Why is abortion ever ok?

[EatMorChikin]

Those that say it's never okay. If a chick is raped, why the fuck would she want to bring a product of that into the world? I say it should usually be the woman's choice what to do. She's the one that has to carry it. And those of us that are parents, know what our women go through.

I guess you could consider me a pro choice conservative.

I don't even like talking about the extreme cases because it assumes that the young girl who just made a mistake shouldn't be able to get an abortion if she is not ready to have a baby or start a family.

Just two young dumb lovers who didn't wear a condom. She's about to go off to college, or she can not go to college and stay home and raise the kid.

If you are religious you can choose to have and raise the baby and figure it out with a child in your life. But if you are not religious you should be able to opt for an abortion. It should be their option. Morning after pill would be preferred but if its too late for that, a woman should have the choice to abort. Fuck everyone else's morality. Its your life lady do what you think is best.

Of course they should not have sex, and if they do wear a condom, be on the pill or insert an IUD and if that doesn't work the morning after pill but there are too many women in America that if this happened to them at the wrong time, I don't care what they say their position is, they would get the abortion too. So abortion must remain a safe and legal option for women.

And I hope no one ever has to have one. In an ideal world. But this aint no ideal world.

My teenage GF had to have one, we were just too young and immature. No telling if some of my one night stands 18-24 went that way too, I was never notified.

 

[occupied]

It's not ever just OK, it's a heavy decision that is hardly ever taken lightly. Anyone who would take it lightly is probably not going to be a good parent anyway. I hardly ever comment on abortion threads because I have to take the position for abortion as if I approve of it as a belated method of contraception, I do not. Women should definitely have this choice but they should also have such ridiculously ready access to all forms of contraception that there is no excuse for not having it and men (or in this case boys) should keep it in their pants (or get a vasectomy) if they are not prepared to raise their children.

 

[Judicial review]

Those that say it's never okay. If a chick is raped, why the fuck would she want to bring a product of that into the world? I say it should usually be the woman's choice what to do. She's the one that has to carry it. And those of us that are parents, know what our women go through.

I guess you could consider me a pro choice conservative.

I don't even like talking about the extreme cases because it assumes that the young girl who just made a mistake shouldn't be able to get an abortion if she is not ready to have a baby or start a family.

Just two young dumb lovers who didn't wear a condom. She's about to go off to college, or she can not go to college and stay home and raise the kid.

If you are religious you can choose to have and raise the baby and figure it out with a child in your life. But if you are not religious you should be able to opt for an abortion. It should be their option. Morning after pill would be preferred but if its too late for that, a woman should have the choice to abort. Fuck everyone else's morality. Its your life lady do what you think is best.

Of course they should not have sex, and if they do wear a condom, be on the pill or insert an IUD and if that doesn't work the morning after pill but there are too many women in America that if this happened to them at the wrong time, I don't care what they say their position is, they would get the abortion too. So abortion must remain a safe and legal option for women.

And I hope no one ever has to have one. In an ideal world. But this aint no ideal world.

My teenage GF had to have one, we were just too young and immature. No telling if some of my one night stands 18-24 went that way too, I was never notified.

You think you have it bad... I might be the father of 157 kids like that guy in that movie...

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Btw OP, Christianity isn't incompatible with abortion. Bible mentions it a few times and has no problem with it,

God s Not Pro-Life

"The Biblical God is NOT pro-life, he advocates child murder, infanticide, child abuse and abortion...

Abortion:

Hosea 9:11-16 Hosea prays for God’s intervention. “Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, 0 Lord: what wilt thou give? Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. . .Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.” Clearly Hosea desires that the people of Ephraim can no longer have children. God of course obeys by making all their unborn children miscarry. Is not terminating a pregnancy unnaturally “abortion”?

Numbers 5:11-21 The description of a bizarre, brutal and abusive ritual to be performed on a wife SUSPECTED of adultery. This is considered to be an induced abortion to rid a woman of another man’s child.

Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.” In other words: women that might be pregnant, which clearly is abortion for the fetus.

Hosea 13:16 God promises to dash to pieces the infants of Samaria and the “their women with child shall be ripped up”. Once again this god kills the unborn, including their pregnant mothers.

2 Kings 15:16 God allows the pregnant women of Tappuah (aka Tiphsah) to be “ripped open”. And the Christians have the audacity to say god is pro-life. How and the hell is it that Christians can read passages where God allows pregnant women to be murdered, yet still claim abortion is wrong?"

