Zone1 A truth from Jesus

[surada]

LONG LONG before "livius" was invented (by 'gawd knows whom')
the book "DANIEL" was discredited as far back as the talmud. But it
was somehow ADOPTED by the Catholic Church and important
christian scholars who decided that jews disowned it because it is
(lol) all about jesus.

I've just been reading the Jewish version of Daniel. When did they disown it? It's about Antiochus IV Epiphanies.

 

[surada]

SO? so is the book of Job-----which is also part of catholic
canon. In what you call the "old testament" it (daniel) is part of
"KETUVIM" in the "jewish tanach"------ie ---just "writings"----
which IMHO constitute a haphazard folder

Yep. That makes sense.

 

[surada]

a point ^^^^ hotly debated amongst scholars of the "holy mother
church" In fact the entire book is highly questionable amongst past
and present Jewish scholars which learned "holy mother church"
scholars attribute to the "fact" that "Jesus" is mentioned therein

That's not what the Catholic Church teaches.

 

[irosie91]

I've just been reading the Jewish version of Daniel. When did they disown it? It's about Antiochus IV Epiphanies.

there is a "jewish version" of Daniel?----try again---the book was
written---MOST LIKELY BY A JEW---in aramaic. For jews it is a
BOOK-----like the book of Esther-----in the category KITUVIN--
ie WRITINGS . As far as I know it is not even in the category
NEVEIM (prophets). The jewish version---to wit the translation
that is in the SEPTUAGINT ----is part of the Catholic Canon----ie
part of the "holy scriptures"----thus the pope considers it
"DIVINE" Many jewish commentators on scriptural writings
rejected it------as early as the talmudists-----as did Maimonides.
As far as I know----it is not read as part of the weekly public
readings in synagogues. It seems to me to be sort of rejected
just something MISHNAIC. (Esther is read in synagogues)

 

[surada]

there is a "jewish version" of Daniel?----try again---the book was
written---MOST LIKELY BY A JEW---in aramaic. For jews it is a
BOOK-----like the book of Esther-----in the category KITUVIN--
ie WRITINGS . As far as I know it is not even in the category
NEVEIM (prophets). The jewish version---to wit the translation
that is in the SEPTUAGINT ----is part of the Catholic Canon----ie
part of the "holy scriptures"----thus the pope considers it
"DIVINE" Many jewish commentators on scriptural writings
rejected it------as early as the talmudists-----as did Maimonides.
As far as I know----it is not read as part of the weekly public
readings in synagogues. It seems to me to be sort of rejected
just something MISHNAIC. (Esther is read in synagogues)

Antiochus IV Epiphanies defiled the temple and persecuted the Jews.

The Book of Daniel | Prophet Daniel, Babylonian Exile, Jewish History | Britannica

The Book of Daniel, a book of the Old Testament found in the Ketuvim (Writings), the third section of the Jewish canon, but placed among the Prophets in the Christian canon. The first half of the book (chapters 1–6) contains stories in the third person about the experiences of Daniel and his

www.britannica.com

 

[Clyde 154]

I suspect the "Jesus is God" narrative is a fabrication of the religion, intentional or not. I don't think Jesus called himself God or equal, but was actually humble and reverential. He pointed to God not himself.

He may have figuratively spoken of our Creator being accessible within our selves, though.

There's no mention of Jesus in the book of Daniel.

Is Jesus the Archangel Michael?

Jehovah’s Witnesses claim Jesus is the archangel Michael, but what does the Bible say?

www.str.org

This is hardly the revealed TRUTH.........Jesus is not only mentioned in the book of Daniel........God "confirms" the fact that Jesus is the Messiah of prophecy.

What is a confirmation? A confirmation is evidence, proof of something that is a guaranteed truth. Those that profess to being members of the church/kingdom that God created in the name of Jesus Christ......are instructed not to accept or believe something with BLIND FAITH........confirm all things, test all things and hold on to that which is righteous in the sight of God (1 Thess. 5:21, Hebrews 11:1), "Now faith is the title/deed of things hoped for; the putting to the proof of things not seen."

