Can you leftist assure me that this is bs?(Obamacare)

[konradv]

Leftist can you reassure me that this isn't true? The health care system in Britain seems to work a lot like this. Why shouldn't we have a system that can supply our entire population with what they need? Why limit and put medical suppliers out of business???

What this guy was talking about is we won't be able to supply people with what they need. This scares me.

Could we ever supply people with what they need?

Or only those who could afford healthcare?

So the left's solution is nobody can get what they need if some fucked up panel says it costs too much. If a person can afford, who the hell are you or anyone to tell them no? This is a free country, correct? Well, for a little while longer anyway.

Is there a part of the law that says those who can afford it can't pay out-of-pocket? Didn't think so. Why do you waste our time with this kind of nonsense?

 

[Pinocchio]

Ever see movie "The Rainmaker". This is what private insurance does today.

Private insurance ..... oh yeah .... that is the Rep plan.

 

[g5000]

Good little parrot.
It will do no such thing.

You probably believe the part about there being a Healthcare Trust Fund too.

You are a fool if you believe otherwise. That's why before the Supreme Court decision there was so much discussion about severability.

The whole purpose of the mandate was to support the costs of insuring pre-existing conditions.

.

Now you are just making me laugh, you haven't read the Bill.
They "rold" you thats what it would do and you are just parroting the line.

Tell me oh learned one....

1) Which HC Bill are you talking about.....
2) What the Health Exchanges are responsible for

So you have no evidence of a death panel then. Exactly as I figured.

I am probably the only person on this forum who has read it. I have a copy on my hard drive from which I have often quoted.


So go ahead. Prove there is a death panel in the bill.



I am going to guess, if you even bother to cover up your mistake, that you will quote the provisions which establish a national board which is supposed to determine the efficacy of various treatments.

That is something insurance companies do, too. They aren't going to pay for you to visit a witch doctor. And that is not a death panel, either.


So go ahead. Show us the death panels. Quote the relevant provisions.

.

 

[tyroneweaver]

everyone gets treated the same under obamacare. Get the ovens ready

 

[Antares]

There will certainly be "death panels." Just like Britain and Oregon and every other place that has similar systems, this one encourages over use by people and limits supply. The result is shortage. Since you cannot allocate resources based on price, you must ration them. Ergo some people's lives will not be considered worth saving.

There have always been "death panels". If an insurance company refused to cover something, it essentially became a "death warrant panel". Just like in the past, you can always cover it out-of-pocket.

I defy anyone to provide a quote by a politician from before Obama was elected who called that process a death panel.

.

Poor kid, hung up what to call them eh?

Call it what you will, they will decide who lives and who doesn't.

 

[g5000]

There have always been "death panels". If an insurance company refused to cover something, it essentially became a "death warrant panel". Just like in the past, you can always cover it out-of-pocket.

I defy anyone to provide a quote by a politician from before Obama was elected who called that process a death panel.

.

Poor kid, hung up what to call them eh?

Call it what you will, they will decide who lives and who doesn't.

Show us the death panels.

Quote the provisions, piss drinker.


.

 

[Antares]

You are a fool if you believe otherwise. That's why before the Supreme Court decision there was so much discussion about severability.

The whole purpose of the mandate was to support the costs of insuring pre-existing conditions.

.

Now you are just making me laugh, you haven't read the Bill.
They "rold" you thats what it would do and you are just parroting the line.

Tell me oh learned one....

1) Which HC Bill are you talking about.....
2) What the Health Exchanges are responsible for

So you have no evidence of a death panel then. Exactly as I figured.

I am probably the only person on this forum who has read it. I have a copy on my hard drive from which I have often quoted.


So go ahead. Prove there is a death panel in the bill.



I am going to guess, if you even bother to cover up your mistake, that you will quote the provisions which establish a national board which is supposed to determine the efficacy of various treatments.

That is something insurance companies do, too. They aren't going to pay for you to visit a witch doctor. And that is not a death panel, either.