 

[there4eyeM]

We are all involved in making choices about life. For one example, any mature woman who is not pregnant has chosen not to fertilize the living egg in her.

 

[EatMorChikin]

You think you have it bad... I might be the father of 157 kids like that guy in that movie...

I might have a few I'm not aware of, but that wouldn't necessarily make me happy.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I am a Christian - but I am a Christian who believes in the separation of Church and state.

My opposition to abortion stems from a legal position that a fetus is a human being who should be entitled to protection under our law.

 

[EatMorChikin]

I am a Christian - but I am a Christian who believes in the separation of Church and state.

My opposition to abortion stems from a legal position that a fetus is a human being who should be entitled to protection under our law.

How about rape and incest?

 

[BULLDOG]

"Because I'm pro-liberty" is the easy and obvious answer to why I'm not anti-abortion.

It really does come down to a matter of liberty. A woman's body does not belong to you, your church or your government, and some people will just have to learn to deal with that.

Pass many laws dictating what people can and can't do with "their own bodies." Why should what they do do a 3rd party's body be any different? Don't ltet minors get tatoos, don't let people use narcotics as they please, don't let minors purchase alcohol, etc.

Killing your own baby is no more a woman's right, a privacy right or issue, or anything else but advocating the right to bash your own baby's head against the bathroom floor until it's dead because you didn't want the baby.

Until we use correct terms and call it what it is, it's going to continue being misrepresented as a something besides murdering your own child.

Bashing your baby's head against the bathroom floor is murder, not an abortion. They are in no way the same thing.

 

[g5000]

Half of all Americans self-identify as "pro-life" while the other half self-identify as "pro-choice", and yet 2/3 of all Americans are opposed to abortion after the first trimester. Under Roe v. Wade, second trimester abortions are legal. So 2/3 of Americans, including those who self-identify as "pro-choice", are opposed to Roe v. Wade, though many of them may not even realize it.

I am pro-life, and a few years back I was attempting to prove the rate of abortions skyrocketed after Roe v. Wade. So I was walking into my research with a heavy bias, believing that before Roe v. Wade abortions were around 7 percent of what they were after Roe v. Wade.

Turns out I was WAY off.

Turns out there were nearly a million legal abortions a year before Roe v. Wade, and after Roe v. Wade the rate of abortions did not rise dramatically.

Here's why. While there were only a handful of states which allowed unrestricted abortions, most of the states which outlawed abortions permitted abortions for "the health of the mother" and for rape or incest.

So what happened is that doctors created a mile wide definition of "the health of the mother", and the end result was nearly a million abortions a year under the "health of the mother" rule.

I write all this to point out that when someone says they are against abortion except in cases of rape and incest and the "health of the mother", they should know that what they mean is not what ends up happening in practice.

This also means that overturning Roe v. Wade would probably have zero effect on the rate of abortion in America.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

That's a very hard question indeed.

No it isn't. Lemme put it in a simpler to understand way,

Do you support bashing your newborn baby's head against the floor until it split opens and the baby dies? What about if the umbilical cord is still attached? Still as much a s part of the mother as it was when still inside her womb. Why is abortion "ok" but bashing the baby's head against the ground isn't?

As to why women do it, usual answer is economic reasons. They simply don't want to spend the money raising yet another, or first child. In other words, their leisure activities and items are more important than the baby if they'd have to give things up to avoid having to work more to sustain them, or kill the baby to avoid the whole issue completely.

What they never mention in these abortion debates or on tv is the aftermath. Think women who get an abortion just skip merrily away, or do they suffer the anguish and regret the rest of their lives? Maybe if we made people consider the next 30 or so years of their life and likely regret, nightmares, stress, and guilt the abortion issue would go away as either we banned it completely (bad idea, more regs, not a ban,) or it at least became a few and few between issue.

Bringing religion into it though is foolish. Religion has no problem with it. Having a purely reliigous is it ok or not debate, would have it ok and fully legal.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I am a Christian - but I am a Christian who believes in the separation of Church and state.

My opposition to abortion stems from a legal position that a fetus is a human being who should be entitled to protection under our law.

How about rape and incest?

Good questions.
As for rape, I have a hard time punishing the child for the crime. And I have heard some truly uplifting stories about women who carried "rape babies" to term and they are truly inspiring and amazing women. I have a hard time requiring that kind of torment by law. I would allow abortion in that case.

