Zone1 What is free speech ?

[MisterBeale]

Why has rudi been bankrpted if not for telling lies ?

We have already covered this.

Lies are fine, defamation that affects a person's reputation is NOT, so long as the person it is aimed at, is NOT a public figure.

Wow, you are really really thick mate.



This was a civil lawsuit to sue for damages. Rudi's trial was not a criminal one, it was a civil case. The election interference case has nothing to do with free speech.


"The $148 million verdict in a defamation case brought by two former Georgia election workers marks a new low point for the man once lauded as “America’s mayor,” whose advocacy of Donald Trump’s false election claims has led to criminal charges and hefty legal bills. And the jury’s verdict could be a troubling sign for Giuliani as he gears up to defend himself against charges in Georgia that could land him behind bars. . . "

$148 million damages verdict adds to Rudy Giuliani's financial woes as he awaits his criminal trial

The stunning $148 million judgment against Rudy Giuliani over his lies about two Georgia election workers marks a new low point for the man once lauded as “America’s mayor."

apnews.com

There are no a priori restraints for free speech, only consequences if you violate the restrictions that have already been pointed out to you.

“People whose words cause actual harm to others can be held liable for that damage,” she noted. That’s what the Georgia election workers are claiming in their lawsuit.

Lying about people and bullying them can have consequences despite free-speech protections, Greenky explained: “Right-wing commentator Alex Jones found that out when courts ordered him to pay more than US$1 billion in damages for his statements about, and treatment of, parents of children who were killed in the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in Newtown, Connecticut.”

Giuliani claims the First Amendment lets him lie – 3 essential reads

To what degree can the First Amendment be used to protect someone from the consequences of lying?

theconversation.com

What Is Defamation?​

"Defamation occurs when a false statement is made to a third party if the statement is presented as factual and causes harm to the plaintiff’s reputation.
In order for a plaintiff to recover compensation for defamation, the plaintiff must prove the defendant was at fault for making the false statement. Proving fault depends on who was defamed.

Public vs. Private Figures​

When a private figure is defamed, a less stringent standard is used to determine if the defendant can be found at fault.

• If a false statement is made about a private figure, the key question is whether the defendant was negligent in determining if the statement was true or false before making it. If a reasonably prudent person would have taken more care in determining the validity of the statement, then the defendant could be at fault and held liable for defamation.
• If a false statement is made about a public figure, an actual malice standard applies. The defendant is at fault and liable for defamation only for knowingly making a false statement or for acting with reckless disregard in determining whether or not the statement was true.

It is much more difficult for public figures to make a successful claim for either libel or slander because of the actual malice standard that applies. . . "

Libel Vs. Slander: What’s The Difference?

The First Amendment protects the right to free speech, but there are limits. Defamation is one such limit. Defamation occurs when false statements are presented as fact and they cause harm to individuals or businesses. Defamation can hurt someone’s reputation and damage their economic opportuniti

www.forbes.com

 

[Dr.Know]

I suspect that might form part of project 2025.

Project 2025 is not Trump, its the Heritage foundation and has been around for 20 years. The Deep State has a similar plan they call the "Green New Deal" which lays the foundation for Totalitarianism under the guise of "Protecting the Environment".

The Deep State has co-opted the Democrat Party and is using it as their primary vehicle to garner political power. The Republicans are a bunch of Frat boys that do not know how to fight and are largely irrelevant today.

They are rolling out their Bullshyt the closer we get to the election,,,,soon Trump will be drinking the blood of babies ,,,torturing old women,,,,eliminating Social Security bla bla bla and the Masstards will believe it.

 

[The Duke]

Its lies. You claim 90% of my posts are hate speech. That is just a made up figure. You cant back it up with evidence.

Tommy, wtf is hatespeech, brah?

 

[Tommy Tainant]

We have already covered this.

Lies are fine, defamation that affects a person's reputation is NOT, so long as the person it is aimed at, is NOT a public figure.

Wow, you are really really thick mate.



This was a civil lawsuit to sue for damages. Rudi's trial was not a criminal one, it was a civil case. The election interference case has nothing to do with free speech.


