Roe v. Wade getting overturned!!

[ding]

NFBW: Can you tell me @ClaireH or @ding or @BackAgain or @airplanemechanic what an umbilical cord does?

Do you know in your vast scientific and medical knowledge without checking @ClaireH why a separate life as you call it is using oxygenated blood produced by an actual living breathing, eating, drinking, peeing, pooping, thinking’ laughing, crying, bitching, loving human being who lives and experiences life in the exact same and entirely magnificent and mysterious universe as all of us posting here on this message board?

Are you a “being” like us @ClaireH or are you a “being” living like a fetus temporarily connected to an umbilical cord in a dark wet very small and limited universe called the womb? END2207220945

There's a very simple reason you deny that after fertilization a new genetically distinct human has been created... you can't bear to face the reality of supporting the ending a human life.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Always been a question liberals can't answer. It's a simple one, too.

If a "fetus" is part of the mother while inside the womb, why does someone get charged with 2 counts of murder if they kill a pregnant woman?

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207221839

BackAgain “….. from nothing to being there is no logical bridge” James

BackAgain220722-#3,798 “The zygote or embryo or fetus in whatever stage of human development is a being like is. Exactly like us but-for …. “”

NFBW: ah yes! but-for. . . as a moral free will human being existing in the vast universe, I bring up the ‘but-fors’ regarding the moral obligations I have to a human fetus living in the womb of a human being also existing with free will in the same universe but unbeknownst to me, and the American Taliban Tag TEAM here cries foul. Not permissible in the discussion. There is no distinction between a fetus and me. END2207221839

 

[beagle9]

If your question is when does a fetus have equal right to life as the mother and every other viable human being on earth, I believe Roe v. Wade set precedent at viability outside the womb . Catholic doctrine of Humana vitae declares in my absolutely non theological capacity That God creates a soul at conception because he has a plan for its life. It is therefore a sin to terminate pregnancy. Jewish theology however declares that ensoulment takes place at first breath and that is when a fetus becomes a human being. Science does not not define an exact moment between those two theological conclusions on the subject that’s why I believe Roe v. Wade was settled law for 50 years and should not have been taken down giving precedence to the Catholic doctrine becoming a law for everyone.

You, me or no human being knows when a soul is placed (whether it be placed into a developing child while in the womb or after it takes it's first breath). No one knows.

Theologians, scientist or any human being cannot see a soul, and therefore they have no idea when it's placed into a human being or at what stage of development it is placed into that human being.

The heartbeat could possibly signify soul induction, or the soul could be living in the very cell's that begin to form the human being within the womb. Who knows, I don't.

Best not to play around in areas that are grey and/or foggy, because if wrong it's not good.

 

[BackAgain]

NFBW2207221839

BackAgain “….. from nothing to being there is no logical bridge” James

BackAgain220722-#3,798 “The zygote or embryo or fetus in whatever stage of human development is a being like is. Exactly like us but-for …. “”

NFBW: ah yes! but-for. . . as a moral free will human being existing in the vast universe, I bring up the ‘but-fors’ regarding the moral obligations I have to a human fetus living in the womb of a human being also existing with free will in the same universe but unbeknownst to me, and the American Taliban Tag TEAM here cries foul. Not permissible in the discussion. There is no distinction between a fetus and me. END2207221839

Don’t distort. I said but for the specific stage of development. I didn’t address the question of sentience or cognition. That too is a stage of development. And your insertion of the concept of free will is oddly a religious concept and philosophical. It’s not scientific per se. So what did you of all people choose to go that route?

I know you dislike being pinned down. Your waddling and evasions prove that. But it’s quite clear that you aren’t interested in a serious discussion.

So, before I have to just place you on ignore, answer the question. If a human zygote is a living human, with its own unique DNA, then it is deserving of the right to life. Yes or no?

 

[airplanemechanic]

NFBW2207221839

BackAgain “….. from nothing to being there is no logical bridge” James

BackAgain220722-#3,798 “The zygote or embryo or fetus in whatever stage of human development is a being like is. Exactly like us but-for …. “”

NFBW: ah yes! but-for. . . as a moral free will human being existing in the vast universe, I bring up the ‘but-fors’ regarding the moral obligations I have to a human fetus living in the womb of a human being also existing with free will in the same universe but unbeknownst to me, and the American Taliban Tag TEAM here cries foul. Not permissible in the discussion. There is no distinction between a fetus and me. END2207221839

Care to answer the question posed in post 3802?

 

[ClaireH]

NFBW2207220945 the universe in which we beings live has some mystery

NFBW2207211608-#3,783 “The fetus is part of the woman, not a separate being. I don’t need a scientist to confirm that.”

ClaireH220721-#3,786 “Without checking, any medical person who says that a fetus is not a separate life from its mother created his or her own medical certification off a fax machine, but of course they had help.

