Zone1 POLL: "Where do (your) Basic Human Rights come from? Zone1

[Chuz Life]

Twelve Pages in, and I'm still the only one who has tried to explain where I think basic human rights come from and what my reasons and logic are for that conclusion.

It's kind of ridiculous that we all have so many other debates and comments about subjects involving rights (esp. basic human rights), when we can't even try to identify and agree with each other about what those rights are, or about where they come from or begin.

 

[Chuz Life]

No. I've dealt with you before. I posted, you ignored it, and now you're strutting around like you "won". Go **** yourself. Sick and tired of twats and trolls.

Asking for clarity and for more input is somehow tantamount to "strutting around like I "won?"

Please go ahead and block me. I'll do the same for you.

Edit to add; By the way, I actually marked your one post that came close to answering the OP as "informative."

Even though you made no effort to support your claims or arguments with anything, sort of an explanation.

Just claims.

You even seemed to agree with the idea on some level that at least the "right to one's thoughts" are inherent and exists, even if the government is "fuzzy" with its recognition or protections.

But you made no attempt to explain it further, give examples, etc.

D

Zone1 Post in thread 'POLL: "Where do (your) Basic Human Rights come from? Zone1'

Oct 7, 2025

"Human" rights is a pretty fuzzy term and is often abused to justify violating more rights than it protects.

Inalienable rights, however, are simply by-products of volition. It all stems from the ability of a human to think, and act, for themselves. Whether the government protects those rights, or not, depends on the Constitution and the laws we implement. But the capacity to think and act freely is an inherent human trait.

In my view, the Bill of Rights could have been, should have been, replaced with something more general - "Congress shall pass no law limiting a person's freedom (to...

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[sparky]

So perhaps we really don't have 'rights' at all........we're just egotistical enough to think we do.....~S~

 

[Chuz Life]

So perhaps we really don't have 'rights' at all........we're just egotistical enough to think we do.....~S~

Are you just being facetious, or are you really wanting to make the case?

I'd like to see someone try to prove a negative like that one.

That's a big claim.

 

[TemplarKormac]

Well doesn't our government make laws based upon the ten commandments?

Yes, but does it follow them?

 

[Leo123]

That's what TemplarKormac said and it makes sense but I also wanted to know if morality doesn't come from God then where does it come from? For instance it's against the law to murder and steal but why? Rhetorical question here.

Morality is a societal agreement in how to behave. In a dictatorship, the dictator is the arbiter of morals. In our Constitutional Republic based on Judeo/Christian morals and values that Democratic believers agree is the highest moral power. In our form of government, belief in a Creator and what we deem the Creator would demand morally is the highest moral stance, We don't need more laws we just need belief in a higher power and agree. The alternate is to believe in a few mortal human's definition of morals. Belief in a higher power brings humility that would not ordinarily be present in human beings.

 

[SweetSue92]

As an Agnostic, I can agree to "creator" because that covers it, even if my "parents" are my only creators.

That said, I would like to see any evidence or proof of God, to the extent that is possible.

One evidence is that you have any "human rights" at all....or even think you do.

Without God, you and I are bags of meat and space dust signifying nothing, doing nothing, whose existence means nothing.

Very few people believe that. Another evidence for God.

 

[sparky]

Are you just being facetious, or are you really wanting to make the case?

I'd like to see someone try to prove a negative like that one.

That's a big claim.

Just trying to think outta the box Chuz.....

do we have the right to see the sun come up tomorrow?

~S~

 

[Dekster]

As a realist myself, I couldn't disagree more.

I even shared the link where AI analyzed the comment, and AI does not support your claim either.

Feel free to disagree and use AI to support your bias. Just because authoritarians rely on reality doesn't make reality any different.

 

[ChristisKing]

Yes, but does it follow them?

Yes but its citizens don't always.

 

[forkintheroad7]

Right.

That said, we are not obligated to adopt the thinking or conclusions of "the founders," though.

Agree?

Edit: I think it is likely that "the founders" believed that basic human rights are inherent, and they worded it as "our creator" to be as inclusive of all other views as possible.

If you don't adhere to God's laws and His ways (the ways of Jesus Christ and HIS CHURCH)

it will not matter in the End what you believe about where rights come from... not one bit.

Jesus said that HE is the WAY, the TRUTH and the LIFE, that no one gets to Heaven (the Father) except through HIM.

I guess you don't accept that...

No wonder you suffer from depression (or whatever you call it)

 

[forkintheroad7]

You want proof of God?

Here's my proof (although one does have to recall the word FAITH [as opposed to knowledge alone]):

I know there is a God because the Catholic Church gives us the Real Presence of God [Jesus, same deal] in our Churches. And no one can dissuade me from my Faith, which is exactly what Jesus knew... He knew (and He is God) that we would have to be absolutely convinced of His reality. He knew better than anyone how utterly fallen and depraved we were/are.

