an investigation being launched into her welfare, OTH, unless these guys had a previous criminal record, I can't really understand being detained for that long. However, I wasn't there, I didn't run their info, nor to I have all the facts.

We must guard against the belief that the police state is racially motivated though. It destroys and interferes with the rights of all citizens. We should all be alarmed and outraged at its excesses against any citizen, and not make it an issue of race.

Not everyone knows its illegal to sleep in your car. It doesnt even make any apparent sense it would be illegal. If youre tired and you pull over so you wont be a danger to other motorists one would assume it was ok to catch some sleep.

I'm going with the racially motivated for 2 reasons. The kept the guys for 11 hours. They could have cleared it up right there if they werent racists.

So you ran their licenses and know what their priors were?

Who me? The cops did all that. Do you honestly believe it took 11 hours to do that? They werent arrested for sleeping in the car at all.

That's my point my friend.

It is not for us to make that sort of a judgement. The press WANTS you to be outraged, so they don't give you all of the facts.

You don't know what their criminal records are. You have no idea why they were held for 11 hours. For all we know, the police were being super lenient and letting them go really quickly because they had to make their competition, when ordinarily, they would have been held over for some trial they missed or put in the pokey for parking violations. . . who knows?

But if the slant of this article was to make the police look bad, do you think the reporter would have made the department cooperating with these guys lawyers in a quick fashion a focus of the article? Of course not. It doesn't serve the social engineering or the paper selling goals of the corporation.

I'm not saying such a scenario did, or would happen, all I am saying, is we DON'T KNOW why they were held for that long. It's easy to think the worst.

I wasnt outraged. To me it was an expected result. i was just wondering where the tipping point was in regards to common sense. At what point does it prove it was a racial profiling incident?

Even if they had criminal records what is the problem with that if they have already served their time? That doesnt even weigh into the equation. If they were wanted then that would be the only thing that made sense and they would have been held. Then the headline would have been "white teen saved from Black felons on the run".

You cant excuse their behavior after a certain point. It was clearly a racial thing.

Well, that's the point, we don't know what was on their record.

It is possible they they weren't, in fact felons.

It is possible that they just had outstanding parking violations. Most of the minorities I know don't even bother with those. It doesn't rise to the level of a felony. OTH, if you get caught with them unpaid? You're toast. Or expired insurance, or expired licenses, etc. It could be any number or bullshit victimless paperwork used as an excuse to detain them. We both know none of it would make for good press if you are trying to make a good "racial profiling" story, when, in fact, none exists.

Chances are, they were just poor. There is no crime in being poor and just trying to live your life and eek out a living. But the way the system is set up, it criminalizes you, whether you are black or white. Unfortunately, more often than not, these laws disproportionately affect minorities, so it appears to be institutional racism.

If it were any of these, the system would have no cause to put them in the pokey. Debtors prisons were banned a long time ago. They would have just been given yet another summons and be set free, once again. Chances are, they will ignore it again, till they get into trouble once again.

Eventually, I've heard of judges locking folks up for stupid shit like this, b/c folks refuse to work with the system.
Debtors prisons are illegal in America. Missouri locked me up in one anyway | Nicole Bolden

 

[ChrisL]

Who would leave their 13-year-old daughter in the care of two men to sleep outside in a car? I am definitely questioning the parents here.

 

[Toro]

They were Black. Even worse the girl was white.

What would have been even better is if it was a man and a woman, and the man was white and the woman was black.

 

[Mudda]

Here is the scenario. You are a cop and you see 2 grown ass men with a 13 year old girl asleep in a car parked at a gas station. You question the guys and talk to the girl. They tell you they are together and even produce a affidavit showing they have legal custody of the girl. What do you do next?

If they're black, shoot them. They are obviously up to no good.

 

[Asclepias]

Who would leave their 13-year-old daughter in the care of two men to sleep outside in a car? I am definitely questioning the parents here.

Pretty sure they didnt hire the guys to sleep outside in a car with their daughter. You must not have read the story.

 

[ChrisL]

Who would leave their 13-year-old daughter in the care of two men to sleep outside in a car? I am definitely questioning the parents here.

Pretty sure they didnt hire the guys to sleep outside in a car with their daughter. You must not have read the story.

The OP story? Well, it's pretty short on details but does say that the two men have "legal custody." I asked who would leave their child in the care of such people, unless they had no choice, but again the story has pretty much no details to consider. So, the first thing I would do is to try to find out more about this situation. I would probably be suspicious no matter what color their skin was. It's weird.

 

[Tresha91203]

Cops cuff white teen, two black men at video shoot

Hmmm... Is there some law against two grown men being with a 13-year-old girl? I'm not really understanding what is to question here... nothing unusual was happening? They weren't trying to molest her or she wasn't naked... nothing? I mean.... I don't even get why a cop would question them. They were all asleep in the car?

I disagree. The cop certainly should have questioned them. What if your daughter had been kidnapped and sold into sex slavery?

On what basis? You can't be suggesting cops question every man with a teenage girl in their custody... that makes no sense whatsoever.

Yes, I understand there is a sex trade where girls are kidnapped. They usually don't run around sleeping in cars at gas stations though.

On the basis there is no family resemblance. if i saw two guys of any color with a 13 yr girl of any color and she didnt look like one of them they are getting questioned. Calls would be made on the spot.

My only issue is 11 hours. Once a few calls are made, whats the holdup?