Zone1 On the fall of Lucifer

[Monk-Eye]

" Morpheme Etymology Invoke King Sol Goad "

* Failed To Coincide Proffered Analogies *

I think assigning celestial bodies as manifestations of spiritual events came after the actual events occurred. The sun and moon are more accurate representations of God and Lucifer. God rules the daylight (truth, righteousness), Lucifer/Satan rules the night (falsehood, evil).

Sew now yearn goad is deity of the sun son , a solar deity ?

The sin mythology is for a deity of the moon .

The luciferian mythology is associated with a deity of planet venus , that is commonly alluded to as morning star and evening star .

While sin mythology and luciferian mythology may share a common thread in some fable , the two mythologies are not equivalent .

. The Book of Revelation (KJV King James Version) .
rev 22
[16] I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

. Sin (mythology) - Wikipedia .

. Phosphorus (morning star) - Wikipedia .
The Latin word corresponding to Greek "Phosphorus" is "Lucifer". ....While at an early stage the Morning Star (called Phosphorus and other names) and the Evening Star (referred to by names such as Hesperus) were thought of as two celestial objects, the Greeks accepted that the two were the same, but they seem to have continued to treat the two mythological entities as distinct.

. Morning Star - Wikipedia .

• Morning star, most commonly used as a name for the planet Venus when it appears in the east before sunrise
  
  • See also Venus in culture
• Morning star, a name for the star Sirius, which appears in the sky just before sunrise from early July to mid-September
• Morning star, a (less common) name for the planet Mercury when it appears in the east before sunrise
• Heliacal rising, the astronomical occurrence when a star rises and becomes visible over the eastern horizon before sunrise, thus becoming a morning star.

 

[presonorek]

I've read revelations a few times and it's like some crazy comic book story
it's so hard to follow what is going on, I was wrote over 2000 years ago
what was the mindset then as it's nothing we know of now
it reads likes like a crazy fantasy tale of good and evil

In the beginning of Revelations it says that this is a vision that John saw. Have you ever had a crazy dream? Well Revelation is a crazy dream. It was just more vivid and more memorable than the dreams we have. Let me give an example of a modern dream.

"My sister was sitting in the backseat of my car but she was a horse but I knew she was my sister. I was upfront driving but it looked like I was in a golf cart and two men kept chasing me while they were holding dogs. One guy was my fourth grade teacher and the other one was the lady that works at the local grocery store. (I know it was a man but it was the lady from the grocery store don't ask me to explain it.) My sister kept throwing jelly beans at these two men but every time she threw a black one it hit me in the face while I was trying to drive. When I crashed the car it scared me so bad that I woke up."

I hope that helps you put Revelation into context.

 

[Meriweather]

Well Revelation is a crazy dream.

Revelation is apocalyptic literature, popular at the time it was written. It uses a lot of symbolism, but if one knows that 'code', it's easily understood. When John wrote Revelation, Jews immediately understood it, but the Romans did not, which worked out for the best in Christian communities.

 

[egp320i]

In the beginning of Revelations it says that this is a vision that John saw. Have you ever had a crazy dream? Well Revelation is a crazy dream. It was just more vivid and more memorable than the dreams we have. Let me give an example of a modern dream.

"My sister was sitting in the backseat of my car but she was a horse but I knew she was my sister. I was upfront driving but it looked like I was in a golf cart and two men kept chasing me while they were holding dogs. One guy was my fourth grade teacher and the other one was the lady that works at the local grocery store. (I know it was a man but it was the lady from the grocery store don't ask me to explain it.) My sister kept throwing jelly beans at these two men but every time she threw a black one it hit me in the face while I was trying to drive. When I crashed the car it scared me so bad that I woke up."

I hope that helps you put Revelation into context.

could or could not have been and as meriweather stated some code the jews could figure out but the romans could not, nobody really knows, it was written over 2000 years ago

 

[Woodznutz]

could or could not have been and as meriweather stated some code the jews could figure out but the romans could not, nobody really knows, it was written over 2000 years ago

A lot of prophecy and symbolism isn't understood until after it happens. "Oh, that's what that meant."

