Mueller Approval Rating Plummets as Trump Investigation Drags On

[iceberg]

Mueller has an "approval rating"?

Is he running for something?

Only in right wing la la land where facts and evidence are dirty words.

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

 

[iceberg]

speaking of cults, why does the left keep assuming people on the right are fox news hounds? i know very few cons that watch almost any "major news" source cause we know they're all full of crap these days.

it's like you *think* you pulled some get out of jail free card out of the netherdepths of your ass to go AH HA! with. same as going RACIST quick - you're out to kill any cred by associating someone with "bad juju" whether THAT PERSON ever mentioned that crap or not.

very leftist of you. i can see why geaux doesn't want to play. your "rulebook" is jr high at best.

You're right....that is an assumption. However, for years we've seen right wingers base their beliefs in right wing media opposed to actual facts and evidence. Need proof of this....I point you to the current POTUS rants about Obama being born in Kenya. I suppose "FOX News" in this context would represent the right wing media who influences (incorrectly) so many peoples' opinions.

One of the biggest problems is the notion that ALL news sources are "full of crap".....this is the thinking that has to be had if Trump supporters are to believe Trump. News organizations in general will report on what Trump does....if Trump likes the coverage; he'll use it.....if he doesn't like the coverage, he'll scream "fake news". It is an obvious tactic, but for Trump supporters, an effective one.

It is amazing to me how quickly the media became the enemy once Trump took office....just because they have the audacity to report on what Trump says or does. The very people who claimed Obama was tyrannical are supporting tyranny with Donald Trump.

Republicans have hated the media for a long time.

Trump is preaching to the choir.

One of the biggest misnomers on the planet. Republicans hate REAL media because they report facts and evidence. They LOVE media used as entertainment because they can create whatever news they want. Trump looks at the real media as a threat because they report what he says and does........any sort of check on his power he hates. He's proven this over and over.....which makes the Republicans (who claim to stand for "small government") infatuation with the guy all the more bizarre.

The “real media” is a disgrace and literally is getting people killed.

You are just too stupid to understand and recognize propaganda.

How is reporting real facts and evidence propaganda.....isn't that the OPPOSITE of propaganda?

i can misuse a lot of facts and people do it all the time on all sides. 100% true. correct?

would you say the right can misuse / misrepresent facts? if the right can can the left also? if both sides can misuse facts, what exactly are they again?

points of discussion, not an end result. if you see a difference as an end result and not a beginning to understanding, in my mind i'm way ahead of you in at least being willing to discuss "facts" and find our core differences. you seem to want to stop there and go "YOU CONSERVATIVE" and stop thinking.

weak in my book but both sides do this way too much.

 

[Frank the Tank]

When's your next cult meeting? Careful if they give you some Kool-Aid to drin..............ah nevermind, take a big drink! HA!

Let me know if you ever start thinking for yourself and so we can debate issues....

speaking of cults, why does the left keep assuming people on the right are fox news hounds? i know very few cons that watch almost any "major news" source cause we know they're all full of crap these days.

it's like you *think* you pulled some get out of jail free card out of the netherdepths of your ass to go AH HA! with. same as going RACIST quick - you're out to kill any cred by associating someone with "bad juju" whether THAT PERSON ever mentioned that crap or not.

very leftist of you. i can see why geaux doesn't want to play. your "rulebook" is jr high at best.

You're right....that is an assumption. However, for years we've seen right wingers base their beliefs in right wing media opposed to actual facts and evidence. Need proof of this....I point you to the current POTUS rants about Obama being born in Kenya. I suppose "FOX News" in this context would represent the right wing media who influences (incorrectly) so many peoples' opinions.

One of the biggest problems is the notion that ALL news sources are "full of crap".....this is the thinking that has to be had if Trump supporters are to believe Trump. News organizations in general will report on what Trump does....if Trump likes the coverage; he'll use it.....if he doesn't like the coverage, he'll scream "fake news". It is an obvious tactic, but for Trump supporters, an effective one.

It is amazing to me how quickly the media became the enemy once Trump took office....just because they have the audacity to report on what Trump says or does. The very people who claimed Obama was tyrannical are supporting tyranny with Donald Trump.

i've seen the left do the same.

