Ukraine-"Russia" sea clash: Poroshenko urges Nato to send ships

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

 

[SobieskiSavedEurope]

They threw out the Russian stooge BECAUSE he was a corrupt Russian stooge.

Look at your own statement.

"Russians in Ukraine..."

RUSSIANS...not Ukrainians

Again, that sounds like a good reason to redraw the borders, give the Crimea and other regions to Russia, and let the Ukrainians keep the rest.

History is not your friend. Hitler used ethnic Germans in Czechoslovakia as an excuse to take the Sudetenland...after which he simply gobbled up the rest of the country.

Except he didn't "gobble up" the rest of the country. The Slovaks got their own country. The Hungarians got to rejoin Hungary. The Czechs were given their own country.

which everyone at the time was kind of fine with... Nobody thought the fake country of Czechoslovakia was worth going to war over, even the people who lived in it. The Hungarians, Slovaks and Germans welcomed the new order.

That's the blueprint Putin is using

Perhaps. So what? Here's the underlying problem. the borders of nations of the former USSR don't really represent where people actually live, they represent what the commissars thought would be easier to administer. The Crimea was never really considered part of the Ukraine until Krushev decided it was. The Russians living there had enough, and why shouldn't they?

Again, why is any of this our problem?

Now, all that said, I would feel perfectly fine with a rational discussion of this if we didn't have a Russian Puppet in our white house that will probably let Putin get away with this, or worse, start a shooting war to prove he isn't a Russian Stooge.

Crimea should become Tatar again, obviously they're more indigenous, and also more qualified to run it than Russians, or Ukrainians.

 

[Litwin]

once NATO is there, Somalia with snow will vanish from Azov sea 100% . will NATO finish off new created Somalian off shore in Azov sea? whats Trump is gonna do , which side he supports ?

"Ukraine-"Russia" sea clash: Poroshenko urges Nato to send ships"...Nato has expressed "full support" for Ukraine, which is not a member state.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46381166

Do they have Marcon's cell phone on speed dial?

Muscovy GDP (with oil-gas, without it Muscovy is Bangladesh) is a similar to Spanish one, and much smaller than Californian . Putlerstan is a bum actually.

try to find putlerstan here:

 

[Litwin]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

 

[MisterBeale]

Nope, just can't get worked up about the Ukrainians being in a mess they got themselves into.

It's not my problem.

Putin's aggression is the WORLD'S problem...just as Hitler's aggressions were

Don't you mean Ukraine's aggression is Putin's problem, not our problem?

There are two sides to every story. Why did they fire?

Hmmmm.. . . .

Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova
Earlier in the day, the press service of the Russian FSB's Crimean border department detailed that three Ukrainian Navy ships crossed into a temporarily off-limits section of Russian territorial waters, moving from the Black Sea to the Kerch Strait.
Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova

If you are interested Putin told the whole story about Ukrainian provocation in Black see. It's a bit long but worth of reading.

Vladimir Putin: As concerns the incident in the Black Sea, it was obviously a provocation organised by the current officials – I think, by the incumbent president, ahead of the presidential election in Ukraine to be held next March.

The current president is, I think, fifth in the popularity rating and there is a chance he may not make it into the second round. Therefore, he needs to do something to escalate the situation and create unsurpassable obstacles for his rivals, especially in the opposition.

Why do I think so and why am I even certain that this is the case? Look, there was an incident (I will speak about it in a minute) in the Black Sea. But it is a border incident, nothing more. What happened in 2014 when Crimea decided to join Russia? That was a different story, a big one.

What about the painful civil war in southeastern Ukraine, in Donbass, in the Lugansk region, when government forces deployed tanks and heavy artillery, even aviation? It was a war while no martial law was declared.

Now, a small Black Sea incident resulted in martial law. This is clearly a measure taken because of the presidential election. It is absolutely obvious.

Now regarding this incident, or provocation, to be exact. Certainly, this is a provocation. Look, last September roughly the same convoy of Ukrainian military ships passed through the Kerch Strait under the Kerch Bridge to the Sea of Azov.

They fully complied with all agreements and requirements, informing the border guards about what ships made up the convoy, who they were and where they were going. We provided them with a pilotage service and quietly led them to their destination in the Sea of Azov.

What happened this time? They did not respond to our border guard’s requests. They entered our territorial waters. I would like you to note that they entered our territorial waters which were ours before Crimea became part of the Russian Federation. That is, they entered the waters which have always been Russian territorial waters.