So go ahead. Show us the death panels. Quote the relevant provisions.

.

(smile) Ok, we'll call them the Daisy Council, they'll still decide who lives and dies.

Now...it's on your hard drive eh...then give me the number of the Bill.

Then tell me what the Exchanges are responsible for....c'mon...you can do it.

 

[g5000]

Now you are just making me laugh, you haven't read the Bill.
They "rold" you thats what it would do and you are just parroting the line.

Tell me oh learned one....

1) Which HC Bill are you talking about.....
2) What the Health Exchanges are responsible for

So you have no evidence of a death panel then. Exactly as I figured.

I am probably the only person on this forum who has read it. I have a copy on my hard drive from which I have often quoted.


So go ahead. Prove there is a death panel in the bill.



I am going to guess, if you even bother to cover up your mistake, that you will quote the provisions which establish a national board which is supposed to determine the efficacy of various treatments.

That is something insurance companies do, too. They aren't going to pay for you to visit a witch doctor. And that is not a death panel, either.


So go ahead. Show us the death panels. Quote the relevant provisions.

.

(smile) Ok, we'll call them the Daisy Council, they'll still decide who lives and dies.

Now...it's on your hard drive eh...then give me the number of the Bill.

Then tell me what the Exchanges are responsible for....c'mon...you can do it.

The exchanges are centrally managed means of offering a variety of insurance options to customers. (Edited to add: Two national non-profit insurance companies will be allowed on the exchanges. The government gets to pick the winners. That is one of the things I was talking about when I said there are legitimate things to bitch about in the bill.)

You really are sinking fast now, kiddo. You tangled with someone who has actually read the bill.

You have nothing.

You said there are death panels. You made a claim and must prove it.

Show us the provisions, piss drinker!

.

 

[Antares]

So you have no evidence of a death panel then. Exactly as I figured.

I am probably the only person on this forum who has read it. I have a copy on my hard drive from which I have often quoted.


So go ahead. Prove there is a death panel in the bill.



I am going to guess, if you even bother to cover up your mistake, that you will quote the provisions which establish a national board which is supposed to determine the efficacy of various treatments.

That is something insurance companies do, too. They aren't going to pay for you to visit a witch doctor. And that is not a death panel, either.


So go ahead. Show us the death panels. Quote the relevant provisions.

.

(smile) Ok, we'll call them the Daisy Council, they'll still decide who lives and dies.

Now...it's on your hard drive eh...then give me the number of the Bill.

Then tell me what the Exchanges are responsible for....c'mon...you can do it.

The exchanges are centrally managed means of offering a variety of insurance options to customers. (Edited to add: Two national non-profit insurance companies will be allowed on the exchanges. The government gets to pick the winners. That is one of the things I was talking about when I said there legitimate things to bitch about in the bill.)

You really are sinking fast now, kiddo. You tangled with someone who has actually read the bill.

You have nothing.

You said there are death panels. You made a claim and must prove it.

Show us the provisions, piss drinker!

.

You aren't very good at this.

What is the Bill called...c'mon, I'll help you...

HR????

"The exchanges are centrally managed means of offering a variety of insurance options to customers. (Edited to add: Two national non-profit insurance companies will be allowed on the exchanges. The government gets to pick the winners. That is one of the things I was talking about when I said there legitimate things to bitch about in the bill.)

C'mon kid....

What SPECIFICALLY will be the responsibility of the exchanges....and then we can move on....um'k?

As I said, YOU are hung up on what to call the panel...but you in no way can dispute what their function is

 

[g5000]

Ever see movie "The Rainmaker". This is what private insurance does today.

Private insurance ..... oh yeah .... that is the Rep plan.

I will tell you a superior plan to ObamaCare. ObamaCare does fuck-all to bend the cost curve down. The American people were suckered by a bait and switch con.


First, we need to eliminate the tax exemption of employer-sponsored health insurance, thus making it go away. Employer-sponsored health insurance is one of the biggest drivers of increasing costs. And ObamaCare actually entrenches this even more deeply, which is the exact opposite direction we need to go.

