Zone1 Is Jesus God?

[ding]

Why do you metaphorically confuse God with a painter and the universe with a painting?

That is at best a very imperfect metaphor.

I'm not. I'm telling you the standard metaphor used to describe pantheism. Pantheism is based upon the belief that God is in everything. And the standard response to that is the painter is not the painting. I didn't just make it up.

 

[ding]

No, YOU just assumed that!

You've gone through the looking glass now.

 

[toobfreak]

I disagree. Which part of you is God?

None of me is God, but all of me is part of God. Wow. You really do have a very poor grasp of theology and words after all. I bet you suck at mathematics. No wonder people constantly argue with you, Ding, but don't drag me into your mental syzygys.

 

[kjw47]

And we see Him leading the armies of heaven carrying the name "Word of God" and the title "Lord of lords". You do know that, right? Did you look it up in your new rewrite and realize that the name of God had been put in there because you wanted to eliminate His titles, and that's why you're ignoring it?

God gave him those titles.

 

[ding]

So you think God created us and dropped us off at the street corner bus stop then drove away.

How can you be so confused to think that to be part of God, that means we must BE Gods ourselves?

You better go back and rethink what you think you know because you are very confused.

Not at all. I think God created existence (aka our universe) and we eventually arose according to the laws of nature as predestined by the laws of nature.

 

[ding]

None of me is God, but all of me is part of God. Wow. You really do have a very poor grasp of theology and words after all. I bet you suck at mathematics. No wonder people constantly argue with you, Ding, but don't drag me into your mental syzygys.

So if all of you is part of God then all of you must be God but only a part of God is you.

 

[kjw47]

Good post. Jesus is the Son of YHWH and the beginning of His creation. The firstborn, literally. His first created being. I'd say Gabriel is the second born who embodies the Holy Spirit power of YHWH. All angels under Gabriel's authority receive the Holy Spirit's power and glory and can act on behalf of YHWH. The angels on the Ark of the Covenant represent Jesus/Archangel Michael and Gabriel, facing YHWH who is between them.

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Gabriel is one of the angels that is in the presence of YHWH, with the Firstborn Archangel and Son of YHWH.

Personally i believe the anointed Cherub who became satan may have been 2nd. It was he that was appointed over the Garden, he got jealous and wanted worship.

 

[ding]

None of me is God, but all of me is part of God.

How is that not contradictory?

 

[ding]

Grrrrr! I do not seek to exalt myself.

Bullshit.

 

[TruthNotBS]

God is existence. Which does not mean he is part of everything which exists. That would be the painter being the painting or better known as pantheism. God supplies reality to every part of existence at all times and all places.

YHWH can encompass all things and be all in all as the NT explicitly states. I wouldn't call that Pantheism, I'd identify it as Panentheism.

"When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." (1 Corinthians 15:28)

That YHWH may be ALL, in ALL. Jesus gives The Name of His Father, to all of His disciples. That divine nature or name, is worn and incorporated into the being of all members of Christ's royal family. Whoever is of the body of Jesus Christ will bear The Name of YHWH:

KJV: "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name." Revelation 3:12 (KJV)

KJV: "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust." 2 Peter 1:4 (KJV)

 

[TruthNotBS]

Personally i believe the anointed Cherub who became satan may have been 2nd. It was he that was appointed over the Garden, he got jealous and wanted worship.

It might have been, you're right and then Gabriel took his place.

 

[surada]

Not for me. I always do exactly as God commands and so life is a blessing, not a curse.

But for anyone living under any delusion that contradicts logic, reasoning, and reality it is....

If you don't believe me, be honest with yourself. You defy the law of God, advocate human sacrifice, desecrate the teachings of Jesus, and mislead others to do the same which is murder. You die every single time you go to church to defy the Law of God, never finding peace in death

Pop quiz!

How ethical are your religious beliefs?

I'm a very ethical person. Do you believe in blood sacrifice?

 

[ding]

YHWH can encompass all things and be all in all as the NT explicitly states. I wouldn't call that Pantheism, I'd identify it as Panentheism.

"When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all." (1 Corinthians 15:28)

That YHWH may be ALL, in ALL. Jesus gives The Name of His Father, to all of His disciples. That divine nature or name, is worn and incorporated into the being of all members of Christ's royal family. Whoever is of the body of Jesus Christ will bear The Name of YHWH:

KJV: "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name." Revelation 3:12 (KJV)

KJV: "Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust." 2 Peter 1:4 (KJV)

I believe we are God's creatures. We came from dust and we shall return to dust. We have God's spirit within us. But that's not saying we are part of God or God is part of us as God can withdraw his spirit from us.

 

[TruthNotBS]

I believe we are God's creatures. We came from dust and we shall return to dust. We have God's spirit within us. But that's not saying we are part of God or God is part of us as God can withdraw his spirit from us.

At the sub-atomic level, that energy might just be part of God. It's His energy and we are all part and parcel of that divine energy at the root level of our existence.