Without responding to our border guards, they proceeded to move towards the [Kerch] Bridge. Neither did they respond to our proposal to moor the ships at the marina. Our proposal to take a pilot – even after the violation of our state border they, nevertheless, were offered to take a pilot – was met with silence, there was no reaction whatsoever.

What should border guards do in a situation like this? Military ships had entered Russian territorial waters and were not responding to our border guards and it was unclear what they were going to do. What did the border guards have to do? Had they acted differently, all of them would have been put on trial. They were fulfilling their military duty, the order they were given and, as things stand, they were fulfilling their legitimate functions to protect the territorial integrity of the Russian Federation.

I believe that the same would have been done in any other country, it is absolutely clear. Also, it was discovered that two Ukrainian Security Service officers were among the crew members and, in fact, were in charge of this special operation. They have acknowledged they were Ukrainian Security Service officers. These are clear signs of a provocation that had been planned in advance so it could be used as a pretext for introducing martial law in the country.

This has nothing to do with the efforts being taken to put relations between Russia and Ukraine back on track. This is a game to exacerbate tension, this is an immoral game that is being played in the country in order to neutralise someone’s political opponents.

In fact, I have already got used to many things but today’s Kiev authorities…They have succeeded in selling anti-Russia sentiments and they have nothing else to sell. It seems that no matter what they do, they always get away with it. If they ask to be given infants for breakfast they will probably have them served. Well, we will be told, they want to eat and that is it.

This is a very short-sighted policy. It will not lead to good things because it tends to unnerve today’s Ukrainian leadership in a way that it does not urge them to get down to normal political work within the country and start pursuing normal economic policy.

They have economic problems in addition to social and financial problems and they never stop to beg, asking the International Monetary Fund to give them money. But these are the future generations who will have to pay this money back. As for their work to promote cooperation with their neighbours, there is nothing good to speak about.

Russia Calling! Investment Forum

P.S. And all that happened just in 5 days before important Putin/Trump negotiations in Argentina on November, 30 hopping to destroy them.

That's what I'm reading in other independent media.

from TV.ru?



"Russian" TV: "a rysski child was crucified in Ukraine."

Dude, you're so bad at this.

That is the same reporter.

That has nothing to do with the other source I posted.

 

[MisterBeale]

So wait...you defend Russia trying to invade and conquer Ukraine in the same way you defend Hitler invading and conquering Czechoslovakia?

Are you a Russian troll?

Nope, just can't get worked up about the Ukrainians being in a mess they got themselves into.

It's not my problem.

Putin's aggression is the WORLD'S problem...just as Hitler's aggressions were

Don't you mean Ukraine's aggression is Putin's problem, not our problem?

There are two sides to every story. Why did they fire?

Hmmmm.. . . .

Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova
Earlier in the day, the press service of the Russian FSB's Crimean border department detailed that three Ukrainian Navy ships crossed into a temporarily off-limits section of Russian territorial waters, moving from the Black Sea to the Kerch Strait.
Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova

how it feels to lose again?

"
Donald J. Trump
✔
@realDonaldTrump
· 41 мин

Based on the fact that the ships and sailors have not been returned to Ukraine from "Russia",
I have decided it would be best for all parties concerned to cancel my previously scheduled meeting....
"

So you are unaware the Trump consults with Kissinger and Richard Haas?

Boy, you are out of your league.

It is YOU that are the loser in this conversation.

 

[MisterBeale]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

If Iran or N. Korea violates American territorial waters and refuses to acknowledge our Navy, they will probably get the same treatment.

Do you have a point?

 

[Litwin]

Putin's aggression is the WORLD'S problem...just as Hitler's aggressions were

Don't you mean Ukraine's aggression is Putin's problem, not our problem?

There are two sides to every story. Why did they fire?

Hmmmm.. . . .

Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova
Earlier in the day, the press service of the Russian FSB's Crimean border department detailed that three Ukrainian Navy ships crossed into a temporarily off-limits section of Russian territorial waters, moving from the Black Sea to the Kerch Strait.
Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova

If you are interested Putin told the whole story about Ukrainian provocation in Black see. It's a bit long but worth of reading.

Vladimir Putin: As concerns the incident in the Black Sea, it was obviously a provocation organised by the current officials – I think, by the incumbent president, ahead of the presidential election in Ukraine to be held next March.

The current president is, I think, fifth in the popularity rating and there is a chance he may not make it into the second round. Therefore, he needs to do something to escalate the situation and create unsurpassable obstacles for his rivals, especially in the opposition.