How did God "confirm" the Messiahship of Christ Jesus? Take for instance the prophecy concerning the destruction of Jerusalem made by both Daniel and Jesus.

The Book of Daniel reads, "And He (God) will make a firm covenant (a New Covenant) with with the "many" (the entire nation of Israel) for a week (symbolism for a period of time.......Christianity was taught expressly to the Jews for the first 10 years of its existence) but in the middle of the week He will put a stop to sacrifice and gain offering (Jesus put an end to the Jewish practices of annual animal sacrifices to carry one's sin from one year to the next) and on the wing of ABOMINATIONS (the total destruction of the Jewish nation and religion as practiced......coming to fulfillment around 70A.D when the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and scattered the Jewish tribes around the globe) WILL COME "ONE" (Jesus the Messiah of prophecy) WHO MAKES DESOLATION (Jesus warned the Jewish leaders about the coming abomination by directly referrencing the book of Daniel (Matt.23:38-39).......in fact Matthew 23 1-39) contains a message concerning the prophecy of Daniel with Jesus ending the warning by letting them know that this destruction would come in that same generation of time)

............................even until a complete destruction (of Jersualem). One that is decreed (fixed by command of God) is poured out on the One (Christ Jesus) who makes desolete. -- Daniel 9:27

Its obvious to those who would see.......Jesus is a critical part of the fulfillment of Daniels prophecy concerning the end of Biblical Isarel because of the way they killed and mocked the prophets of God......the last and most important prophet.....THE MESSIAH HIMSELF that was rejected, humliated and ultimately placed to death by those same Jewish leaders. It was the end of God's longsuffering with those under the Covenant of Moses ........God lived up to His condition of that covenant, God vowed to destroy Israel and Scatter them around the globe if they continued breaking the Covenant after God had Husbanded Israel exclusively. (Lev. 26:27-39, Deut. 4:25-28, 8:19-20)

God warned Israel and all the tribes that a New Covenant would come if they continued to break the Covenant God made with Moses, a covenant that would not require animal sacrifices and laws written on stone.....but laws written on the hearts of God's people. (Jer. 31:31-34) Jesus fulfilled that prophecy........to fulfill/make complete the requirements of the Law of Moses (Matthew 5:17-18) Jesus' sacrifice on the cross became the perfect sacrifical lamb of God and fulfilled the Covenant of Moses......in its place Jesus was given all authority on earth and in heaven, thus the New Covenant of Grace with its king........Christ Jesus.........our "advocate" standing between our sins and the Father. God so loved the world that He gave His only Begotten Son. This mirror's Abrahams faith in offering up his son as evidence of faith.........it compeltes all but one remaining promise made to Abraham by God.........and that last promise is being fulfilled on a daily basis....making the descendants (the adopted sons of Abraham).......number like the stars in the sky. (Gal. 3:28-29) God confirms this prophecy with a spiritual Nation of Christians (sons of Abraham) numbering in the BILLIONS, the world's leading religion by number.

 

[surada]

This is hardly the revealed TRUTH.........Jesus is not only mentioned in the book of Daniel........God "confirms" the fact that Jesus is the Messiah of prophecy.

What is a confirmation? A confirmation is evidence, proof of something that is a guaranteed truth. Those that profess to being members of the church/kingdom that God created in the name of Jesus Christ......are instructed not to accept or believe something with BLIND FAITH........confirm all things, test all things and hold on to that which is righteous in the sight of God (1 Thess. 5:21, Hebrews 11:1), "Now faith is the title/deed of things hoped for; the putting to the proof of things not seen."

How did God "confirm" the Messiahship of Christ Jesus? Take for instance the prophecy concerning the destruction of Jerusalem made by both Daniel and Jesus.

