K, so those who like the idea of National Healthcare

[Arawyn]

Did you fnd issue w/HMO decisions in the 90s?

 

[editec]

I think the idea of National Health insurance is a good one.

As yet I have not seen a plan that I think is going to solve our HC problems, though.

 

[midcan5]

Me.

Why markets can’t cure healthcare - Paul Krugman Blog - NYTimes.com
http://www.counterpunch.com/ginsburg07242009.html
http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/82/2/PHCBP.pdf

profit
3rd UPDATE: UnitedHealth 2Q Profit Doubles, Membership Declines - WSJ.com

 

[johnrocks]

You won't find liberals "going there" with this question since their savior Edward Kennedy said on the Senate floor when introducing the monster that is HMO's.."We need legislation which reorganizes the system to guarantee a sufficient volume of high quality medical care, distributed equitably across the country and available at reasonable cost to every American. It is going to take a drastic overhaul of our entire way of doing business in the health-care field in order to solve the financing and organizational aspects of our health crisis. One aspect of that solution is the creation of comprehensive systems of health-care delivery".

You see..government is the reason for our problems,not the private sector,imho.

 

[editec]

You won't find liberals "going there" with this question since their savior Edward Kennedy said on the Senate floor when introducing the monster that is HMO's.."We need legislation which reorganizes the system to guarantee a sufficient volume of high quality medical care, distributed equitably across the country and available at reasonable cost to every American. It is going to take a drastic overhaul of our entire way of doing business in the health-care field in order to solve the financing and organizational aspects of our health crisis. One aspect of that solution is the creation of comprehensive systems of health-care delivery".

You see..government is the reason for our problems,not the private sector,imho.

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

 

[johnrocks]

You won't find liberals "going there" with this question since their savior Edward Kennedy said on the Senate floor when introducing the monster that is HMO's.."We need legislation which reorganizes the system to guarantee a sufficient volume of high quality medical care, distributed equitably across the country and available at reasonable cost to every American. It is going to take a drastic overhaul of our entire way of doing business in the health-care field in order to solve the financing and organizational aspects of our health crisis. One aspect of that solution is the creation of comprehensive systems of health-care delivery".

You see..government is the reason for our problems,not the private sector,imho.

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

So solving a problem government for the most part created can be solved with more government? Here is Krugma,while advocating single payor says that 60% of healthcare is already provided by government so if he is so smart,how is that 60% not a huge part of the problem?
http://www.charlierose.com/view/interview/10433

 

[xsited1]

You won't find liberals "going there" with this question since their savior Edward Kennedy said on the Senate floor when introducing the monster that is HMO's.."We need legislation which reorganizes the system to guarantee a sufficient volume of high quality medical care, distributed equitably across the country and available at reasonable cost to every American. It is going to take a drastic overhaul of our entire way of doing business in the health-care field in order to solve the financing and organizational aspects of our health crisis. One aspect of that solution is the creation of comprehensive systems of health-care delivery".

You see..government is the reason for our problems,not the private sector,imho.

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

So solving a problem government for the most part created can be solved with more government? Here is Krugma,while advocating single payor says that 60% of healthcare is already provided by government so if he is so smart,how is that 60% not a huge part of the problem?
Charlie Rose - A conversation with Paul Krugman

Didn't anybody ever tell you that you can always solve a problem by throwing more money at it? This is especially true when you're using taxpayer money.

 

[Zoom-boing]

Whenever our health benefits come up for renewal, we have never, ever chosen an HMO. We always get a PPO (preferred provider). They give you specific doctors in the group but if you choose to go outside of that group, you're still covered. You do have to pay a little more but you can go to whoever you want.

I just heard on Fox that the Dems are now looking to censor the words "government-run health care". You cannot make this shit up.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Whenever our health benefits come up for renewal, we have never, ever chosen an HMO. We always get a PPO (preferred provider). They give you specific doctors in the group but if you choose to go outside of that group, you're still covered. You do have to pay a little more but you can go to whoever you want.

I just heard on Fox that the Dems are now looking to censor the words "government-run health care". You cannot make this shit up.

You're absolutely right.

washingtonpost.com

CNSNews.com - House Democrats Censor Republican's Use of Term 'Government-Run' Health Care in Constituent Communications

Censorship in the Health Care Debate

 

[Skull Pilot]

But then again we obviously have a President who thinks he knows better than a doctor when it comes to certain procedures.

Obama says tonsillitis is a matter of doctors’ greed - WSJ.com

Those greedy doctors. “You come in and you’ve got a bad sore throat, or your child has a bad sore throat or has repeated sore throats,” President Obama explained at Wednesday’s press conference. “The doctor may look at the reimbursement system and say to himself, ‘You know what? I make a lot more money if I take this kid’s tonsils out.’”

is this guy a fucking idiot or what?

 

[editec]

You won't find liberals "going there" with this question since their savior Edward Kennedy said on the Senate floor when introducing the monster that is HMO's.."We need legislation which reorganizes the system to guarantee a sufficient volume of high quality medical care, distributed equitably across the country and available at reasonable cost to every American. It is going to take a drastic overhaul of our entire way of doing business in the health-care field in order to solve the financing and organizational aspects of our health crisis. One aspect of that solution is the creation of comprehensive systems of health-care delivery".

You see..government is the reason for our problems,not the private sector,imho.

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

So solving a problem government for the most part created can be solved with more government?

As I stated rather clearly in my last post, I do not think the problem is being created "for the most part" by government.

Nice try insinuating words in my mouth though.

Here is Krugma,while advocating single payor says that 60% of healthcare is already provided by government so if he is so smart,how is that 60% not a huge part of the problem?
Charlie Rose - A conversation with Paul Krugman

Where is Krugma?