Why do I think so and why am I even certain that this is the case? Look, there was an incident (I will speak about it in a minute) in the Black Sea. But it is a border incident, nothing more. What happened in 2014 when Crimea decided to join Russia? That was a different story, a big one.

What about the painful civil war in southeastern Ukraine, in Donbass, in the Lugansk region, when government forces deployed tanks and heavy artillery, even aviation? It was a war while no martial law was declared.

Now, a small Black Sea incident resulted in martial law. This is clearly a measure taken because of the presidential election. It is absolutely obvious.

Now regarding this incident, or provocation, to be exact. Certainly, this is a provocation. Look, last September roughly the same convoy of Ukrainian military ships passed through the Kerch Strait under the Kerch Bridge to the Sea of Azov.

They fully complied with all agreements and requirements, informing the border guards about what ships made up the convoy, who they were and where they were going. We provided them with a pilotage service and quietly led them to their destination in the Sea of Azov.

What happened this time? They did not respond to our border guard’s requests. They entered our territorial waters. I would like you to note that they entered our territorial waters which were ours before Crimea became part of the Russian Federation. That is, they entered the waters which have always been Russian territorial waters.

Without responding to our border guards, they proceeded to move towards the [Kerch] Bridge. Neither did they respond to our proposal to moor the ships at the marina. Our proposal to take a pilot – even after the violation of our state border they, nevertheless, were offered to take a pilot – was met with silence, there was no reaction whatsoever.

What should border guards do in a situation like this? Military ships had entered Russian territorial waters and were not responding to our border guards and it was unclear what they were going to do. What did the border guards have to do? Had they acted differently, all of them would have been put on trial. They were fulfilling their military duty, the order they were given and, as things stand, they were fulfilling their legitimate functions to protect the territorial integrity of the Russian Federation.

I believe that the same would have been done in any other country, it is absolutely clear. Also, it was discovered that two Ukrainian Security Service officers were among the crew members and, in fact, were in charge of this special operation. They have acknowledged they were Ukrainian Security Service officers. These are clear signs of a provocation that had been planned in advance so it could be used as a pretext for introducing martial law in the country.

This has nothing to do with the efforts being taken to put relations between Russia and Ukraine back on track. This is a game to exacerbate tension, this is an immoral game that is being played in the country in order to neutralise someone’s political opponents.

In fact, I have already got used to many things but today’s Kiev authorities…They have succeeded in selling anti-Russia sentiments and they have nothing else to sell. It seems that no matter what they do, they always get away with it. If they ask to be given infants for breakfast they will probably have them served. Well, we will be told, they want to eat and that is it.

This is a very short-sighted policy. It will not lead to good things because it tends to unnerve today’s Ukrainian leadership in a way that it does not urge them to get down to normal political work within the country and start pursuing normal economic policy.

They have economic problems in addition to social and financial problems and they never stop to beg, asking the International Monetary Fund to give them money. But these are the future generations who will have to pay this money back. As for their work to promote cooperation with their neighbours, there is nothing good to speak about.

Russia Calling! Investment Forum

P.S. And all that happened just in 5 days before important Putin/Trump negotiations in Argentina on November, 30 hopping to destroy them.

That's what I'm reading in other independent media.

from TV.ru?



"Russian" TV: "a rysski child was crucified in Ukraine."

Dude, you're so bad at this.

That is the same reporter.

That has nothing to do with the other source I posted.

you have never posted serious journalistic here , you know why? coz you live in parallel TV.ru reality

all your sources.ru could be easy found here

 

[MisterBeale]

Putin is trying to start a war.

How many nations will he be allowed to gobble up?

Maybe the Ukraine should stop fucking with him.

Here's the thing. Ukraine had an election, and the pro-Russia guy won in a fair vote. Then the minority overthrew him, Russians in the Ukraine said, "We're out".

Why is this our problem?

They threw out the Russian stooge BECAUSE he was a corrupt Russian stooge.

Look at your own statement.

"Russians in Ukraine..."

RUSSIANS...not Ukrainians

History is not your friend. Hitler used ethnic Germans in Czechoslovakia as an excuse to take the Sudetenland...after which he simply gobbled up the rest of the country.