PEOPLE tend to follow news that suits their views. to pretend the other side simply doesn't see the brilliance that is our own thoughts is just an arrogance you'd not likely put up with in someone else now is it?

CNN pushes their views hard and heavy as well and are just as notorious for being "their side only" news but every time a liberal says something i don't say YOU GET YOUR NEWS OFF CNN!!! - i usually do something pretty revolutionary and ask them for their source so i can go look.

even if CNN is presented, i won't GUFFAW and blow it off. i'll see how they're trying to present the "news" and make decisions on it as i go. blanket statements such as FAUX or CLINTON NEWS NETWORK are pre-made decisions on the part of the person doing it and makes actual conversation difficult at best because you just put up a dozen strawmen in front of me i now get to explain OF WHICH i never said a thing about.

stereotypes do that. taking shortcuts in understanding people do that. and while no i don't watch fox news, i also don't discredit them right off either, as i don't CNN. i'm aware of the past and have a good idea what i'll find but i don't go in looking for it to be bad or that is exactly what i will find cause *I* need to find it that way.

the media was the enemy with obama. he just didn't take it to twitter and drag the fight out into the streets. he instead said shit like:
Obama Rips Fox: 'We're Going to Have to Change How the Media Reports' | Breitbart

"And so, if we’re going to change how John Boehner and Mitch McConnell think, we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like. And how budgets connect to that. And that’s a hard process because that requires a much broader conversation than typically we have on the nightly news."

let me stress:

"we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like."

what the fuck is all that about? going to have to change how the media reports?

obama went to TOWN on fox news and started all this division by telling 1/2 an audience they were full of shit. he did it politely with "with dignity" i suppose. but he did it. he then went after individual journalists who broke bad stories on him - sharyl attkisson and fast n furious. she broke it and obama spied on her from there on out. to say that obama didn't go after the media is bullshit. he even went after info wars to shut them down.

now i will not defend any of these outlets. they run their own business and great. i listen to them or i don't. but it is NO PRESIDENTS JOB to dictate terms to our media under any circumstances.

that likely helped birth the "fake news" movement.

all this "supporting tyranny" talk is talk. that's it. we laugh at the other side for the stupid fanatical things they come up with then turn around and do them back to the other side as if suddenly it became clever.

if it was stupid when THEY did it, it's just as stupid when YOU do it.

yet we keep at it in some revenge factor and make up reasons to hate the other side - such as they watch fox news and support a tyrant. while that may make *us* feel better about the various imperfections in the world, it's not true now is it?

so please don't sit there and tell me obama didn't have anything to do with these media wars that are going on. it's a proven fact when one side gets away with something the next side coming in will push it. obama got away with tearing into conservative media and this is the "payback" so to speak for that. trump said "hold my beer" and took it up a notch.

we can either realize this is a bad direction and collectively stop it or we can keep kicking it up a notch til we blow it all up and become venezuela.

would that then make people happy? no. we'd then sit there and continue to blame the other size for destroying everything when in truth - we all did it. together. ironic but still so very stupid.

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

 

[Frank the Tank]

Mueller has an "approval rating"?

Is he running for something?

Only in right wing la la land where facts and evidence are dirty words.

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

 

[iceberg]

speaking of cults, why does the left keep assuming people on the right are fox news hounds? i know very few cons that watch almost any "major news" source cause we know they're all full of crap these days.

it's like you *think* you pulled some get out of jail free card out of the netherdepths of your ass to go AH HA! with. same as going RACIST quick - you're out to kill any cred by associating someone with "bad juju" whether THAT PERSON ever mentioned that crap or not.

very leftist of you. i can see why geaux doesn't want to play. your "rulebook" is jr high at best.

You're right....that is an assumption. However, for years we've seen right wingers base their beliefs in right wing media opposed to actual facts and evidence. Need proof of this....I point you to the current POTUS rants about Obama being born in Kenya. I suppose "FOX News" in this context would represent the right wing media who influences (incorrectly) so many peoples' opinions.

One of the biggest problems is the notion that ALL news sources are "full of crap".....this is the thinking that has to be had if Trump supporters are to believe Trump. News organizations in general will report on what Trump does....if Trump likes the coverage; he'll use it.....if he doesn't like the coverage, he'll scream "fake news". It is an obvious tactic, but for Trump supporters, an effective one.

