Parkland, Florida School Massacre Panel Recommends Allowing Willing And Trained Teachers To Be Armed

[Rustic]

More guns, more death.
CDC: Nearly 40,000 people died in gun violence in 2017

\
Hey...doofus....that link doesn't give you the CDC link for the data......you moron...

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

 

[rightwinger]

Here's a good non-lethal suggestion that would have a far less chance of killing kids, as well as would have a good chance of taking the shooter alive.

Arm every teacher with a police style taser, with 4 bolts before needing reloading, as well as has a 35 ft. range. If a shooter showed up, several teachers with police tasers would have a very good chance of stopping them.

Get rid of the Gun Free Zone status, allow parents and other people with business at the school to carry their legal guns, allow trained teachers and staff to carry guns...and there won't be a mass shooting...since shooters won't target that building. We know they won't because they tell us they choose gun free zones.....

Half measures like yours will get people killed...just like gun free zones do.

Even gun safety instructors can't help but shoot themselves. You want kids getting accidently shot regularly?

Ohio gun shop owner killed when gun discharges during concealed carry permit class

Americans use their guns 1.1 million times a year to save lives...get back to us when accidents reach that level ........

That fake news again

 

[rightwinger]

More guns, more death.
CDC: Nearly 40,000 people died in gun violence in 2017

\
Hey...doofus....that link doesn't give you the CDC link for the data......you moron...

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

Over half the time they do

 

[Rustic]

\
Hey...doofus....that link doesn't give you the CDC link for the data......you moron...

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

Over half the time they do

Lol
Na, not really
Anyway, suicide takes care of itself...

 

[ABikerSailor]

More guns, more death.
CDC: Nearly 40,000 people died in gun violence in 2017

\
Hey...doofus....that link doesn't give you the CDC link for the data......you moron...

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

 

[Rustic]

\
Hey...doofus....that link doesn't give you the CDC link for the data......you moron...

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

Suicide is the most cowardly act a human can do, No amount of frivolous gun control laws will change that fact

 

[ABikerSailor]

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

Suicide is the most cowardly act a human can do, No amount of frivolous gun control laws will change that fact

Suicide can be caused by a lot of different things, it's not just cowardice. I was a Navy Drug and Alcohol Program Advisor for the last 8 years I was in, and part of the training was suicide awareness and prevention.

Most of the time, it's because a person is hopeless, and can't figure any other way out of the bad situation they are in.

 

[Brain357]

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

Suicide is the most cowardly act a human can do, No amount of frivolous gun control laws will change that fact

I disagree.
Veterans die by suicide at greater rates, VA finds

 

[ABikerSailor]

Look up Michael Boorda sometime. He was a guy that enlisted in the Navy as an E-1, worked his way up through the ranks until he was able to get an officer's commission, and then worked his way up the chain of command until he became a full Admiral. And, because of his extraordinary career, the Navy created a new program called the Seaman to Admiral program, which is a way for enlisted people to become officers, following the track that Boorda laid down.

And, even though he was an extraordinary man, who did a lot of great and brave things, he committed suicide on active duty, and it sent shockwaves through the Navy.

 

[Rustic]

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

Suicide is the most cowardly act a human can do, No amount of frivolous gun control laws will change that fact

Suicide can be caused by a lot of different things, it's not just cowardice. I was a Navy Drug and Alcohol Program Advisor for the last 8 years I was in, and part of the training was suicide awareness and prevention.

Most of the time, it's because a person is hopeless, and can't figure any other way out of the bad situation they are in.

There is never an excuse for suicide, that why the result of suicide is final... as the way it should be.

 

[Rustic]

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

It's readily obvious that you haven't had to deal with a suicidal person, or have had any training concerning the subject, otherwise you wouldn't have made such an idiotic statement.

Suicide is the most cowardly act a human can do, No amount of frivolous gun control laws will change that fact

I disagree.
Veterans die by suicide at greater rates, VA finds

Lol
Like I said, there is no excuse for suicide... It takes no prisoners for a reason

 

[Rustic]

Look up Michael Boorda sometime. He was a guy that enlisted in the Navy as an E-1, worked his way up through the ranks until he was able to get an officer's commission, and then worked his way up the chain of command until he became a full Admiral. And, because of his extraordinary career, the Navy created a new program called the Seaman to Admiral program, which is a way for enlisted people to become officers, following the track that Boorda laid down.

