God does exist. Itelligent design in the Universe is prof of God.

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I'm pretty sure we can identify living organisms. .

Sure, in familiar forms.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

silly folks are those that believe in secular humanism

As opposed to... What? Being a dick with no morality or empathy? You need a dictionary.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

The universe was created FROM nothing by no thing.

Says Shaman Ding. No, i don't want a brochure. Get off my porch.

 

[ding]

It matters not which faith system you follow as long as you are genuine in your faith.

I’m going to go out on a limb here. You probably haven’t attended meetings with other Christians in over 5 years.

This statement has no Christian attributes at all. This sounds all “Religion of Antiquity”ish. What is the name of your personal made up religion? Is breezewood your cousin?

I am the only Catholic in a room full of Baptists at my men's bible study group. But I have heard your complaint frequently that I'm not a Catholic or not a Christian by atheists and protestants, so you are in excellent company. The problem is no one has ever been able to show why they believe that.

Being a Christian means that I believe that God chose to be born into this world to testify to the truth and suffer death to reconcile justice with mercy. That's really all one needs to believe to be Christian. I don't have to believe like the protestants do. But I totally get why you want me to argue there is only one true way. It would justify your foolish decisions in your head. Which is why you keep arguing this stupid point.

Basically you are an atheist of the god in the Bible. Nothing wrong with that.

I'm OK with you believing that cause it would be illogical for me to correct all of your errors to arrive at what I already know.

Well. Being the smartest man in the world comes with its own challenges. I don’t envy you.

I didn’t say you were an all out atheist. You are just an atheist of the god in the Bible. Me too!

You are probably an atheist of the god in the Qu’ran but that is a different discussion altogether.

Nothing special about me. It's more about how you allowed your biases to cloud your objectivity. Your understanding of the Bible is what led you to believe that God does not exist. My understanding confirmed my belief. So I am pretty sure we wouldn't agree on much. Apparently you have a need for me to justify my beliefs to you. I don't have that need. That whole I am an atheist about something might just be the dumbest argument yet.

Religion is based on 'belief' which requires no proof. From Wikipedia..' A belief is an attitude that something is the case, or that some proposition about the world is true. In epistemology, philosophers use the term "belief" to refer to attitudes about the world which can be either true or false. To believe something is to take it to be true; for instance, to believe that snow is white is comparable to accepting the truth of the proposition "snow is white". However, holding a belief does not require active introspection. For example, few carefully consider whether or not the sun will rise tomorrow, simply assuming that it will. Moreover, beliefs need not be occurrent (e.g. a person actively thinking "snow is white"), but can instead be dispositional (e.g. a person who if asked about the color of snow would assert "snow is white").

As a general rule I usually need a good reason to believe something.

I think the possibility of a first cause (a god) is highly likely. I’m not sure why Allah has to be that first cause. Couldn’t it be a different god than the one the Muslims worship? Just because a god exists doesn’t mean it is Allah. Allah can be all made up for the purpose of building a huge army and the idea just lingered around a few extra centuries.

Are you afraid if you pick the wrong perception of God that God will penalize you or something?

Maybe. Maybe not. How does that change the discussion in any way shape or form?

I have concluded that it is suspicious if someone claims that they know the particular god that created the universe and that god wants me to do the exact same things that the person making the claim wants me to do. So I scream in the face of any liar who says (blank) god is the real one and I have to do what the person saying it wants me to do. It’s doggone ridiculous is what it is. I say bull shenanigans to anybody who tells me that Allah is the one true god thus I am obligated to live by the Qu’ran. Malarkey!

If God doesn’t want to reveal Himself for who He/She/It really is then why would we be punished by that deity unless that deity is sadistic? Even if that is the case I would have no control over stopping that god from punishing me for getting it all wrong. Are you really offended that I call out people on their BS? A lie is a lie. If you said God speaks to you then I say you are a full blown liar. If you say that you know which god is real then I say you are a full blown liar. Those are arrogant claims that make me extremely angry. No. I am not angry at God. I’m angry at liars that make bold faced ridiculous lies and call me out for being the person in the wrong. I’m not in the wrong. You are make a claim that is blatantly and obviously untrue. This doesn’t mean I am afraid of God. It means you are a liar for saying you know God. You don’t. Even if you did I’m pretty sure that God didn’t obligate you to prove it and then leave you without any tools whatsoever to administer the proof. You are accused of being a liar. That’s all it is. Get mad if you want. You are the one spreading full blown lies.