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Re

Revelation is apocalyptic literature, popular at the time it was written. It uses a lot of symbolism, but if one knows that 'code', it's easily understood. When John wrote Revelation, Jews immediately understood it, but the Romans did not, which worked out for the best in Christian communitie

could or could not have been and as meriweather stated some code the jews could figure out but the romans could not, nobody really knows, it was written over 2000 years ago

Also, "the Jews" DIDN'T understand the "code." It was intended for the FOLLOWERS of Jesus only. Sadly, most of modern professing Christianity has willingly chosen to follow a paganized christ

 

[Meriweather]

could or could not have been and as meriweather stated some code the jews could figure out but the romans could not, nobody really knows, it was written over 2000 years ago

William Barclay, who described himself as an Evangelical liberal, has a great commentary on the Book of Revelation. I recommend it.

 

[Meriweather]

Also, "the Jews" DIDN'T understand the "code." It was intended for the FOLLOWERS of Jesus only. Sadly, most of modern professing Christianity has willingly chosen to follow a paganized christ

Recall at that time John and the other Apostles had disciples who were Jews. It was Paul was the Apostle to the Gentiles.

 

[Woodznutz]

William Barclay, who described himself as an Evangelical liberal, has a great commentary on the Book of Revelation. I recommend it.

I just read Barclay's rather lengthy thoughts on Revelation 12. He cites many biblical parallels but falls short in some important respects, imo.

 

[Meriweather]

I just read Barclay's rather lengthy thoughts on Revelation 12. He cites many biblical parallels but falls short in some important respects, imo.

Which point(s) do you feel he misses?

 

[Woodznutz]

Which point(s) do you feel he misses?

Specifically, the length of time that the church would be under the protection of God in the wilderness using the 'day for a year' principle. I believe it has everything to do with the persecution of the church by the papacy and its emergence with the Reformation.

And, while he rightly observes that the messiah will come out of Israel, he only weakly suggests that the church will as well. He could have cited Jesus' commission to go only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel for the purpose of 'building his church'.

 

[Carl in Michigan]

Recall at that time John and the other Apostles had disciples who were Jews. It was Paul was the Apostle to the Gentiles.

"The Jews" as a whole reject Christ as the Son. You know that.
No, they didn't understand, except for the FEW called by the Father

 

[Meriweather]

the length of time that the church would be under the protection of God in the wilderness

Where we differ, is that one perspective is that John was writing to people in his own time, encouraging them to keep heart, reminding them God's people had gone through tough times before. The other perspective is that John wasn't even writing to the early Christians in the early Church. He was talking about thousands of years into the future.

Church perspectives: Apparently you, the LDS faith, and even other denominations perceive the Catholic Church as the enemy. However, Catholic/Orthodox have the perspective that Christ built his church--and not even the gates of hell will prevail against it. The first issue is that Christ was going to build a Church/Assembly not write scripture. It was the Catholic Church that formed and canonized scripture while keeping close watch on it is the Church/Assembly Christ gave us, not the scripture. Note that Christ tells the Apostles up front that things are going to go wrong in the Assembly: Good intentions will lead to trouble, some people in power will turn out to be wolves in sheep's clothing, etc. But fear not. Not even hell can prevail against this Assembly, and further, not even hell can prevent the good that pours forth from the Assembly/Church. When people left the Church, we heard Christ's own words: Will you leave me, too?

 

[Woodznutz]

Where we differ, is that one perspective is that John was writing to people in his own time, encouraging them to keep heart, reminding them God's people had gone through tough times before. The other perspective is that John wasn't even writing to the early Christians in the early Church. He was talking about thousands of years into the future.