It is amazing to me how quickly the media became the enemy once Trump took office....just because they have the audacity to report on what Trump says or does. The very people who claimed Obama was tyrannical are supporting tyranny with Donald Trump.

i've seen the left do the same.

PEOPLE tend to follow news that suits their views. to pretend the other side simply doesn't see the brilliance that is our own thoughts is just an arrogance you'd not likely put up with in someone else now is it?

CNN pushes their views hard and heavy as well and are just as notorious for being "their side only" news but every time a liberal says something i don't say YOU GET YOUR NEWS OFF CNN!!! - i usually do something pretty revolutionary and ask them for their source so i can go look.

even if CNN is presented, i won't GUFFAW and blow it off. i'll see how they're trying to present the "news" and make decisions on it as i go. blanket statements such as FAUX or CLINTON NEWS NETWORK are pre-made decisions on the part of the person doing it and makes actual conversation difficult at best because you just put up a dozen strawmen in front of me i now get to explain OF WHICH i never said a thing about.

stereotypes do that. taking shortcuts in understanding people do that. and while no i don't watch fox news, i also don't discredit them right off either, as i don't CNN. i'm aware of the past and have a good idea what i'll find but i don't go in looking for it to be bad or that is exactly what i will find cause *I* need to find it that way.

the media was the enemy with obama. he just didn't take it to twitter and drag the fight out into the streets. he instead said shit like:
Obama Rips Fox: 'We're Going to Have to Change How the Media Reports' | Breitbart

"And so, if we’re going to change how John Boehner and Mitch McConnell think, we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like. And how budgets connect to that. And that’s a hard process because that requires a much broader conversation than typically we have on the nightly news."

let me stress:

"we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like."

what the fuck is all that about? going to have to change how the media reports?

obama went to TOWN on fox news and started all this division by telling 1/2 an audience they were full of shit. he did it politely with "with dignity" i suppose. but he did it. he then went after individual journalists who broke bad stories on him - sharyl attkisson and fast n furious. she broke it and obama spied on her from there on out. to say that obama didn't go after the media is bullshit. he even went after info wars to shut them down.

now i will not defend any of these outlets. they run their own business and great. i listen to them or i don't. but it is NO PRESIDENTS JOB to dictate terms to our media under any circumstances.

that likely helped birth the "fake news" movement.

all this "supporting tyranny" talk is talk. that's it. we laugh at the other side for the stupid fanatical things they come up with then turn around and do them back to the other side as if suddenly it became clever.

if it was stupid when THEY did it, it's just as stupid when YOU do it.

yet we keep at it in some revenge factor and make up reasons to hate the other side - such as they watch fox news and support a tyrant. while that may make *us* feel better about the various imperfections in the world, it's not true now is it?

so please don't sit there and tell me obama didn't have anything to do with these media wars that are going on. it's a proven fact when one side gets away with something the next side coming in will push it. obama got away with tearing into conservative media and this is the "payback" so to speak for that. trump said "hold my beer" and took it up a notch.

we can either realize this is a bad direction and collectively stop it or we can keep kicking it up a notch til we blow it all up and become venezuela.

would that then make people happy? no. we'd then sit there and continue to blame the other size for destroying everything when in truth - we all did it. together. ironic but still so very stupid.

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

 

[iceberg]

Mueller has an "approval rating"?

Is he running for something?

Only in right wing la la land where facts and evidence are dirty words.

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

sure.

can we agree that trump is a slimy piece of shit is an opinion?

 

[rightwinger]

He is a prosecutor

It is not a popularity contest

Oh yes it is. November will remind you folks of that. America is quickly growing tired of Muellers partisan attacks

-Geaux

By November, he will have dropped his report

We will have other things to be concerned on.....like Trumps corrupt administration

 

[rightwinger]

Mueller is a Republican
His bosses are Republicans

Trying to blame this on Democrats won’t work

 

[Frank the Tank]

Only in right wing la la land where facts and evidence are dirty words.

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

sure.

can we agree that trump is a slimy piece of shit is an opinion?

Absolutely.....using pejoratives is always opinion. However, for Donald Trump and his followers......castigating large groups of people just as you have (in reverse) is what led to his popularity. When Trump does it......it makes him a "fighter against the establishment".....when it happens against him, it makes him a victim.