Not only that, Obama waived a tax hike on Cadillac plans for his union pals that is in ObamaCare. Proof positive he is a special interest lackey.


Next, you should be able to buy your health insurance the same way you buy your home, auto, and life insurance. From any company in the country. And you get to choose what options you want to pay for, and which options you don't.

This also has the added benefit of giving you the ability to have uninterrupted health insurance coverage with the same insurance company despite any number of changes in your employers.

Just like home, auto, and life insurance.


Of the alleged "47 million uninsured Americans" a full third of those people aren't Americans. They are legal and illegal immigrants.

Another approximate 8 percent are voluntarily uninsured.

And the people who are uninsured today are not the same people who will be uninsured six months from now. That is because many of them are people who lost their jobs, and therefore their employer-sponsored health insurance.

ObamaCare is massive government overkill for what is actually a much, much smaller problem than the bleeding hearts made it out to be.

.\

 

[g5000]

(smile) Ok, we'll call them the Daisy Council, they'll still decide who lives and dies.

Now...it's on your hard drive eh...then give me the number of the Bill.

Then tell me what the Exchanges are responsible for....c'mon...you can do it.

The exchanges are centrally managed means of offering a variety of insurance options to customers. (Edited to add: Two national non-profit insurance companies will be allowed on the exchanges. The government gets to pick the winners. That is one of the things I was talking about when I said there legitimate things to bitch about in the bill.)

You really are sinking fast now, kiddo. You tangled with someone who has actually read the bill.

You have nothing.

You said there are death panels. You made a claim and must prove it.

Show us the provisions, piss drinker!

.

You aren't very good at this.

What is the Bill called...c'mon, I'll help you...

HR????

"The exchanges are centrally managed means of offering a variety of insurance options to customers. (Edited to add: Two national non-profit insurance companies will be allowed on the exchanges. The government gets to pick the winners. That is one of the things I was talking about when I said there legitimate things to bitch about in the bill.)

C'mon kid....

What SPECIFICALLY will be the responsibility of the exchanges....and then we can move on....um'k?

As I said, YOU are hung up on what to call the panel...but you in no way can dispute what their function is

Quote the provisions, piss drinker.

.

 

[ilia25]

Leftist can you reassure me that this isn't true? The health care system in Britain seems to work a lot like this. Why shouldn't we have a system that can supply our entire population with what they need? Why limit and put medical suppliers out of business???





What this guy was talking about is we won't be able to supply people with what they need. This scares me.

Could we ever supply people with what they need?

Or only those who could afford healthcare?

If someone has to wait months to get basic help. That is what scares me...I don't want to find myself in such a case.

You won't -- you are free to pay for a treatment out-of-pocket, or you can buy more expensive insurance.

 

[g5000]

If someone has to wait months to get basic help. That is what scares me...I don't want to find myself in such a case.

If we do not start to bend the cost curve of health care down, we will all be on waiting lists.

Obamacare does not bend the cost curve down. And it will bankrupt the states.

.

 

[g5000]

Piss drinker, when you read the bill you will discover what you think is there is not there.

That's probably why you won't quote the bill.



.

 

[ilia25]

HHS releases rules requiring pre-existing conditions coverage
The Hill ^ | 11/20/12 | Sam Baker

HHS releases rules requiring pre-existing conditions coverage - The Hill's Healthwatch

The Obama administration issued new rules Tuesday that require insurance companies to cover people with preexisting conditions — one of the most popular provisions of President Obama’s healthcare law. The Health and Human Services Department also began to implement other popular, but expensive, parts of the Affordable Care Act. Regulations released Tuesday will prohibit insurers from charging women a higher premium than men, and will require plans in every state to cover certain services.

This will force everyone to pay equal and force insurance company out of the business.

There is no cap on insurance premiums, so the insurance companies can set them as high as they need to remain profitable.

 

[francoHFW]

O-care has ended caps on annual and lifetime care. 45k people a year will no longer be dying for not having insurance.