That's the blueprint Putin is using

The Country of Czechoslovakia did not vote to be German. The Ukrainians voted to return to Russia. The UN didn't like it. Fuck the UN.

tovarishch troll, a referendum under foreign occupation has no juridic power

"
United Nations General Assembly Resolution 68/262 was adopted on March 27, 2014 by the sixty-eighth session of the United Nations General Assembly in response to the Russian annexation of Crimea and entitled "Territorial integrity of Ukraine". ...the General Assembly's commitment to the territorial integrity of Ukraine within its internationally recognized borders and underscored the invalidity of the 2014 Crimean referendum. Eleven nations voted against the resolution, while 58 abstained, and a further 24 states were absent when the vote took place.

The resolution was introduced by Canada, Costa Rica, Germany, Lithuania, Poland and Ukraine.[1] The adoption of the resolution was preceded by the unsuccessful attempts of the United Nations Security Council, which convened seven sessions to address the Crimean crisis, only to face a Russian veto[2] of draft resolution S/2014/189,[3] sponsored by 42 countries.

The UN General Assembly also passed the related Resolution 71/205 in December 2016, entitled "Situation of human rights in the Autonomous Republic of Crimea and the city of Sevastopol (Ukraine)""

The U.N.?

 

[ABikerSailor]

If they hate me for being white, male and Christian there's not a damn thing I can do about it, except maybe convert to Judaism.

If you convert to Judaism, then the Trump supporters and white supremacists will hate you.

 

[MisterBeale]

Don't you mean Ukraine's aggression is Putin's problem, not our problem?

There are two sides to every story. Why did they fire?

Hmmmm.. . . .

Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova
Earlier in the day, the press service of the Russian FSB's Crimean border department detailed that three Ukrainian Navy ships crossed into a temporarily off-limits section of Russian territorial waters, moving from the Black Sea to the Kerch Strait.
Ukraine Resorts to 'Bandit Methods' in Kerch Strait - Maria Zakharova

If you are interested Putin told the whole story about Ukrainian provocation in Black see. It's a bit long but worth of reading.

Vladimir Putin: As concerns the incident in the Black Sea, it was obviously a provocation organised by the current officials – I think, by the incumbent president, ahead of the presidential election in Ukraine to be held next March.

The current president is, I think, fifth in the popularity rating and there is a chance he may not make it into the second round. Therefore, he needs to do something to escalate the situation and create unsurpassable obstacles for his rivals, especially in the opposition.

Why do I think so and why am I even certain that this is the case? Look, there was an incident (I will speak about it in a minute) in the Black Sea. But it is a border incident, nothing more. What happened in 2014 when Crimea decided to join Russia? That was a different story, a big one.

What about the painful civil war in southeastern Ukraine, in Donbass, in the Lugansk region, when government forces deployed tanks and heavy artillery, even aviation? It was a war while no martial law was declared.

Now, a small Black Sea incident resulted in martial law. This is clearly a measure taken because of the presidential election. It is absolutely obvious.

Now regarding this incident, or provocation, to be exact. Certainly, this is a provocation. Look, last September roughly the same convoy of Ukrainian military ships passed through the Kerch Strait under the Kerch Bridge to the Sea of Azov.

They fully complied with all agreements and requirements, informing the border guards about what ships made up the convoy, who they were and where they were going. We provided them with a pilotage service and quietly led them to their destination in the Sea of Azov.

What happened this time? They did not respond to our border guard’s requests. They entered our territorial waters. I would like you to note that they entered our territorial waters which were ours before Crimea became part of the Russian Federation. That is, they entered the waters which have always been Russian territorial waters.

Without responding to our border guards, they proceeded to move towards the [Kerch] Bridge. Neither did they respond to our proposal to moor the ships at the marina. Our proposal to take a pilot – even after the violation of our state border they, nevertheless, were offered to take a pilot – was met with silence, there was no reaction whatsoever.

What should border guards do in a situation like this? Military ships had entered Russian territorial waters and were not responding to our border guards and it was unclear what they were going to do. What did the border guards have to do? Had they acted differently, all of them would have been put on trial. They were fulfilling their military duty, the order they were given and, as things stand, they were fulfilling their legitimate functions to protect the territorial integrity of the Russian Federation.

I believe that the same would have been done in any other country, it is absolutely clear. Also, it was discovered that two Ukrainian Security Service officers were among the crew members and, in fact, were in charge of this special operation. They have acknowledged they were Ukrainian Security Service officers. These are clear signs of a provocation that had been planned in advance so it could be used as a pretext for introducing martial law in the country.

This has nothing to do with the efforts being taken to put relations between Russia and Ukraine back on track. This is a game to exacerbate tension, this is an immoral game that is being played in the country in order to neutralise someone’s political opponents.