The Book of Daniel reads, "And He (God) will make a firm covenant (a New Covenant) with with the "many" (the entire nation of Israel) for a week (symbolism for a period of time.......Christianity was taught expressly to the Jews for the first 10 years of its existence) but in the middle of the week He will put a stop to sacrifice and gain offering (Jesus put an end to the Jewish practices of annual animal sacrifices to carry one's sin from one year to the next) and on the wing of ABOMINATIONS (the total destruction of the Jewish nation and religion as practiced......coming to fulfillment around 70A.D when the Romans destroyed Jerusalem and scattered the Jewish tribes around the globe) WILL COME "ONE" (Jesus the Messiah of prophecy) WHO MAKES DESOLATION (Jesus warned the Jewish leaders about the coming abomination by directly referrencing the book of Daniel (Matt.23:38-39).......in fact Matthew 23 1-39) contains a message concerning the prophecy of Daniel with Jesus ending the warning by letting them know that this destruction would come in that same generation of time)

............................even until a complete destruction (of Jersualem). One that is decreed (fixed by command of God) is poured out on the One (Christ Jesus) who makes desolete. -- Daniel 9:27

Its obvious to those who would see.......Jesus is a critical part of the fulfillment of Daniels prophecy concerning the end of Biblical Isarel because of the way they killed and mocked the prophets of God......the last and most important prophet.....THE MESSIAH HIMSELF that was rejected, humliated and ultimately placed to death by those same Jewish leaders. It was the end of God's longsuffering with those under the Covenant of Moses ........God lived up to His condition of that covenant, God vowed to destroy Israel and Scatter them around the globe if they continued breaking the Covenant after God had Husbanded Israel exclusively. (Lev. 26:27-39, Deut. 4:25-28, 8:19-20)

God warned Israel and all the tribes that a New Covenant would come if they continued to break the Covenant God made with Moses, a covenant that would not require animal sacrifices and laws written on stone.....but laws written on the hearts of God's people. (Jer. 31:31-34) Jesus fulfilled that prophecy........to fulfill/make complete the requirements of the Law of Moses (Matthew 5:17-18) Jesus' sacrifice on the cross became the perfect sacrifical lamb of God and fulfilled the Covenant of Moses......in its place Jesus was given all authority on earth and in heaven, thus the New Covenant of Grace with its king........Christ Jesus.

Antiochus IV Epiphanies defiled the temple and made it an Abomination of Desolation. No mention of Jesus. Jesus referenced the story: when you see it again flee to the mountains.

 

[irosie91]

Antiochus IV Epiphanies defiled the temple and persecuted the Jews.

The Book of Daniel | Prophet Daniel, Babylonian Exile, Jewish History | Britannica

The Book of Daniel, a book of the Old Testament found in the Ketuvim (Writings), the third section of the Jewish canon, but placed among the Prophets in the Christian canon. The first half of the book (chapters 1–6) contains stories in the third person about the experiences of Daniel and his

www.britannica.com

are you presenting the episcopalian version of NEWS? That factoid
of history is NOT the issue that made Daniel a hero amongst christian
'scholars' nor is it among the issues that discredit the book of Daniel
in the eyes of jewish scholars

 

[Mac-7]

Matthew 28:18-19-- All authority has been given to me in heaven and on earth.

Fact--If Jesus were God, already had the authority, but he didnt. That means one who is superior to him gave him the authority. Proving he is not equal to his Father. Proving Jesus' words 100% truth= John 20:17, Rev 3:12--He teaches of that one--The Father is greater than i- proving 0 equality. Proving every trinity religion on earth false. It takes believing Jesus, no trinitarian will. They live by the errors translated in centuries ago by the religion that came out of Rome and believe them over the one they claim to follow. Those errors contradict Jesus to the core.

What religion do you represent?