So....bringing this back around to the original subject....there are specific facts that we now know about Trump and his ties to Russia in regards to getting elected in the first place. There is also a whole lot we don't know........we should ALL AGREE that an independent investigation is needed to see what FACTS come out. Those saying Mueller is involved in partisan attacks do the exact thing you claim to dislike.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Well of course. Mueller is toast with the American people

-Geaux
------------------------

This isn’t just me opining, however. A new Washington Post/George Mason poll released Friday finds that 45 percent of respondents disapproved of how Mueller was conducting the investigation, significantly up from 31 percent in January.

Mueller Approval Rating Plummets as Trump Investigation Drags On

Heartless bastard Mueller separated Manafort from his children on Fathers Day!

Manafort is a political prisoner

Free Manafort!

 

[CrusaderFrank]

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

sure.

can we agree that trump is a slimy piece of shit is an opinion?

Absolutely.....using pejoratives is always opinion. However, for Donald Trump and his followers......castigating large groups of people just as you have (in reverse) is what led to his popularity. When Trump does it......it makes him a "fighter against the establishment".....when it happens against him, it makes him a victim.

So....bringing this back around to the original subject....there are specific facts that we now know about Trump and his ties to Russia in regards to getting elected in the first place. There is also a whole lot we don't know........we should ALL AGREE that an independent investigation is needed to see what FACTS come out. Those saying Mueller is involved in partisan attacks do the exact thing you claim to dislike.

Remember when we call Hillary supporters "deplorables" and "basement dwellers"?

 

[Frank the Tank]

You're right....that is an assumption. However, for years we've seen right wingers base their beliefs in right wing media opposed to actual facts and evidence. Need proof of this....I point you to the current POTUS rants about Obama being born in Kenya. I suppose "FOX News" in this context would represent the right wing media who influences (incorrectly) so many peoples' opinions.

One of the biggest problems is the notion that ALL news sources are "full of crap".....this is the thinking that has to be had if Trump supporters are to believe Trump. News organizations in general will report on what Trump does....if Trump likes the coverage; he'll use it.....if he doesn't like the coverage, he'll scream "fake news". It is an obvious tactic, but for Trump supporters, an effective one.

It is amazing to me how quickly the media became the enemy once Trump took office....just because they have the audacity to report on what Trump says or does. The very people who claimed Obama was tyrannical are supporting tyranny with Donald Trump.

i've seen the left do the same.

PEOPLE tend to follow news that suits their views. to pretend the other side simply doesn't see the brilliance that is our own thoughts is just an arrogance you'd not likely put up with in someone else now is it?

CNN pushes their views hard and heavy as well and are just as notorious for being "their side only" news but every time a liberal says something i don't say YOU GET YOUR NEWS OFF CNN!!! - i usually do something pretty revolutionary and ask them for their source so i can go look.

even if CNN is presented, i won't GUFFAW and blow it off. i'll see how they're trying to present the "news" and make decisions on it as i go. blanket statements such as FAUX or CLINTON NEWS NETWORK are pre-made decisions on the part of the person doing it and makes actual conversation difficult at best because you just put up a dozen strawmen in front of me i now get to explain OF WHICH i never said a thing about.

stereotypes do that. taking shortcuts in understanding people do that. and while no i don't watch fox news, i also don't discredit them right off either, as i don't CNN. i'm aware of the past and have a good idea what i'll find but i don't go in looking for it to be bad or that is exactly what i will find cause *I* need to find it that way.

the media was the enemy with obama. he just didn't take it to twitter and drag the fight out into the streets. he instead said shit like:
Obama Rips Fox: 'We're Going to Have to Change How the Media Reports' | Breitbart

"And so, if we’re going to change how John Boehner and Mitch McConnell think, we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like. And how budgets connect to that. And that’s a hard process because that requires a much broader conversation than typically we have on the nightly news."

let me stress:

"we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like."

what the fuck is all that about? going to have to change how the media reports?

obama went to TOWN on fox news and started all this division by telling 1/2 an audience they were full of shit. he did it politely with "with dignity" i suppose. but he did it. he then went after individual journalists who broke bad stories on him - sharyl attkisson and fast n furious. she broke it and obama spied on her from there on out. to say that obama didn't go after the media is bullshit. he even went after info wars to shut them down.

