I've posted this several times BUT no one especially the MSM seems to understand... we will have blackouts daily with just 50% cars/trucks being EVs!

[healthmyths]

Simply put and all substantiated by links is this:

If 50% of American cars/trucks are EVs, there will be a shortage of nearly 7.25 TRILLION kWh a year of electricity.
Simple numbers.
Today the USA 11,070 electric generating plants generate 4.165 TRILLION kWh a year.
The average EV car uses 0.25 kWh to travel 1 mile Average Electric Car kWh Per Mile [Results From 231 EVs]
The average EV truck uses 4.3 kWh to travel one mile. Battery capacity and recharging needs for electric buses in city transit service (Journal Article) | OSTI.GOV

Average EV Truck
So the average Truck travels 84,433 miles in a year or using about 20,000 kWh per EV truck

How Many Miles Do Truckers Drive a Year?

In our free load board’s latest blog post, we discuss how many miles the average trucker does in a year. Learn more here.

blog.freefreightsearch.com

In 2018 there were roughly 11,000,000 commercial trucks on the roads.
So if 50% are EVs or 5,500,000 they will being using in one year 107,995,697,674 kWh.


Average EV Car
With 228,200,000 American drivers, averaging 14,263 miles or at 1,627,408,300,000 miles at 0.25/kWh equals 6,509,633,200,000 kWh.
Between Car/trucks EVs will use 6,617,628,897,674 kWh or nearly 1.58 TIMES MORE than is generated today!

In other words... Current electricity being generate is 6.617 Trillion kWh.. But 50% of EVs cars/trucks will NEED 6.509 TRILLION kWh.

It takes 10 years to build a nuclear power plant that will generate the average of 14.482 Billion kWh... or this means 456 NEW nuclear plants.
The most recent nuclear power plant is estimated to cost about $7 billion INFOGRAPHIC: How Much Power Does A Nuclear Reactor Produce? or for 456 new plants cost: $3.198 TRILLION.

And who will be paying for this? We Americans will directly with their home electricity bills AND indirectly with their goods/services providers.
So why can't we understand WE will have a massive black outs with 50% of our cars/trucks being EVs.

 

[CowboyTed]

All very well...

But Europe are going that way and they just increased the production of Electricity...

Based on 2019 data, the US would need to produce 20-50% more electricity in a year if all cars were EVs. According to data from the Department of Energy (DOE), the cost of powering EVs is approximately 35-75% cheaper than the cost for gas-powered vehicles per mile

How much electricity would it take to power all cars if they were electric? - USAFacts

Our nation, in numbers. USAFacts provides a comprehensive, nonpartisan view of the state of our union.

usafacts.org

Electricity Grids Can Handle Electric Vehicles Easily – They Just Need Proper Management

One of the most frequent concerns you will see from electric vehicle haters is that the electricity grid can’t possibly cope with all cars becoming EVs. However, they haven’t done the math properly. The grids in most developed nations will be just fine. Here’s how.

www.forbes.com

Myth buster: Electric vehicles will overload the power grid | Virta

Some argue that EVs will make the grid unstable, which could mean hefty investments. Facts and data show why they are wrong.

www.virta.global

Why Electric Vehicles Won't Break the Grid

Though conservatives have attacked California officials for asking electric vehicle owners to unplug during a heat wave, experts say more electric cars won’t topple the power grid

www.scientificamerican.com

And from UK

Busting the myths and misconceptions about electric vehicles | National Grid Group

There are a number of concerns and misconceptions about EVs that are still making people think twice – here we address some of the most common EV myths.

www.nationalgrid.com

So investment will be needed but that investment was alway be needed... Facts are EV use less power than Gas powered cars...

 

[Polishprince]

That's of course the real Global problem with the electric vehicle craze. A lot of countries have had power interruptions for many years. Its called "load shedding".

Its one thing if you are sitting around in an American city waiting indefinitely for a charge, but what if you are out in the country, or out of the country.

You'll feel awfully stupid switching from gasoline if you are stranded and out of power on the Trans African Highway in the middle of nowhere.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Figures don't lie, but watch how liars figure.