It changes the discussion because you don't seem genuine in the discussion as evidenced by the fact that you are all over the map. Case in point... I tell you that just because people have different perceptions of God - which is quite natural by the way - that that doesn't mean there are multiple Gods or even a right and wrong perception of God. That any perception of God that leads to one becoming a better person is good and desirable. Your response to that was that I am not a Christian and did not believe in the God of Abraham. You even changed your signature line to reflect your disagreement. Now you say it's suspicious if someone claims that they know the particular god that created the universe. That's totally opposite of what you were arguing. You literally criticized me for something you now say you agree with.

As for God not revealing Himself to you, what you really mean to say is that God does not reveal Himself to you in the way you think He should. Just because you have poor discernment and can't see how God has worked in your life does not mean that God failed to reveal Himself to you. God reveals Himself to you the same way God reveals Himself to everyone. To blame God for YOUR failure is short sighted and prevents you from learning from your mistake because you won't acknowledge YOUR mistake. You can't fix what you don't acknowledge is broke.

 

[ding]

Are you afraid if you pick the wrong perception of God that God will penalize you or something?

You’re mad. I’m mad. That’s fine.

You did something wrong. I didn’t.

You claim that God spoke to you.
I claim that God has never spoke to me.

You are telling something that is a lie or something that appears to be a lie. Any reasonable or unreasonable person would conclude that you are making an outrageous claim.

I am telling something that is true or something that appears to be true. Any reasonable or unreasonable person would conclude that I am making a realistic claim.

I have done nothing wrong. You have. Either own your full blown lies and apologize or dismiss your wrongdoing and continue spreading falsehoods when you have the inkling to do so. GOD HAS NEVER SPOKE TO YOU AND YOU KNOW THAT. Your lie will continue to piss me off to no end because it is filthy, rotten, gross, and disgusting. I hope you are punished for your lies by other humans who hear you speak this filth. Actually, utilizing the name of god to accomplish your objectives violated Biblical standards. In Old Testament days you would be repeatedly assaulted with extremely heavy rocks until you were dead if you ever claimed that God spoke to you. They’d kill you as hard as hell. I think we should have that same law today and murder people as hard as hell for saying God speaks to them. It is filth to the nth degree. He ever makes that claim should be killed alongside the child molestors. I will become angrier and angrier for the rest of my life ever time someone says that God speaks to them because it is utterly repulsive and disgusting. I don’t care if you are mentally insane. You don’t have to spread your filth onto the rest of society.

God does not speak to human beings and until He does, I will call anybody a liar who says that He spoke to them. I can’t put into words how repulsive it is when people say that. I wish I could describe how much I hate it when people use God’s name in this way.

I'm not mad and I have no idea of what you believe I did wrong. I don't believe you are genuine. I believe you are here to make fun of others. I think you are getting mad because I'm not responding the way you expect or hope.

God speaks to me the exact same way He speaks to everyone... including you. The only reason you can't hear it or see it is because you have poor discernment skills. That's no one's fault but your own. It's not God's fault that He didn't send you a burning bush or an email. It's your fault because you can't see how God has worked in your life. You are more than willing to find reasons not to believe in God - all of which are idiotic by the way - but make no effort whatsoever to look for reasons to believe in God and more importantly... have a relationship with God. If you did, you would discover your life was much more enjoyable and satisfying.

 

[ding]

The universe was created FROM nothing by no thing.

Says Shaman Ding. No, i don't want a brochure. Get off my porch.

Militant atheism is an intellectual dead end. You and Grumblenuts can expect more of the same misery until you change your ways. So says Shaman ding.

 

[ding]

silly folks are those that believe in secular humanism

As opposed to... What? Being a dick with no morality or empathy? You need a dictionary.

"Communism is naturalized humanism." Karl Marx

"Our program necessarily includes the propaganda of atheism." Vladimir Lenin

 

[ding]

We can see the vast number of life forms here on the planet Earth. The oceans, on land, the different varieties of plants. All this life did not just happen by accident , as many non beleiving scientist say. God does exist. This is a planet with air , water, and food for us all to consume. It was not made by accident. This world was created for us by an intelligent God. We did not evolve from apes . We were all created by God. Designed in his likeness. Your thoughts.

God sucked at feeding us. Man improved it big time. If you disagree then go live in the forest.

See Job 40

 

[ding]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

 

[ding]

I'm pretty sure we can identify living organisms. .

Sure, in familiar forms.

No. By their characteristics.

The Characteristics of Life | Biology for Majors I

courses.lumenlearning.com

.

You have been watching too much science fiction.

 

[Taz]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

At one time, leading scientists of the day thought the earth was flat. Until we can see the BB, we won't know how it started, is it cyclical..., and even then...

 

[ding]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

At one time, leading scientists of the day thought the earth was flat. Until we can see the BB, we won't know how it started, is it cyclical..., and even then...

