if not evolution

[RWNJ]

animal survival rates

Depends on the animal. In some cases I'd say (pre-medicine) humans actually have it worse

https://www.quora.com/Nature-Are-an...ilar-to-that-of-humans-before-modern-medicine

World Population Growth - Our World in Data

Don't know why they think they can predict population growth. After all, it only takes one virus to completely throw the numbers off.

hahahah--that's just it!!
chances of survival were much lower only decades ago without medicine/etc--not to mention at the time of creation/evolution
..babies were more likely to die--from disease/starvation/BIRTH--per the article/etc
it is a fact human life expectancy is higher now
now you are arguing with statistics--where are yours to back up your theory??

How many died from the plague? Do you know how that affected population growth? One little virus could wipe out the majority of humans, and there's not a damn thing we could do about it.

so Adam and Eve- and their children--were immune from all disease/etc?

For one thing, there were not nearly as many diseases back then. We know they didn't have aids. That's a recent development. In fact, new diseases are popping up all over the place.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

You can't win an argument -- or even have an argument at all -- with someone who gets to come armed with "magic!!!". Literally any fact or evidence you present can be dismissed, and magic substituted for it.

And, as anyone can see from reaidng RWNJs posts, his affinity for makimg up anything he likes is not confined to religion. Population growth prediction? Nope, sorry, totally worthless....because, viruses. Why? Because, RWNJs gut feeling.

So as we can all see, the affinity for instantly and forever believing anything that suits you tends to bleed outside the arena of religion, when it comes to religious people.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

For one thing, there were not nearly as many diseases back then. W

See what I mean? He just pulled this right out of his ass. Not only does he not have a shred of evidence for this ad hoc claim, he will believe it forever and will reject any and all evidence to the contrary. Forever.

You cannot reason with a person like this.

 

[harmonica]

animal survival rates
https://www.quora.com/Nature-Are-an...ilar-to-that-of-humans-before-modern-medicine

World Population Growth - Our World in Data

Don't know why they think they can predict population growth. After all, it only takes one virus to completely throw the numbers off.

hahahah--that's just it!!
chances of survival were much lower only decades ago without medicine/etc--not to mention at the time of creation/evolution
..babies were more likely to die--from disease/starvation/BIRTH--per the article/etc
it is a fact human life expectancy is higher now
now you are arguing with statistics--where are yours to back up your theory??

How many died from the plague? Do you know how that affected population growth? One little virus could wipe out the majority of humans, and there's not a damn thing we could do about it.

so Adam and Eve- and their children--were immune from all disease/etc?

For one thing, there were not nearly as many diseases back then. We know they didn't have aids. That's a recent development. In fact, new diseases are popping up all over the place.

with modern being 1800s or so:
so with modern/advance farming-farming tools-animals/modern transportation/storage/etc
with modern FIREARM weapons vs non firearms for hunting/etc
with modern/advanced communication
with better understanding of the diseases and communication to spread the understanding
with all of this, the birth rates stayed about the same throughout history?

Human population grew rapidly during the Industrial Revolution, not because the birth rate increased, but because the death rate began to fall. This mortality revolution began in the 1700s in Europe and spread to North America by the mid-1800s. Death rates fell as new farming and transportation technology expanded the food supply and lessened the danger of famine. New technologies and increasing industrialization improved public health and living standards

Human Population: Future Growth

this is just common sense.....you don't even need to research it to figure it out-
I figured it out before researching
I thought of the first paragraph I wrote before researching the link--which is almost identical to what I wrote !!

of course I've done some reading on the Black Death, history of humans/etc

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

 

[harmonica]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

 

[koshergrl]

if you don't believe in evolution, then you must believe a fully formed man just appeared/etc?
is this correct?

Idiotic false premise.

Nobody doesn't believe in evolution.

Obviously animals and plants evolve..that's how we get different kinds of dogs and roses.

We just don't believe evolution explains the creation of life. Because it doesn't. It's not even scientific to say it does.

 

[harmonica]

Childbirth in Medieval and Tudor Times by Sarah Bryson - The Tudor Society
The Historical Horror of Childbirth

 

[harmonica]

animal survival rates
https://www.quora.com/Nature-Are-an...ilar-to-that-of-humans-before-modern-medicine

World Population Growth - Our World in Data

Don't know why they think they can predict population growth. After all, it only takes one virus to completely throw the numbers off.

hahahah--that's just it!!
chances of survival were much lower only decades ago without medicine/etc--not to mention at the time of creation/evolution
..babies were more likely to die--from disease/starvation/BIRTH--per the article/etc
it is a fact human life expectancy is higher now
now you are arguing with statistics--where are yours to back up your theory??

