CDZ Inviting ALL leftists for an HONEST conversation

[mamooth]

As you watch this, please think about how silly it is to deny reality that cannot be denied:

First, that video did not show Sanders calling for production to be nationalized. Thus, it's a lie to say he's calling for "socialism". No matter how much you duck and weave, that fact doesn't change. Socialism is nationalizing the means of production. No one on the left is calling for that, hence no one on the left is calling for socialism, hence the OP is a dishonest strawman.

Second, Sanders is not "the left", so even if he did call for production to be nationalized, it would not support your claim that "the left is calling for socialism".

We're trying to debate you in good faith, but you're not responding in good faith. We've asked you to define your terms. I've proposed a more honest question. No good. It looks like you just want to push your "liberals are socialists!" strawman instead of debating with integrity and intelligence.

Maybe I'll start a thread asking conservatives to explain why all conservatives are racists. I could say "you know what racism is" when asked to define racism. I'd point to a single racist conservative as proof all conservatives are racists. Then I'd accuse all conservatives who deny being racists as being afraid to debate. As it would be a thread based on a dishonest strawman, it would be a thread equivalent to this one.

 

[P@triot]

why they left won’t create their socialist utopia through free will in the free market.

Because they can't.

Ok. This is a start. So why not?

 

[Oddball]

They're not interested in voluntary association....You will do as your told, at gunpoint if necessary, peasant.

Well, that seems to be the indisputable reality of it. I’m waiting for one of them to prove otherwise in an honest, intelligent discussion but so far none of them are even willing to try.

I've tried....They're not interested.

 

[Confounding]

He is a socialist if you think tuition free public universities and universal healthcare = socialism.

Well considering that is socialism...

You can't have a free market society with public universities and healthcare?

 

[Confounding]

why not?

Not enough people will contribute enough on their own to solve the problems they're trying to solve. It has to be compulsory or it just won't be enough.

 

[Confounding]

We're trying to debate you in good faith, but you're not responding in good faith.

Bingo.

 

[P@triot]

He is a socialist if you think tuition free public universities and universal healthcare = socialism.

Well considering that is socialism...

You can't have a free market society with public universities and healthcare?

Why are you being disingenuous when I asked for honest discussion. First you said “FREE” and then you conveniently omitted that term in your next post.

 

[Confounding]

First you claimed Sanders wasn’t on the left

I think you misinterpreted what was said there.

 

[P@triot]

why not?

Not enough people will contribute enough on their own to solve the problems they're trying to solve. It has to be compulsory or it just won't be enough.

Why not? If they love socialism and claim it “works” why wouldn’t they all contribute everything they have and then evenly distribute among all members?

 

[Confounding]

He is a socialist if you think tuition free public universities and universal healthcare = socialism.

Well considering that is socialism...

You can't have a free market society with public universities and healthcare?

Why are you being disingenuous when I asked for honest discussion. First you said “FREE” and then you conveniently omitted that term in your next post.

Can you have a free market society with public universities and healthcare?


It's a yes or no question.

 

[P@triot]

First you claimed Sanders wasn’t on the left

I think you misinterpreted what was said there.

Ok...so help me to understand. Explain it.

 

[Confounding]

why not?

Not enough people will contribute enough on their own to solve the problems they're trying to solve. It has to be compulsory or it just won't be enough.

Why not? If they love socialism and claim it “works” why wouldn’t they all contribute everything they have and then evenly distribute among all members?

I think the why is kind of irrelevant. It wouldn't work that way.

 

[sartre play]

Not a fan of Bernie, that said, he has the right to say he prefers most of the platforms of socialism, & I have the right to Not vote for him. just like I have the right to not vote for Trumps platform. Hate & name calling I try and avoid.

 

[P@triot]

We're trying to debate you in good faith, but you're not responding in good faith.

Bingo.

Appropriate. Bingo is a game and he is engaging in a childish game (such as claimfin Bernie Sanders isn’t a socialist when Bernie Sanders openly calls himself a socialist) when I asked for an honest discussion.

I don’t understand why you guys get so easily frustrated and resort to snark and other childish tactics. Why can’t you guys just have an honest discussion?

 

[Confounding]

First you claimed Sanders wasn’t on the left

I think you misinterpreted what was said there.

Ok...so help me to understand. Explain it.

mamooth was saying that Sanders doesn't represent everybody on the left, not that he's not on it. You failed to comprehend what was said.

 

[P@triot]

why not?

Not enough people will contribute enough on their own to solve the problems they're trying to solve. It has to be compulsory or it just won't be enough.

Why not? If they love socialism and claim it “works” why wouldn’t they all contribute everything they have and then evenly distribute among all members?

I think the why is kind of irrelevant. It wouldn't work that way.

The why is 100% relevant. If it can’t work with 10 people, it certainly can’t work with three-hundred million. You’re openly admitting that it doesn’t work.

 

[P@triot]

First you claimed Sanders wasn’t on the left

I think you misinterpreted what was said there.

Ok...so help me to understand. Explain it.

mamooth was saying that Sanders doesn't represent everybody on the left, not that he's not on it. You failed to comprehend what was said.

You are correct. I apologize. I misread that.

 

[mamooth]

First you claimed Sanders wasn’t on the left

No, I didn't. I said Sanders is not "the left", which is entirely different. That means, according to basic English, that Sanders does not represent the entire left.

(which is an egregious lie) and then you admitted he was on the left when you claimed you were going to create a similar post about conservatism and clearly stated you would pick one conservative. So you admit my choice in Bernie Sanders is accurate because he is that “one” leftists. Wow.

If you'd like to say you just misread the sentence and then apologize for misstating my position, I'd be okay with that. Wait, I see you did say that, so it's good.

 

[Confounding]

You’re openly admitting that it doesn’t work.

You actually just don't understand what I am saying at all.

 

[Oddball]

why not?

Not enough people will contribute enough on their own to solve the problems they're trying to solve. It has to be compulsory or it just won't be enough.

There you have it...People are no good, so we need to have *people* wave a gun in your face to make sure you "do the right thing".