 

[kjw47]

Jesus was a "man"......i.e., the Son of Man, descendent

The Simple answer to your "false premise" that lacks logic and reason.........You and your cult are antichrists. (1 John 2:22, 1 John 4:1,3, 1 John 2:18, 2 John 1:7)

According to scripture Jesus was deity in the flesh (John 1:1-5,14). He was not conceived natrually by woman (Isa. 7:14, Matthew 1:23). Jesus came from heaven, the spiritual realm of God (John 3:13, 6:38).........Jesus proved His mighty "Messiahship" by working signs and wonders (miracles) -- John 20:30-31 Jesus accepted worship (Matth.14:33, John 9:38)......only God is to be worshiped, even the enemies of Jesus (the religious leaders) comprehended that Jesus was claiming to be equal with God (John 10:30,33)


The scriptures demonstrate your logical fallacy in denial that Jesus is God in the fact that Jesus is the Son of God and equal in all ways. While on earth in the form of a "man" Jesus emptied Himself.....made Himself of no reputation even to the point of death on the Cross (Phil. 2:6-8). Take note that Jesus "the man, the son of man, descendant of Adam" did not preform any miracles until the Father granted Him this authority.......Jesus' ministry lasted but 3 and 1/2 years on earth.

Sorry to see one so lost in the darkness they absolutely refuse to believe Jesus--Its pretty sad.

 

[kjw47]

I suspect the "Jesus is God" narrative is a fabrication of the religion, intentional or not. I don't think Jesus called himself God or equal, but was actually humble and reverential. He pointed to God not himself.

He may have figuratively spoken of our Creator being accessible within our selves, though.

Yes at John 17:3 Jesus is 100% clear--The one who sent him( Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD--most outright refuse to believe Jesus. Yet claim to be his follower.

 

[kjw47]

Daniel is about Antiochus IV Epiphanies.

Alot of Daniel is prophecy of the last days= now.

 

[kjw47]

Clear meaning is He is indeed God....Satan treated him as such also

Fact shows the opposite- God cannot be tempted, satan knows that fact. He tempted Jesus in the wilderness at his weakest point, 40 days fasting. Jesus replied to his tempting--It is to Jehovah God one must render sacred service. But since trinity translations have removed Gods name in 7000 places just about, to support satans will, few know that fact.

 

[kjw47]

What religion do you represent?

The religion Jesus is the head of. The Jehovah witnesses.

 

[surada]

Alot of Daniel is prophecy of the last days= now.

Nope. Revelation is a letter to the 7 churches.. and it tells us that it will happen soon within a generation. Don't change the scripture.

The new Christians fled Jerusalem for Pella and avoided the tribulation.

 

[surada]

Fact shows the opposite- God cannot be tempted, satan knows that fact. He tempted Jesus in the wilderness at his weakest point, 40 days fasting. Jesus replied to his tempting--It is to Jehovah God one must render sacred service. But since trinity translations have removed Gods name in 7000 places just about, to support satans will, few know that fact.

Jehovah's witnesses date to about 1830, don't they?

 

[Clyde 154]

Sorry to see one so lost in the darkness they absolutely refuse to believe Jesus--Its pretty sad.

Yeah......ad hominem insults work when you can't address the actual content of the Holy Scriptures. Your cult is indeed a most loving brotherhood.

 

[surada]

Yeah......ad hominem insults work when you can't address the actual content of the Holy Scriptures. Your cult is indeed a most loving brotherhood.

They were an offshoot of the millerites.. 1872.

Jehovah’s Witness | religion

Jehovah’s Witness, member of a millennialist denomination that developed within the larger 19th-century Adventist movement in the United States and has since spread worldwide. The Jehovah’s Witnesses are an outgrowth of the International Bible Students Association, which was founded in 1872 in...

www.britannica.com

 

[Clyde 154]

Antiochus IV Epiphanies defiled the temple and made it an Abomination of Desolation. No mention of Jesus. Jesus referenced the story: when you see it again flee to the mountains.

As demonstrated.......God confirmed that Daniel was speaking of Jesus as being the Messiah when Jesus' prophecy came true concerning the total desolation of Israel with its people scrattered all around the globe......just as God confirmed Jesus by the sheer numbers of descendents of father Abraham......numbering like the stars in the heavens. What more evidence does one need as confirmation? Christian Faith is justified by such confirmations. God has confirmed Christianity by the sheer numbers of over 3 Billion people.