How many died from the plague? Do you know how that affected population growth? One little virus could wipe out the majority of humans, and there's not a damn thing we could do about it.

so Adam and Eve- and their children--were immune from all disease/etc?

For one thing, there were not nearly as many diseases back then. We know they didn't have aids. That's a recent development. In fact, new diseases are popping up all over the place.

but you JUST said they did have viruses ...that killed many??!! Black Death was one of the greatest

Don't know why they think they can predict population growth. After all, it only takes one virus to completely throw the numbers off.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

We just don't believe evolution explains the creation of life

It's not meant to do so. Selection explains abiogenesis.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

So the force of evolution has been working actively on Earth based crocodiles and monkeys and aquatic life on Titan, Europa and elsewhere?

 

[harmonica]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

So the force of evolution has been working actively on Earth based crocodiles and monkeys and aquatic life on Titan, Europa and elsewhere?

well, why would god put millions of galaxies in the universe--for us not to see and no life on them?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

So the force of evolution has been working actively on Earth based crocodiles and monkeys and aquatic life on Titan, Europa and elsewhere?

well, why would god put millions of galaxies in the universe--for us not to see and no life on them?

I'm sure there's life in the solar system and Universe. Have you ever seen the medieval artwork depicting UFOs?

My point is. if evolution works like a force of nature, why have crocodiles been immune to it for 200 million years, but humoinoids get zapped every couple of hundred thousand years?

 

[G.T.]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

So the force of evolution has been working actively on Earth based crocodiles and monkeys and aquatic life on Titan, Europa and elsewhere?

well, why would god put millions of galaxies in the universe--for us not to see and no life on them?

I'm sure there's life in the solar system and Universe. Have you ever seen the medieval artwork depicting UFOs?

My point is. if evolution works like a force of nature, why have crocodiles been immune to it for 200 million years, but humoinoids get zapped every couple of hundred thousand years?

Frank, this question assumes a lack of understanding of evolution. Genetic variance is not a "zapping" - like, it's not an invisible & motivated, cognitive force that thinks and acts.

Crocodiles' traits, as-is, assured survival................ thus were traits passed on via reproduction for 200million years (assuming your # is true) ~ any mutations/variants were not the traits that took over via reproduction because the traits already there were surviving and reproducing unimpeded. The question answered itself.

And humanoids were not "zapped." "Humanoids" born with certain traits survived better than humanoids with other failed traits - so the failed traits were reproduced out of the gene pool - meaning did not survive & reproduce unimpeded......whereas the dominant traits DID reproduce unimpeded thus were "passed down" via that reproduction.

Over (long as fuck)periods of time, this causes the eventual human you see today - and that's SIMPLY because the human you see today? Inherited traits that assured survival - like the crocodile.

 

[harmonica]

Is evolution a force that radiates throughout the universe?

wouldn't it?
why would there be millions of galaxies--that we can't see without a telescope?

So the force of evolution has been working actively on Earth based crocodiles and monkeys and aquatic life on Titan, Europa and elsewhere?

well, why would god put millions of galaxies in the universe--for us not to see and no life on them?

I'm sure there's life in the solar system and Universe. Have you ever seen the medieval artwork depicting UFOs?

My point is. if evolution works like a force of nature, why have crocodiles been immune to it for 200 million years, but humoinoids get zapped every couple of hundred thousand years?

good and interesting point
...isn't it because of necessity? the don't need to change?
the crocs have been able to ''learn'' to survive as they've had a much greater time on earth where as humanoids have only been around for how long? maybe a few million years?
...crocs lay dozens of eggs? where as we see in the links I provided human childbirth used to be dangerous for the mom.....the crocs do not need to change for population to survive.....the humans/humanoids that were smarter survived ---thus brainpower needed to change
...I'm no expert on the subject though
Why haven't crocodiles changed? | Science Questions | Naked Scientists
Crocodiles are 'stuck in the past': Genetic study shows reptiles are closely related to birds but their evolution is 'unusually slow' | Daily Mail Online

 

[sealybobo]

Every other universe is unique

Sorry, not possible, with infinite universes. Take any state of any universe, and , in infinite multiverse theory, that state has occured and will occur an infinite number of times.

Not impossible

And while our universe may look as if it has a beginning, the multiverse need not have a beginning.

Mathematics of Eternity Prove The Universe Must Have Had A Beginning

The mathematics you present in that link do, in fact, render the idea of a finite number of unique universes to be impossible.