Church perspectives: Apparently you, the LDS faith, and even other denominations perceive the Catholic Church as the enemy. However, Catholic/Orthodox have the perspective that Christ built his church--and not even the gates of hell will prevail against it. The first issue is that Christ was going to build a Church/Assembly not write scripture. It was the Catholic Church that formed and canonized scripture while keeping close watch on it is the Church/Assembly Christ gave us, not the scripture. Note that Christ tells the Apostles up front that things are going to go wrong in the Assembly: Good intentions will lead to trouble, some people in power will turn out to be wolves in sheep's clothing, etc. But fear not. Not even hell can prevail against this Assembly, and further, not even hell can prevent the good that pours forth from the Assembly/Church. When people left the Church, we heard Christ's own words: Will you leave me, too?

The Reformation put an end to the power of the RCC to dictate the Christian religion.

 

[Meriweather]

"The Jews" as a whole reject Christ as the Son. You know that.
No, they didn't understand, except for the FEW called by the Father

Jews do not reject God. When the Temple fell (and even prior to this), a number of Jews accepted what would become known as Christianity. Remember the First Church Council--the Council of Jerusalem? This was not held because some Gentiles thought all of Christianity should be circumcised and observe Jewish dietary Law, etc. It was because the great number of Jews thought that Gentiles should enter Christianity through Judaism, following Jewish customs and Laws in order to become Christian. When the Temple was demolished those of the Jewish faith who were skeptical of Jesus and the new Church, had to make a few changes themselves. First, Herod's Temple could not become known as the third temple because the third temple heralded the coming of the Messiah. It was pointed out as the Second Temple still operated outside Herald's Temple, Herod's Temple was only a renovation of the Second Temple. Therefore, Jesus could not be the Messiah prophesied and so on.

Better, Jewish authorities and faithful Jews themselves reminded one another of the ills that befell the Judah and all the Israelites when they turned to false gods. They pointed out that there was only One God--and that God was not human. Therefore to consider a human (Jesus) God, and worship him was clearly idol worship. Time and time again Jews suffered when they began worshiping idols.

It is truly a matter of faith to believe Jesus is the Word made flesh, and worship him as absolutely true God and true man. It is also a matter of great faith to believe God's Word was not made flesh, and to continually, constantly, and devotedly worship God our Creator. When faced with this, can we humans truly judge which requires the greater faith in our God?

 

[Meriweather]

The Reformation put an end to the power of the RCC to dictate the Christian religion.

No, it did not put an end to the power of the Catholic Church to guide Christ's Assembly/Church. Some decided each individual through the power of the Holy Spirit could decide the meaning of each scripture verse of him/herself, and decide the Way for him/herself. So off they went, losing some of the scriptures, the sacraments, traditions, and even joining together for community worship every Sunday.

 

[Woodznutz]

No, it did not put an end to the power of the Catholic Church to guide Christ's Assembly/Church. Some decided each individual through the power of the Holy Spirit could decide the meaning of each scripture verse of him/herself, and decide the Way for him/herself. So off they went, losing some of the scriptures, the sacraments, traditions, and even joining together for community worship every Sunday.

Many Protestant denominations accept the RCC as a religious authority. However, Christ hasn't vested his church in any single denomination. The church is a spiritual organism. What binds the church together is the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Meriweather]

Many Protestant denominations accept the RCC as a religious authority. However, Christ hasn't vested his church in any single denomination. The church is a spiritual organism. What binds the church together is the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

And when individuals claim the Holy Spirit gave opposing guidance?

 

[Shiversepter]

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So many, many comments to read and I enjoy reading what others feel and beleive.


When many people hear the title " Fallen Angel " they are imagining the Sinful , Sexually Devant - " Lust Angels " whom had Fallen Down From Heaven and went after " Strange Flesh

☞ many people believe that " Isaiah 14 " is about Satan or the Angel / Lucifer -

this word Lucifer is an Italian / Latin word that is dedicated to the definition of " Light " Glory, Shining

But- the original Hebrew word was { Hallal } / = meaning Glory, Praise, Shining, Brilliance and Commended - Boasting, Shining - Raging

or drawing great overly attention to yourself = Hallal

Hallal - Lucifer in the Italian and English Translations

son of the morning! - this simply refers to “ AT THE DAWN OR MORNING OR BEGENING OF CREATION OR BEGENNING OF AN ERA OR ANY IMPORTANT TIME -

" the sons of God " they were the morning stars who sang with joy

In the Bible, there are three terms

1. rising in the morning. - 2. morning stars. - 3. son of the morning.

