" I am tired of doing business this way"

[william the wie]

you lost me, SK. Are you saying that reduced trade is good bad or indifferent?

 

[iamwhatiseem]

One must keep increasing their profits.

Hardly.
If you are not in the finance business, or the oil business, or in the green energy business...you are overwhelmingly under the threat of NO profit.
It has not been about increasing profits for two and a half years now - it is about survival.
Finding revenue is not all that difficult, in fact it is easy - finding revenue you can make a profit off of is becoming a war.
People who are not in business are unaware of this. They may not know just how many mergers and acquisitions that have taken place in the last 13 months. Each and every one of those mergers resulted in lay-offs, doors closed and services ended. If a person believes these take place to "increase profits" - they are mistaken. They overwhelmingly take place because one of the companies wasn't going to make it on their own so they sold their business to a competitor...or the two talked and knew that unless they merge they will not be able to compete in the near future.

I have a suggestion

How about you accept responsibility for your business incompetence instead of blaming your competitors ability to do a better job at a cheaper price.

And only a wingnut would think a failing business would try to save itself by hooking up with another failing business. No wonder your business is failing!!! You believe every loser that tells you a sob story

I also have a suggestion.
Put a red ball on your nose, here where your words are all that is seen - it is easy to see you are a clown. But in the real world, people might mistake you for someone worth a few moments of their time; not realising until it is too late - your just an ass who assumes more than you will ever actually know.

 

[sangha]

I will never understand why the worth of an enterprise is downing, if it doesn´t raise it´s profit each year. As long as it makes profit at all, isn´t it´s job done?

If a corporations' profits are the same as last years, their stock price won't rise. If the stock price doesn't rise, then the people who own the business (ie stockholders) wont make any money, even if the corporation did make a profit.

The days of investing for dividends is long over

What if we allow to trade only 1day per month? Wouldn´t this restress the system?

I don't see how. People will just do 30 times the usual amount of transactions on that one day. The problem isn't the volume of activity, but the way the activity is structured. Under capitalism, you grow or you die.

 

[sangha]

Hardly.
If you are not in the finance business, or the oil business, or in the green energy business...you are overwhelmingly under the threat of NO profit.
It has not been about increasing profits for two and a half years now - it is about survival.
Finding revenue is not all that difficult, in fact it is easy - finding revenue you can make a profit off of is becoming a war.
People who are not in business are unaware of this. They may not know just how many mergers and acquisitions that have taken place in the last 13 months. Each and every one of those mergers resulted in lay-offs, doors closed and services ended. If a person believes these take place to "increase profits" - they are mistaken. They overwhelmingly take place because one of the companies wasn't going to make it on their own so they sold their business to a competitor...or the two talked and knew that unless they merge they will not be able to compete in the near future.

I have a suggestion

How about you accept responsibility for your business incompetence instead of blaming your competitors ability to do a better job at a cheaper price.

And only a wingnut would think a failing business would try to save itself by hooking up with another failing business. No wonder your business is failing!!! You believe every loser that tells you a sob story

I also have a suggestion.
Put a red ball on your nose, here where your words are all that is seen - it is easy to see you are a clown. But in the real world, people might mistake you for someone worth a few moments of their time; not realising until it is too late - your just an ass who assumes more than you will ever actually know.

I should have realized that it's impossible to convince a wingnut take responsibility for his own failures. It's always someone else's fault, right?

 

[boedicca]

I strongly disagree with the prevailing sentiment of this thread as to causality. The situation we are in is a direct result of policies that the politicians ran for (re)election on over the past 50 years. I see no one addressing the issues just scapegoating:

I don't see anyone advocating the phased eradication of medicare/medicaid that has screwed up US Healthcare costs beyond any recognition. The paying of those bills if and when the USG so chooses so with Obamacare we see a popular double down on a losing hand.

The backdoor eradication of COLA for Social Security to reduce the costs of blowing bubbles with fiat money does not address the inflationary spiral we've been in since 1958. Instead generational, class and sectional conflict is encouraged.

Until reality is dealt with instead of scapegoats these problems will grow.

Bingo.

Government spending has increased by 25% as a ratio of GDP in two years, with massive deficits and increases to the debt. Add an increasingly intrusive "centralized planning" oriented regulatory bureaucracy - it's no wonder economic growth is anemic.

The lack of economic growth is causing companies to continually seek lower prices for what they purchase in order to offset their own anemic top line growth.