And, even though he was an extraordinary man, who did a lot of great and brave things, he committed suicide on active duty, and it sent shockwaves through the Navy.

Human nature is morally flawed, No amount of political correctness will change that fact

 

[hadit]

Armed Security Guard did not take on an AR-15

Why should a teacher?

Because he's trapped in a room with kids he's responsible for and no way out.

Doors that can be barricaded will do the same thing

It's that compatible with other safety concerns, such as preventing students from being able to barricade themselves out of the reach of school authorities?

 

[ABikerSailor]

And, here is another one where a Navy Admiral committed suicide recently........

U.S. Navy admiral Scott Stearney found dead in apparent suicide

Vice Adm. Scott Stearney, who oversaw U.S. naval forces in the Middle East, was found dead Saturday in his residence in Bahrain, officials said. Defense officials told CBS News they are calling it an "apparent suicide."




Stearney was the commander of the U.S. Navy's Bahrain-based 5th Fleet. Rear Adm. Paul Schlise, the deputy commander of the 5th Fleet, has assumed command, the Navy said in a statement.

"This is devastating news for the Stearney family, for the team at 5th Fleet, and for the entire U.S. Navy," Chief of Naval Operations Adm. John Richardson said. "Scott Stearney was a decorated Naval warrior. He was a devoted husband and father, and he was a good friend to all."


And, here is an example of an Army General killing themselves on active duty.........

Army report: Self-doubt and sleep deprivation led to 2-star's suicide

Maj. Gen. John Rossi was two days away from pinning on a third star and taking the reins at U.S. Army Space and Missile Defense Command last summer when he hanged himself.

Army investigators ruled his July 31 death a suicide and attributed the tragedy to a wave of career and medical stress that impaired his judgment and distorted his sense of self-worth, coming to a head that last week in July, according to a 15-6 investigation released Wednesday.

"They ultimately overwhelmed his psychological defenses and ability to cope with these negative emotions, resulting in his decision to commit suicide during the last period of time in which he was likely to be alone before assuming command of the SMDC," according to the report.

The findings have prompted an Army-wide review of mental health issues in the general officer corps to be headed up by a three-star, Army Secretary Eric Fanning told Army Times in a Jan. 4 interview.



Hate to tell you, but cowardice isn't the only reason for suicide.

 

[hadit]

More guns, more death.
CDC: Nearly 40,000 people died in gun violence in 2017

Let's examine that saying. Is it factual or is it trite and not really true?

Where do most of those deaths occur, in areas with strong anti-gun laws or in areas with lax anti-gun laws? If it were true, one would expect to find less gun violence in areas where guns are more difficult to access, more heavily regulated, and where penalties for misuse are harsher. Is that indeed the case or is the opposite true?

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Seems like in the last few mass shootings, armed police officers were shot and killed.

So tell me again, if you arm more people, fewer people will die?

Or is it, more armed police and fewer people will die?

To me, it's seems obvious that if there were fewer guns, fewer people would be shot.

But Republican logic says that's not true. Course, their idea of "safe" is arm everyone in a crowded and dark theater. Now that's safety.

And your false logic is just that...false. As soon as the police arrived the shooters committed suicide, surrendered or ran away, if the police didn't shoot them first. Armed citizens on the site of mass public shootings have a 94% success rate at stopping mass shooters or limiting the number of killed....

Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events [FBI]

Of all the active shooter events there were 33 at which an armed citizen was present. Of those, Armed Citizens were successful at stopping the Active shooter 75.8% of the time (25 incidents) and were successful in reducing the loss of life in an additional 18.2% (6) of incidents. In only 2 of the 33 incidents (6.1%) was the Armed Citizen(s) not helpful in any way in stopping the active shooter or reducing the loss of life.

Thus the headline of our report that Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events.