"The $148 million verdict in a defamation case brought by two former Georgia election workers marks a new low point for the man once lauded as “America’s mayor,” whose advocacy of Donald Trump’s false election claims has led to criminal charges and hefty legal bills. And the jury’s verdict could be a troubling sign for Giuliani as he gears up to defend himself against charges in Georgia that could land him behind bars. . . "

$148 million damages verdict adds to Rudy Giuliani's financial woes as he awaits his criminal trial

The stunning $148 million judgment against Rudy Giuliani over his lies about two Georgia election workers marks a new low point for the man once lauded as “America’s mayor."

apnews.com

There are no a priori restraints for free speech, only consequences if you violate the restrictions that have already been pointed out to you.

“People whose words cause actual harm to others can be held liable for that damage,” she noted. That’s what the Georgia election workers are claiming in their lawsuit.

Lying about people and bullying them can have consequences despite free-speech protections, Greenky explained: “Right-wing commentator Alex Jones found that out when courts ordered him to pay more than US$1 billion in damages for his statements about, and treatment of, parents of children who were killed in the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in Newtown, Connecticut.”

Giuliani claims the First Amendment lets him lie – 3 essential reads

To what degree can the First Amendment be used to protect someone from the consequences of lying?

theconversation.com

What Is Defamation?​

"Defamation occurs when a false statement is made to a third party if the statement is presented as factual and causes harm to the plaintiff’s reputation.
In order for a plaintiff to recover compensation for defamation, the plaintiff must prove the defendant was at fault for making the false statement. Proving fault depends on who was defamed.

Public vs. Private Figures​

When a private figure is defamed, a less stringent standard is used to determine if the defendant can be found at fault.

• If a false statement is made about a private figure, the key question is whether the defendant was negligent in determining if the statement was true or false before making it. If a reasonably prudent person would have taken more care in determining the validity of the statement, then the defendant could be at fault and held liable for defamation.
• If a false statement is made about a public figure, an actual malice standard applies. The defendant is at fault and liable for defamation only for knowingly making a false statement or for acting with reckless disregard in determining whether or not the statement was true.

It is much more difficult for public figures to make a successful claim for either libel or slander because of the actual malice standard that applies. . . "

Libel Vs. Slander: What’s The Difference?

The First Amendment protects the right to free speech, but there are limits. Defamation is one such limit. Defamation occurs when false statements are presented as fact and they cause harm to individuals or businesses. Defamation can hurt someone’s reputation and damage their economic opportuniti

www.forbes.com

Rudi was ruined for saying stuff. Where is your famous free speech ?
Obviously you havent got free speech. You have a limited form of it.
Lies are protected except when they arent. Its not a straightforward proposition.
Perhaps you would be better off being honest.
Your protected speech argument rather works against the christian nationalists argument that you are a christian nation as well.

 

[lennypartiv]

What is free speech?

What a laugh that you ask that. On your side of the pond, people get arrested for possessing eggs.

Scottish man arrested for 'holding eggs near Queen's coffin' faces no action

NO action will be taken against a man arrested and charged after allegedly holding eggs near Queen Elizabeth’s coffin ...

www.thenational.scot

 

[Tommy Tainant]

What a laugh that you ask that. On your side of the pond, people get arrested for possessing eggs.

Scottish man arrested for 'holding eggs near Queen's coffin' faces no action

NO action will be taken against a man arrested and charged after allegedly holding eggs near Queen Elizabeth’s coffin ...

www.thenational.scot

Released without charge. He was there on a noble mission. But generqlly a bit petty.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Tommy, I know it's a complex concept for you to understand since you don't have free speech in Great Britain. Don't say anything offensive or I'll have to turn you in.

Well we so have lower murder rates than you. Perhaps death is a price you pay for err free speech.

 

[whitehall]

A lecture from the Brits on free speech? Give me a freaking break.

 

[lennypartiv]

Released without charge. He was there on a noble mission. But generqlly a bit petty.

He was on a noble mission? He appears to be someone who doesn't respect authority.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

The first Amendment allows me to tell you that you are a fat arsed pig diddling piece of shit.

You can do that in most countries. Certainly in the UK.