I talked to a really smart guy here at work this morning. I told him what we were discussing and he agrees with me that there is no alternate universe with another me. He said "you would have to believe in fate or destiny to believe that". And he says you would have to believe both universes started off the exact same way and with the exact same molecules and atoms which they wouldn't because each universe is different. And even if they both started off the same way if one thing different happens then everything changes and I will not end up existing in that other universe. Just one thing. And honestly, not even Adam and Eve will exist in that alternate universe. That happened here. In that other universe the earth doesn't even exist. And if another earth like planet exists, that's not us. They are someone different.

Because the big bang that happened in this universe is not the same big bang that happened in another universe. And the atoms in that universe are different.

And lets say Adam and Eve are my first ancestors. Are you suggesting that there is another universe where another adam and eve meet, and their kids meet the same partners and so on down the line until you are born? That's impossible even with an infinite number of universes. Because in our universe the events that take place are infinite. If I look left in one universe and look right in another, nothing will be the same. If I sneeze here but not there, everything changes.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I told him what we were discussing and he agrees with me that there is no alternate universe with another me. He said "you would have to believe in fate or destiny to believe that".

You can tell him that, if it is assumed that there are infinite subverses, each with a finite amount of information, he is 100% incorrect and can be proven to be incorrect with a fairly simple mathematical proof.

And he says you would have to believe both universes started off the exact same way and with the exact same molecules and atoms which they wouldn't because each universe is different.

He is also wrong about that. While the universe may be deterministic, it is also chaotic. What this means is that two subverses with identical starting states may not share all future states (due to quantum uncertainty), and two subverses with different initial states may display identical states later in their futures.

And lets say Adam and Eve are my first ancestors. Are you suggesting that there is another universe where another adam and eve meet, and their kids meet the same partners and so on down the line until you are born?

I am not suggesting there are ONE or TWO such universes, but actually an INFINITE NUMBER of such universes.

 

[sealybobo]

I told him what we were discussing and he agrees with me that there is no alternate universe with another me. He said "you would have to believe in fate or destiny to believe that".

You can tell him that, if it is assumed that there are infinite subverses, each with a finite amount of information, he is 100% incorrect and can be proven to be incorrect with a fairly simple mathematical proof.

And he says you would have to believe both universes started off the exact same way and with the exact same molecules and atoms which they wouldn't because each universe is different.

He is also wrong about that. While the universe may be deterministic, it is also chaotic. What this means is that two subverses with identical starting states may not share all future states (due to quantum uncertainty), and two subverses with different initial states may display identical states later in their futures.

And lets say Adam and Eve are my first ancestors. Are you suggesting that there is another universe where another adam and eve meet, and their kids meet the same partners and so on down the line until you are born?

I am not suggesting there are ONE or TWO such universes, but actually an INFINITE NUMBER of such universes.

Sorry. There’s only one universe where I exist and we’re in it. Another universe doesn’t have the same anything as us. It’s 100% different. It’s over there and we are here. It was then we are now. Two different marbles. If you make marbles you’ll never make the same marble twice.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

Sorry. There’s only one universe where I exist and we’re in it.

I don't know why you are apologizing...you could not possibly know the truth of that statement, so therefore have not corrected anyone. Nor have you made an argument for it.

The things I am saying are true if we assume a multiverse with an infinite number of subverses.

If you make marbles you’ll never make the same marble twice

100% incorrect, IF you make an infinite number of marbles. Not only will you make the same marble twice, you will make every possible marble an infinite number of times each. Marbles are finite, and so contain a finite amount of information.

 

[G.T.]

I told him what we were discussing and he agrees with me that there is no alternate universe with another me. He said "you would have to believe in fate or destiny to believe that".

You can tell him that, if it is assumed that there are infinite subverses, each with a finite amount of information, he is 100% incorrect and can be proven to be incorrect with a fairly simple mathematical proof.

And he says you would have to believe both universes started off the exact same way and with the exact same molecules and atoms which they wouldn't because each universe is different.

He is also wrong about that. While the universe may be deterministic, it is also chaotic. What this means is that two subverses with identical starting states may not share all future states (due to quantum uncertainty), and two subverses with different initial states may display identical states later in their futures.

And lets say Adam and Eve are my first ancestors. Are you suggesting that there is another universe where another adam and eve meet, and their kids meet the same partners and so on down the line until you are born?

I am not suggesting there are ONE or TWO such universes, but actually an INFINITE NUMBER of such universes.

Sorry. There’s only one universe where I exist and we’re in it. Another universe doesn’t have the same anything as us. It’s 100% different. It’s over there and we are here. It was then we are now. Two different marbles. If you make marbles you’ll never make the same marble twice.

Man...

this concept yall are bickering about has the underlying theme that, you really cant wrap your head around the concept of infinity.