now i will not defend any of these outlets. they run their own business and great. i listen to them or i don't. but it is NO PRESIDENTS JOB to dictate terms to our media under any circumstances.

that likely helped birth the "fake news" movement.

all this "supporting tyranny" talk is talk. that's it. we laugh at the other side for the stupid fanatical things they come up with then turn around and do them back to the other side as if suddenly it became clever.

if it was stupid when THEY did it, it's just as stupid when YOU do it.

yet we keep at it in some revenge factor and make up reasons to hate the other side - such as they watch fox news and support a tyrant. while that may make *us* feel better about the various imperfections in the world, it's not true now is it?

so please don't sit there and tell me obama didn't have anything to do with these media wars that are going on. it's a proven fact when one side gets away with something the next side coming in will push it. obama got away with tearing into conservative media and this is the "payback" so to speak for that. trump said "hold my beer" and took it up a notch.

we can either realize this is a bad direction and collectively stop it or we can keep kicking it up a notch til we blow it all up and become venezuela.

would that then make people happy? no. we'd then sit there and continue to blame the other size for destroying everything when in truth - we all did it. together. ironic but still so very stupid.

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

Absolutely agree with you here.....but, I would then ask you do the same thing when it comes to believing or not believing Trump. When Trump, for example, makes a claim that he wants to "provide health insurance for everyone" but then doesn't tell you HOW he is going to do so....that should be an indication that Trump is lying to us. That level of critique you apply to media is too often NOT applied to the Trump Administration.

 

[rightwinger]

i've seen the left do the same.

PEOPLE tend to follow news that suits their views. to pretend the other side simply doesn't see the brilliance that is our own thoughts is just an arrogance you'd not likely put up with in someone else now is it?

CNN pushes their views hard and heavy as well and are just as notorious for being "their side only" news but every time a liberal says something i don't say YOU GET YOUR NEWS OFF CNN!!! - i usually do something pretty revolutionary and ask them for their source so i can go look.

even if CNN is presented, i won't GUFFAW and blow it off. i'll see how they're trying to present the "news" and make decisions on it as i go. blanket statements such as FAUX or CLINTON NEWS NETWORK are pre-made decisions on the part of the person doing it and makes actual conversation difficult at best because you just put up a dozen strawmen in front of me i now get to explain OF WHICH i never said a thing about.

stereotypes do that. taking shortcuts in understanding people do that. and while no i don't watch fox news, i also don't discredit them right off either, as i don't CNN. i'm aware of the past and have a good idea what i'll find but i don't go in looking for it to be bad or that is exactly what i will find cause *I* need to find it that way.

the media was the enemy with obama. he just didn't take it to twitter and drag the fight out into the streets. he instead said shit like:
Obama Rips Fox: 'We're Going to Have to Change How the Media Reports' | Breitbart

"And so, if we’re going to change how John Boehner and Mitch McConnell think, we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like. And how budgets connect to that. And that’s a hard process because that requires a much broader conversation than typically we have on the nightly news."

let me stress:

"we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like."

what the fuck is all that about? going to have to change how the media reports?

obama went to TOWN on fox news and started all this division by telling 1/2 an audience they were full of shit. he did it politely with "with dignity" i suppose. but he did it. he then went after individual journalists who broke bad stories on him - sharyl attkisson and fast n furious. she broke it and obama spied on her from there on out. to say that obama didn't go after the media is bullshit. he even went after info wars to shut them down.

now i will not defend any of these outlets. they run their own business and great. i listen to them or i don't. but it is NO PRESIDENTS JOB to dictate terms to our media under any circumstances.

that likely helped birth the "fake news" movement.

all this "supporting tyranny" talk is talk. that's it. we laugh at the other side for the stupid fanatical things they come up with then turn around and do them back to the other side as if suddenly it became clever.

if it was stupid when THEY did it, it's just as stupid when YOU do it.

yet we keep at it in some revenge factor and make up reasons to hate the other side - such as they watch fox news and support a tyrant. while that may make *us* feel better about the various imperfections in the world, it's not true now is it?

so please don't sit there and tell me obama didn't have anything to do with these media wars that are going on. it's a proven fact when one side gets away with something the next side coming in will push it. obama got away with tearing into conservative media and this is the "payback" so to speak for that. trump said "hold my beer" and took it up a notch.

we can either realize this is a bad direction and collectively stop it or we can keep kicking it up a notch til we blow it all up and become venezuela.

would that then make people happy? no. we'd then sit there and continue to blame the other size for destroying everything when in truth - we all did it. together. ironic but still so very stupid.