In the 2 incidents at which the armed citizen “failed” to stop or slow the active shooter, one is the previously mentioned incident with hunters. The other is an incident in which the CCWer was shot in the back in a Las Vegas Walmart when he failed to identify that there were 2 Active Shooters involved in the attack. He neglected to identify the one that shot him in the back while he was trying to ambush the other perpetrator.

We also decided to look at the breakdown of events that took place in gun free zones and the relative death toll from events in gun free zones vs non-gun-free zones.

Of the 283 incidents in our data pool, we were unable to identify if the event took place in a gun-free zone in a large number (41%) of the events. Most of the events took place at a business, church, home, or other places at which as a rule of law it is not a gun free zone but potentially could have been declared one by the property owner. Without any information in the FBI study or any indication one way or the other from the news reports, we have indicated that event with a question mark.

If you look at all of the Active Shooter events (pie chart on the top) you see that for those which we have the information, almost twice as many took place in gun free zones than not; but realistically the vast majority of those for which we have no information (indicated as ?) are probably NOT gun free zones.

If you isolate just the events at which 8 or more people were killed the data paints a different picture (pie chart on the bottom). In these incidents, 77.8% took place in a gun-free zone suggesting that gun free zones lead to a higher death rate vs active shooter events in general

=====

One of the final metrics we thought was important to consider is the potential tendency for armed citizens to injure or kill innocent people in their attempt to “save the day.” A common point in political discussions is to point out the lack of training of most armed citizens and the decrease in safety inherent in their presence during violent encounters.

As you can see below, however, at the 33 incidents at which Armed Citizens were present, there were zero situations at which the Armed Citizen injured or killed an innocent person. It never happened.

Would you knock this crap off. You are so misinformed, you must be a trumpite.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

and think about it but a retired Marine or Army Veteran all dressed for a day of School Duty , all Polished and Pressed and walking the Halls with an AR15 and with a sidearm on the hip is likely to impress young students and might get the young students interested in guns and shooting which would be a good thing DeanRD .

You are aware that mass shooters are too often veterans?

Very wrong, very wrong and misinformed.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Here's a good non-lethal suggestion that would have a far less chance of killing kids, as well as would have a good chance of taking the shooter alive.

Arm every teacher with a police style taser, with 4 bolts before needing reloading, as well as has a 35 ft. range. If a shooter showed up, several teachers with police tasers would have a very good chance of stopping them.

Get rid of the Gun Free Zone status, allow parents and other people with business at the school to carry their legal guns, allow trained teachers and staff to carry guns...and there won't be a mass shooting...since shooters won't target that building. We know they won't because they tell us they choose gun free zones.....

Half measures like yours will get people killed...just like gun free zones do.

Even gun safety instructors can't help but shoot themselves. You want kids getting accidently shot regularly?

Ohio gun shop owner killed when gun discharges during concealed carry permit class

"OMG! I found a story about one guy! It's an EPIDEMIC!"

They are quite easy to find princess.
California teacher accidentally fires gun and injures student - CNN

1.1 million times a year Americans use their guns to save lives..... 18 states already allow teachers to carry guns...... you have to find a lot more....

Again, stop making shit up.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Hey doofus, 40,000 dead.

Nope...not until they link to the actual CDC data...and suicides do not count...

Suicides are increasing with your guns.

Suicide is an incurable disease of cowardliness...
Firearms have nothing to do with it

Over half the time they do

Lol
Na, not really
Anyway, suicide takes care of itself...

The problem is, many times Suicide also takes others with them like suicide by cop, ALL Mass shooters, domestic disputes turned bad, etc..

 

[2aguy]

The school had over 3,200 students plus staff and 12 buildings on campus....normal, law abiding people were not allowed to carry their legal guns with them, as they can in so many other places.....because it was against the law...had there been armed citizens there, the chances of them keeping the kid away to begin with would have been pretty good...and had they been in the area? Armed citizens have 94% success rate at stopping mass shooters and/or limiting the injuries and death.......

Tasers won't do that....