There are only two options; the universe began or it existed forever. The latter has been discredited. Time for you to move on from living on a flat earth.

 

[Taz]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

At one time, leading scientists of the day thought the earth was flat. Until we can see the BB, we won't know how it started, is it cyclical..., and even then...

There are only two options; the universe began or it existed forever. The latter has been discredited. Time for you to move on from living on a flat earth.

Both options are still open until we know for sure. What you're doing is akin to premature ejaculation.

 

[ding]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

At one time, leading scientists of the day thought the earth was flat. Until we can see the BB, we won't know how it started, is it cyclical..., and even then...

There are only two options; the universe began or it existed forever. The latter has been discredited. Time for you to move on from living on a flat earth.

Both options are still open until we know for sure. What you're doing is akin to premature ejaculation.

That's not how science works. Science never knows for sure. Science always allows for the possibility of reversing itself.

For all practical intents and purposes, until proven otherwise, cyclical universe models are dead. So you can pretend all you want that science does not believe the universe began, but you are just lying to yourself.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

For all practical intents and purposes, until proven otherwise, cyclical universe models are dead.

False. See: Roger Penrose

 

[ding]

For all practical intents and purposes, until proven otherwise, cyclical universe models are dead.

False. See: Roger Penrose

Atheists, especially militant atheists like yourself, are violently opposed to the universe beginning, despite the overwhelming evidence that it did. The problem is none of you has a model that explains how matter and energy can exist for eternity without leaving a universe filled with radiation or being thermally equilibrated. Not to mention why the CMB would exist or how an infinite acting universe does not violate the SLoT or explaining the mechanism for expansion.

So saying "See Roger Penrose" and expecting that to magically mean something is as stupid as believing in an invisible magician.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

For all practical intents and purposes, until proven otherwise, cyclical universe models are dead.

False. See: Roger Penrose

Atheists, especially militant atheists like yourself, are violently opposed to the universe beginning, despite the overwhelming evidence that it did. The problem is none of you has a model that explains how matter and energy can exist for eternity without leaving a universe filled with radiation or being thermally equilibrated. Not to mention why the CMB would exist or how an infinite acting universe does not violate the SLoT or explaining the mechanism for expansion.

So saying "See Roger Penrose" and expecting that to magically mean something is as stupid as believing in an invisible magician.

The cyclic model is not dead, as defined by scientists still working on it and supporting it. I.E., Roger Penrose, et. al. What you said is just provably false.

And then there is also this:

Physicists Debate Hawking’s Idea That the Universe Had No Beginning | Quanta Magazine

A recent challenge to Stephen Hawking’s biggest idea — about how the universe might have come from nothing — has cosmologists choosing sides.

www.quantamagazine.org

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

What people like Penrose are doing is trying to design a method to test the cyclical model. One way is to test predictions it makes for the CMB. Penrose claims it passes those tests, but that this is not definitive. So their work lies ahead of them.

 

[Taz]

An eternal entity is the only theory that I have heard on the matter. This is in no way shape or form saying that this eternal entity is a personage. The eternal entity could be a pile of mashed potatoes or something like that. Nobody has ever identified what that first cause was.

There's no way of knowing whether first causes recycle or not. Our Universe may just swallow itself and restart every 50 billion years or so. Regardless, the Aether remains. The ultimate pile of mashed potatoes, only far more intriguing and delicious!

CMB says otherwise. So does the SLoT. And I have not even started getting into what made the universe expand in the first place and what would make it expand after a big crunch.

But here's a detailed explanation on why no one (except atheists and fools) believes in a cyclical universe anymore.

At one time, leading scientists of the day thought the earth was flat. Until we can see the BB, we won't know how it started, is it cyclical..., and even then...

There are only two options; the universe began or it existed forever. The latter has been discredited. Time for you to move on from living on a flat earth.

Both options are still open until we know for sure. What you're doing is akin to premature ejaculation.

That's not how science works. Science never knows for sure. Science always allows for the possibility of reversing itself.

For all practical intents and purposes, until proven otherwise, cyclical universe models are dead. So you can pretend all you want that science does not believe the universe began, but you are just lying to yourself.

This incarnation of the universe started with the BB. What happened before that is anybody's guess. Plus, you're confusing theory with fact.

 

[Rye Catcher]

We can see the vast number of life forms here on the planet Earth. The oceans, on land, the different varieties of plants. All this life did not just happen by accident , as many non beleiving scientist say. God does exist. This is a planet with air , water, and food for us all to consume. It was not made by accident. This world was created for us by an intelligent God. We did not evolve from apes . We were all created by God. Designed in his likeness. Your thoughts.

You've the right to believe that a God exists. However, there is no proof, no probative evidence to convince others.