 

[Zoom-boing]

But then again we obviously have a President who thinks he knows better than a doctor when it comes to certain procedures.

Obama says tonsillitis is a matter of doctors’ greed - WSJ.com

Those greedy doctors. “You come in and you’ve got a bad sore throat, or your child has a bad sore throat or has repeated sore throats,” President Obama explained at Wednesday’s press conference. “The doctor may look at the reimbursement system and say to himself, ‘You know what? I make a lot more money if I take this kid’s tonsils out.’”

is this guy a fucking idiot or what?

I just saw a report on our local news last night talking about children who have sleep problems due to tonsils/adenoids causing snoring which woke the kids up throughout the night, causing problems during the day including ADD-symptoms. Once the tonsils and/or adenoids were removed, the children slept much better and their daytime symptoms improved or went away.

But hey, I guess being POTUS gives you special 'doctoring' knowledge, huh?

 

[Skull Pilot]

But then again we obviously have a President who thinks he knows better than a doctor when it comes to certain procedures.

Obama says tonsillitis is a matter of doctors’ greed - WSJ.com

Those greedy doctors. “You come in and you’ve got a bad sore throat, or your child has a bad sore throat or has repeated sore throats,” President Obama explained at Wednesday’s press conference. “The doctor may look at the reimbursement system and say to himself, ‘You know what? I make a lot more money if I take this kid’s tonsils out.’”

is this guy a fucking idiot or what?

I just saw a report on our local news last night talking about children who have sleep problems due to tonsils/adenoids causing snoring which woke the kids up throughout the night, causing problems during the day including ADD-symptoms. Once the tonsils and/or adenoids were removed, the children slept much better and their daytime symptoms improved or went away.

But hey, I guess being POTUS gives you special 'doctoring' knowledge, huh?

But but but Obama can do anything from bringing world peace to eradicating sore throats because he has hope. YES WE CAN



But seriously, I had my tonsils out when I was a kid and I can count on one hand the number of sore throats I've had in the past 40 years.

My son on the other hand is 19, never had his tonsils out and gets a strep throat every year for which he needs three doctor's visits and a course of antibiotics.

Now tell me that my tonsillectomy is more expensive over 40 years than my son's chronic sore throats.

 

[Zoom-boing]

But then again we obviously have a President who thinks he knows better than a doctor when it comes to certain procedures.

Obama says tonsillitis is a matter of doctors’ greed - WSJ.com



is this guy a fucking idiot or what?

I just saw a report on our local news last night talking about children who have sleep problems due to tonsils/adenoids causing snoring which woke the kids up throughout the night, causing problems during the day including ADD-symptoms. Once the tonsils and/or adenoids were removed, the children slept much better and their daytime symptoms improved or went away.

But hey, I guess being POTUS gives you special 'doctoring' knowledge, huh?

But but but Obama can do anything from bringing world peace to eradicating sore throats because he has hope. YES WE CAN



But seriously, I had my tonsils out when I was a kid and I can count on one hand the number of sore throats I've had in the past 40 years.

My son on the other hand is 19, never had his tonsils out and gets a strep throat every year for which he needs three doctor's visits and a course of antibiotics.

Now tell me that my tonsillectomy is more expensive over 40 years than my son's chronic sore throats.

Agree about the cost of the surgery vs. the cost of doc's visits and meds over the course of time.

I was the exact same way as your son. Had tonsillitis a lot as a kid, got something called Quincey (abscessed tonsils) when I was around 19 or so and suffered strep throat off and on in my early twenties and early thirties. The doc never wanted to take my tonsils out when I was a kid because he said they were doing their job. The infection was kept to my tonsils vs. settling somewhere else in my body. Hey, that's what the doc said so I never had my tonsils out. Haven't suffered any type of throat problems since my youngest (who is 12) was 1.

I do know that the less sleep I got and the more stressed I was the more likely I was to get sick when I was your son's age.

 

[Skull Pilot]

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

So solving a problem government for the most part created can be solved with more government? Here is Krugma,while advocating single payor says that 60% of healthcare is already provided by government so if he is so smart,how is that 60% not a huge part of the problem?
Charlie Rose - A conversation with Paul Krugman

Didn't anybody ever tell you that you can always solve a problem by throwing more money at it? This is especially true when you're using taxpayer money.

"Any problem on earth can be solved with the careful application of high explosives. The trick is to not be around when they go off."

Solved with explosives , Valkyrie, Sound Bite

 

[Arawyn]

Me.

Why markets can’t cure healthcare - Paul Krugman Blog - NYTimes.com
Carl Ginsburg: The Actually Existing Health Care System
http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/82/2/PHCBP.pdf

profit
3rd UPDATE: UnitedHealth 2Q Profit Doubles, Membership Declines - WSJ.com

But the same people who are advocating this "plan" (with exception of Obama, he wasn't on scene then) are the same ones who railed against HMOs in the 90s. Do you not see an issue with that?

 

[johnrocks]

The reasons for the HC crises are demographic and technological, more than a question of who funds it or how, I think.

Of course when we enacted Medicade and Medicare we exaserbated the problem, too.

We increased demand without also increasing supply and the escalating cost of HC overall has climbed from about 4% of GNP to 18% of GNP since that time.

But an aging population AND increasingly effective (but expensive) HC procedures are, I think, primarlily the problem we're dealing with right now.

As I stated rather clearly in my last post, I do not think the problem is being created "for the most part" by government.

Nice try insinuating words in my mouth though.

Here is Krugma,while advocating single payor says that 60% of healthcare is already provided by government so if he is so smart,how is that 60% not a huge part of the problem?
Charlie Rose - A conversation with Paul Krugman

Where is Krugma?

Not trying to insinuate anything and you know who I was "talking" about but the typo deflection was rather