That's why He gave us this Real Presence. I have doubted the Bible (mostly before I read it...). I have doubted the sincerity of Christians.. I have doubted so many things.

But when I get a doubt in my head (put there by Satan...)

All I have to do is recall to mind

the Real Presence

and all doubts vanish immediately.

 

[Chuz Life]

One evidence is that you have any "human rights" at all....or even think you do.

How can I verify or validate that claim?

What evidence is there to support it?

Without God, you and I are bags of meat and space dust signifying nothing, doing nothing, whose existence means nothing.

That seems plausible.

Even for all the millions of years of lives lost before us.

Very few people believe that. Another evidence for God.

I must be among the "very few," then, because I am seeing less and less evidence and reason to conclude otherwise.

 

[Chuz Life]

If you don't adhere to God's laws and His ways (the ways of Jesus Christ and HIS CHURCH)

it will not matter in the End what you believe about where rights come from... not one bit.

Jesus said that HE is the WAY, the TRUTH and the LIFE, that no one gets to Heaven (the Father) except through HIM.

I guess you don't accept that...

No wonder you suffer from depression (or whatever you call it)

We agree (God or not) in one respect or the other (or maybe both), it will not matter in the end.

We can only count on the living to have thoughts on "what matters."

 

[forkintheroad7]

We agree (God or not) in one respect or the other (or maybe both), it will not matter in the end.

We can only count on the living to have thoughts on "what matters."

So you don't believe there is life after death?

There has to be... Nothing makes sense otherwise. You implied you are depressed or feel hopeless at times. Everyone goes through that, whether they admit it or not. It's the human condition, as a priest I knew put it once.. All it takes is one look around at the world and how much injustice there is, to realize that there has to be justice some day

and that some day is with God in Heaven

or the other alternative.

 

[forkintheroad7]

We agree (God or not) in one respect or the other (or maybe both), it will not matter in the end.

We can only count on the living to have thoughts on "what matters."

I see you don't comment on my post (just a few posts from this one)

on the Real Presence of God in the Church

 

[Chuz Life]

You want proof of God?

For the sake of this discussion, I do. Sure.

Here's my proof (although one does have to recall the word FAITH [as opposed to knowledge alone]):

?

I know there is a God because the Catholic Church gives us the Real Presence of God [Jesus, same deal] in our Churches. And no one can dissuade me from my Faith, which is exactly what Jesus knew... He knew (and He is God) that we would have to be absolutely convinced of His reality. He knew better than anyone how utterly fallen and depraved we were/are.

"You ask me how I know he lives. . . . he LIVES! Within my heart"

Yeah. I know the song.

Great tune, and I'm not trying to belittle it, because, in some respects, "beliefs" are real. Beliefs (even illogical beliefs) are certainly real motivations for a lot of people in life.

That's why He gave us this Real Presence. I have doubted the Bible (mostly before I read it...). I have doubted the sincerity of Christians.. I have doubted so many things.

But when I get a doubt in my head (put there by Satan...)

All I have to do is recall to mind

the Real Presence

and all doubts vanish immediately.

Great testimony, but, unfortunately, firmly held beliefs are not evidence of fact.

 

[Hafar1014]

Right.

That said, we are not obligated to adopt the thinking or conclusions of "the founders," though.

Agree?

Edit: I think it is likely that "the founders" believed that basic human rights are inherent, and they worded it as "our creator" to be as inclusive of all other views as possible.

Of course you are. Inherent rights are foundation of the American freedom. Rights cant come form the government. We the people create government to protect the rights we own as property. Thats why government are civil servants. They work for us. When government becomes destructive of these ends it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it

Ill point out democrats and the left wing hates this as they want them to be the source of rights

 

[forkintheroad7]

Great testimony, but, unfortunately, firmly held beliefs are not evidence of fact.

You people!

Who told you that what I "believe" or KNOW (is more like it)

is nothing more than "firmly held beliefs"?

JUST WHY do people assume that I do not know anything with certainty?

Presumption is a serious malady

I searched for years and years to find the Truth and I found it... only to hear a bunch of clueless people who have not done the same

tell me it's just a bunch of... what I choose to believe and blah blah blah

Well, you don't at all appear to be on that Narrow Pathway Jesus spoke of so I guess I won't be seeing you in Heaven.. assuming I get there myself.

If I keep interacting w/ people on the forum, I may not..

 

[Hafar1014]

For the sake of this discussion, I do. Sure.

?

"You ask me how I know he lives. . . . he LIVES! Within my heart"

Yeah. I know the song.

Great tune, and I'm not trying to belittle it, because, in some respects, "beliefs" are real. Beliefs (even illogical beliefs) are certainly real motivations for a lot of people in life.


Great testimony, but, unfortunately, firmly held beliefs are not evidence of fact.

There is no proof of god or proof there is no god. It makes no difference. The words "state their creator" That can be nature or anything you want