If someone was to actually read your link about cars, they would find out the actual statistics, as well as find out that it is much cheaper to use EV's than to use ICE engines for their vehicles.

If someone was to click on the link that you said was about trucks, they would actually see that it was talking about how to make CITY BUSES (not trucks) work better by charging them at the end of each run. Incidentally, there was nothing in there about trucks.

And, the third paragraph was talking about commercial trucks in general, nothing was said about EV trucks.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You'll feel awfully stupid switching from gasoline if you are stranded and out of power on the Trans African Highway in the middle of nowhere.

Hate to tell you, but there are more than likely very few gas stations along your "Trans African Highway", whatever the hell that is. And, also, how does that translate to what is going on in America if what you are talking about is in Africa? That's a whole different continent for fuck's sake.

 

[toobfreak]

we will have blackouts daily with just 50% cars/trucks being EVs!​

I've seen your threads but have not tried to follow the math, but your conclusion doesn't sound too unreasonable without a MASSIVE infusion of money and investment in our electric grid.

As our grid stands right now, I'd say it is just barely holding its own with virtually no headroom with just normal consumption. Add in a storm or some other natural event much less half the country charging 1000 pound car batteries, truck batteries, plane batteries, and bus batteries, and our grid will fall FLAT ON ITS FACE. Especially with that pinhead in Washington taxing an axe to all of our mainstay energy sources.

But as a retired, EE, I realize I'm just blowing smoke!

 

[healthmyths]

Figures don't lie, but watch how liars figure.

If someone was to actually read your link about cars, they would find out the actual statistics, as well as find out that it is much cheaper to use EV's than to use ICE engines for their vehicles.

If someone was to click on the link that you said was about trucks, they would actually see that it was talking about how to make CITY BUSES (not trucks) work better by charging them at the end of each run. Incidentally, there was nothing in there about trucks.

And, the third paragraph was talking about commercial trucks in general, nothing was said about EV trucks.

OK... buses charged at the end of each run.... HOW???? Solar panels? Wind Turbines? The point is "chargers" use electricity.
Where is the electricity going to come from? Please think!
Average EV Truck
So the average Truck travels 84,433 miles in a year or using about 20,000 kWh per EV truck

How Many Miles Do Truckers Drive a Year?​

In our free load board’s latest blog post, we discuss how many miles the average trucker does in a year. Learn more here.

blog.freefreightsearch.com
In 2018 there were roughly 11,000,000 commercial trucks on the roads.

So if 50% are EVs or 5,500,000 they will being using in one year 107,995,697,674 kWh.

 

[Bleipriester]

But Europe are going that way and they just increased the production of Electricity...

Actually, no. Erection of wind turbines is way behind schedule in Germany. And there a some gas issues. There was an extreme price hike that isn´t over though gas prices are down. Electricity price is tied to gas price, seemingly only when the gas price goes up.
I pay 140 € per month only for electricity.

 

[healthmyths]

I've seen your threads but have not tried to follow the math, but your conclusion doesn't sound too unreasonable without a MASSIVE infusion of money and investment in our electric grid.

As our grid stands right now, I'd say it is just barely holding its own with virtually no headroom with just normal consumption. Add in a storm or some other natural event much less half the country charging 1000 pound car batteries, truck batteries, plane batteries, and bus batteries, and our grid will fall FLAT ON ITS FACE. Especially with that pinhead in Washington taxing an axe to all of our mainstay energy sources.

But as a retired, EE, I realize I'm just blowing smoke!

I appreciate your comments. And you are right about the grid failures. Because without the basic generating plants where is the electricity used by the grids coming from? Solar panels-- average number of days in the USA that it is sunny...? Wind turbines

 

[Esdraelon]

Add in a storm or some other natural event much less half the country charging 1000 pound car batteries, truck batteries, plane batteries, and bus batteries, and our grid will fall FLAT ON ITS FACE.

Which condition is the desired outcome. These idiots who push the EVs may believe in what their masters are selling them but the truth is that this is just part of a multifaceted plan to collapse the nations of the west and to force global leadership on everyone.