Imagine all the friendly fire.
Friendly Fire Killed Sheriff's Sergeant At Thousand Oaks, Calif., Shooting Scene

Yes.....that is why you need an armed civilian....

Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events [FBI]

Of all the active shooter events there were 33 at which an armed citizen was present. Of those, Armed Citizens were successful at stopping the Active shooter 75.8% of the time (25 incidents) and were successful in reducing the loss of life in an additional 18.2% (6) of incidents. In only 2 of the 33 incidents (6.1%) was the Armed Citizen(s) not helpful in any way in stopping the active shooter or reducing the loss of life.

Thus the headline of our report that Armed Citizens Are Successful 94% Of The Time At Active Shooter Events.


In the 2 incidents at which the armed citizen “failed” to stop or slow the active shooter, one is the previously mentioned incident with hunters. The other is an incident in which the CCWer was shot in the back in a Las Vegas Walmart when he failed to identify that there were 2 Active Shooters involved in the attack. He neglected to identify the one that shot him in the back while he was trying to ambush the other perpetrator.

We also decided to look at the breakdown of events that took place in gun free zones and the relative death toll from events in gun free zones vs non-gun-free zones.

Of the 283 incidents in our data pool, we were unable to identify if the event took place in a gun-free zone in a large number (41%) of the events. Most of the events took place at a business, church, home, or other places at which as a rule of law it is not a gun free zone but potentially could have been declared one by the property owner. Without any information in the FBI study or any indication one way or the other from the news reports, we have indicated that event with a question mark.

If you look at all of the Active Shooter events (pie chart on the top) you see that for those which we have the information, almost twice as many took place in gun free zones than not; but realistically the vast majority of those for which we have no information (indicated as ?) are probably NOT gun free zones.

If you isolate just the events at which 8 or more people were killed the data paints a different picture (pie chart on the bottom). In these incidents, 77.8% took place in a gun-free zone suggesting that gun free zones lead to a higher death rate vs active shooter events in general

=====

One of the final metrics we thought was important to consider is the potential tendency for armed citizens to injure or kill innocent people in their attempt to “save the day.” A common point in political discussions is to point out the lack of training of most armed citizens and the decrease in safety inherent in their presence during violent encounters.

As you can see below, however, at the 33 incidents at which Armed Citizens were present, there were zero situations at which the Armed Citizen injured or killed an innocent person. It never happened.

Yeah it works out really well.
Man Killed by Police at Alabama Mall Was a ‘Good Guy With a Gun,’ Family’s Lawyer Says

Yep...this is why you need armed citizens, they shoot fewer innocent people than police...

As you can see below, however, at the 33 incidents at which Armed Citizens were present, there were zero situations at which the Armed Citizen injured or killed an innocent person. It never happened.

A recent study
John Donohue, a law professor at Stanford University, was a co-author of a National Bureau of Economic Research study that examined how gun violence coincides with the ability for individuals to carry concealed weapons, known as Right To Carry (RTC) laws. The NBER study discredited the idea of the “good guy with a gun” as a possible solution to gun violence.

Donohue told ABC News that the research “concluded that allowing citizens to carry handguns seems to increase violent crime 13 to 15 percent by the 10th year” of the laws being enacted in the state.

Another takeaway from the NBER report is that the presence of the gun could turn a would-be good guy into an intentional or unintentional bad guy.

Reports cast doubt on 'good guy with a gun' theory in mass shootings

He is an actual hack....here....an actual study...Looking at every year, every state, applying poverty rates and other factors...

The study...
https://www.journalacs.org/article/S1072-7515(18)32074-X/abstract

Results


During the study period, all states moved to adopt some form of concealed-carry legislation, with a trend toward less restrictive legislation. After adjusting for state and year, there was no significant association between shifts from restrictive to nonrestrictive carry legislation on violent crime and public health indicators. Adjusting further for poverty and unemployment did not significantly influence the results.

Conclusions
This study demonstrated no statistically significant association between the liberalization of state level firearm carry legislation over the last 30 years and the rates of homicides or other violent crime. Policy efforts aimed at injury prevention and the reduction of firearm-related violence should likely investigate other targets for potential intervention.