Zone1 A Great Authority Given Unto the Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ

[hobelim]

So where do you draw the line between miraculous and made up?

"The Bible" is called the Torah by the people who wrote it meaning instruction. So like any fairy tale the question isn't whether it actually happened or not, the question is what is the teaching.

Only the teaching matters.

Just like Pinocchio. No one wonders whether it was a true story or not. Only the teaching matters

Anyone who claims the Bible is a literal account of historical events is at best irrational if not a con even if the stories take place during historical times with actual historical figures as characters.

For instance, the talking serpent was a reference to the pharaoh who wore a serpent on his head and practiced the magical arts, sorcery, what is now known as mind control, brainwashing. It was written to educate Hebrew children about the dangers of losing your sanity for life to a con artist.

After 400 years of "slavery" in Egypt.

 

[onefour1]

How convenient. With that claim, you can simply make it up as you go along. There is no authority, no standard, and Scripture can be added to say whatever you want. Good luck with that.

Sure there is. You simply need to believe that God can still reveal his will unto his servants the apostles and prophets. Nowhere in the Bible does it suggest that he discontinued this process.

 

[BS Filter]

Hebrews 1:1-2
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Yes this verse tells us that in times past God spoke through prophets. Yes, this verse tells us that in these last days he has spoken unto us by his Son. But it does not say anything about never speaking again to us through prophets. These last days or final days that you refer to are the last half of this earth's mortal time. Yes, Jesus has spoken unto us and will yet speak unto us in these last days. But there is nothing about his never speaking to us again through prophets and apostles. You really need to study Ephesians 4:11-15 which was also taught by Paul just as Hebrews 1:1-2 was. Paul teaches that we are to always have apostles and prophets until we come unto the perfect man, unto the fulness of the stature of Christ. We are not there yet. Apostles and prophets are still needed till we all come to the unity of the faith.

It also doesn't say that God will speak to us again through prophets writing Scripture. This is Scripture and I would be very careful. I'm not trying to manipulate you by fear, I'm simply warning about the fact that Scripture is something you don't play with. "The Last Days" is pretty clear. The entire Mormon doctrine is based on the fact that the Church failed. Isn't that correct? The New Testament prophets are not writing Scripture. We can tell that because the book of mormon and the doctrines and covenants contradict Scripture. The first chapter of Galatians nails it. The mormon gospel is not the Gospel of Paul.

 

[BULLDOG]

"The Bible" is called the Torah by the people who wrote it meaning instruction. So like any fairy tale the question isn't whether it actually happened or not, the question is what is the teaching.

Only the teaching matters.

Just like Pinocchio. No one wonders whether it was a true story or not. Only the teaching matters

Anyone who claims the Bible is a literal account of historical events is at best irrational if not a con even if the stories take place during historical times with actual historical figures as characters.

For instance, the talking serpent was a reference to the pharaoh who wore a serpent on his head and practiced the magical arts, sorcery, what is now known as mind control, brainwashing. It was written to educate Hebrew children about the dangers of losing your sanity for life to a con artist.

After 400 years of "slavery" in Egypt.

Where can you find any of the New Testament in the Torah

 

[onefour1]

It also doesn't say that God will speak to us again through prophets writing Scripture. This is Scripture and I would be very careful. I'm not trying to manipulate you by fear, I'm simply warning about the fact that Scripture is something you don't play with. "The Last Days" is pretty clear. The entire Mormon doctrine is based on the fact that the Church failed. Isn't that correct?

Yes. After the apostles died the church fell into a state of apostasy and needed to be restored again to the earth.

Acts 3:20-21
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Through the Prophet Joseph Smith, God again opened the heavens and instituted the restitution of all things.

 

[BS Filter]

Yes. After the apostles died the church fell into a state of apostasy and needed to be restored again to the earth.

Acts 3:20-21
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Through the Prophet Joseph Smith, God again opened the heavens and instituted the restitution of all things.

No, the church didn't fall into a state of apostacy. That's the same thing that the Jehovah Witnesses claim. The Church is alive and well. Who is the Body of Christ?

 

[onefour1]

No, the church didn't fall into a state of apostacy. That's the same thing that the Jehovah Witnesses claim. The Church is alive and well. Who is the Body of Christ?

Sure it did. Martin Luther and the protestants protested against the apostate Catholic church. When Judas betrayed the Christ they replaced him with a new apostle but after awhile they stopped replacing the apostles and they eventually changed the baptism of accountable people to baptizing unaccountable infants. They also deified Mary who was not God. Jesus taught to call no man your father but to only recognize God your eternal Father in Heaven as your father. The meaning of the word, "Pope" is Father. At one time they would forgive sin for the payment of money, that was called indulgences. Through apostasy they lost the priesthood and authority to act in behalf of God in all the necessary ordinances of the priesthood. A restitution or restoration became necessary to bring back Christ's true church. The body of Christ is the members of Christ's true church who receive the saving ordinances such as baptism, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, the priesthood and now eternal marriage in the House of the Lord under the hands of those who hold authority from God. So do you believe that the Catholics carried on with the true church of Jesus Christ?

 

[ding]

"The Bible" is called the Torah by the people who wrote it meaning instruction. So like any fairy tale the question isn't whether it actually happened or not, the question is what is the teaching.

So you are saying that Israel really doesn't have any God given rights to the land they occupy? That that was a fairytale?

 

[ding]

After 400 years of "slavery" in Egypt.

Were Jews really slaves in Egypt?