As for incest - we talking about two consenting adults, so I am less inclined to allow abortion in that case. But the couple should be held fully accountable for the care of any orc such a union produces.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

"Because I'm pro-liberty" is the easy and obvious answer to why I'm not anti-abortion.

It really does come down to a matter of liberty. A woman's body does not belong to you, your church or your government, and some people will just have to learn to deal with that.

Thank you. Well done. I don't care if someone is a Christian, Hindu, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist or any other stupid religion. Just get the fuck out of my bedroom.
My house. My life.

A fetus or a zygote is NOT a human being. And if some idiot thinks it is, then get that fetus a social security number and START PAYING THEIR TAXES FOR THEM. That will shut them the fuck up.

 

[EatMorChikin]

I am a Christian - but I am a Christian who believes in the separation of Church and state.

My opposition to abortion stems from a legal position that a fetus is a human being who should be entitled to protection under our law.

How about rape and incest?

Good questions.
As for rape, I have a hard time punishing the child for the crime. And I have heard some truly uplifting stories about women who carried "rape babies" to term and they are truly inspiring and amazing women. I have a hard time requiring that kind of torment by law. I would allow abortion in that case.

As for incest - we talking about two consenting adults, so I am less inclined to allow abortion in that case. But the couple should be held fully accountable for the care of any orc such a union produces.

No incest is not always 2 consenting adults. Sometimes it is a sicko father manipulating his daughter to hop in the sack with him. Some might call that rape, but I don't. It might be worse, but it isn't rape.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Those that say it's never okay. If a chick is raped, why the fuck would she want to bring a product of that into the world? I say it should usually be the woman's choice what to do. She's the one that has to carry it. And those of us that are parents, know what our women go through.

I guess you could consider me a pro choice conservative.

I don't even like talking about the extreme cases because it assumes that the young girl who just made a mistake shouldn't be able to get an abortion if she is not ready to have a baby or start a family.

Just two young dumb lovers who didn't wear a condom. She's about to go off to college, or she can not go to college and stay home and raise the kid.

If you are religious you can choose to have and raise the baby and figure it out with a child in your life. But if you are not religious you should be able to opt for an abortion. It should be their option. Morning after pill would be preferred but if its too late for that, a woman should have the choice to abort. Fuck everyone else's morality. Its your life lady do what you think is best.

Of course they should not have sex, and if they do wear a condom, be on the pill or insert an IUD and if that doesn't work the morning after pill but there are too many women in America that if this happened to them at the wrong time, I don't care what they say their position is, they would get the abortion too. So abortion must remain a safe and legal option for women.

And I hope no one ever has to have one. In an ideal world. But this aint no ideal world.

My teenage GF had to have one, we were just too young and immature. No telling if some of my one night stands 18-24 went that way too, I was never notified.

That's because they went and got abortions, or else you'd be paying child support up the ass. Instead you got to keep your money for yourself, right?

 

[nodoginnafight]

Half of all Americans self-identify as "pro-life" while the other half self-identify as "pro-choice", and yet 2/3 of all Americans are opposed to abortion after the first trimester. Under Roe v. Wade, second trimester abortions are legal. So 2/3 of Americans, including those who self-identify as "pro-choice", are opposed to Roe v. Wade, though many of them may not even realize it.

I am pro-life, and a few years back I was attempting to prove the rate of abortions skyrocketed after Roe v. Wade. So I was walking into my research with a heavy bias, believing that before Roe v. Wade abortions were around 7 percent of what they were after Roe v. Wade.

Turns out I was WAY off.

Turns out there were nearly a million legal abortions a year before Roe v. Wade, and after Roe v. Wade the rate of abortions did not rise dramatically.

Here's why. While there were only a handful of states which allowed unrestricted abortions, most of the states which outlawed abortions permitted abortions for "the health of the mother" and for rape or incest.

So what happened is that doctors created a mile wide definition of "the health of the mother", and the end result was nearly a million abortions a year under the "health of the mother" rule.

I write all this to point out that when someone says they are against abortion except in cases of rape and incest and the "health of the mother", they should know that what they mean is not what ends up happening in practice.

This also means that overturning Roe v. Wade would probably have zero effect on the rate of abortion in America.

