'No Separation Of Church And State': Trump's Religious Liberty Commission Reveals Its Priorities

[ThisIsMe]

Thomas Jefferson would not have agreed.......are you smarter than Thomas Jefferson??

You’re talking about Danbury? That was a letter re assuring a church that the government want going to interfere with their freedom to worship and that the words of the constitution provided a wall of separation in regards to not being able to establish a religion.

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,’ thus building a wall of separation between Church & State." [1, 2]

 

[jacksonlamb]

There is no separation of church and state, it doesn’t exist. The government can’t mandate a national religion. Congress has repeatedly re affirmed, on a bi partisan basis, that “in God we trust” would be the national motto.

That phrase is emblazoned over the stage of both houses of Congress and is on our money.

You don't want taxes going to organized religion.

I don't think anyone cares what you or I believe in.

 

[ThisIsMe]

The founders did not separate the church from the state. Freedom of religion is not freedom from religion.

I’ll push back on this, you absolutely have the freedom from religion in that you are not required to practice any religion, but this does not mean that religion has to be absent from government.

 

[jacksonlamb]

You’re talking about Danbury? That was a letter re assuring a church that the government want going to interfere with their freedom to worship and that the words of the constitution provided a wall of separation in regards to not being able to establish a religion.

Yes, as TJ wrote, a "wall of seperation between church and state."

I’ll push back on this, you absolutely have the freedom from religion in that you are not required to practice any religion, but this does not mean that religion has to be absent from government.

Organized religion does, indeed.

 

[ThisIsMe]

Pro-life folks are often pro-gun. How that works is indeed a mystery.

Because being pro gun does not mean being pro murder

 

[jacksonlamb]

Because being pro gun does not mean being pro murder

Neither does pro choice.

 

[ThisIsMe]

Yes, as TJ wrote, a "wall of seperation between church and state."

That was in a letter to the church in Danbury who were worried that the states that had an established religion would infringe on their rights.

In 1801, the Danbury Baptists of Connecticut wrote to President Thomas Jefferson. As a religious minority suffering under the state's established Congregationalist church, they sought reassurance that their religious liberties were inalienable rights. Jefferson’s 1802 reply famously coined the metaphor "a wall of separation between church and State"

He used the constitutional prohibition of a national religion to assure them that their religious liberties would be protected.

Organized religion does, indeed.

There are no prohibitions of religion being in government, it just says that our government cannot establish a national religion.

 

[ThisIsMe]

Neither does pro choice.

That depends on what you call “life”

 

[ThisIsMe]

Isn't it implied by "...Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof…"?

Those words don’t imply that government must abstain from religion

 

[ThisIsMe]

Sure has been. The Constitution does not establish a church, and it prevents religious oaths.

Tax money to organized religion disenfranchises non-believers, thus validating no taxation without representation.

No, it just means the government can’t assist one religious body and deny another.

There never has been any prohibition of religion in government. Our government affirms the national motto of “in God we trust” every time the legislation comes up, with bi partisan support.

 

[HikerGuy83]

The Christo-fascist right has long wanted to eliminate Establishment Clause jurisprudence and abandon the Framers’ mandate that church and state remain separate.

Nothing coud be further from the truth.

The framers allowed the states to do whatever.

As an example.....

Connecticut’s State Church After the U.S. Constitution​

Yes — Connecticut did have an established church after the U.S. Constitution was ratified in 1791. The Congregational Church was the official, tax‑supported church of the colony and state from its founding in the 1630s until it was formally disestablished in 1818 Wikipedia+1.

How the Establishment Worked​

• Official status: The Congregational Church was the “established Society” in Connecticut, meaning it was recognized by law as the state’s official church teachitct.org.
• Tax support: All residents, including non‑members, were required to pay taxes to the Congregational Church. By 1790, about two‑thirds of religious societies in the state were Congregationalist, while the rest were other Christian denominations teachitct.org.
• Legal requirements: Blasphemy and worship of other gods were capital offenses under the 1650 Code, and religious education was mandated for children and apprentices teachitct.org.
• Schools: The church oversaw local schools until 1795 teachitct.org.

The U.S. Constitution and Connecticut​

The First Amendment (ratified 1791) prohibited Congress from making an establishment of religion, but it did not require states to disestablish their own churches. Many states, including Connecticut, retained their established churches well after the amendment firstamendment.mtsu.edu.

End of the State Church​

• 1818 Constitution: Connecticut adopted a new state constitution in 1818 that ended state support for the Congregational Church, effectively disestablishing it Wikipedia+1.
• This came nearly two decades after the First Amendment, reflecting gradual political and social changes rather than immediate federal enforcement.

In summary: Connecticut continued to have a state church after the U.S. Constitution, with the Congregational Church as the official, tax‑supported faith until the 1818 Constitution abolished it

 

[jacksonlamb]

That was in a letter to the church in Danbury who were worried that the states that had an established religion would infringe on their rights.

He used the constitutional prohibition of a national religion to assure them that their religious liberties would be protected.

There are no prohibitions of religion being in government, it just says that our government cannot establish a national religion.

TJ's are authentic and real. You have an opinion, nothing more.

 

[jacksonlamb]

Those words don’t imply that government must abstain from religion

Yes, it does. Established religion has no place in our government.

 

[jacksonlamb]

No, it just means the government can’t assist one religious body and deny another.

There never has been any prohibition of religion in government. Our government affirms the national motto of “in God we trust” every time the legislation comes up, with bi partisan support.

No, it cannot favor organized religion over agnosticism or atheism.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

We have constantly seen on TV the disrespecting of Christianity and outright blasphemy. Not a single move to do the same to Islam.

Okay but people being disrespectful of another's religion is not the same as a government sponsored/mandated religion. Heck that's why the founding fathers left England, in order to have freedom of religion which is probably the reason that principle made its way into the U.S. Constitution as the 1st Amendment.

 

[jacksonlamb]

It is my right to laugh at others' religions.

It is not my right to prevent them from believing or keep them from worshipping legally.

 

[Superbadbrutha]

Democrats have blacks trapped in urban plantations so who has turned back the clock again. Well its you people who vote for the party that owns you the democrats

That's what you call dumbass MAGA logic.

 

[jacksonlamb]

That's what you call dumbass MAGA logic.

What's a black urban plantation? They are idiots the MAGAtwits.

 

[ThisIsMe]

TJ's are authentic and real. You have an opinion, nothing more.

His words weee indeed real, it they aren’t what you think they are.

 

[ThisIsMe]

No, it cannot favor organized religion over agnosticism or atheism.

Hmm, I’m the same vein, it cannot favor atheism over religion then.


I never said it had to favor anything, I simply said that there is nothing prohibiting religion in government.