These are SYMBOLIC allegoric meaning of the character and denotation and the illustration of symbolism = meaning …………. to own or to control or dominate or to EXIST in - the early morning dawn of a historical period, timeline or time – frame.

The context is " - to have dominion at the beginning “ or start or originate or " be born " in the onset of a beginning time. “ The dawn “ has a symbolic meaning of the first appearance of light in the sky before sunrise. "the new pink rose light of dawn" daybreak, sunrise, first light, daylight; to begin, break, arrive, emerge or come into existence. A new era in history or beginning of a phenomenon or period of time, especially one considered favorable, dominating, controlling or first or primary control

“ MORNING STARS " or " SONS OF THE MORNING “ { existing } AT - “ THE DAWN
“ “ THE SONS OF THE MORNING “ -or- “ RISING IN THE MORNING "

This all means the origins of a primary, early or firstly originating place or existence, having, obtaining owning and or existing as { BEING } FIRST ORIGINAL in history, as to exist at the beginning of a period or to possess a possession of rightfulness as of that at the first or original right of power as favorable, dominating, controlling or first or primary control,

ESPECIALLY THE DAWN OR MORNING OR BEGENING OF CREATION- the sons of God were the morning stars who sang with joy

as we see in Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, ……. to him will I give power over the nations:………….. 28 And I will give him the morning star.

Rev 22:16 I, Jesus, am the root and stock of David, the bright and morning star.
Psa 110:3 the day of thy power…… from the womb of the morning: having the dew of thy youth.
Eze 7:6 An end is come, ……… The morning is come unto thee,
Hos 10:15 ……….: in a morning shall the king of Israel utterly be cut off.
Psa 49:14 Like sheep they are laid in the grave;......in the morning; their beauty shall consume in the grave from their dwelling.
Eze 7:7 The morning is come unto thee,..... the time is come, the day of trouble is near,
Hos 6:3 .... the LORD is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us
Eze 7:10 Behold the day, behold, it is come: the morning is gone forth; the rod hath blossomed, pride hath budded.
Hos 10:15 So shall Bethel do unto you because of your great wickedness: in a morning shall the king of Israel utterly be cut off.
Rev 2:28 And I will give him the morning star.
Isa 17:11 .....and in the morning shalt thou make thy seed to flourish: but the harvest........... day of grief and of desperate sorrow.

There are many of these exact type of symbolic words that define momentous events and periods as a new beginning of dominion

Also we see in - Isa 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven { the shining } Hallal / hêylêl / hay-lale-

איך How you - נפלת fell - משׁמים from heaven - הילל / Hallal - the shining Glory - בן־שׁחר
son of the dawn - נגדעת you cut off - לארץ the land - חולשׁ and were weakened -
על־גוים׃ upon the nations

Meaning

HOW YOU FELL FROM HEAVEN THE SHINING SON OF THE DAWN YOU CUT OFF THE LAND

AND WERE WEAKENED UPON THE NATIONS

this passage is explaining that the king of Babylon was LITERALLY weakened upon the nations and fell down from his height of power.

Isa 14:4 ...... take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, : -
I do not believe this has anything whatsoever to literally do with Satan or Lucifer himself - but is simply making a annalistic metaphoric comparison or making a reference to Satan's control and how the king of Babylon, : - is of the same spiritual nature as the devil to sought control in Eden

as a proverb, with Satan himself - compared to the king of Babylon, : -

 

[Shiversepter]

the term fallen angel simply is not a term or phrase that is mentioned in the Bible. The Bible shows that the angels of Satan and evil are still in the heavens and have not been cast down.

we would have to assume that God literally performed a miracle and transformed spirits into human bodies or that God placed horrible, evil and wicked Angels into human bodies.

there are two versions to the story

one says that God immediately cast the fallen angels into a pit in darkness

and another says he placed the fallen angels into human bodies and allowed them to have sex and romance for a few years, before casting them into the pit.