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

Absolutely agree with you here.....but, I would then ask you do the same thing when it comes to believing or not believing Trump. When Trump, for example, makes a claim that he wants to "provide health insurance for everyone" but then doesn't tell you HOW he is going to do so....that should be an indication that Trump is lying to us. That level of critique you apply to media is too often NOT applied to the Trump Administration.

Trump stated he had a health plan all ready that was better and cheaper than Obamacare

Once elected, he turned to Congress and said......give me a plan

They spent a few weeks and came up with a piece of crap

 

[iceberg]

i'm right wing. hell i may be in la la land. but i love facts and evidence.

now disagreeing with you or others - suddenly that makes my facts/evidence bogus and yours right for usually no other reason than they're yours. that can be a leftist thing but i see many on the right do the same.

which you gonna do at this point, tank? keep the stereotypes alive and well or work to understand individuals? i think i've killed every stereotype you tossed out so far this am.

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

sure.

can we agree that trump is a slimy piece of shit is an opinion?

Absolutely.....using pejoratives is always opinion. However, for Donald Trump and his followers......castigating large groups of people just as you have (in reverse) is what led to his popularity. When Trump does it......it makes him a "fighter against the establishment".....when it happens against him, it makes him a victim.

So....bringing this back around to the original subject....there are specific facts that we now know about Trump and his ties to Russia in regards to getting elected in the first place. There is also a whole lot we don't know........we should ALL AGREE that an independent investigation is needed to see what FACTS come out. Those saying Mueller is involved in partisan attacks do the exact thing you claim to dislike.

and how is what is happening to trump any different than what happens to any of us out to justify how we feel about something? you're kinda getting mad at human nature and calling it trump.

and at this point what we do know is obama's DOJ let a lawyer into the country who previously was not allowed here to talk with Trump Jr at Trump Tower. do we really know more than that? have any of these indictments stemmed from this actual issue or was other stuff found they went after?

 

[Frank the Tank]

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

Absolutely agree with you here.....but, I would then ask you do the same thing when it comes to believing or not believing Trump. When Trump, for example, makes a claim that he wants to "provide health insurance for everyone" but then doesn't tell you HOW he is going to do so....that should be an indication that Trump is lying to us. That level of critique you apply to media is too often NOT applied to the Trump Administration.

Trump stated he had a health plan all ready that was better and cheaper than Obamacare

Once elected, he turned to Congress and said......give me a plan

They spent a few weeks and came up with a piece of crap

Evidently....that was just a concoction of the media?!?!?!?!?

 

[iceberg]

i've seen the left do the same.

PEOPLE tend to follow news that suits their views. to pretend the other side simply doesn't see the brilliance that is our own thoughts is just an arrogance you'd not likely put up with in someone else now is it?

CNN pushes their views hard and heavy as well and are just as notorious for being "their side only" news but every time a liberal says something i don't say YOU GET YOUR NEWS OFF CNN!!! - i usually do something pretty revolutionary and ask them for their source so i can go look.

even if CNN is presented, i won't GUFFAW and blow it off. i'll see how they're trying to present the "news" and make decisions on it as i go. blanket statements such as FAUX or CLINTON NEWS NETWORK are pre-made decisions on the part of the person doing it and makes actual conversation difficult at best because you just put up a dozen strawmen in front of me i now get to explain OF WHICH i never said a thing about.

stereotypes do that. taking shortcuts in understanding people do that. and while no i don't watch fox news, i also don't discredit them right off either, as i don't CNN. i'm aware of the past and have a good idea what i'll find but i don't go in looking for it to be bad or that is exactly what i will find cause *I* need to find it that way.

the media was the enemy with obama. he just didn't take it to twitter and drag the fight out into the streets. he instead said shit like:
Obama Rips Fox: 'We're Going to Have to Change How the Media Reports' | Breitbart

