I Have Another Issue With The Catholic Doctrine

[Wyatt earp]

A protestant catholic??? Like; the gentle torture, the towering midget, a snowy summer's day, fiery ice, cruel kindness, bittersweet, pleasing pain, noiseless sound....an Oxymoron.

Yup a protestant/catholic who thinks John had Dementia living on that island when he wrote his books and Paul was retarded .

 

[Cougarbear]

That's what I said, we all die because of the sin of adam and if Judas didn't fulfill scripture, Jesus wouldn't of died on the cross for everyone's sins and we wouldnt of had everlasting life.

That doesn't mean Judas didn't sin. Matthew 27:3-4, "Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders. Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood..." The betrayal of an innocent person is a sin in anyone's book. No?
Yes, it is by prophecy that this happened. But, just because a prophet foresaw this event doesn't mean the person in the event is not a sinner in the event. He left and hanged himself. Not very good because he fell and his body was split apart on the rocks below.

 

[Cougarbear]

Yup a protestant/catholic who thinks John had Dementia living on that island when he wrote his books and Paul was retarded .

Ummm...Paul and John's books are included in Protestant Bibles. So, they do not believe they were with dementia or retarded. Why do you believe this? Weird?

 

[Wyatt earp]

Ummm...Paul and John's books are included in Protestant Bibles. So, they do not believe they were with dementia or retarded. Why do you believe this? Weird?

I studied the new testament so much in the past 3 years; that's my conclusion and I can't believe how upset it gets bible thumpers when I say it

 

[Wyatt earp]

That doesn't mean Judas didn't sin. Matthew 27:3-4, "Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders. Saying, I have sinned in that I have betrayed the innocent blood..." The betrayal of an innocent person is a sin in anyone's book. No?
Yes, it is by prophecy that this happened. But, just because a prophet foresaw this event doesn't mean the person in the event is not a sinner in the event. He left and hanged himself. Not very good because he fell and his body was split apart on the rocks below.

You miss the point, if Judas didn't do what he did No one would of had eternal life and if you read the book of acts he fell over and his guts exploded

 

[Cougarbear]

I studied the new testament so much in the past 3 years; that's my conclusion and I can't believe how upset it gets bible thumpers when I say it

I'm trying to understand why you would say it. I study the Bible a lot as well and don't come up with that conclusion. I believe in revelation and prophecy. Do you?

 

[Cougarbear]

You miss the point, if Judas didn't do what he did No one would of had eternal life and if you read the book of acts he fell over and his guts exploded

So what? That doesn't mean Judas didn't sin. He most certainly did. And, if you have studied the Bible so much, you wouldn't have missed this fact. Also, what if Judas decided not to betray Jesus. Would Jesus had not been crucified anyways? Would the Romans and wicked priests and elders not have figured out who Jesus was to take him to Pilate?

Like I said, Judas did a poor job hanging himself over the rocks and the rope broke, he fell on the rocks, splitting himself up and his guts exploded.

 

[Wyatt earp]

I'm trying to understand why you would say it. I study the Bible a lot as well and don't come up with that conclusion. I believe in revelation and prophecy. Do you?

Do you want to discuss it normal?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

I've always had an issue with Mary being sinless because then Christ's sacrifice on the cross would have been pointless, but nowhere in the Bible does it say that she was taken into Heaven both body and soul like Jesus was.

The ‘problem’ is ignorance of Catholic dogma.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

No, I'm not Catholic.

No kidding.

 

[Meriweather]

If Judas didn't fulfill scripture Jesus wouldn't of died for our sins, Judas didn't betray anyone he had to do what he did.

We limit God to only one way? What if mankind had repented? And followed Christ?

 

[Cougarbear]

Do you want to discuss it normal?

Normal what? Prophecy and revelation by God is true.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Normal what? Prophecy and revelation by God is true.

Do you want to discuss it civil or are you going to bore me?



Some of my examples that Paul is retarded is because if you read the books of Peter even he imply's Paul is retarded when he says some things Paul writes are hard to understand.


Take Romans 3:11

Here are my notes on the subject:

 

[Wyatt earp]

If you can't read it, look up 2 chronicles 15:2, 2 chronicles 15:15, 1 chronicles 28:9, Jeremiah 29:13 and deuteronomy 4:29

 

[Cougarbear]

Do you want to discuss it civil or are you going to bore me?



Some of my examples that Paul is retarded is because if you read the books of Peter even he imply's Paul is retarded when he says some things Paul writes are hard to understand.


Take Romans 3:11

View attachment 613282

Well, it's hard to discuss versus without context. What Paul is doing through the entire chapter is grace through faith and not works of the law. Yet, in verse 31, he says "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: Yea, we establish the law. James would argue faith without works is dead. But, I don't see Paul and James then at odds like most try to make them. We are saved by the grace or atonement of Christ after all we can do. What do you think about that ending? I think it justifies both Paul and James.
I think the translators have the language issue, not Paul.

 

[Wyatt earp]

Well, it's hard to discuss versus without context. What Paul is doing through the entire chapter is grace through faith and not works of the law. Yet, in verse 31, he says "Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: Yea, we establish the law. James would argue faith without works is dead. But, I don't see Paul and James then at odds like most try to make them. We are saved by the grace or atonement of Christ after all we can do. What do you think about that ending? I think it justifies both Paul and James.
I think the translators have the language issue, not Paul.

This is what I think James wrote his book first and Paul was pissed when he read it so he wrote Galatians to tick off James.

To me it's always been saved by grace and the works of love

 

[Meriweather]

If you can't read it, look up 2 chronicles 15:2, 2 chronicles 15:15, 1 chronicles 28:9, Jeremiah 29:13 and deuteronomy 4:29

Why not use some of the texts Paul was referencing? (Ps. 14:1-3; Ps. 5:9; Ps. 140:3; Ps. 10:7; Isa. 59:7-8; Ps. 36:1)

Paul was trying to make a point...however strong sin in man might be, we have an even stronger savior.

 

[Meriweather]

This is what I think James wrote his book first and Paul was pissed when he read it so he wrote Galatians to tick off James.

Galatians was most likely written before 55 AD; James not until around 90 AD. It is equally likely, some were misunderstanding Paul, and James wrote to clarify what Paul was saying.

 

[Meriweather]

Yup a protestant/catholic who thinks John had Dementia living on that island when he wrote his books

John was using apocalyptic literature, a writing form popular at the time among the Jews and using symbolism quite confusing to Romans. John was writing about first century issues and troubles with the Romans in such a way the Romans hadn't a clue about all the bad things he was saying about them.

It is helpful to have a commentary handy when reading Revelation. In my opinion, William Barclay has one of the best.

 

[Cougarbear]

This is what I think James wrote his book first and Paul was pissed when he read it so he wrote Galatians to tick off James.

To me it's always been saved by grace and the works of love

However, then Jesus teachings about repentance, restitution and baptism are lies? We are all saved from eternal death through the resurrection. Where we exist after the resurrection grace does not cover. That's why we have a judgment day and our book of life will be open. That's why Paul taught that there are 3 degrees of glory in heaven (many mansions). Jesus made covenants with people in all ages he has prophets in. We will be judged on how we have kept our covenants with him. "If ye love me, keep my commandments."