The Teachings of Jesus Christ

[Mudda]

So who made god?

Ah, heck. I teach middle school science, and people are always after me to teach something that requires a doctorate! I'll try presenting a very simplified form (since that is the only form my not very advanced scientific brain operates).

About fourteen billion years ago scientists agree the universe had its beginning. Since nothing can come from nothing, something caused our universe to come into being. The universe coming into being also began the beginning of time because time does not operate outside of cause and effect (as there is nothing to measure).

No one made/caused God because God operates before/outside of time, outside of cause and effect. (When something operates outside cause and effect, it cannot itself be caused.)

"Since nothing can come from nothing", then where did god come from?

 

[Mudda]

... and Meriweather crucifies a 13 year old girl for being a Free Spirit, the same as what was done to Jesus.

Yawn. Not being content to be wrong once, you decide to repeat yourself, hmmm.

Someday you will have to stop by my classroom where the LGBT crowd have felt welcome at lunch and where I am welcome at their meetings. They would laugh you to scorn. When I speak of differences in 13-year-old girls I know what I'm talking about. Your reading comprehension is sadly lacking.

So you invite young teenagers into your classroom for lunch? Hmmm, sounds kinda pedophillic.

 

[Meriweather]

Apparently, Jesus died on that wood for our sins. So according to Christianity, my sin bill has already been paid.

Is Jesus your sacrificial lamb? Recall that the life of Jesus is a kind of overlay of the Old Testament, of what came before. In Exodus, the Israelites were told to paint their door posts with the blood of their sacrificial lamb--and that the angel of death would pass over that house. Recall that both blood and Jesus symbolize life. Is Jesus and his teachings your life? This is a life of obedience to God. At points where failure occurs, Christ is our help.

It is best to recall another of Christ's teachings: Enter through the narrow gate. Anyone who tries to enter through any other means is a thief and a murderer.

 

[Meriweather]

"Since nothing can come from nothing", then where did god come from?

You missed a key point: After the universe was set into motion, nothing here in this universe can come from nothing. There was a beginning to the universe, a beginning to time. What came before the beginning? Who caused the beginning? God is that first cause. What caused the first cause doesn't make sense, because if something caused the first cause, then that particular first cause would no longer be the first cause.

Either nothing caused the universe to exist (nothing comes from nothing); or, the first cause caused the next cause (the universe) to come into existence. What is that cause that could create a universe? Believers call that first cause "God".

 

[Mudda]

Apparently, Jesus died on that wood for our sins. So according to Christianity, my sin bill has already been paid.

Is Jesus your sacrificial lamb? Recall that the life of Jesus is a kind of overlay of the Old Testament, of what came before. In Exodus, the Israelites were told to paint their door posts with the blood of their sacrificial lamb--and that the angel of death would pass over that house. Recall that both blood and Jesus symbolize life. Is Jesus and his teachings your life? This is a life of obedience to God. At points where failure occurs, Christ is our help.

It is best to recall another of Christ's teachings: Enter through the narrow gate. Anyone who tries to enter through any other means is a thief and a murderer.

It doesn't matter what gate I enter by, my sin bill has already been paid by Geezoos dying nailed to wood.

 

[Mudda]

"Since nothing can come from nothing", then where did god come from?

You missed a key point: After the universe was set into motion, nothing here in this universe can come from nothing. There was a beginning to the universe, a beginning to time. What came before the beginning? Who caused the beginning? God is that first cause. What caused the first cause doesn't make sense, because if something caused the first cause, then that particular first cause would no longer be the first cause.

Either nothing caused the universe to exist (nothing comes from nothing); or, the first cause caused the next cause (the universe) to come into existence. What is that cause that could create a universe? Believers call that first cause "God".

So what makes you think that god wasn't created? You got some kind of proof?

 

[Meriweather]

So what makes you think that god wasn't created? You got some kind of proof?

We are talking about First Cause.

God, being first, could not have been created. Think of it this way. If someone came in first in a race, who came in ahead of him? No one, as he was first.

 

[Meriweather]

It doesn't matter what gate I enter by, my sin bill has already been paid...

Now you are quoting a latter day interpretation of some Protestant sect more than a thousand years after Jesus lived. I'd be cautious, remembering Jesus himself said, "I will say to some who called upon my name, begone, I never knew you."

 

[hobelim]

It is best to recall another of Christ's teachings: Enter through the narrow gate. Anyone who tries to enter through any other means is a thief and a murderer.

I see the narrow gate as a reference to the only right way to understand and follow the divine commands that leads to eternal life..

