Tax the Rich? Tax the Millionaires!

[MitchMan]

Lonestar, I thought you went to work.

 

[MitchMan]

Slave labor and cheap labor built this country. There you go again, thinking that capitalists are the only players.

By the way, what on earth makes you think that you have a command of the facts? You are obviously not an educated man, nor a studied man. You obviously do not have knowledge of even basic economics or finance. Certainly, there has been no formal or structured study by you. Hell, you can't even read!

 

[M14 Shooter]

To quote myself:

The way to assess the situation substantively, honestly, and accurately is to keep your eye and your perspective on the big picture. The big picture is that in this country there is a massively disproportionate concentration of wealth and income at the top. The USA is the 2nd worst offender in the world. Ever heard of the ‘GINI Coefficient’? Connected to this lopsidedness is the loud and clear fact that the majority of the working class is suffering badly, especially the bottom 40% of the majority.

M14, educate us, please. How is this a false premise? Actually, specifically which part of what I wrote is false? And, specifically, which part is something for the government to address? Please be specific and unambiguous. Your comment needs more definition.

The message I received from your post is that the disparity of wealth is a problem, and that the problem must be addressed. The proper mechanism for this is government, thru restrictions that prevent such a disparate distribution of wealth, and the elimination of this dispartiy by usiing that wealth to enable others.

Am I wrong?

 

[LibocalypseNow]

Only pitiful Losers sit around obsessing over how much $$ others make. Winners don't think that way. It's not anyone's business how much $$ individual Citizens make. If you're a miserable Loser,just stop being bitter & miserable and do something about it. You're a Loser because of your own choices & mentality. So stop blaming everyone else. And you are not entitled to other Citizens' Income because you're a Loser. That would just be stealing. So just get off your couch and make something of yourself. It doesn't matter how much $$ other Citizens make. That flawed mentality has gotten you where you are today...Loserville. Now stop being a bitter Loser and become a Winner. Good luck & God Bless.

 

[MitchMan]

M14, you are close by about 30%. Good, this is progress, finally.

The message I received from your post is that the disparity of wealth is a problem, and that the problem must be addressed. The proper mechanism for this is government, thru restrictions that prevent such a disparate distribution of wealth, and the elimination of this dispartiy by usiing that wealth to enable others.

The proper mechanism to address the disparity of wealth (and income) is first, by and large, through the political process to elect politicians and vote for legislation the results in the necessary changes in the current problematic economic structure. The changes through the political process will then effect the requisite changes in: business practices, economic structure, the legal system, the tax system, labor practices, etc., etc., etc.

Now this will involve government, the private sector, and the public sector, and institutions. The point being that government doesn't have to do it all. It is only a false, yet common, right wing characterization that we liberals want government to do it only and to do it all. If you listen carefully to the media, you will find that it is commonly right wingers that constantly put that out there for the most part.

Now, this is where you really blow it, deliberately and, might I say, quite transparently:

the elimination of this dispartiy by usiing that wealth to enable others

The full context is that the excess wealth that the rich and wealthy have was the wealth that was produced by the working class for the most part, but found its way of our current legal yet inequitable economic system through to the pockets of the wealthy few at the top, thereby, leaving the majority of the working class without enough of the wealth that they actually produced in their (working class) pockets to buy the necessities of life and enjoy a better than subsistance lifestyle. That is quite different than the way you put it within the context of your statement.

To reiterate, the economic system needs fixes so that much more of the wealth that the working class produces stays in their pockets. THEN, after it is in their pockets via a fair economic system, they (the working class) can USE that wealth to ENABLE the working class to live a better life.

Distinctions are all important.

 

[MitchMan]

Numb nuts, I mean Libo, I have asked you before and I will ask you again, what portion of the US population are you demonzing here? 3%, 5%, 30%, 50%, 85%?

It's easy to do your "drive by" type of commentary. Be a man and support what you write with facts and sound logic. You won't have any credibility until you do.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

No one is entitled to stealing other Citizens' Income. This is something the bitter Losers can't or wont understand. If you're a Loser,try not being such a Loser. Stop blaming others. You are not entitled to stealing from other American Citizens. Period,end of story.

 

[M14 Shooter]

The proper mechanism to address the disparity of wealth (and income) is first, by and large, through the political process to elect politicians and vote for legislation the results in the necessary changes in the current problematic economic structure.

Then, my statement stands.
Your premise is false, that this is something for the government to address.

The government exists to protect your rights, not create or maintain some sort of economic structure, especially a structure created with the intent to make sure anyone has the means to buy anything.

 

[MitchMan]

M14, you can say you disagree with me, but when you say that my premise is "false", you tread on very thin ice. The burden of proof of any accusation is on the accuser. Prove that my premise is false or you have no credibility.

If you think that the government has no role, in the economic system of our country (or any other country), either currently or in the future, you are as blind as a bat and suffer from the most severest case of myopia in this thread so far (and that's pretty bad). Talk about a false premise.

Do you realize that you are hereby contradicting virtually all past and present economists, including but not limited to Adam Smith, Milton Friedman, and even Greenspan? Very thin ice indeed.