 

[Mac-7]

Welcome to the Liz Truss school of free speech: you can criticise anyone – except her | Gaby Hinsliff

Those defending the right to be offensive want a safe space for themselves while shutting down dissenting voices, says Guardian columnist Gaby Hinsliff

www.theguardian.com

This article argues that the siren calls come from extremists who want to make some noise.
I can agree with a lot of that.
But my own definition is better.
Someone wanting to whistleblow on a matter of public concern. Not someone who just wants to vent their prejudice.
Lies are not protected.
IE lying about spomeons sexuality to attack sexual minorities
lying about race or religion to attack racial minorities
lying about anything basically
ie - Vance fucks furniture. his wife looks hot. She should get his attention.

Lies arent campaign promises that you dont carry out.
IE Trumps wall. He obviously wanted it but couldnt get it done. Happens all the time like Obamas healthcare.

Lies are labelling a pic in London as a pic of Sheffield
Or reporting a riot when you are sat on your arse 1000 miles away.

The current political scene is based on lies and too many people make a good living out of just lying.

That isnt free speech. That is just the law of the jungle.

What is free speech ?​

Since Brits do not have free speech anymore it is no wonder that you have to ask

 

[Tommy Tainant]

What is free speech ?​

Since Brits do not have free speech anymore it is no wonder that you have to ask

Neither have you. You think you have but the reality doesnt match your fantasy. Ask Rudy or the Gateway Pundit or Fox or Newsmax.

 

[Mac-7]

Neither have you. You think you have but the reality doesnt match your fantasy. Ask Rudy or the Gateway Pundit or Fox or Newsmax.

The UK is actually putting people in jail

Which is much worse than what you think you see in America

But I take no comfort in your loss

Because bad lib ideas on one side of the pond often turn up on the other side sooner or later

 

[Soupnazi630]

Neither have you. You think you have but the reality doesnt match your fantasy. Ask Rudy or the Gateway Pundit or Fox or Newsmax.

yes we do

You cannot name a law rudy broke

 

[MisterBeale]

A lecture from the Brits on free speech? Give me a freaking break.

 

[MisterBeale]

Rudi was ruined for saying stuff. Where is your famous free speech ?
Obviously you havent got free speech. You have a limited form of it.
Lies are protected except when they arent. Its not a straightforward proposition.
Perhaps you would be better off being honest.
Your protected speech argument rather works against the christian nationalists argument that you are a christian nation as well.

Police Escalate Britain’s War on Independent Journalism​

Police Escalate Britain’s War on Independent Journalism

The raid on investigative journalist Asa Winstanley isn’t about terrorism, writes Jonathan Cook – except that of the U.K. government. It is about scaring us into staying silent on Britain’s collusion in Israel’s genocide. By Jonathan Cook Jonathan-Cook.net The U.K. government and police

consortiumnews.com

 

[BackAgain]

So do CBS have the right to "free speech" under maga logic?

Taint, you obviously miss the point.

SEE B.S. doesn’t own the airwaves. The American people do, here. So entities like SEE B.S. can indeed be told to offer opposing points of view access to the airwaves whether they like it or not.

And when they purport to offer “news” (or their “news” division does), they can indeed have their license reviewed if they instead use our airwaves to propagandize all their viewers.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Taint, you obviously miss the point.

SEE B.S. doesn’t own the airwaves. The American people do, here. So entities like SEE B.S. can indeed be told to offer opposing points of view access to the airwaves whether they like it or not.

And when they purport to offer “news” (or their “news” division does), they can indeed have their license reviewed if they instead use our airwaves to propagandize all their viewers.

In this case, and in ABCs case, it is perceived lack of loyalty to trump. He learned this trick from Orban.

 

[Tommy Tainant]

Police Escalate Britain’s War on Independent Journalism​

Police Escalate Britain’s War on Independent Journalism

The raid on investigative journalist Asa Winstanley isn’t about terrorism, writes Jonathan Cook – except that of the U.K. government. It is about scaring us into staying silent on Britain’s collusion in Israel’s genocide. By Jonathan Cook Jonathan-Cook.net The U.K. government and police

consortiumnews.com

View attachment 1028460

It doesnt say what the charges are.
If it was exposing Israel we would all be in jail. Far more prominent people than this guy.
I wont go further because I dont know. Neither do you. Lets see what happens.

 

[BackAgain]

In this case, and in ABCs case, it is perceived lack of loyalty to trump. He learned this trick from Orban.

Thanks for your incoherent but knowledgeless post.

You imbecile.