Zone1 A Brief Look at Blacks and Jews in America(take 2)

[Coyote]

1) First, nobody is planning to get rid of immigrants. You, like liberals, conflate decent legal immigrants with ILLEGAL aliens.

I'm conflating nothing. You, like rightists, try to hide your nativist rhetoric and policy preferences behind a veneer of "it's only illegal immigration" you worry about.

2) Are you actually drawing a parallel between opposition to illegal aliens and prejudice against law-abiding, American Jews?!

I don't know why you keep brinnging up illegal immigrants. I didn't. I'm talking about legal immigration.

3) And I notice that you also jump in to say you’re worried that Muslims will be blamed, too. JEWS have always been the #1 scapegoat throughout the world, and rushing in to say “yeah, all minorities” may suffer weakens or downplays that.

In this country Muslims are a much smaller minority and frequently heavily targeted by rightwing hate groups,so ya, they suffer. Is that, like blacks, a bridge too far for your empathy to extend to?

 

[Coyote]

I think IM2 is claiming that the majority of blacks are as antisemitic and anti-white as he is. I would assume he’s wrong, and the black activists on this thread - raging and screaming and accusing and insulting, along with blaming racist whitey and Jew boys for all their troubles - are in the slim majority.

I don't see the "majority of blacks" "raging, screaming and accusing and insulting" here.

 

[Lisa558]

I'm conflating nothing. You, like rightists, try to hide your nativist rhetoric and policy preferences behind a veneer of "it's only illegal immigration" you worry about.

We’ll of course it’s only illegal aliens I worry about. Are you falsely accusing me of being opposed to LEGAL immigration, which is how my own family came here?

I don't know why you keep brinnging up illegal immigrants. I didn't. I'm talking about legal immigration.

In this country Muslims are a much smaller minority and frequently heavily targeted by rightwing hate groups,so ya, they suffer. Is that, like blacks, a bridge to far for your empathy to extend to?

No, I was talking about how Jews have always been made the scapegoat, and like leftists, you attempt to water it down by bringing in blacks and Muslims. It’s the same reason blacks got upset when other people insisted ALL Lives Matter - the claim was that by bringing others into it, it was watering down the issue.

 

[Lisa558]

I don't see the "majority of blacks" "raging, screaming and accusing and insulting" here.

I specifically said the black activists, and yes, that’s what they’re doing. You have yet to condemn or even challenge a single one of them because, well….they’re black and you have different tolerance levels depending on which race or ethnicity the person belongs to.

 

[Lisa558]

This website is just preparing us for what life will be like when the Democrat party is finally susseful in establishing their thousand year woke.

I hope I’ve died of old age by then and won’t have to see it.

 

[Coyote]

The thing is that these leftists want to separate out what happened in Germany in the 40s as if that meant Jews in America escaped the HORRIFIC antisemitism there, because it supports their excuse that blacks had it worse HERE than Jews did HERE - even back three generations.

Having your parents, grandparents, siblings, aunts, uncles, and cousins all STOLEN from you and wiped from the Earth - and knowing the horror they suffered in their final hours - IS experiencing antisemitism, even if it was from an inner-city tenement in New York.

Something you might not have considered, but slavery too ripped apart and destroyed families.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

It’s just the opposite! I am showing how Jews, DESPITE the antisemitism, did not allow themselves to become victims

If the Jewish people, in your opinion only, possessed the power to "not allow themselves to become victims" then why didn't they stay in their own country and use that 'power' to resist and defeat Hitler?

And why did you say "did not allow themselves to become victims" instead of "did not allow ourselves to become victims"

 

[Coyote]

We’ll of course it’s only illegal aliens I worry about. Are you falsely accusing me of being opposed to LEGAL immigration, which is how my own family came here?


No, I was talking about how Jews have always been made the scapegoat, and like leftists, you attempt to water it down by bringing in blacks and Muslims. It’s the same reason blacks got upset when other people insisted ALL Lives Matter - the claim was that by bringing others into it, it was watering down the issue.

Goodness. How dare we mention other groups who have been persecuted and harmed in this country. And you accuse blacks of victimology while waiving the victim card?

This country has treated multiple groups horribly, it's not just Jews. None deseve to be marginalized and that is what seems to be happening here...."there can only be one"...

It's all bad.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Did 6 million of your relatives - and within the memory of those living today - get rounded up because they were black and killed for that sole reason

So now in addition to your poor penniless uneducated great grandparents you have 6 million more relatives you forgot about?

 

[Coyote]

I specifically said the black activists, and yes, that’s what they’re doing. You have yet to condemn or even challenge a single one of them because, well….they’re black and you have different tolerance levels depending on which race or ethnicity the person belongs to.

Who exactly are the black activists", those who don't toe the line on the issue of race in America?

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Because that hasn’t been the case in two generations.

You‘ve had 40 years to take advantage of pro-black policies, given out at the expense of whites, to move up. And MOST blacks have. That’s why they are living in nice homes and eating out at expensive restaurants. They made the right choices and improved their lives.

That some blacks did not isn’t the fault of whitey.

Lisa all you're doing is demonstrating that you are far less educated that you would have us believe. You have a very simple-minded way of look at complex issues along with an inability to process new information apparently.

And your resentment of the progress that black people are finally making speaks volumes about your own insecurities which leads me to suspect that you're probably not quite as successful as you want us to believe.

YOU are not the arbitrator of how long it takes to get things done. YOU get no say so in how government money is spent. You don't want your tax dollars spent on reparations then stop paying taxes or better yet, move out of the United States altogether.