During the time of Jesus when every Jew had been following a strict literal interpretation of the law according to the talmud, the traditions of men, for over a thousand years it was very difficult because one could not conform to the deeper implications and teaching of the law that few find without violating the literal letter of the law and becoming a sinner, worthy of death, in the eyes of everyone else....

What Jesus understood is that one cannot follow the literal letter of the law without violating the deeper implications of the very same law and receiving the death promised for disobedience..

For instance, once his mind was opened by God to understand Jesus could no longer conform to kosher law as a menu without violating the deeper implications of Kosher law because to accept the teaching that one can become holy by eating or refraining from certain food is to swallow the flesh of unclean creatures that do not ruminate.

They wanted to kill Jesus for being a sinner but to Jesus everyone else was already dead.


In this day and age, entering by the narrow gate and conforming to the way to life that is straight, narrow, and difficult, is unbelievably easy.

 

[Meriweather]

In this day and age, entering by the narrow gate and conforming to the way to life that is straight, narrow, and difficult, is unbelievably easy.

In some of today's teaching of Christianity is the thought that Christ paid for all of mankind's sins two thousand years ago. From here on out sins are already covered by God's grace. It seems to me this is precisely the broad way about which Jesus warned.


If we keep in mind the two greatest Commandments (Love of God, love of fellow man) that narrow way is not so easy. The human heart is incredibly treacherous--who can understand it? No matter how selfless we intend to be, at the back of our minds is always the question, "What is in it for me?" How do we get through the narrow gate with an attitude of, "What is in it for me?"

Fortunately, we have another of Jesus' teachings: "With God, all things are possible."

Even this does not excuse us from doing our own part as best we are able.

 

[hobelim]

In this day and age, entering by the narrow gate and conforming to the way to life that is straight, narrow, and difficult, is unbelievably easy.

In some of today's teaching of Christianity is the thought that Christ paid for all of mankind's sins two thousand years ago. From here on out sins are already covered by God's grace. It seems to me this is precisely the broad way about which Jesus warned.


If we keep in mind the two greatest Commandments (Love of God, love of fellow man) that narrow way is not so easy. The human heart is incredibly treacherous--who can understand it? No matter how selfless we intend to be, at the back of our minds is always the question, "What is in it for me?" How do we get through the narrow gate with an attitude of, "What is in it for me?"

Fortunately, we have another of Jesus' teachings: "With God, all things are possible."

Even this does not excuse us from doing our own part as best we are able.

I know that you have been told that Jesus abolished divine law.

I am telling you that the only thing that was abolished was the wrong way to follow that law, not the law itself.

Its really not about being selfless its about not being stupid.


How hard is that?


The two greatest commands were given as a constraint on how to discern the hidden meaning and intent of any given law.

If you loved God you would never be seeking spiritual life on your knees before anything made by human hands.

If you loved your neighbor you cant very well pick up stones to kill them with just because they liked bacon, the subject has to be about something else. ....

If you look and look and keep on looking you will find it.

 

[Meriweather]

I know that you have been told that Jesus abolished divine law.

I am telling you that the only thing that was abolished was the wrong way to follow that law, not the law itself.

Its really not about being selfless its about not being stupid.


How hard is that?

What the heck? Jesus did not abolish Divine Law, and Catholics do not believe that he did. Christ taught fulfilling Divine Law, and he is the interpreter of Divine Law.

 

[hobelim]

I know that you have been told that Jesus abolished divine law.

I am telling you that the only thing that was abolished was the wrong way to follow that law, not the law itself.

Its really not about being selfless its about not being stupid.


How hard is that?

What the heck? Jesus did not abolish Divine Law, and Catholics do not believe that he did. Christ taught fulfilling Divine Law, and he is the interpreter of Divine Law.

To fulfill the law is to comply with its demands. Jesus said that believers in him will do what he did.

When are you going to get around to it darling?


Seems like you've been munching on the flesh of unclean creatures that do not ruminate.

 

[Meriweather]

I know everything Jesus said cannot be my personal "favorite", but he said so many great things. The Lord's Prayer has helped to sustain me many times in my life.

One of my favorite events in Jesus' life was when he met with Zacchaeus who was up in a sycamore tree.

 

[Mudda]

So what makes you think that god wasn't created? You got some kind of proof?

We are talking about First Cause.

God, being first, could not have been created. Think of it this way. If someone came in first in a race, who came in ahead of him? No one, as he was first.

But the person who came in first was created. And in fact, you have no proof that god wasn't created. Please try again.