NFBW: Can you tell me ClaireH or ding or BackAgain or airplanemechanic what an umbilical cord does? It is necessary to deliver nutrients to the baby, and crap when the mother CHOOSES to injest crap...all her choice of course as it's HER body she's feeding as well, even if the mother to be in question considers her growing baby to be a 2nd class citizen, or 3rd as some do. The cord attaches the baby to the mother as you already know but is not part of the baby nor needed by the mother after birth. It is typically discarded by medical personnel or used for stem cell experiments. Some families preserve the cord and afterbirth, but I'll leave the reasoning out of this discussion as it's beyond my cultural beliefs and slightly off topic.

Why didn't you answer the questions posed to you about this topic by other members? You seem to be skilled at C&P so what's up? Hmmm I'd say questions ignored are intentionally ignored yes? Answer this: what is a zygote if not a baby in early stage?

Science confirms it takes male sperm to create a zygote by fertilizing the female egg. Your take that a baby growing in the womb share the mother's life, as if they are of one life and not two, is likely due to your own abortion bias not from miseducation. If the baby and pregnant mother were to actually share the same life, they could never be separated. It's hard enough to survive living following delicate organ procedures such as significant heart surgeries working with actual vital organs, much less if doctors attempted to reduce "1 life" in half. Like that's happening during delivery. Good grief. Food delivery source...there's your cut and dry answer to the cord. That's it.

 

[BackAgain]

NFBW: Can you tell me ClaireH or ding or BackAgain or airplanemechanic what an umbilical cord does? It is necessary to deliver nutrients to the baby, and crap when the mother CHOOSES to injest crap...all her choice of course as it's HER body she's feeding as well, even if the mother to be in question considers her growing baby to be a 2nd class citizen, or 3rd as some do. The cord attaches the baby to the mother as you already know but is not part of the baby nor needed by the mother after birth. It is typically discarded by medical personnel or used for stem cell experiments. Some families preserve the cord and afterbirth, but I'll leave the reasoning out of this discussion as it's beyond my cultural beliefs and slightly off topic.

Why didn't you answer the questions posed to you about this topic by other members? You seem to be skilled at C&P so what's up? Hmmm I'd say questions ignored are intentionally ignored yes? Answer this: what is a zygote if not a baby in early stage?

Science confirms it takes male sperm to create a zygote by fertilizing the female egg. Your take that a baby growing in the womb share the mother's life, as if they are of one life and not two, is likely due to your own abortion bias not from miseducation. If the baby and pregnant mother were to actually share the same life, they could never be separated. It's hard enough to survive living following delicate organ procedures such as significant heart surgeries working with actual vital organs, much less if doctors attempted to reduce "1 life" in half. Like that's happening during delivery. Good grief. Food delivery source...there's your cut and dry answer to the cord. That's it.

Already answered

 

[bodecea]

Always been a question liberals can't answer. It's a simple one, too.

If a "fetus" is part of the mother while inside the womb, why does someone get charged with 2 counts of murder if they kill a pregnant woman?

Why aren't pregnant women allowed to claim a fetus on their taxes?

Why do dead people get more body autonomy than pregnant women?

 

[bodecea]

Don’t distort. I said but for the specific stage of development. I didn’t address the question of sentience or cognition. That too is a stage of development. And your insertion of the concept of free will is oddly a religious concept and philosophical. It’s not scientific per se. So what did you of all people choose to go that route?

I know you dislike being pinned down. Your waddling and evasions prove that. But it’s quite clear that you aren’t interested in a serious discussion.

So, before I have to just place you on ignore, answer the question. If a human zygote is a living human, with its own unique DNA, then it is deserving of the right to life. Yes or no?

And deserving of child support from the moment of con-ception. Plus, time to reset the idea of a birthday back 9 months.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207222109

NFBW2207211608-#3,783 “The fetus is part of the woman, not a separate being. I don’t need a scientist to confirm that.”

ClaireH220721-#3,786 “Without checking, any medical person who says that a fetus is not a separate life from its mother created his or her own medical certification off a fax machine, but of course they had help.

NFBW2207220945-#3,795 Can you tell me ClaireH or ding or BackAgain or airplanemechanic what an umbilical cord does?

ClaireH220722-#3,807 “Food delivery source...there's your cut and dry answer to the cord. That's it.”

NFBW: So, ClaireH if the fetus is separated from the human being that is eating and breathing for it, what happens to the fetus? END2207222109

 

[BackAgain]

And deserving of child support from the moment of con-ception. Plus, time to reset the idea of a birthday back 9 months.

I wasn’t addressing you, troll.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Why aren't pregnant women allowed to claim a fetus on their taxes?

Why do dead people get more body autonomy than pregnant women?

So you have no answer to the question. Thanks for playing.

They can't claim a fetus on their taxes because the fetus doesn't have an SSN yet. Taxes have absolutely nothing to do with being a human or not. An SSN is issued when a baby is born. An SSN doesn't make someone a human, or else every non US citizen would be a non-human as they don't have SSN numbers either.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207222200
ClaireH220722-#3,807 The cord attaches the baby to the mother as you already know

NFBW: Why did you type the following utterly absurd statement knowing full well that every fetus is connected to a living breathing human being. Without that attachment the development of a live fetus stops.