 

[Lisa558]

Something you might not have considered, but slavery too ripped apart and destroyed families.

Yeah, but we are talking about families ripped apart during the lifetimes of those suffering. Jews in the 40s suffered immensely from having their families killed, and blacks for the last two generations haven’t had anything even close to that. Sure, slavery ripped families apart, but that wasn’t during the lifetime of anyone alive today.

But you go back to making excuses for blacks. They are the “oppressed” and the successful Jews are part of the “oppressor” class. What liberals are doing do this country is beyond horrific.

 

[Lisa558]

Lisa all you're doing is demonstrating that you are far less educated that you would have us believe. You have a very simple-minded way of look at complex issues along with an inability to process new information apparently.

And your resentment of the progress that black people are finally making speaks volumes about your own insecurities which leads me to suspect that you're probably not quite as successful as you want us to believe.

YOU are not the arbitrator of how long it takes to get things done. YOU get no say so in how government money is spent. You don't want your tax dollars spent on reparations then stop paying taxes or better yet, move out of the United States altogether.

All lies and beliefs you ascribe to me that aren’t true. That you have to drop to this level of debate - assigning beliefs to your enemy and then castigating them based on the false belief you’ve assigned to them - tells me you are in too far gone to engage with anyone who doesn’t agree with you.

Goodbye and good luck.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Nobody ever said Jews were perfect

You imply it Lisa, every damn day - "Oooh we did it, why can't black people do it too? <wink wink>

As @flacaltenn pointed out, they dealt with restricted neighborhoods where developers wouldn’t sell, and all sorts of clubs where Jews weren’t allowed.

For less than 100 years, for black people more than 300 years

So with all that determination, motivation, effort, hard work, discipline, and sacrifice to work around all that prejudice, are you applauding their outcomes in spite of antisemitism, or, like IM2 and Newvine, are you looking for ways to discredit them

Again Lisa, I take exception with YOU not the Jewish people in general. In fact you're the only Jewish person I know that I actively dislike. However that doesn't impact historical facts which you always interpret in the the light most favorable to the Jewish people

 

[Lisa558]

Who exactly are the black activists", those who don't toe the line on the issue of race in America?

Oh great….another assigned belief.

I a, talking about the black activists on this thread, accusing people of being racist and evil, accusing them of being liars, ascribing beliefs to them that they don’t have, and all because they won’t submit to the idea that blacks are responsible for their own choices and outcomes in the 3rd decade of the 21st century.

I find it quite telling that not only have you been unwilling to challenge any of the horrendous and nasty accusations being leveled at posters by blacks here, in Zone 1, you direct your ire and accusations to the sole Jew on this thread, and let everything else pass by.

And just as bad, you’ve joined along with the race-baiting OP, who is interpreting the positive things Jews did for blacks as being selfish, to make Jews look intolerant by digging up some obscure article by a college intern who claimed Jews saw other Jews as dirty and ignorant.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

I am fascinated. There have been some demands by various black groups for "reparations". "Reparations for what "? As to the "antisemitism"--do you deny that there is anti-jew feeling perpeturated by black leaders?

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

no so "HONESTLY" Lisa has asserted "RACISM
no longer exists in the U.S ? where?

"HOW IN THE HELL" do you get from the statement of Lisa "....murder of your people was
WORSE than the murder of ours..."?

 

[Lisa558]

You imply it Lisa, every damn day - "Oooh we did it, why can't black people do it too? <wink wink>


For less than 100 years, for black people more than 300 years


Again Lisa, I take exception with YOU not the Jewish people in general. In fact you're the only Jewish person I know that I actively dislike. However that doesn't impact historical facts which you always interpret in the the light most favorable to the Jewish people

Your hostility and accusations are not appropriate in a Zone 1 thread. (I can’t help noticing that we’ve had non-Jews making really blatant racist comments - they’re lazy, they’re a subspecies, etc., etc., - but for some reason, your ire is all directed at the Jew.

 

[Coyote]

Yeah, but we are talking about families ripped apart during the lifetimes of those suffering. Jews in the 40s suffered immensely from having their families killed, and blacks for the last two generations haven’t had anything even close to that. Sure, slavery ripped families apart, but that wasn’t during the lifetime of anyone alive today.

But you go back to making excuses for blacks. They are the “oppressed” and the successful Jews are part of the “oppressor” class. What liberals are doing do this country is beyond horrific.

What is horrific IMO is an inability the recognize that others have suffered persecution and worse, in this country and in living memory. Whether it is watching the horrors of the Holocaust from a distance, knowing there was nothing you could do save your relatives or the horror of having your lynched and murdered because his skin color demanded vigilante justice...it's all bad. WW2, black soldiers, who's own country maintained strict segregation, fought to liberate Jews. Civil Rights, Jews fought to bring civil rights to Blacks. There is an irony here.

 

[Coyote]

Oh great….another assigned belief.

I a, talking about the black activists on this thread, accusing people of being racist and evil, accusing them of being liars, ascribing beliefs to them that they don’t have, and all because they won’t submit to the idea that blacks are responsible for their own choices and outcomes in the 3rd decade of the 21st century.

I find it quite telling that not only have you been unwilling to challenge any of the horrendous and nasty accusations being leveled at posters by blacks here, in Zone 1, you direct your ire and accusations to the sole Jew on this thread, and let everything else pass by.

And just as bad, you’ve joined along with the race-baiting OP, who is interpreting the positive things Jews did for blacks as being selfish, to make Jews look intolerant by digging up some obscure article by a college intern who claimed Jews saw other Jews as dirty and ignorant.

You aren't the sole Jew on this thread.