 

[toobfreak]

Which condition is the desired outcome. These idiots who push the EVs may believe in what their masters are selling them but the truth is that this is just part of a multifaceted plan to collapse the nations of the west and to force global leadership on everyone.

Bottom line is that consumers will be bilked into going EV until it starts getting so bad with so many problems that the outcry demands both a partial return to ICE or the continuation of choice in ICE PLUS massive revitalization of the grid with nuclear, NG and whatever else.

Especially when people start to really suffer over this "green" tech while seeing absolutely NO change/improvement in our climate justifying it.

 

[1srelluc]

Jeez, so you mean they will fuck-up even more of the hinterlands with power-line blight to run lines so the city EV weenies can tool around? Fuck them.

 

[Synthaholic]

I have an entire thread about ways to solve it. Knock yourself out.

Our Solar/Alt Energy Future

It's coming quicker than people think. The solutions are there.

www.usmessageboard.com

 

[healthmyths]

I have an entire thread about ways to solve it. Knock yourself out.

Our Solar/Alt Energy Future

It's coming quicker than people think. The solutions are there.

www.usmessageboard.com

Solar panels eh? Oh I've looked into that... here check out these numbers and tell me how that will work.
Check out these numbers and the sources for them and then tell me solar panels is the solution.

For example a standard 3X5 foot solar panel generates 44.65 kWh per panel.

https://www.gotrhythm.com/blog/solar-energy/how-much-power-does-a-solar-panel-produce

To generate 8.3 Trillion kWh per year or 691,666,666,667 kWh/month for EVs with solar panels at 44.65 kWh per month/panel generating enough will require 15,490,854,797 solar panels at a cost of $200.00/ panel or $3,098,170,959,400 !

How Much Do Solar Panels Cost? (Apr 2024)

A typical residential solar panel system costs $12,000 to $30,000 (or more)

www.consumeraffairs.com

 

[Synthaholic]

Solar panels eh? Oh I've looked into that... here check out these numbers and tell me how that will work.
Check out these numbers and the sources for them and then tell me solar panels is the solution.

For example a standard 3X5 foot solar panel generates 44.65 kWh per panel.

https://www.gotrhythm.com/blog/solar-energy/how-much-power-does-a-solar-panel-produce

To generate 8.3 Trillion kWh per year or 691,666,666,667 kWh/month for EVs with solar panels at 44.65 kWh per month/panel generating enough will require 15,490,854,797 solar panels at a cost of $200.00/ panel or $3,098,170,959,400 !

How Much Do Solar Panels Cost? (Apr 2024)

A typical residential solar panel system costs $12,000 to $30,000 (or more)

www.consumeraffairs.com

View attachment 764485

If solar panels are all you got from that thread, you didn't read that thread. At least not my posts.

 

[candycorn]

Simply put and all substantiated by links is this:

If 50% of American cars/trucks are EVs, there will be a shortage of nearly 7.25 TRILLION kWh a year of electricity.
Simple numbers.
Today the USA 11,070 electric generating plants generate 4.165 TRILLION kWh a year.
The average EV car uses 0.25 kWh to travel 1 mile Average Electric Car kWh Per Mile [Results From 231 EVs]
The average EV truck uses 4.3 kWh to travel one mile. Battery capacity and recharging needs for electric buses in city transit service (Journal Article) | OSTI.GOV

Average EV Truck
So the average Truck travels 84,433 miles in a year or using about 20,000 kWh per EV truck

How Many Miles Do Truckers Drive a Year?

In our free load board’s latest blog post, we discuss how many miles the average trucker does in a year. Learn more here.

blog.freefreightsearch.com

In 2018 there were roughly 11,000,000 commercial trucks on the roads.
So if 50% are EVs or 5,500,000 they will being using in one year 107,995,697,674 kWh.


Average EV Car
With 228,200,000 American drivers, averaging 14,263 miles or at 1,627,408,300,000 miles at 0.25/kWh equals 6,509,633,200,000 kWh.
Between Car/trucks EVs will use 6,617,628,897,674 kWh or nearly 1.58 TIMES MORE than is generated today!

In other words... Current electricity being generate is 6.617 Trillion kWh.. But 50% of EVs cars/trucks will NEED 6.509 TRILLION kWh.