We won't have delays like other countries- we have so many MRI and Catscan machines, etc, it's ridiculous. We just have to watch the Pubs to make sure they don't screw it up, like the Tories in the UK have done.

Masscare proves these horrors are just Pub fear mongering, and that costs start coming down immediately....

 

[Antares]

Piss drinker, when you read the bill you will discover what you think is there is not there.

That's probably why you won't quote the bill.



.

You don't even know which Bill it is

You don't know what the Exchanges are for...you don't know shit.

You are only parroting what you've read other people say kid...as I said you just aren't very good at this.

 

[g5000]

HHS releases rules requiring pre-existing conditions coverage
The Hill ^ | 11/20/12 | Sam Baker

HHS releases rules requiring pre-existing conditions coverage - The Hill's Healthwatch

The Obama administration issued new rules Tuesday that require insurance companies to cover people with preexisting conditions — one of the most popular provisions of President Obama’s healthcare law. The Health and Human Services Department also began to implement other popular, but expensive, parts of the Affordable Care Act. Regulations released Tuesday will prohibit insurers from charging women a higher premium than men, and will require plans in every state to cover certain services.

This will force everyone to pay equal and force insurance company out of the business.

There is no cap on insurance premiums, so the insurance companies can set them as high as they need to remain profitable.

Yes.

But wait, there's more!

The ObamaCare bill currently allows subsidies (tax credits) to help pay insurance premiums for people earning up to 400 percent above the poverty level.

Since ObamaCare does not bend the cost curve down, even this federal gift won't be enough for very long. Soon we will hear cries for more monetary assistance.

We are well and truly fucked.

.

 

[Politico]

There is no system of any kind for anything that can provide everyone what they need.

 

[g5000]

Now, Piss Drinker, I just made a claim that ObamaCare provides subsidies (tax credits) to people earning up to 400 percent above poverty level to pay for their health insurance.

Here is how you go about proving a claim by quoting the relevant provisions:

SEC. 1401. REFUNDABLE TAX CREDIT PROVIDING PREMIUM ASSISTANCE
FOR COVERAGE UNDER A QUALIFIED HEALTH
PLAN.

GENERAL.—In the case of an applicable taxpayer, there
shall be allowed as a credit against the tax imposed by this subtitle
for any taxable year an amount equal to the premium assistance
credit amount of the taxpayer for the taxable year.

The premium assistance
amount determined under this subsection with respect
to any coverage month is the amount equal to the lesser of—
‘‘(A) the monthly premiums for such month for 1 or
more qualified health plans offered in the individual market
within a State which cover the taxpayer, the taxpayer’s
spouse, or any dependent (as defined in section 152) of
the taxpayer and which were enrolled in through an
Exchange established by the State under 1311 of the
Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, or
‘‘(B) the excess (if any) of—
‘‘(i) the adjusted monthly premium for such month
for the applicable second lowest cost silver plan with
respect to the taxpayer, over‘
‘(ii) an amount equal to 1/12 of the product of
the applicable percentage and the taxpayer’s household
income for the taxable year.

‘‘(ii) SPECIAL RULE FOR TAXPAYERS UNDER 133 PERCENT
OF POVERTY LINE.—If a taxpayer’s household
income for the taxable year is in excess of 100 percent,
but not more than 133 percent, of the poverty line
for a family of the size involved, the taxpayer’s
applicable percentage shall be 2 percent.

DEFINITION AND RULES RELATING TO APPLICABLE TAXPAYERS,
COVERAGE MONTHS, AND QUALIFIED HEALTH PLAN.—For
purposes of this section—
‘‘(1) APPLICABLE TAXPAYER.—
‘‘(A) IN GENERAL.—The term ‘applicable taxpayer’
means, with respect to any taxable year, a taxpayer whose
household income for the taxable year exceeds 100 percent
but does not exceed 400 percent of an amount equal to
the poverty line for a family of the size involved.

http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-111hr3590enr/pdf/BILLS-111hr3590enr.pdf