 

[Mudda]

It doesn't matter what gate I enter by, my sin bill has already been paid...

Now you are quoting a latter day interpretation of some Protestant sect more than a thousand years after Jesus lived. I'd be cautious, remembering Jesus himself said, "I will say to some who called upon my name, begone, I never knew you."

I think he's talking about you because he's paid my sin bill already, you can't take that back.

 

[Meriweather]

But the person who came in first was created. And in fact, you have no proof that god wasn't created. Please try again.

You wanted the scientific explanation. I gave it. Science has proved that the universe had a beginning. They do not know what caused the universe to begin. The theories:

1. Something outside of space/time caused it to begin (i.e., God)
2. Nothing caused it to begin. It just happened out of nothing, but from that point forward things started coming from other things, and everything stopped coming out of nothing.

You are not trying very hard. If something created God, then that would become the first cause. Then you go ad nauseam into but who created that until....you still wind up with what was FIRST? Believers go straight to who/what was FIRST. Nothing/no one could create the first because then it wouldn't have been FIRST would it?

What do you think was first? (Remember, nothing can come before what was first.)

 

[Mudda]

But the person who came in first was created. And in fact, you have no proof that god wasn't created. Please try again.

You wanted the scientific explanation. I gave it. Science has proved that the universe had a beginning. They do not know what caused the universe to begin. The theories:

1. Something outside of space/time caused it to begin (i.e., God)
2. Nothing caused it to begin. It just happened out of nothing, but from that point forward things started coming from other things, and everything stopped coming out of nothing.

You are not trying very hard. If something created God, then that would become the first cause. Then you go ad nauseam into but who created that until....you still wind up with what was FIRST? Believers go straight to who/what was FIRST. Nothing/no one could create the first because then it wouldn't have been FIRST would it?

What do you think was first? (Remember, nothing can come before what was first.)

Nothing has been proven to have been first, that you claim it was your invisible stone cutter is totally without foundation. I can admit that we don't yet know how everything started and who was first... and just because I don't know doesn't mean that I'm going to make something up like you do.

 

[Meriweather]

Nothing has been proven to have been first, that you claim it was your invisible stone cutter is totally without foundation. I can admit that we don't yet know how everything started and who was first... and just because I don't know doesn't mean that I'm going to make something up like you do.

Sigh. Open a science book. All agree the universe had a beginning. What caused the beginning?

Or, are you going with your own theory (something made up ) that the universe did not have a beginning?

If you decide to go along with science that the universe did have a beginning, then science presents two options: An intelligence that exists beyond space/time; or, that the universe came about from nothing. In either case, at present, science has no way to prove or even theorize about either.

In today's conversation with you, I am speaking outside religion. I've put on my other hat--science. I'm advising you on how science looks at it. I'm not saying there is this greater intelligence (what people of faith refer to as God); and I am not saying the universe came from nothing. I have been trying to get through to you that these are the two possibilities scientists currently face and (currently) have no way of exploring either of them.

I have not been arguing "the only possible solution" to this stage of reality. I am simply pointing out what the two solutions are. If you can come up with a third, I am sure science would be delighted to consider that one, too.

 

[Mudda]

Nothing has been proven to have been first, that you claim it was your invisible stone cutter is totally without foundation. I can admit that we don't yet know how everything started and who was first... and just because I don't know doesn't mean that I'm going to make something up like you do.

Sigh. Open a science book. All agree the universe had a beginning. What caused the beginning?

Or, are you going with your own theory (something made up ) that the universe did not have a beginning?

If you decide to go along with science that the universe did have a beginning, then science presents two options: An intelligence that exists beyond space/time; or, that the universe came about from nothing. In either case, at present, science has no way to prove or even theorize about either.

In today's conversation with you, I am speaking outside religion. I've put on my other hat--science. I'm advising you on how science looks at it. I'm not saying there is this greater intelligence (what people of faith refer to as God); and I am not saying the universe came from nothing. I have been trying to get through to you that these are the two possibilities scientists currently face and (currently) have no way of exploring either of them.

I have not been arguing "the only possible solution" to this stage of reality. I am simply pointing out what the two solutions are. If you can come up with a third, I am sure science would be delighted to consider that one, too.

Actually, scientists don't pretend say what was before the Big Bang, like you do. The universe could be on a never ending loop of expansion and contraction. There could be several, if not billions of universes out there... We just don't know. For you to claim that you know what scientists are confronted with is total malarky. That scientists would restrict themselves to only 2 possibilities is complete nonsense. Geez, and you teach in a real school?