A Good Example Of Why We Will Lose This War

NATO AIR

Senior Member
Jun 25, 2004
4,275
285
48
USS Abraham Lincoln
because we're just not ruthless or cunning enough... we worship at the false altar of freedom and human rights in a time of war when we can afford to our enemies neither.

(at least if you're of the john mccain/michael scheuer set, whose criticism and ideas are starting to make a lot of sense)

http://www.uscav.com/uscavonpoint/Feature.aspx?id=156
The comments expressed by Dr. Scheuer are his own. They do not represent the opinion of "U.S. CAVALRY ON POINT", U.S. Cavalry Corp., Cavalry Security Group (CSG), any CSG subsidiaries, nor its management.

Dr. Scheuer's photo was kindly provided by Sam Dorrance/Malaga Productions 2005.

Missing Zawahiri - A Portent of America’s Coming Defeat

In a country knowledgeable of history and with its head screwed on right, last week’s near-miss attack on the life of al-Qaeda deputy leader Ayman al-Zawahiri would have been greeted with a resounding hurrah, a hearty well done to the reported CIA gunners, and an sincere injunction to keep shooting. Worries about 17 dead Pakistanis -- who were, after all, waiting to host Zawahiri to dinner -- would be non-existent because U.S. intelligence and military forces are meant to protect America by killing its enemies, not to absolutely avoid foreign casualties. And, finally, there would be questions and lingering worries among everyday folks about why there have been so few reported attacks on America’s enemies in Afghanistan and Pakistan.

Sadly, America’s knowledge of history is nearly nil and its bipartisan leaders are far from having their heads properly screwed on. The reaction to the near-miss on Zawahiri has been coast-to-coast media and political wailing -- with the commendable exception of Senator John McCain -- about the seventeen dead “Pakistani innocents” caused by a “botched CIA operation.” Now the Pakistani people are angry at the United States, claim the wailers, and that will make the battle against bin Laden more difficult. Washington, they assert, must act to ensure that the CIA does not kill more innocent Pakistanis, thereby leaving the impression that the CIA attack on Zawahiri was rogue operation -- “aren’t they all” is always the media’s position -- that cared not a whit about civilian casualties. If past is prologue, the net impact of this ahistorical and illogical reaction will be to scare the politicians, increase the paralyzing bureaucratic and lawyerly oversight of war-waging , and make the killing of our enemies even less likely. Indeed, Pakistan’s ruling party has called for a public U.S. apology and the Secretary of State responded on 16 January 2006 by saying that Washington “would address Pakistan’s concerns over the bombing.” Thus, the road toward America’s defeat by Islamic extremists continues to be paved with historical ignorance and moral cowardice.

In a rational, historically aware country, U.S. leaders would have told Americans that the attack on Zawahiri was facilitated by U.S. intelligence officers and Special Forces who risked their lives to gather intelligence that seemed to fix Zawahiri in a specific place at a specific time. Because Washington’s most important duty is to protect Americans, they would have said, we acted on the best information available and, so to speak, let 'er rip. Unfortunately, we missed Zawahiri, but we killed four of his fighters and will keep trying to get him and bin Laden. As for the dead Pakistanis, they are foreigners not Americans and we have no responsibility to protect them. And, in any event, they were about to serve up sautéed goat steaks and curry to one of America’s most dangerous enemies. The lesson all Pakistanis should take from the incident is that we are not concerned with the lives of Zawahiri’s abettors, that they were lucky the village was not hit by B-52s, and that next time they may not be so fortunate.

Such a public articulation would have been neither callus nor irresponsible; it just would have been true. We are engaged in war against Islamic militants who fight as insurgents. These men wear no uniforms, and live -- and hide -- among a population in eastern Afghanistan and western Pakistan that overwhelmingly supports them because the insurgents are their coreligionists and because they are attacking the United States. The current problem for America is not last week’s near-miss on Zawahiri, but that there have been so few attacks on Zawahiri and bin Laden. Frankly, from an intelligence perspective, the more violence, the better chance to collect quality intelligence. Frequent, deadly bombings -- even if not always totally effective -- make the enemy nervous, force him to move about, and stimulate chattiness as he communicates electronically about his location and status. Our ability to collect intelligence pin-pointing the enemy increases exponentially when he is talking and moving. Thus, even a near-miss is a valuable stimulus to collection.

