there4eyeM
unlicensed metaphysician
- Jul 5, 2012
- 20,712
- 5,326
- 280
Your wrong in your statement.Both premises in your statement are wrong.There are three points
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
Your wrong in your statement.Both premises in your statement are wrong.There are three points
Good to know.Your wrong in your statement.
I was saved but I don't believe in JC anymore, unless you mean Julius Caesar.
Those stupid people knock on my door and said I wasn't saved. And that was not the only experience I had with those stupid people.
Prodigal son. One can walk away. And return. Or not.If you were saved, then you still are. Salvation is not something you can walk in and out of, like a revolving door.
Prodigal son. One can walk away. And return. Or not.If you were saved, then you still are. Salvation is not something you can walk in and out of, like a revolving door.
Sorry, but I don't find losing one's salvation is an option. One is either saved or not saved. If someone decides to chuck it all away for whatever reason, then it is unlikely that individual was ever saved at all. Simply put, salvation isn't a bed of roses with everything going perfectly swell in this lifetime. There are going to be trials and tribulations, and frankly all Christians should be well aware of this fact. People who believe that once a Christian everything is going to be sweet and lovely are in for a rude awakening. People are not stupid. Oh, someone may say something someone else doesn't wish to hear, but that is the thing discussions are made of. I'm sorry that you feel as though your were somehow disrespected; however, GOD likely sent them your way. There is nothing worse than living a lie or believing one thing but finding out later your were headed in the wrong direction. Alter boys and choir members don't go to heaven because they are appreciated by the bishop for the job they do. Salvation is a very intimate thing ---- one will know it when it happens. Things are simply never the same again.Well, see ---- perhaps you are not saved. I feel that Christ is the most important thing we have. Do you believe that or not?I think a difference between a Christian and a Catholic is how they live their religion. I feel that Christians are very much up front with their beliefs. Catholics tend to shelf their views. Or lets say that a Christian has primarily one view ---- while a Catholic likely has a personal view and a social view. In other words, the Christian kid is likely the one who raises his hand in class and questions the validity of gay marriage during Social Studies, while a Catholic classmate mutters, "Oh, here we go again..."
A little bit too upfront all the time. When I think about born again, and Christ took all of our sins I almost puke.
I was saved but I don't believe in JC anymore, unless you mean Julius Caesar.
Those stupid people knock on my door and said I wasn't saved. And that was not the only experience I had with those stupid people.
Remember, the Prodigal son never stopped being the man son. Also, you may wish to consider the brother who never left the nest. It is very revealing. The one son came to realize the mistake he made and learned from it, while the brother was self absorbed and lacked consideration for either his brother or what his father had gone through... The story is more that just a man sowing his wild oats and later regretting it. He came to realize that even his fathers servants were treated far better than he was when his drawing card ran out... The father's love was unconditional, while the elder brother's love was conditional.Prodigal son. One can walk away. And return. Or not.If you were saved, then you still are. Salvation is not something you can walk in and out of, like a revolving door.
"Once "saved" always "saved" may be perplexing to Catholics. "Saved" isn't a word commonly used. Catholics think more in terms of redemption, and that Christ is our salvation. The reason Christ is our salvation is his way is obedience to the Father. When we fail in this, our sins are forgiven. Catholics do believe in one baptism where one enters into the Body of Christ (Christ is our salvation, our Way of life).You can't go from being spiritually born to unborn - in the same way that a baby can't go from being physically born to going back into the womb. This, to me, is one of the biggest problems with Catholics. Many seem to not understand the basics of salvation.
How do Protestants look at the story from the once saved, always saved perspective. Was the son saved before he left, or once he decided to return home?Remember, the Prodigal son never stopped being the man son. Also, you may wish to consider the brother who never left the nest. It is very revealing. The one son came to realize the mistake he made and learned from it, while the brother was self absorbed and lacked consideration for either his brother or what his father had gone through... The story is more that just a man sowing his wild oats and later regretting it. He came to realize that even his fathers servants were treated far better than he was when his drawing card ran out... The father's love was unconditional, while the elder brother's love was conditional.