 

[psikeyhackr]

Providing a great product, dependable service, longterm relationships with your clients....all...pale to compare to the almighty bottom price.
How cheap can you sell it for.

I am tired of doing business this way.

Who is providing a great product? I could see the construction quality of stereo equipment going down back in the 70s. I watched computer cases get worse and worse over 20 years. The electronics got better and cheaper because of Moore's Law but most consumer don't understand how junky the stuff is otherwise. And then they will pay $500 for an iPad.

I haven't been to an auto show in 30 years. I was looking at plastic bumpers and other parts hanging off cars while walking down the street yesterday. Years ago I had a conversation with an old timer in HVAC and asked him about the equipment. He said it was junk.

Economists can talk about price and quality but a lot of people that work on it despise it. They are just trapped by the economics.

Funny thing about computers though. I am wondering when people are going to figure out better, as in more powerful, computers can't really make them more productive. They just make the software waste more processing power. Are they just doing the business for the money and not really accomplishing anything? Deliberately writing software to be incompatible to force people to upgrade?

psik

 

[The Hatter]

Bingo.

Government spending has increased by 25% as a ratio of GDP in two years, with massive deficits and increases to the debt. Add an increasingly intrusive "centralized planning" oriented regulatory bureaucracy - it's no wonder economic growth is anemic.

The lack of economic growth is causing companies to continually seek lower prices for what they purchase in order to offset their own anemic top line growth.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html

American businesses earned profits at an annual rate of $1.659 trillion in the third quarter, according to a Commerce Department report released Tuesday. That is the highest figure recorded since the government began keeping track over 60 years ago, at least in nominal or noninflation-adjusted terms.

The government does not adjust the numbers for inflation, in part because these corporate profits can be affected by pricing changes from all over the world and because the government does not have a price index for individual companies. The next-highest annual corporate profits level on record was in the third quarter of 2006, when they were $1.655 trillion.

Corporate profits have been doing extremely well for a while. Since their cyclical low in the fourth quarter of 2008, profits have grown for seven consecutive quarters, at some of the fastest rates in history. As a share of gross domestic product, corporate profits also have been increasing, and they now represent 11.2 percent of total output. That is the highest share since the fourth quarter of 2006, when they accounted for 11.7 percent of output.

Still, most economists say the current growth rate is far too slow to recover the considerable ground lost during the recession.

 

[sangha]

Bingo.

Government spending has increased by 25% as a ratio of GDP in two years, with massive deficits and increases to the debt. Add an increasingly intrusive "centralized planning" oriented regulatory bureaucracy - it's no wonder economic growth is anemic.

The lack of economic growth is causing companies to continually seek lower prices for what they purchase in order to offset their own anemic top line growth.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html

American businesses earned profits at an annual rate of $1.659 trillion in the third quarter, according to a Commerce Department report released Tuesday. That is the highest figure recorded since the government began keeping track over 60 years ago, at least in nominal or noninflation-adjusted terms.

The government does not adjust the numbers for inflation, in part because these corporate profits can be affected by pricing changes from all over the world and because the government does not have a price index for individual companies. The next-highest annual corporate profits level on record was in the third quarter of 2006, when they were $1.655 trillion.

Corporate profits have been doing extremely well for a while. Since their cyclical low in the fourth quarter of 2008, profits have grown for seven consecutive quarters, at some of the fastest rates in history. As a share of gross domestic product, corporate profits also have been increasing, and they now represent 11.2 percent of total output. That is the highest share since the fourth quarter of 2006, when they accounted for 11.7 percent of output.

Still, most economists say the current growth rate is far too slow to recover the considerable ground lost during the recession.

The wingnuts don't care about the facts because reality has a liberal bias

Instead, they think that corporate america must be suffering because they don't know how to make a living running a business

 

[daveman]

What?

You don't like the Conservative Corporatist Anti-Capitalist model?

Conservatives and their love of the third world.

Go fig.

I believe you mean liberals and their tendency to create a business climate that punishes success and saddles industry with unsustainable regulations.

 

[westwall]

One must keep increasing their profits.

Hardly.
If you are not in the finance business, or the oil business, or in the green energy business...you are overwhelmingly under the threat of NO profit.
It has not been about increasing profits for two and a half years now - it is about survival.
Finding revenue is not all that difficult, in fact it is easy - finding revenue you can make a profit off of is becoming a war.
People who are not in business are unaware of this. They may not know just how many mergers and acquisitions that have taken place in the last 13 months. Each and every one of those mergers resulted in lay-offs, doors closed and services ended. If a person believes these take place to "increase profits" - they are mistaken. They overwhelmingly take place because one of the companies wasn't going to make it on their own so they sold their business to a competitor...or the two talked and knew that unless they merge they will not be able to compete in the near future.