And there is much to be said for killing foreigners -- even in large numbers -- who are willing to host, hide, feed, fund, and pray for America’s enemies. No enemy of America in the modern age, be that foe a nation-state or an insurgent movement, could have or can be beaten by only killing the guys with the guns. The North could not have beaten the Confederacy by only killing the men of Lee’s Army of Northern Virginia, any more than the United States could have beaten Imperial Japan or Nazi Germany by only killing the uniformed soldiers of those nations. To definitively defeat those foes -- and leave no them no doubt they were utterly beaten and further resistance was futile -- Billy Sherman’s army had to make Georgia and the Carolinas blaze and howl, and U.S. flyers had to destroy Dresden, fire-bomb Tokyo, and atomize Hiroshima and Nagasaki. If America’s Islamic insurgent enemies are to be decisively defeated, Pakistani, Iraqi, and Afghan civilians --like their Southern, German, and Japanese predecessors -- will have to howl and burn as our intelligence and military services kill the insurgents. Based on the iron-laws of history, and our iron resolve not to change any U.S. polcy that motivates the Islamists, this a sad but unavoidable reality.

In the wake of the near-miss of Zawahiri, then, we are watching most of our bipartisan political elite, the media, our pacifist mainstream churches, and the lethally anti-American academy push the United States ever closer to defeat by combining to prevent the United States from using its full military power. All of these entities will shelter under the noxious effusions of the just-war theorists, those paragons who are always bent on making wars into never-ending, ever-resurgent bloodlettings by finding fatal moral fault with any attempt to -- excuse the word -- “Win.”

Still, though chances seem slim, there may be a W.T .Sherman, a Curtis Lemay, or a Philip Henry Sheridan out there in the country, a man or woman who rejects just-war theory and seeks to apply America’s traditional, pre-1945 “merciful-war theory”: Annihilate the enemy and its support base as quickly as possible with unremitting, brutal, and indiscriminate violence and then come home, leaving the enemy -- and all others watching -- to ponder the cost of starting a war against the United States. The only leniency our country is obligated to afford those who attack us was described by Sheridan: “Nothing should be left to the people but eyes to lament the war.”
 
Annihilate the enemy and its support base as quickly as possible with unremitting, brutal, and indiscriminate violence and then come home, leaving the enemy -- and all others watching -- to ponder the cost of starting a war against the United States. The only leniency our country is obligated to afford those who attack us was described by Sheridan: “Nothing should be left to the people but eyes to lament the war.”

I'm onboard with this .....
 
I agree with a lot that Dr. Scheuer says in his article but not his conclusion: that we will lose the war against the terrorists. As long as George W. is president, that will not happen. But if the Democrats should get back in power, all bets are off.
 
Adam's Apple said:
I agree with a lot that Dr. Scheuer says in his article but not his conclusion: that we will lose the war against the terrorists. As long as George W. is president, that will not happen. But if the Democrats should get back in power, all bets are off.

I think that's his point. The enemy within is doing their damnedest to ensure we lose. People/organizations such as that should be as feared as al Qaeda.
 
Do you agree with Scheuer's hypothesis that we will lose this war?

When I read the article, remembrances of Lyndon Johnson, Walter Kronkite, Vietnam, etc., came tumbling back to mind. In my opinion, the anti-American, cowardly PC crowd can bluster all they want, but as long as George W. is president, he will pay them no heed and we will not lose the war.
 
rtwngAvngr said:
Nato's got some evil libs that get in his ear once in a while.
Hey now, NATO does just fine...remember he came to this board as pretty much a full blown lib.
 
CSM said:
Hey now, NATO does just fine...remember he came to this board as pretty much a full blown lib.

He still falls for a lot of lib negativism dressed up as "analysis".

But still, he's one of the sharpest young'n's I know. :rock: Nato Rocks!
 
Adam's Apple said:
Do you agree with Scheuer's hypothesis that we will lose this war?

When I read the article, remembrances of Lyndon Johnson, Walter Kronkite, Vietnam, etc., came tumbling back to mind. In my opinion, the anti-American, cowardly PC crowd can bluster all they want, but as long as George W. is president, he will pay them no heed and we will not lose the war.

Except that, contrary to the fever dreams of the kook Dem conspiracy-theorists, he isn't going to be President forever. Democrats can't wait to help the world be destroying their own country's status in the world. It is their mission in life. Just read the posts by the libs on this board. They don't care about Al Qaeda or anything. Terrorism is just one of those things like hurricanes. Happens every so often, what are ya gonna do, best not to overreact. Now BUSH, there's a threat to America if they ever saw one.
 