Exodus: History or Mythic Tale? | My Jewish Learning

Story of Exodus. Jewish History from 2500 BCE - 539 BCE. Ancient Jewish History. Jewish History and Community.

www.myjewishlearning.com

 

[BS Filter]

Sure it did. Martin Luther and the protestants protested against the apostate Catholic church. When Judas betrayed the Christ they replaced him with a new apostle but after awhile they stopped replacing the apostles and they eventually changed the baptism of accountable people to baptizing unaccountable infants. They also deified Mary who was not God. Jesus taught to call no man your father but to only recognize God your eternal Father in Heaven as your father. The meaning of the word, "Pope" is Father. At one time they would forgive sin for the payment of money, that was called indulgences. Through apostasy they lost the priesthood and authority to act in behalf of God in all the necessary ordinances of the priesthood. A restitution or restoration became necessary to bring back Christ's true church. The body of Christ is the members of Christ's true church who receive the saving ordinances such as baptism, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost, the priesthood and now eternal marriage in the House of the Lord under the hands of those who hold authority from God. So do you believe that the Catholics carried on with the true church of Jesus Christ?

Yet, the Church continued with the Protestant movement. The Church is still going strong. There is no priesthood because all Christians are priests. I received the gift of the Holy Ghost and I'm not mormon. There is no such thing as eternal marriage. There are millions of Christian in nondenominational churches all over the world.

 

[onefour1]

Yet, the Church continued with the Protestant movement. The Church is still going strong. There is no priesthood because all Christians are priests. I received the gift of the Holy Ghost and I'm not mormon. There is no such thing as eternal marriage. There are millions of Christian in nondenominational churches all over the world.

From the LDS perspective, if the Catholics were apostate, then those who break off from the Catholics as protestants did not have authority nor priesthood either. The Catholics were so bad that they did realize that something was seriously wrong and broke away from them but did not have the priesthood authority to perform the necessary priesthood ordinances of the gospel. We believe it took a restitution or restoration of the priesthood and church to bring back the church that existed in the days of Christ and his apostles. This came about by many heavenly visitations and a restoring of the priesthood to establish Christ's church once again upon the earth.

 

[BS Filter]

From the LDS perspective, if the Catholics were apostate, then those who break off from the Catholics as protestants did not have authority nor priesthood either. The Catholics were so bad that they did realize that something was seriously wrong and broke away from them but did not have the priesthood authority to perform the necessary priesthood ordinances of the gospel. We believe it took a restitution or restoration of the priesthood and church to bring back the church that existed in the days of Christ and his apostles. This came about by many heavenly visitations and a restoring of the priesthood to establish Christ's church once again upon the earth.

There are no priesthood ordinances for the Church

 

[onefour1]

There are no priesthood ordinances for the Church

Through the priesthood the apostles and other members of the church were able to perform ordinances such as baptism, conferring the Holy Ghost, administering the sacrament, administering to the sick and afflicted, etc.

 

[BS Filter]

Through the priesthood the apostles and other members of the church were able to perform ordinances such as baptism, conferring the Holy Ghost, administering the sacrament, administering to the sick and afflicted,

Any Christian can perform water baptisms. I received the Baptism of the Holy Spirit alone in prayer. In the Book of Acts they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and no one touched them. There is no priesthood in the Church and never has been. Every believer is a priest, that's what Scripture says.

Mormons believe their Church is the only true church. So which church was the only true Church during the days of the Book of Acts? The Jehovah Witnesses also believe that they are the only true church. Here's a fact, there is no such as a true church. The church is every believer in Jesus. The church isn't an organization. The church is every believer in Jesus. Period.

 

[kjw47]

The bible also says
Matthew 17:20
“Because you have so little faith,” He answered. “For truly I tell you, if you have faith the size of a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, ‘Move from here to there,’ and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you.”

You would think there would be at least a few reports of mountains being moved, But I haven't found any. Do you think that might have been just made-up shit, and nobody really has the power to order a mountain to move?

It was symbolism. Example--like quitting smoking can seem mountainous to an individual, but with faith one can do it. I did. God helped me.

 

[hobelim]

Where can you find any of the New Testament in the Torah

You can't without digging deeply. "The word became flesh" is saying that the existing metaphor for Divine teaching, bread from heaven, became the flesh (teaching) of Jesus. A new metaphor for a new Divine revelation that the words in the Law are figurative, the subjects hidden and not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used. Like "flesh" in kosher law

The kingdom of Heaven is hidden treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it (whoever Jesus was) BURIED IT AGAIN." If you look and look and keep on looking,(thinking) you will find it."

 

[BULLDOG]

It was symbolism. Example--like quitting smoking can seem mountainous to an individual, but with faith one can do it. I did. God helped me.

He didn't say if you had faith as a mustard seed, you could quit smoking. Again, everything in the Bible is 100% true except the parts you don't like, and the totally batshit crazy parts, so you call those parts metaphors.

 

[BULLDOG]

You can't without digging deeply. "The word became flesh" is saying that the existing metaphor for Divine teaching, bread from heaven, became the flesh (teaching) of Jesus. A new metaphor for a new Divine revelation that the words in the Law are figurative, the subjects hidden and not necessarily directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used. Like "flesh" in kosher law

The kingdom of Heaven is hidden treasure lying buried in a field. The man who found it (whoever Jesus was) BURIED IT AGAIN." If you look and look and keep on looking,(thinking) you will find it."

Again, -------- BATSHIT CRAZY = METAPHORE

That makes things much easier for you, doesn't it?

 

[kjw47]

He didn't say if you had faith as a mustard seed, you could quit smoking. Again, everything in the Bible is 100% true except the parts you don't like, and the totally batshit crazy parts, so you call those parts metaphors.

No one can move mountains. Its your unrealistic reasoning misleading you.

 

[BULLDOG]

No one can move mountains. Its your unrealistic reasoning misleading you.

Someone should have told the guy that put it in the Bible.