ClaireH220721-#3,786 . . . any medical person who says that a fetus is not a separate life from its mother created his or her own medical certification off a fax machine

NFBW: Can any of you ClaireH
BackAgain airplanemechanic
ding explain how the unique DNA of the fetus can save the life of the fetus if a fetus is separated from the living breathing human being who provides nourishment and oxygenated blood for its survival? END2207222200

 

[airplanemechanic]

NFBW2207222200
ClaireH220722-#3,807 The cord attaches the baby to the mother as you already know

NFBW: Why did you type the following utterly absurd statement knowing full well that every fetus is connected to a living breathing human being. Without that attachment the development of a live fetus stops.

ClaireH220721-#3,786 . . . any medical person who says that a fetus is not a separate life from its mother created his or her own medical certification off a fax machine

NFBW: Can any of you ClaireH
BackAgain airplanemechanic
ding explain how the unique DNA of the fetus can save the life of the fetus if a fetus is separated from the living breathing human being who provides nourishment and oxygenated blood for its survival? END2207222200

Can you answer the question I asked in 3802?

 

[beagle9]

NFBW2207222200
ClaireH220722-#3,807 The cord attaches the baby to the mother as you already know

NFBW: Why did you type the following utterly absurd statement knowing full well that every fetus is connected to a living breathing human being. Without that attachment the development of a live fetus stops.

ClaireH220721-#3,786 . . . any medical person who says that a fetus is not a separate life from its mother created his or her own medical certification off a fax machine

NFBW: Can any of you ClaireH
BackAgain airplanemechanic
ding explain how the unique DNA of the fetus can save the life of the fetus if a fetus is separated from the living breathing human being who provides nourishment and oxygenated blood for its survival? END2207222200

A 10 day old baby is connected to it's mother also, otherwise if she is breast feeding or hand feeding, if she stops what happens to the tiny human being ? Your arguments are ridiculous.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207230010 “bring into being" - Spoken when Jesus walked the earth - partus "act of giving birth, childbirth," from parere "to give birth to, bring into being"

History and Etymology for postpartum - from the Latin phrase post partum "after childbirth," from post "after" + partum, accusative of partus "act of giving birth, childbirth," from parere "to give birth to, bring into being"​

airplanemechanic220722-#3,802 If a "fetus" is part of the mother while inside the womb, why does someone get charged with 2 counts of murder if they kill a pregnant woman?”

NFBW: The fetus is wholly part of and temporarily fully dependent upon the eating and breathing human being that the fetus is attached to. The final stage of pregnancy is called the Postpartum period

So Your “if” airplanemechanic is pure American Taliban Bullshit, but the answer to the question is that a potential life is at stake. THE LAW must assume that at the time of such a murder a pregnant woman’s intent had to be that she planned to allow the pregnancy to go full term. Hence 2 homicides. One for the actualized human being, the other for the latent and potential human being.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207230030

ClaireH220722-#3,807 Why didn't you answer the questions posed to you about this topic by other members?

NFBW: I try to answer all questions. If I missed one, point it out, I will answer it for you ClaireH END2207230030

 

[airplanemechanic]

NFBW2207230010 “bring into being" - Spoken when Jesus walked the earth - partus "act of giving birth, childbirth," from parere "to give birth to, bring into being"

History and Etymology for postpartum - from the Latin phrase post partum "after childbirth," from post "after" + partum, accusative of partus "act of giving birth, childbirth," from parere "to give birth to, bring into being"​

airplanemechanic220722-#3,802 If a "fetus" is part of the mother while inside the womb, why does someone get charged with 2 counts of murder if they kill a pregnant woman?”

NFBW: The fetus is wholly part of and temporarily fully dependent upon the eating and breathing human being that the fetus is attached to. The final stage of pregnancy is called the Postpartum period

So Your “if” airplanemechanic is pure American Taliban Bullshit, but the answer to the question is that a potential life is at stake. THE LAW must assume that at the time of such a murder a pregnant woman’s intent had to be that she planned to allow the pregnancy to go full term. Hence 2 homicides. One for the actualized human being, the other for the latent and potential human being.

So it becomes, to use your words, no longer a "latent and potential" human being if the mother decides she wants to kill it?

There is no provision in the law about whether or not the mom wanted to keep it or any assumptions one way or the other. So with that in mind, that you basically just make shit up as you go along, what if she had planned to have an abortion and was killed standing outside the abortion clinic waiting to get in? Should the man be charged with double murder? Or maybe he should be able to send the family the bill for his free abortion services?

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW2207230117

beagle9220722-#3,816 “A 10 day old baby is connected to it's mother also, otherwise if she is breast feeding or hand feeding, if she stops what happens to the tiny human being ?

NFBW: I covered that. See below - I have two daughters and when they were babies I managed to bottle feed them whenever I had a chance. If a natural mother is not available after the birth of a child other humans can take over .

ChemEngineer220721-#3,774 Challenge any baby murderer to specify the precise second when a developing baby "becomes" a human.

NFBW2207221425-#3,776: a fetus scientifically becomes a human “being” when it can survive outside the womb with continued support from human beings including highly trained medical professional human beings. Prior to that moment it is human but is not a human being. END2207230117