It takes 10 years to build a nuclear power plant that will generate the average of 14.482 Billion kWh... or this means 456 NEW nuclear plants.
The most recent nuclear power plant is estimated to cost about $7 billion INFOGRAPHIC: How Much Power Does A Nuclear Reactor Produce? or for 456 new plants cost: $3.198 TRILLION.

And who will be paying for this? We Americans will directly with their home electricity bills AND indirectly with their goods/services providers.
So why can't we understand WE will have a massive black outs with 50% of our cars/trucks being EVs.


View attachment 764384

Today its 482 plants...

Lets take a trip down memory lane...shall we?

It used to be 2,767 plants...

Then it was over 3,000 plants

And that's just 10% of cars/trucks becoming EVs requiring the addition of 3,460 power plants !

So now we're down to 482. Thanks Joe.

 

[ABikerSailor]

You know what I find funny as hell? That the EV doomsayers are throwing out figures of what the grid is TODAY, not what it might be in the future.

And..................fwiw..................when automobiles first came out, gas stations were a rarity, but, as the auto became more and more prevalent in every day society, more people saw that there was a market for gas, and started to open up more gas stations. Now? They are readily available in damn near every part of the country. You can drive from one end of the country to the other without having to worry much at all about having enough gas to make it to the next station location. Same thing is gonna happen as EV's become more and more prevalent and used by more people.

If we put TOMORROW's EV projections with TODAY's current power grid, yeah, the doom and gloom crowd might have a point, but the fact is, that as something comes more and more into use by the general public, businesses and corporations see that there is a profit to be met by filling a need, and that's how things get built.

As more and more EV's start hitting the roads and getting bought by more and more people, businesses are going to see a need that they can profit from, and they will build the infrastructure required.

Need examples of that happening? Look no farther than your cell phone. 20 years ago, having a charger in your car for your cell phone was almost unheard of, but now? You can't hardly find a car nowadays that DOESN'T have a phone charger in it. Same thing with businesses, they saw that people started to use their phones almost non stop, saw a need for it, and now most places also have somewhere that you can charge your phone.

Same thing with Wi-Fi..............at one time it was considered a luxury, but damn near every place that has a good customer base has Wi-Fi in their place of business that you can use for free. Why? Because it helps bring in customers so they can make money.

As EV's become more commonly used by the general public, you can bet that there is someone out there who is gonna figure out how to profit from them and build whatever is needed to do so.

 

[ABikerSailor]

OK... buses charged at the end of each run.... HOW???? Solar panels? Wind Turbines? The point is "chargers" use electricity.
Where is the electricity going to come from? Please think!

Buses charged at the end of each run would place less strain on the grid than having all of them charge at the same time each night. Ever wonder why people in hot climates are asked to reduce (not stop altogether) their air conditioning use? That's so that everyone isn't running their AC at full blast all at the same time. If everyone is only using their AC when they need it (or even running it at a moderate use rather than full blast) then the grid isn't stressed. But, have everyone run it at full blast all at the same time, and yeah, you're gonna have brown outs and power outages.

 

[healthmyths]

Buses charged at the end of each run would place less strain on the grid than having all of them charge at the same time each night. Ever wonder why people in hot climates are asked to reduce (not stop altogether) their air conditioning use? That's so that everyone isn't running their AC at full blast all at the same time. If everyone is only using their AC when they need it (or even running it at a moderate use rather than full blast) then the grid isn't stressed. But, have everyone run it at full blast all at the same time, and yeah, you're gonna have brown outs and power outages.

You still haven't addressed the simple fact that TODAY the total electricity generated is 4,165,030,000,000 kWh per year!
Total kWh electricity generated In USA source:

Electricity generation, capacity, and sales in the United States - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

U.S. annual electricity generation and generation capacity by fuel/energy sources and definitions of important electricity terms.

www.eia.gov

That's it!
If 50% of all CARS/TRUCKS are EVs with cars averaging or Total kWh for car of 0.25 kWh per mile and 4.3 kWh per Mile Per Truck

Battery capacity and recharging needs for electric buses in city transit service (Journal Article) | DOE PAGES

The U.S. Department of Energy's Office of Scientific and Technical Information

www.osti.gov

Total kWh needed per year is 7,253,819,246,512 kWh if 50% of cars/trucks are EVs in the USA.
Nuclear Power plants
Total kWh per year generated by 1 electric power plant: 14,482,222,222 kWh.
Based on 54 nuclear plants producing 782,040,000,000 in 1 year.