"And so, if we’re going to change how John Boehner and Mitch McConnell think, we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like. And how budgets connect to that. And that’s a hard process because that requires a much broader conversation than typically we have on the nightly news."

let me stress:

"we’re going to have to change how our body politic thinks, which means we’re going to have to change how the media reports on these issues, and how people’s impressions of what it’s like to struggle in this economy looks like."

what the fuck is all that about? going to have to change how the media reports?

obama went to TOWN on fox news and started all this division by telling 1/2 an audience they were full of shit. he did it politely with "with dignity" i suppose. but he did it. he then went after individual journalists who broke bad stories on him - sharyl attkisson and fast n furious. she broke it and obama spied on her from there on out. to say that obama didn't go after the media is bullshit. he even went after info wars to shut them down.

now i will not defend any of these outlets. they run their own business and great. i listen to them or i don't. but it is NO PRESIDENTS JOB to dictate terms to our media under any circumstances.

that likely helped birth the "fake news" movement.

all this "supporting tyranny" talk is talk. that's it. we laugh at the other side for the stupid fanatical things they come up with then turn around and do them back to the other side as if suddenly it became clever.

if it was stupid when THEY did it, it's just as stupid when YOU do it.

yet we keep at it in some revenge factor and make up reasons to hate the other side - such as they watch fox news and support a tyrant. while that may make *us* feel better about the various imperfections in the world, it's not true now is it?

so please don't sit there and tell me obama didn't have anything to do with these media wars that are going on. it's a proven fact when one side gets away with something the next side coming in will push it. obama got away with tearing into conservative media and this is the "payback" so to speak for that. trump said "hold my beer" and took it up a notch.

we can either realize this is a bad direction and collectively stop it or we can keep kicking it up a notch til we blow it all up and become venezuela.

would that then make people happy? no. we'd then sit there and continue to blame the other size for destroying everything when in truth - we all did it. together. ironic but still so very stupid.

All I care is that the debate can be had understanding facts are facts. We used to be able to debate issues based on CBO reports (for example).....but now, we cannot even do that because the current Administration has convinced their followers that their word supersedes math or science. When this is the case, debate is pointless. This is the EXACT REASON why Trump went to war against the media, en masse. Then, he can pass a tax cut for himself (or the people who crashed the economy 10 years ago) and raise the deficit to do so......if the media calls him out on it, he can play the victim card. Trump has convinced his people that his word is more important than anyone else's.......no matter how many times it can be proven he is lying.

THAT is where the cult talk comes in.....this is unprecedented in our history....and ungodly dangerous.

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

Absolutely agree with you here.....but, I would then ask you do the same thing when it comes to believing or not believing Trump. When Trump, for example, makes a claim that he wants to "provide health insurance for everyone" but then doesn't tell you HOW he is going to do so....that should be an indication that Trump is lying to us. That level of critique you apply to media is too often NOT applied to the Trump Administration.

i don't put a whole lot of trumps "Made for Prime Time TV" talk than i did when he had his own reality show.

obama said we can keep our own doctor. lie.
you have to pass it to see what's in it - bullshit.

you're taking your comfort zone and giving it latitude you won't give things you're not comfortable with. again, human nature but when the other side does the same thing you're doing but through their own eyes, a fight breaks out where discussions should. that's on both sides and it needs to stop.

 

[BuckToothMoron]

Well of course. Mueller is toast with the American people

-Geaux
------------------------

This isn’t just me opining, however. A new Washington Post/George Mason poll released Friday finds that 45 percent of respondents disapproved of how Mueller was conducting the investigation, significantly up from 31 percent in January.

Mueller Approval Rating Plummets as Trump Investigation Drags On

I really can’t see why Mueller would care he has low approval ratings. He isn’t running for any office, and he is carrying the Dems water without the Dems being subject to his approval ratings.

 

[Frank the Tank]

The problem lies in where you say "my facts/evidence".......there is no "my" or "your" facts/evidence.....there is only real facts/evidence. That's the problem......if, for example, a tax package predominantly benefits the wealthy, that's a fact because the numbers don't lie. Your problem is that you believe there are facts you have to choose from....there isn't. The choice is whether or not you believe in reality or not.

and this is why i say your and my facts. if i don't agree with you - to me that's a start of a discussion to find out where we've gone on different thought patterns and figure out a common ground of which we can agree.

to you it means i suck and seem to live in a fantasy world just to annoy you and the righteous of thought.