I have a suggestion

How about you accept responsibility for your business incompetence instead of blaming your competitors ability to do a better job at a cheaper price.

And only a wingnut would think a failing business would try to save itself by hooking up with another failing business. No wonder your business is failing!!! You believe every loser that tells you a sob story

You MUST be a state worker.

 

[sangha]

Hardly.
If you are not in the finance business, or the oil business, or in the green energy business...you are overwhelmingly under the threat of NO profit.
It has not been about increasing profits for two and a half years now - it is about survival.
Finding revenue is not all that difficult, in fact it is easy - finding revenue you can make a profit off of is becoming a war.
People who are not in business are unaware of this. They may not know just how many mergers and acquisitions that have taken place in the last 13 months. Each and every one of those mergers resulted in lay-offs, doors closed and services ended. If a person believes these take place to "increase profits" - they are mistaken. They overwhelmingly take place because one of the companies wasn't going to make it on their own so they sold their business to a competitor...or the two talked and knew that unless they merge they will not be able to compete in the near future.

I have a suggestion

How about you accept responsibility for your business incompetence instead of blaming your competitors ability to do a better job at a cheaper price.

And only a wingnut would think a failing business would try to save itself by hooking up with another failing business. No wonder your business is failing!!! You believe every loser that tells you a sob story

You MUST be a state worker.

Self-employed business owner

Once again, reality is shown to have a liberal bias.

But westwall will believe that I work for the govt because it has nothing to do with reality

 

[boedicca]

bingo.

Government spending has increased by 25% as a ratio of gdp in two years, with massive deficits and increases to the debt. Add an increasingly intrusive "centralized planning" oriented regulatory bureaucracy - it's no wonder economic growth is anemic.

the lack of economic growth is causing companies to continually seek lower prices for what they purchase in order to offset their own anemic top line growth.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html

american businesses earned profits at an annual rate of $1.659 trillion in the third quarter, according to a commerce department report released tuesday. That is the highest figure recorded since the government began keeping track over 60 years ago, at least in nominal or noninflation-adjusted terms.

The government does not adjust the numbers for inflation, in part because these corporate profits can be affected by pricing changes from all over the world and because the government does not have a price index for individual companies. The next-highest annual corporate profits level on record was in the third quarter of 2006, when they were $1.655 trillion.

Corporate profits have been doing extremely well for a while. Since their cyclical low in the fourth quarter of 2008, profits have grown for seven consecutive quarters, at some of the fastest rates in history. As a share of gross domestic product, corporate profits also have been increasing, and they now represent 11.2 percent of total output. That is the highest share since the fourth quarter of 2006, when they accounted for 11.7 percent of output.

still, most economists say the current growth rate is far too slow to recover the considerable ground lost during the recession.

oh noesssssssss!!!11!!!!!!

Profits!!!!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!

 

[sangha]

What?

You don't like the Conservative Corporatist Anti-Capitalist model?

Conservatives and their love of the third world.

Go fig.

I believe you mean liberals and their tendency to create a business climate that punishes success and saddles industry with unsustainable regulations.

The way FDR and the liberals transformed the US into the worlds greatest superpower was just unbearable for the wingnuts

 

[sangha]

bingo.

Government spending has increased by 25% as a ratio of gdp in two years, with massive deficits and increases to the debt. Add an increasingly intrusive "centralized planning" oriented regulatory bureaucracy - it's no wonder economic growth is anemic.

the lack of economic growth is causing companies to continually seek lower prices for what they purchase in order to offset their own anemic top line growth.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/business/economy/24econ.html

still, most economists say the current growth rate is far too slow to recover the considerable ground lost during the recession.

oh noesssssssss!!!11!!!!!!

Profits!!!!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!

boedicca can't decide if profits are up or down. boedicca doesn't even know the difference between them

One minute he's poutraged about the lack of economic growth; the next minute he's cheering it on!!

 

[westwall]

I have a suggestion

How about you accept responsibility for your business incompetence instead of blaming your competitors ability to do a better job at a cheaper price.

And only a wingnut would think a failing business would try to save itself by hooking up with another failing business. No wonder your business is failing!!! You believe every loser that tells you a sob story

You MUST be a state worker.