Question? If Daniel is addressing the defiled temple (Antiochus 1V Epiphanies) and some King of Egypt or Greece.........where is the new Covenant addressed by Daniel 9? I can't see any NEW COVENANT whatsoever as directly prophesied by Daniel, where is the Covenant between God and Egypt, Greece? Daniel 9 prophecy was fulfilled in the 1st century when the mystery was revealed by Christ Jesus. Where is the Covenant of Antiochus 1V Epiphanies addressed in the Holy Scriptures? Show us the Book, Chapter and Verse were Israel engaged in a New Covenant other than the Covenant of Moses that preceded the Covenant of Christ Jesus.

Just say'n..........its not that Jesus is not mentioned By a 1st century name (as the scriptures declare that the prophecies concerning the coming Messiah were a mystery....even to the one's making the prophecy with the mystery not revealed until the Holy Spirit of God revelaed the mystery to the Apostles of Christ in 1st century -- Eph. 3:5,6, 1 Peter 1:10-12)......but God had this plan conceived in Using Jesus as Christ even before the worlds and time itself began -- 1 Peter 1:20, 2 Tim. 1:9

From the 1st century forward.........THE MYSTERY HAS BEEN REVEALED with no ambiguity whatsoever.

There is an old axiom...........an absence of evidence does not constitue any evidene of absence. You are always found guilty of presenting some evidence based upon logcial fallices that can't be proven to be evidence of the negation that you are suggesting. Don't look now but your bigotry is showing.

Ever read Isa. 7:14 and compare that confirmation with Matthew 1:23? As far as names go.......what does the name Emmunanuel translate?

 

[surada]

As demonstrated.......God confirmed that Daniel was speaking of Jesus as being the Messiah when Jesus' prophecy came true concerning the total desolation of Israel with its people scrattered all around the globe......just as God confirmed Jesus by the sheer numbers of descendents of father Abraham......numbering like the stars in the heavens. What more evidence does one need as confirmation? Christian Faith is justified by such confirmations. God has confirmed Christianity by the sheer numbers of over 3 Billion people.


Question? If Daniel is addressing the defiled temple (Antiochus 1V Epiphanies) and some King of Egypt or Greece.........where is the new Covenant addressed by Daniel 9? I can't see any NEW COVENANT whatsoever as directly prophesied by Daniel, where is the Covenant between God and Egypt, Greece? Daniel 9 prophecy was fulfilled in the 1st century when the mystery was revealed by Christ Jesus. Where is the Covenant of Antiochus 1V Epiphanies addressed in the Holy Scriptures? Show us the Book, Chapter and Verse were Israel engaged in a New Covenant other than the Covenant of Moses that preceded the Covenant of Christ Jesus.

Just say'n..........its not that Jesus is not mentioned By a 1st century name (as the scriptures declare that the prophecies concerning the coming Messiah were a mystery....even to the one's making the prophecy with the mystery not revealed until the Holy Spirit of God revelaed the mystery to the Apostles of Christ in 1st century -- Eph. 3:5,6, 1 Peter 1:10-12)......but God had this plan conceived in Using Jesus as Christ even before the worlds and time itself began -- 1 Peter 1:20, 2 Tim. 1:9

From the 1st century forward.........THE MYSTERY HAS BEEN REVEALED with no ambiguity whatsoever.

There is an old axiom...........an absence of evidence does not constitue any evidene of absence. You are always found guilty of presenting some evidence based upon logcial fallices that can't be proven to be evidence of the negation that you are suggesting. Don't look now but your bigotry is showing.

Ever read Isa. 7:14 and compare that confirmation with Matthew 1:23? As far as names go.......what does the name Emmunanuel translate?

I think Isaiah's second son is the subject.

The Identity of the Child in Isaiah 7:14

God uses normal means to accomplish wonderous effects, and He does so for now, for the future, and for eternity. Judah was in desperate straits. The strength and prosperity of King Uzziah had give…

mdharrismd.com