I understand the HUGE loophole that creates. But I don't see anyway around it because I am firm in my belief that no woman should be required by law to risk her own life.

 

[occupied]

Btw OP, Christianity isn't incompatible with abortion. Bible mentions it a few times and has no problem with it,

God s Not Pro-Life

"The Biblical God is NOT pro-life, he advocates child murder, infanticide, child abuse and abortion...

Abortion:

Hosea 9:11-16 Hosea prays for God’s intervention. “Ephraim shall bring forth his children to the murderer. Give them, 0 Lord: what wilt thou give? Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts. . .Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit: yea though they bring forth, yet will I slay even the beloved fruit of their womb.” Clearly Hosea desires that the people of Ephraim can no longer have children. God of course obeys by making all their unborn children miscarry. Is not terminating a pregnancy unnaturally “abortion”?

Numbers 5:11-21 The description of a bizarre, brutal and abusive ritual to be performed on a wife SUSPECTED of adultery. This is considered to be an induced abortion to rid a woman of another man’s child.

Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.” In other words: women that might be pregnant, which clearly is abortion for the fetus.

Hosea 13:16 God promises to dash to pieces the infants of Samaria and the “their women with child shall be ripped up”. Once again this god kills the unborn, including their pregnant mothers.

2 Kings 15:16 God allows the pregnant women of Tappuah (aka Tiphsah) to be “ripped open”. And the Christians have the audacity to say god is pro-life. How and the hell is it that Christians can read passages where God allows pregnant women to be murdered, yet still claim abortion is wrong?"

For all of human history unwanted infants were taken to the edge of the village and left for the scavengers, it is still done far more than anyone would like to admit anywhere people are desperately poor. The story of Moses starts with an instance of abandonment to the elements. It's always been a hard world for the young, our attitude of children being precious treasures is relatively recent. Before birth control children were burdens until they could work and pregnancy was a reason to despair.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I am a Christian - but I am a Christian who believes in the separation of Church and state.

My opposition to abortion stems from a legal position that a fetus is a human being who should be entitled to protection under our law.

How about rape and incest?

Good questions.
As for rape, I have a hard time punishing the child for the crime. And I have heard some truly uplifting stories about women who carried "rape babies" to term and they are truly inspiring and amazing women. I have a hard time requiring that kind of torment by law. I would allow abortion in that case.

As for incest - we talking about two consenting adults, so I am less inclined to allow abortion in that case. But the couple should be held fully accountable for the care of any orc such a union produces.

No incest is not always 2 consenting adults. Sometimes it is a sicko father manipulating his daughter to hop in the sack with him. Some might call that rape, but I don't. It might be worse, but it isn't rape.

If the girl is under age - it is rape.
If she is not - then that is two consenting adults.

 

[NoTeaPartyPleez]

Those that say it's never okay. If a chick is raped, why the fuck would she want to bring a product of that into the world? I say it should usually be the woman's choice what to do. She's the one that has to carry it. And those of us that are parents, know what our women go through.

I guess you could consider me a pro choice conservative.

I don't even like talking about the extreme cases because it assumes that the young girl who just made a mistake shouldn't be able to get an abortion if she is not ready to have a baby or start a family.

Just two young dumb lovers who didn't wear a condom. She's about to go off to college, or she can not go to college and stay home and raise the kid.

If you are religious you can choose to have and raise the baby and figure it out with a child in your life. But if you are not religious you should be able to opt for an abortion. It should be their option. Morning after pill would be preferred but if its too late for that, a woman should have the choice to abort. Fuck everyone else's morality. Its your life lady do what you think is best.

Of course they should not have sex, and if they do wear a condom, be on the pill or insert an IUD and if that doesn't work the morning after pill but there are too many women in America that if this happened to them at the wrong time, I don't care what they say their position is, they would get the abortion too. So abortion must remain a safe and legal option for women.

And I hope no one ever has to have one. In an ideal world. But this aint no ideal world.

My teenage GF had to have one, we were just too young and immature. No telling if some of my one night stands 18-24 went that way too, I was never notified.

You think you have it bad... I might be the father of 157 kids like that guy in that movie...

You might be? What happened to them? Were they aborted? So no child support, aren't you a happy boy?

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Part of the problem with abortion is we call it abortion. "Abortion" is an easy word to support. "Bashing your baby's head against the ground" isn't. Call things what they are and it's harder to support or not different things.