Can we agree that 1 +1=2?

sure.

can we agree that trump is a slimy piece of shit is an opinion?

Absolutely.....using pejoratives is always opinion. However, for Donald Trump and his followers......castigating large groups of people just as you have (in reverse) is what led to his popularity. When Trump does it......it makes him a "fighter against the establishment".....when it happens against him, it makes him a victim.

So....bringing this back around to the original subject....there are specific facts that we now know about Trump and his ties to Russia in regards to getting elected in the first place. There is also a whole lot we don't know........we should ALL AGREE that an independent investigation is needed to see what FACTS come out. Those saying Mueller is involved in partisan attacks do the exact thing you claim to dislike.

and how is what is happening to trump any different than what happens to any of us out to justify how we feel about something? you're kinda getting mad at human nature and calling it trump.

and at this point what we do know is obama's DOJ let a lawyer into the country who previously was not allowed here to talk with Trump Jr at Trump Tower. do we really know more than that? have any of these indictments stemmed from this actual issue or was other stuff found they went after?

For God's sake.....he is the President and drives policy. Should be a bit of a higher standard. That was the case in the past....evidently not the case any longer.

When your "feeling" about something is rooted in horse manure.....that's a problem.

I thought Trump said they never met the lawyer at Trump Tower? Would you call that a blatant lie?

 

[rightwinger]

sounds like all you care about are doing things on comfortable terms.

trump went to war on the media cause the media by and large is not news, it's pop culture in action. we're pop rocks, bell bottom pants, bashing microsoft in the 90s, we're a lighted dance floor with john travolta doing his thing all over us. trump went to war on the media cause he knows how to play them to his strengths. they follow along like a puppy dog and give him the attention he keeps going after. annoying as hell on both parts to be sure but i've resigned myself to knowing this is who we are for at least 2+ more years. maybe 6+ if the left can't find their ass quickly and trot out hillary again.

the media calls out trump for eating fried chicken for the love of god. or getting 2 scoops of ice cream or his wife for wearing heels. the media calls him out cause quite frankly, it makes the audience dance and go crazy and click their little pages and increase that count so they can charge more for ads. i doubt most media gives a shit about the truth anymore as they need revenue or they go under. they need ratings or they're replaced so they will go for biggest bang for the buck.

that hardly puts them in an objective place now does it?

you keep mixing in your personal fears about people you don't know into the mix and that makes a convo w/you difficult cause i'm trying hard to ignore it but all this TRUMP SUCKS CAUSE OF w/o recognizing others have also done the exact same thing but your views on them allowed it to be ok is the very nature of thought that got us into this bag of pop culture shit we're in right now.

How is reporting on a CBO report of Trump's tax plan part of "pop culture"?

Your argument is bizarre because, in your mind, all media is questionable and cannot be believed....regardless of where it derives. However, we should believe Trump blindly simply because that's what he says we should believe? It is illogical and nonsensical. There's a difference between the NYTimes and the National Enquirer for God's sake.......it is incumbent on us to be able to tell the difference.

at this point - all media is. i see them far too often take short cuts and not do their homework. i worked my way through college at a newspaper and it was my minor as well. i see so little today of what i learned then being done and it kills me. people point to "media" who say how they feel and use them as facts without even checking on where they got their story from anymore. it says what you need to hear, so true.

while i agree it's incumbent on us to determine the differences, i can't do that if i don't question it going in, can i?

Absolutely agree with you here.....but, I would then ask you do the same thing when it comes to believing or not believing Trump. When Trump, for example, makes a claim that he wants to "provide health insurance for everyone" but then doesn't tell you HOW he is going to do so....that should be an indication that Trump is lying to us. That level of critique you apply to media is too often NOT applied to the Trump Administration.

Trump stated he had a health plan all ready that was better and cheaper than Obamacare

Once elected, he turned to Congress and said......give me a plan

They spent a few weeks and came up with a piece of crap

Evidently....that was just a concoction of the media?!?!?!?!?

That was a concoction of Lying Donnie

 

[AntonToo]

Mueller Approval Rating Plummets as Trump Investigation Drags On

Dang, if this keeps going he will never win his re-election.