In fact, I have already got used to many things but today’s Kiev authorities…They have succeeded in selling anti-Russia sentiments and they have nothing else to sell. It seems that no matter what they do, they always get away with it. If they ask to be given infants for breakfast they will probably have them served. Well, we will be told, they want to eat and that is it.

This is a very short-sighted policy. It will not lead to good things because it tends to unnerve today’s Ukrainian leadership in a way that it does not urge them to get down to normal political work within the country and start pursuing normal economic policy.

They have economic problems in addition to social and financial problems and they never stop to beg, asking the International Monetary Fund to give them money. But these are the future generations who will have to pay this money back. As for their work to promote cooperation with their neighbours, there is nothing good to speak about.

Russia Calling! Investment Forum

P.S. And all that happened just in 5 days before important Putin/Trump negotiations in Argentina on November, 30 hopping to destroy them.

That's what I'm reading in other independent media.

from TV.ru?



"Russian" TV: "a rysski child was crucified in Ukraine."

Dude, you're so bad at this.

That is the same reporter.

That has nothing to do with the other source I posted.

you have never posted serious journalistic here , you know why? coz you live in parallel TV.ru reality

all your sources.ru could be easy found here

Dude, stop already, you are making a damn fool of yourself, and everyone reading this thread knows it.

I posted from Truthdig.

Truthdig - Media Bias/Fact Check

"Factual Reporting: HIGH


Notes: Truthdig is a news website that provides a mix of long-form articles, interviews, and blog-like commentary on current events, delivered from a politically progressive point of view. Truthdig has a left wing bias in what they choose to report and the words they use, but the articles are generally well written and reasonably sourced. Truthdig won the Webby Award in 2013 for Best Political Site. Further, a factual search reveals they have not failed any fact checks. Overall, we rate Truthdig Left Biased and High for factual reporting. (11/18/2016) Updated (4/12/2018)"

Although they lean to the left quite heavily, they are known for factual reporting.

Again, stop with the fallacies and propaganda.

It is right here for everyone to review.

Ukraine-"Russia" sea clash: Poroshenko urges Nato to send ships

Ukraine-"Russia" sea clash: Poroshenko urges Nato to send ships

Post # 18

Your video was a waste of everyone's time. GO AWAY.

 

[MisterBeale]

If they hate me for being white, male and Christian there's not a damn thing I can do about it, except maybe convert to Judaism.

If you convert to Judaism, then the Trump supporters and white supremacists will hate you.

First, Trump supporters love Jews, many of them ARE Jews, silly. Jared Kushner, Ben Sapiro, Dennis Prager, Mark Savage, etc. etc. etc.

As for the second?

"Only about 25,000 Americans are hardcore ideological activists for the white supremacist movement, a tiny fraction of the white population. They are organized into approximately 300 different organizations. No two groups are exactly alike. They ranging from seemingly innocuous religious sects or tax protesters to openly militant, even violent, neo-Nazi skinheads and Ku Klux Klan Klaverns. The basic underpinnings of these organizations is they are rooted in religion, which is combined with a paramilitary, survivalists, or anarchists operational approach. Currently, Klan groups are on the decline while more Hitler-inspired groups, like the National Alliance and the Church of the Creator, are growing in numbers and influence. Swastikas and Uzis are replacing hoods and crosses. "
Into the Abyss: White Supremacist Groups/Gangs

He'd only piss off and cause hate in 488 thousandth of one percent of the population. I had my kid do the math. He said it was negligible. I wouldn't worry about it.

 

[CowboyTed]

If they hate me for being white, male and Christian there's not a damn thing I can do about it, except maybe convert to Judaism.

If you convert to Judaism, then the Trump supporters and white supremacists will hate you.

First, Trump supporters love Jews, many of them ARE Jews, silly. Jared Kushner, Ben Sapiro, Dennis Prager, Mark Savage, etc. etc. etc.

As for the second?

"Only about 25,000 Americans are hardcore ideological activists for the white supremacist movement, a tiny fraction of the white population. They are organized into approximately 300 different organizations. No two groups are exactly alike. They ranging from seemingly innocuous religious sects or tax protesters to openly militant, even violent, neo-Nazi skinheads and Ku Klux Klan Klaverns. The basic underpinnings of these organizations is they are rooted in religion, which is combined with a paramilitary, survivalists, or anarchists operational approach. Currently, Klan groups are on the decline while more Hitler-inspired groups, like the National Alliance and the Church of the Creator, are growing in numbers and influence. Swastikas and Uzis are replacing hoods and crosses. "
Into the Abyss: White Supremacist Groups/Gangs

He'd only piss off and cause hate in 488 thousandth of one percent of the population. I had my kid do the math. He said it was negligible. I wouldn't worry about it.