Only a fool would for one second believe that the government is not part of an economic system. You need to do some further study, even rudimentary study would be a great help to you. You are coming off kind of stupidly.

 

[M14 Shooter]

M14, you can say you disagree with me, but when you say that my premise is "false", you tread on very thin ice. The burden of proof of any accusation is on the accuser. Prove that my premise is false or you have no credibility.

The government exists to protect your rights, not create or maintain some sort of economic structure, especially a structure created with the intent to make sure anyone has the means to buy anything.
:shrug:

 

[MitchMan]

Reiteration of your original statement is not proof. BTW, are you saying that your statement is from Atlas Shrugged? Is that a citation you are putting at the end :shrug:?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Reiteration of your original statement is not proof.

It is when my original statement -is- the proof - given that said statement was put there to support the claim of a false premise, that should have been obvious.

The :shrug: was included to indicate that you already had what you asked for.

 

[MitchMan]

Let me put it another way, where did you get that quote from, what is the source or the original author of that statement?

 

[LibocalypseNow]

Numb nuts, I mean Libo, I have asked you before and I will ask you again, what portion of the US population are you demonzing here? 3%, 5%, 30%, 50%, 85%?

It's easy to do your "drive by" type of commentary. Be a man and support what you write with facts and sound logic. You won't have any credibility until you do.

No offense man,but you do sound like one of those bitter Losers. Why obsess over how much $$ other Citizens make? It's really none of your business. You don't have the right to steal from fellow Citizens just because you're a bitter Loser. It just doesn't work that way. It's not their fault you're a Loser. That's all on you man. You just need to get it together and stop blaming others. I wish you the best of luck. I really mean that.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Let me put it another way, where did you get that quote from, what is the source or the original author of that statement?

It's not a quote from anyone; -I- am the original author.

The statement is based on two specific clauses:

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Thus:
The government exists to protect your rights, not create or maintain some sort of economic structure, especially a structure created with the intent to make sure anyone has the means to buy anything.

 

[M14 Shooter]

Numb nuts, I mean Libo, I have asked you before and I will ask you again, what portion of the US population are you demonzing here? 3%, 5%, 30%, 50%, 85%?

It's easy to do your "drive by" type of commentary. Be a man and support what you write with facts and sound logic. You won't have any credibility until you do.

No offense man,but you do sound like one of those bitter Losers. Why obsess over how much $$ other Citizens make?

Its simple:
If you can't keep up with the Jonses, bring the Jonses down to you.

 

[LibocalypseNow]

Numb nuts, I mean Libo, I have asked you before and I will ask you again, what portion of the US population are you demonzing here? 3%, 5%, 30%, 50%, 85%?

It's easy to do your "drive by" type of commentary. Be a man and support what you write with facts and sound logic. You won't have any credibility until you do.

No offense man,but you do sound like one of those bitter Losers. Why obsess over how much $$ other Citizens make?

Its simple:
If you can't keep up with the Jonses, bring the Jonses down to you.

Yea these people really do believe they have the right to steal from fellow American Citizens just because they're Losers. They really do believe in that stuff. Only a miserable & bitter Loser sits around obsessing over how much $$ other Citizens make. I stand by that statement.

 

[MitchMan]

M14, I don't know where to begin, but to say I am starting to feel sorry for you. Look, I applaud your interest and intensity toward these kinds of matters. More people should do the same. But, let me just say that to derive the kind of conviction that you exhibit really takes more deliberation than a myopic literal interpretation of some portion of the Constitution. You know, it's just not that simple most of the time.

Actually, I could build my case based on your citings here. "...deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed..." and "promote the general Welfare...", and there are a few more that could easily be legitimately used by me.

The weakest part of your so called proof is that you admit that the actual quote is your own and that it is a compilation and derivation of your own in your original paraphrased form. Man, that wouldn't stand up as proof in any arena. Plus, you need to realize that a human will put their own spin on something that is original. Real and valid proof, especially in this instance, means authoritative literal sourcing. Not your own derivation.

Here's a quote, " Nice try but it won't fly". I said that.

 

[M14 Shooter]

M14, I don't know where to begin, but to say I am starting to feel sorry for you.

Nothing you have stated here counters my argument, generally or specifically.
Feel free to try again.

The weakest part of your so called proof is that you admit that the actual quote is your own and that it is a compilation and derivation of your own in your original paraphrased form. Man, that wouldn't stand up as proof in any arena.

When you defend -your- doctoral dissertation, you'll understand just how wrong you are.

 

[M14 Shooter]

No offense man,but you do sound like one of those bitter Losers. Why obsess over how much $$ other Citizens make?

Its simple:
If you can't keep up with the Jonses, bring the Jonses down to you.

Yea these people really do believe they have the right to steal from fellow American Citizens just because they're Losers. They really do believe in that stuff. Only a miserable & bitter Loser sits around obsessing over how much $$ other Citizens make. I stand by that statement.

Their cry of "It's not fair!" derives from their sense of entitlement - they believe they are entitled to what they want, even if they do not possess the means to get it.