My quarrel was not with NATO or even with a lot of what Dr. Scheuer says in his article, which was thought-provoking and well written. My quarrel was with Dr. Scheuer's conclusion that we would lose the war against the terrorists.
 
Adam's Apple said:
My quarrel was not with NATO or even with a lot of what Dr. Scheuer says in his article, which was thought-provoking and well written. My quarrel was with Dr. Scheuer's conclusion that we would lose the war against the terrorists.

I am not so sure he is incorrect in his conclusion. After all, the American libs have managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory at least once in the 20th Century. If there is any correlation between Vietnam and the current war it is that the left is trying very hard to ensure that the USA's enemies succeed in their goals despite themselves.
 
theim said:
Now BUSH, there's a threat to America if they ever saw one.
Especially with the way he's been pushing to legalize rape across the country. :wtf:

He's so caught up with this that he's just rubber-stamping mindless orders to destroy innocent West-hating denizens of the Arabic world.
 
CSM said:
I am not so sure he is incorrect in his conclusion. After all, the American libs have managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory at least once in the 20th Century.

I don't think there will be a defeat this time as long as Bush and the GOP holds the White House. Bush is not Lyndon Johnson, and the libs are no longer as powerful as they once were. Much to our good fortune, they no longer set the course for this country.
 
Adam's Apple said:
I don't think there will be a defeat this time as long as Bush and the GOP holds the White House. Bush is not Lyndon Johnson, and the libs are no longer as powerful as they once were. Much to our good fortune, they no longer set the course for this country.

I never underestimate the depths of stupidity that can be found among some. There is no doubt in my mind that the war on terror will continue (or at least it should) long after the current administration is out of the White House. The American public has a very short attention span and I have no doubt that the geriatric demagogs that make up the current minority will do their best to hand victory to US enemies just as soon as they think no one is paying attetnion.
 
WHAT A PICTURE - AT OVER TWO MILES AWAY
Here is what technology can do in a war zone. The pictures were taken from an AC130 Specter gunship two and a half miles away. The guys in the picture are setting up a roadside bomb and planning to ambush an American convoy which followed a shortly after the pictures were taken. They were setting up for the ambush and were pacing off the distance from the bomb to where the convoy was to pass by. Turn your sound up.


http://lvlranch.com/images/iraqiinsurgents-takeout.wmv
 
(sorry, was gone for 6 days- went to Hong Kong for Chinese New Year)

Well, I don't know if I rock, but thank you.

And yes, liberal ideas still float easily in my ear at times.

I like to read Scheuer's analysis on the WOT because he brings a vantage point that is rarely heard from in intelligent form... i.e. he is the Curtis LeMay type figure who serves his purpose by reminding us we can utilize violence as a good first option, rather than a last resort.

Simply above all else, what Scheuer reminds us of is that all of us are now infected with a deference to international opinion and views of us, as shaped by our experiences with the international media, which is the #1 enemy of US objectives worldwide.

We cannot win the war on terror by kowtowing to the global media (including our own) and the global elites. We invite our self-destruction, and that is what these foolhardly liberals are doing now. And don't worry, they'll get into power somehow, someway, because sadly, our side continues to win only because right now the opposition is so weak and inept. That won't continue forever.
 
  • Thanks
Reactions: CSM
NATO AIR said:
(sorry, was gone for 6 days- went to Hong Kong for Chinese New Year)

Well, I don't know if I rock, but thank you.

And yes, liberal ideas still float easily in my ear at times.

I like to read Scheuer's analysis on the WOT because he brings a vantage point that is rarely heard from in intelligent form... i.e. he is the Curtis LeMay type figure who serves his purpose by reminding us we can utilize violence as a good first option, rather than a last resort.

Simply above all else, what Scheuer reminds us of is that all of us are now infected with a deference to international opinion and views of us, as shaped by our experiences with the international media, which is the #1 enemy of US objectives worldwide.

We cannot win the war on terror by kowtowing to the global media (including our own) and the global elites. We invite our self-destruction, and that is what these foolhardly liberals are doing now. And don't worry, they'll get into power somehow, someway, because sadly, our side continues to win only because right now the opposition is so weak and inept. That won't continue forever.
yeah...what he just said!
 

Forum List

Back
Top