Or, Salvation is a Way of life...one can remain on the way of salvation or one can decide to turn to evil. Keep in mind most who turn to atheism are not turning to evil. For many, religion can be a stumbling stone.Salvation is not something you can walk in and out of
If a person truly trusted in Christ, then he cannot lose his salvation. He will lose rewards and experience serious consequences in this life, sometimes even the sin unto physical death, but since our salvation is based on the finished work of Christ, we are kept by the power of God and His sovereign work. Several passages stress this."Once "saved" always "saved" may be perplexing to Catholics. "Saved" isn't a word commonly used. Catholics think more in terms of redemption, and that Christ is our salvation. The reason Christ is our salvation is his way is obedience to the Father. When we fail in this, our sins are forgiven. Catholics do believe in one baptism where one enters into the Body of Christ (Christ is our salvation, our Way of life).You can't go from being spiritually born to unborn - in the same way that a baby can't go from being physically born to going back into the womb. This, to me, is one of the biggest problems with Catholics. Many seem to not understand the basics of salvation.
Jesus mentioned that those who just pay lip service, "Lord-Lord" will be told, "I never knew you. I believe it was John, in Revelation, who noted dire consequences for those who turned from Christ, denied him, to save their own life. Then there is the case of Judas. There is the Parable of the Ten Virgins, all of whom started out just fine, but some who ended up getting locked out. Jesus talks of the narrow way, and "Once saved always saved" seems far from that narrow way.
Just as the physically born can go from being very healthy to doing things that make them quite unhealthy works in our spiritual life as well. We can go from being spiritually healthy to being spiritually unhealthy, and I do not see how "Once saved always saved" prevents that. Catholics believe life in Christ and walking in His way is the only way to maintain spiritual health. Baptism is our beginning, our entrance into the Body of Christ who is our Way, our Truth, our Life.
"Once saved always saved" in comparison to that is...perplexing.
The emphasis here is that nothing—no condition or person, and this would include the person himself—can separate the believer from God. The conditions listed include height and depth which would certain have application to the depths of falling away even in unbelief.Romans 8:32-39 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things? 33 Who will bring a charge against God’s elect? God is the one who justifies; 34 who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 Just as it is written, “For Thy sake we are being put to death all day long; We were considered as sheep to be slaughtered.” 37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
10 For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory. 11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we shall also live with Him; 12 If we endure, we shall also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us; 13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful; for He cannot deny Himself.
Saved from what?we would be saved by not sinning or by works.
Saved from eternal separation from GOD's intervention. What we call hell.Saved from what?we would be saved by not sinning or by works.
Revelation 20:15 |
New International Version Anyone whose name was not found written in the book of life was thrown into the lake of fire. |
That was 10 years ago, no one comes to my door and says I'm not saved because they are stupid. Well I started listening to sermons from Prots, Evans, Fundies, and reading the history of the eras :Sorry, but I don't find losing one's salvation is an option. One is either saved or not saved. If someone decides to chuck it all away for whatever reason, then it is unlikely that individual was ever saved at all. Simply put, salvation isn't a bed of roses with everything going perfectly swell in this lifetime. There are going to be trials and tribulations, and frankly all Christians should be well aware of this fact. People who believe that once a Christian everything is going to be sweet and lovely are in for a rude awakening. People are not stupid. Oh, someone may say something someone else doesn't wish to hear, but that is the thing discussions are made of. I'm sorry that you feel as though your were somehow disrespected; however, GOD likely sent them your way. There is nothing worse than living a lie or believing one thing but finding out later your were headed in the wrong direction. Alter boys and choir members don't go to heaven because they are appreciated by the bishop for the job they do. Salvation is a very intimate thing ---- one will know it when it happens. Things are simply never the same again.Well, see ---- perhaps you are not saved. I feel that Christ is the most important thing we have. Do you believe that or not?I think a difference between a Christian and a Catholic is how they live their religion. I feel that Christians are very much up front with their beliefs. Catholics tend to shelf their views. Or lets say that a Christian has primarily one view ---- while a Catholic likely has a personal view and a social view. In other words, the Christian kid is likely the one who raises his hand in class and questions the validity of gay marriage during Social Studies, while a Catholic classmate mutters, "Oh, here we go again..."
A little bit too upfront all the time. When I think about born again, and Christ took all of our sins I almost puke.
I was saved but I don't believe in JC anymore, unless you mean Julius Caesar.
Those stupid people knock on my door and said I wasn't saved. And that was not the only experience I had with those stupid people.