To give you an analogy, your body is comprised of trillions of individual cells. Each cell of your body, contains your DNA and you could technically, with the right technology, clone yourself, with that one cell that has your DNA. It would be inaccurate for me to say that a single cell of your body amounts to you as a person. You're much more than just one physical, individual cell. You're much more complex than that, with your consciousness, memories, feelings, personality, relationships..etc.

Nonetheless, it's somewhat accurate to say that, that individual cell that has your DNA and is part of your body, is part of you. Similar to that, we are part of God, but God is much greater than us as individuals. I can't say "I AM GOD", because I'm just a tiny expression or piece of God's body or existence. God as a whole, doesn't rely on me, I always rely on Him.

 

[ding]

At the sub-atomic level, that energy might just be part of God. It's His energy and we are all part and parcel of that divine energy at the root level of our existence.

To give you an analogy, your body is comprised of trillions of individual cells. Each cell of your body, contains your DNA and you could technically, with the right technology, clone yourself, with that one cell that has your DNA. It would be inaccurate for me to say that a single cell of your body amounts to you as a person. You're much more than just one physical, individual cell. You're much more complex than that, with your consciousness, memories, feelings, personality..etc.

Nonetheless, it's somewhat accurate to say that that individual cell that has your DNA and is part of your body, is part of you.

Similar to that, we are part of God, but God is much greater than us as individuals. I can't say "I AM GOD", because I'm just a tiny expression or piece of God's body or existence. God as a whole, doesn't rely on me, I always rely on Him.

But according to what you just said everything which was created 14 billion years ago was a part of God. Which means that everything is God. This is not the Christian view. The Christian view is that we are God's creatures.

 

[TruthNotBS]

But according to what you just said everything which was created 14 billion years ago was a part of God. Which means that everything is God. This is not the Christian view. The Christian view is that we are God's creatures.

Yes, we are God's creatures but we are all part of God as well. God is all, in all, according to the NT. I already cited that verse, and you ignored it. God can create us, and when we come into existence, we are living within and through God. Nothing can exist outside of God. There is no "outside" of God, all that exists is within Him. He is existence itself. The state of being alive is God.

 

[ding]

Yes, we are God's creatures but we are all part of God as well. God is all, in all, according to the NT. I already cited that verse, and you ignored it. God can create us, and when we come into existence, we are living within and through God. Nothing can exist outside of God. There is no "outside" of God, all that exists is within Him.

I don't have to agree with your interpretation, right? Nor do I need to argue with it either. I'm telling you what the science and logic shows. And according to your logic, everything God created came from a part of God. Which means that literally everything is a part of God. That's pantheism.

Yes, everything exists and continues to exist because God is reality and he supplies his reality to all parts of his creation at all times. He doesn't have to be a part of everything because he is reality itself. God is transcendent. God is not corporeal. God is incorporeal.

 

[TruthNotBS]

I don't have to agree with your interpretation, right? Nor do I need to argue with it either. I'm telling you what the science and logic shows. And according to your logic, everything God created came from a part of God. Which means that literally everything is a part of God. That's pantheism.

Yes, everything exists and continues to exist because God is reality and he supplies his reality to all parts of his creation at all times. He doesn't have to be a part of everything because he is reality itself. God is transcendent. God is not corporeal. God is incorporeal.

God is both transcendent and the energy that we identify as "corporeal" or material. Everything is essentially energy and that energy is connected, caused, and sustained by God. It's not outside of God, because nothing can exist outside of Him. Science and logic agree with what I'm saying.

 

[ding]

God is both transcendent and the energy that we identify as "corporeal" or material. Everything is essentially energy and that energy is connected, caused, and sustained by God. It's not outside of God, because nothing can exist outside of Him. Science and logic agree with what I'm saying.

Energy isn't transcendent. So if God is transcendent then he can't be energy because energy isn't transcendent. So what you are really saying is that God is both transcendent and not transcendent. Which is a highly illogical statement. So no, logic does not agree with what you are saying.

You are literally arguing that God is both the painter and the painting. Which seems unnecessarily complex. Why can't you wrap your mind around a transcendent God can create a material universe from nothing? After all, everything is information, and information is incorporeal.

 

[TruthNotBS]

Energy isn't transcendent. So if God is transcendent then he can't be energy because energy isn't transcendent. So what you are really saying is that God is both transcendent and not transcendent. Which is a highly illogical statement. So no, logic does not agree with what you are saying.

You are literally arguing that God is both the painter and the painting. Which seems unnecessarily complex. Why can't you wrap your mind around a transcendent God can create a material universe from nothing? After all, everything is information, and information is incorporeal.

Information always corresponds to something physical or material otherwise you're simply arguing for the insensible (arguing for nonsense), which isn't logical or scientific at all. God can be both transcendent and eminent as the Bible says, "All in All". Nothing exists independent or outside of God, including the space-time continuum, where we live and find our being. It's quite RICH for a Trinitarian to start appealing to reason or ideological coherence when he believes Jesus is a finite man while also being the infinite God. It's quite funny actually.