INFOGRAPHIC: How Much Power Does A Nuclear Reactor Produce?

A typical nuclear reactor produces 1 gigawatt of power per plant on average. Just how much power is that exactly?

www.energy.gov

Total NEW Nuclear power plants to generate 7,253,819,246,512 kWh if 50% of cars/trucks are EVs in the USA.
7,253,819,246,512 divided by 14,482,222,222 per nuclear power plant per year or totally new nuclear power plants:
500 NEW Nuclear power plants IF 50% of USA cars/trucks are EVs.
Cost passed on to us consumers at $7 Billion/plant: $3,506,142,492,943

https://www.synapse-energy.com/sites/default/files/SynapsePaper.2008-07.0.Nuclear-Plant-Construction-Costs.A0022_0.pdf

I've provided links. These aren't MY made up numbers. These are FACTS:
If 50% of all cars/trucks are EVs they will require and additional: 7,253,819,246,512 kWh per year!
To generate 7.25 Trillion kWh with nuclear plants will require: 500 NEW nuclear plants
To build 500 new nuclear plants will require :$3,506,142,492,943
With 129,930,000 households in the USA:U.S.: number of households 1960-2022 | Statista
Our electric bills either directly or indirectly in higher costs of goods & services will be per household: $26,984.
Total time needed to build one nuclear power plant:
Permitting process: The NRC application review process can take up to five years to complete.

U.S. nuclear industry - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

History and status of U.S. nuclear energy industry, where nuclear power plants are located, and nuclear energy’s share of total U.S. electricity generation.

www.eia.gov

Construction process:Typically a nuclear power plant will take over five years to construct

Nuclear Power Economics | Nuclear Energy Costs - World Nuclear Association

Nuclear power is cost competitive with other forms of electricity generation. Nuclear fuel costs for nuclear plants are a minor proportion of total generating costs, though capital costs are greater.

world-nuclear.org

So between permitting and construction it takes about 10 years from planning, permitting to constructing a nuclear plant.
Oh and by the way the average life-time of a nuclear power plant is 40 years.
Though nuclear plants are theoretically engineered to operate safely for 40 years—their initial permit life—our analysis of the overall record of US commercial nuclear plants shows that almost two dozen reactors were shut down long before their license/design life expired. The True Lifespan of a Nuclear Power Plant – Seacoast Anti-Pollution League
SO take a little time to absorb the FACTS that I've substantiated!
WE will if this totally unplanned migration to just 50% EVs in the words of Joe Biden...
"I want you to look into my eyes, I guarantee We Are Going To Get Rid of Fossil Fuels” September 06, 2019, 5:49 PM


BIDEN GUARANTEES THERE WILL BE

• MASSIVE BLACK OUTS,
• POWER SHORTAGES,
• PEOPLE DYING BECAUSE EV AMBULANCES WEREN'T ABLE TO GET RECHARGED.
• POLICE CARS WAITING TO BE RECHARGED.
• PEOPLE WAITING TO GO TO WORK
• BECAUSE THEY CAN'T GET ELECTRICITY TO RECHARGE THEIR EV.

BIDEN GUARANTEES IT!

 

[healthmyths]

Since some people here still don't understand that you have all the EV chargers BUT if you can't get the electricity to the chargers why that's like this: putting the cart before the horse! With Biden guaranteeing to
"I want you to look into my eyes, I guarantee We Are Going To Get Rid of Fossil Fuels” September 06, 2019, 5:49 PM


BEFORE we have the 500 additional nuclear power plants to provide the additional: 7,253,819,246,512 kWh per year that if 50% of all cars/trucks are EVs. We may have all the chargers BUT we don't have all the power plants to generate the nearly double
the current electricity production of 4,165,030,000,000 kWh per year here in the USA.