Vespasian, the new emperor, having been raised unexpectedly from a low estate, wanted something which might clothe him with divine majesty and authority. This, likewise, was now added. A poor man who was blind, and another who was lame, came both together before him, when he was seated on the tribunal, imploring him to heal them,3 and saying that they were admonished in a dream by the god Serapis to seek his aid, who assured them that he would restore sight to the one by anointing his eyes with his spittle, and give strength to the leg of the other, if he vouchsafed but to touch it with his heel. At first, he could scarcely believe that the thing would any how succeed, and therefore hesitated to venture on making the experiment. At length, however, by the advice of his friends, he made the attempt publicly, in the presence of the assembled multitudes, and it was crowned with success in both cases.4
C. Suetonius Tranquillus, Divus Vespasianus, chapter 7
www.perseus.tufts.edu
If a person truly trusted in Christ, then he cannot lose his salvation. He will lose rewards and experience serious consequences in this life, sometimes even the sin unto physical death, but since our salvation is based on the finished work of Christ, we are kept by the power of God and His sovereign work. Several passages stress this."Once "saved" always "saved" may be perplexing to Catholics. "Saved" isn't a word commonly used. Catholics think more in terms of redemption, and that Christ is our salvation. The reason Christ is our salvation is his way is obedience to the Father. When we fail in this, our sins are forgiven. Catholics do believe in one baptism where one enters into the Body of Christ (Christ is our salvation, our Way of life).You can't go from being spiritually born to unborn - in the same way that a baby can't go from being physically born to going back into the womb. This, to me, is one of the biggest problems with Catholics. Many seem to not understand the basics of salvation.
Jesus mentioned that those who just pay lip service, "Lord-Lord" will be told, "I never knew you. I believe it was John, in Revelation, who noted dire consequences for those who turned from Christ, denied him, to save their own life. Then there is the case of Judas. There is the Parable of the Ten Virgins, all of whom started out just fine, but some who ended up getting locked out. Jesus talks of the narrow way, and "Once saved always saved" seems far from that narrow way.
Just as the physically born can go from being very healthy to doing things that make them quite unhealthy works in our spiritual life as well. We can go from being spiritually healthy to being spiritually unhealthy, and I do not see how "Once saved always saved" prevents that. Catholics believe life in Christ and walking in His way is the only way to maintain spiritual health. Baptism is our beginning, our entrance into the Body of Christ who is our Way, our Truth, our Life.
"Once saved always saved" in comparison to that is...perplexing.
The emphasis here is that nothing—no condition or person, and this would include the person himself—can separate the believer from God. The conditions listed include height and depth which would certain have application to the depths of falling away even in unbelief.Romans 8:32-39 He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how will He not also with Him freely give us all things? 33 Who will bring a charge against God’s elect? God is the one who justifies; 34 who is the one who condemns? Christ Jesus is He who died, yes, rather who was raised, who is at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us. 35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? 36 Just as it is written, “For Thy sake we are being put to death all day long; We were considered as sheep to be slaughtered.” 37 But in all these things we overwhelmingly conquer through Him who loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
We need to recognize that when someone abandons their faith, this is really the result of a process of sin. If we could lose our salvation, then in the final analysis, we would be saved by not sinning or by works.
Another passage that bears on this is 2 Tim. 2:10-13.
10 For this reason I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus and with it eternal glory. 11 It is a trustworthy statement: For if we died with Him, we shall also live with Him; 12 If we endure, we shall also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us; 13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful; for He cannot deny Himself.
We need to recognize that when someone abandons their faith, this is really the result of a process of sin.
Yes, I wonder where did the Islam get virgins in paradise. Do you think that might be it??Now as to the parable of the 10 virgins, perhaps the parable is a continuation of the previous chapter and in that case actually reflect the nation of Israel ----- please note the following: Part 37 - Matthew 25:1-13 The Parable of the Ten Virgins by Thomas Ice
As religion becomes less relevant the sectarian tensions will lessen. The world will be a better place for it.In the early 20th Century, they mocked Catholics. But I think thats what I noticed that they still hate Catholics. Or maybe not Catholics but the Pope and the Catholic Church. They mock the Catholic Faith. Joe Biden is only the second Catholic President of the USA, and one was assassinated before J.F.Kennedy.
No , I think you have it the wrong way round. But I would be interested to hear your reasoning.The division in Belfast isnt so much about the religion, but a way more about the ethnicity.Bullshit. Check out Belfast if you want to see the effects of sectarianism.As the religions wane and the bad things of it you do not like are less relevant, so do the good things. The good things that kept the prices of everything to do very low.As religion becomes less relevant the sectarian tensions will lessen. The world will be a better place for it.In the early 20th Century, they mocked Catholics. But I think thats what I noticed that they still hate Catholics. Or maybe not Catholics but the Pope and the Catholic Church. They mock the Catholic Faith. Joe Biden is only the second Catholic President of the USA, and one was assassinated before J.F.Kennedy.