Seriously,

New poll: Trump’s Israel policies don’t sway most US Jews

"The Mellman poll also found widespread American Jewish distaste for Trump, with 75% expressing disapproval of him."

Problem you got is that Jews are generally well educated and Trump doesn't do well with educated...

 

[JWBooth]

Poking a bear with a stick is always a stupid idea see Georgia in the South Ossetia dust up. Even more retarded is defending the notion. The petty tyrant declared martial law and looks to defer elections, where he would lose again, requiring the US to stage another coup to place their puppet back in office.

i hope you are not posting from Olgino, ´coz your TV.ru propaganda is just so badly outdated , its pure year 2014,

Whatever the fuck that is supposed to mean.

 

[JWBooth]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

Shoulda aimed higher and to the left

 

[JWBooth]

Poking a bear with a stick is always a stupid idea see Georgia in the South Ossetia dust up. Even more retarded is defending the notion. The petty tyrant declared martial law and looks to defer elections, where he would lose again, requiring the US to stage another coup to place their puppet back in office.

So seeking to protect his nation, from the attacks by Putin from without and from within, makes the nation actually being attacked, that has already had its nation invaded and part of it militarily annexed, makes Ukraine's leader 'the bad guy'?

Great lesson for the United States, huh? If your nation is being eroded and attacked from within, your entire way of life and existence threatened, why fight it. F* it - just let the collapse / coup / take-over happen.

Fuck 'em, not our problem, and other than blocking a gas pipeline from Russia into Europe it wouldn't be a blip on the radar.

 

[Litwin]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

Shoulda aimed higher and to the left

you´d already know Muscovites do always work of terrible quality ...

 

[B. Kidd]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

Shoulda aimed higher and to the left

you´d already know Muscovites do always work of terrible quality ...

You've been reduced to talking about shitters.
This is where you have found yourself; thanks to astute USMB debaters.

 

[Litwin]

They threw out the Russian stooge BECAUSE he was a corrupt Russian stooge.

Look at your own statement.

"Russians in Ukraine..."

RUSSIANS...not Ukrainians

Again, that sounds like a good reason to redraw the borders, give the Crimea and other regions to Russia, and let the Ukrainians keep the rest.

History is not your friend. Hitler used ethnic Germans in Czechoslovakia as an excuse to take the Sudetenland...after which he simply gobbled up the rest of the country.

Except he didn't "gobble up" the rest of the country. The Slovaks got their own country. The Hungarians got to rejoin Hungary. The Czechs were given their own country.

which everyone at the time was kind of fine with... Nobody thought the fake country of Czechoslovakia was worth going to war over, even the people who lived in it. The Hungarians, Slovaks and Germans welcomed the new order.

That's the blueprint Putin is using

Perhaps. So what? Here's the underlying problem. the borders of nations of the former USSR don't really represent where people actually live, they represent what the commissars thought would be easier to administer. The Crimea was never really considered part of the Ukraine until Krushev decided it was. The Russians living there had enough, and why shouldn't they?

Again, why is any of this our problem?

Now, all that said, I would feel perfectly fine with a rational discussion of this if we didn't have a Russian Puppet in our white house that will probably let Putin get away with this, or worse, start a shooting war to prove he isn't a Russian Stooge.

Crimea should become Tatar again, obviously they're more indigenous, and also more qualified to run it than Russians, or Ukrainians.

Crimean Tatars are the loyal Ukrainian citizens , much like all other Ukrainians they fight mongol juchi temporary occupation

 

[Litwin]

Did WW3 start between U.S & Russian proxies, and we don't even know it yet?????

no, Muscovy attacked this time under its own flag, so no proxies have been seen in Azov sea

"Penetration holes in a Ukraine Navy patrol craft from Russian weapons."

its a clear as a sunny day that "Russian" vessels were given clear orders to shoot to kill. "

Shoulda aimed higher and to the left

you´d already know Muscovites do always work of terrible quality ...

You've been reduced to talking about shitters.
This is where you have found yourself; thanks to astute USMB debaters.

you talk about shitters ("russians") too , a diffidence between us is you are pro- shitters i am against them