Self-employed business owner

Once again, reality is shown to have a liberal bias.

But westwall will believe that I work for the govt because it has nothing to do with reality

Well I have no problem believing that however I am too and deal with probably 100 independant businesses on a yearly basis. They ALL have seen a minimum 35% reduction in revenue. The only sector that has not seemed to suffer as much is the bar and saloon industry and even there we have had three of those close down in the last year, in a casino town. Did I mention the 5 casinos that have had to shut down as well. Multimillion dollar establishments like the Sienna in Reno have shut their doors.

What industry are you in?

 

[The Hatter]

oh noesssssssss!!!11!!!!!!

Profits!!!!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!

So instead of a real response, you post this? Also, I never bashed the fact that profits were up. I was pointing out your point about economic growth being false.

Tuesday’s Commerce Department report also showed that the nation’s output grew at a slightly faster pace than originally estimated last quarter. Its growth rate, of 2.5 percent a year in inflation-adjusted terms, is higher than the initial estimate of 2 percent. The economy grew at a 1.7 percent annual rate in the second quarter.

 

[sangha]

You MUST be a state worker.

Self-employed business owner

Once again, reality is shown to have a liberal bias.

But westwall will believe that I work for the govt because it has nothing to do with reality

Well I have no problem believing that however I am too and deal with probably 100 independant businesses on a yearly basis. They ALL have seen a minimum 35% reduction in revenue. The only sector that has not seemed to suffer as much is the bar and saloon industry and even there we have had three of those close down in the last year, in a casino town. Did I mention the 5 casinos that have had to shut down as well. Multimillion dollar establishments like the Sienna in Reno have shut their doors.

What industry are you in?

You have no problem believing many things that are not true, like how you deal with 100 independant businesses a year.

And businesses go under in good times and bad. But I guess it's all Obama's fault.

 

[sangha]

oh noesssssssss!!!11!!!!!!

Profits!!!!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!

So instead of a real response, you post this?

Tuesday’s Commerce Department report also showed that the nation’s output grew at a slightly faster pace than originally estimated last quarter. Its growth rate, of 2.5 percent a year in inflation-adjusted terms, is higher than the initial estimate of 2 percent. The economy grew at a 1.7 percent annual rate in the second quarter.

boedicca's still trying to figure out how to explain the whining about no economic growth when the facts shows strong economic growth.

Until then, don't expect much in the way of substance from boedicca

 

[westwall]

Self-employed business owner

Once again, reality is shown to have a liberal bias.

But westwall will believe that I work for the govt because it has nothing to do with reality

Well I have no problem believing that however I am too and deal with probably 100 independant businesses on a yearly basis. They ALL have seen a minimum 35% reduction in revenue. The only sector that has not seemed to suffer as much is the bar and saloon industry and even there we have had three of those close down in the last year, in a casino town. Did I mention the 5 casinos that have had to shut down as well. Multimillion dollar establishments like the Sienna in Reno have shut their doors.

What industry are you in?

You have no problem believing many things that are not true, like how you deal with 100 independant businesses a year.

And businesses go under in good times and bad. But I guess it's all Obama's fault.

I have projects going all over the world and would vastly prefer to concentrate my buying with just a few but the transport costs are just a tad too much don't you know, so I deal with local manufacturers wherever possible to keep the costs down.....so what industry are you in again?

 

[Foxfyre]

One has to have a perspective of history and current events as well as repetitious message board talking points, I believe, in order to understand Boedicca's post. She said a LOT without having to use a lot of words to do it in that response.

Commerce and industry, whether selling a tangible product or a service, must have profits or it cannot stay in business. It must grow, improve, innovate, specialize, and increase in value or it will be swallowed up by others that do. Facilities, tools, equipment breaks down, wears out, becomes obsolete and must be replaced. Cost of living is affected by more than just what people choose to charge for a product or service and it goes down only in times of depression which are beneficial to nobody.

And most people, without sufficient reward for investing their time, talent, blood, sweat, and tears in an enterprise, will get weary of doing it and will just stop. It is much easier to work for wages without all the hassle but unfortunately, if everybody chooses to do that, then there won't be anybody to pay the wages.

There is reason to regret the impersonal big box way of doing business these days, and if we put our collective heads together we might even find a way to remedy that.

But blasting commerce, industry, and profits won't accomplish anything but fewer jobs and less prosperity for everybody.